Stuttering/low FPS in 3dvision with only certain games
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Has anyone else noticed stuttering or low gpu usage leading to low framerates in 3dvision games recently?
Currently I upgraded to a 1060 from a 660ti and now find that games that ran fine before, albeit at a lower framerate, now exhibit stuttering where the scene hitches like it is waiting to load assets and during the hight the fps might drop from 60+ to 20-30 and then go right back up. Also the GPU usage drops to less than 30% during the stutters.
What is also odd is that the stutters and drops only occur if 3d vision is enabled in the Control Panel. It does not matter if I have 3d enabled in game or not. Something is broken in the 3d vision driver code? The games are perfect with 3d vision disabled in the Control Panel
The only thing that has changed in my system is going from a 660ti w/337.88 drivers to a 6GB 1060 running 372.70 drivers.
With both I am running Win 10 x64 on an FX-8350 w/8GB ram.
Here are the games I have tested and found stuttering issues on for now.
Watch Dogs
Far Cry 3 - DX11 (compatability mode)
Arkham Origins - really bad
Games I have tested that run with no issue
Far Cry 3 - DX9
Deus EX HR
Deus Ex MD
Tomb Raider 2013
Thief - new version
Talos Principle
Metro Redux/LL Redux
Has anyone else noticed stuttering or low gpu usage leading to low framerates in 3dvision games recently?
Currently I upgraded to a 1060 from a 660ti and now find that games that ran fine before, albeit at a lower framerate, now exhibit stuttering where the scene hitches like it is waiting to load assets and during the hight the fps might drop from 60+ to 20-30 and then go right back up. Also the GPU usage drops to less than 30% during the stutters.
What is also odd is that the stutters and drops only occur if 3d vision is enabled in the Control Panel. It does not matter if I have 3d enabled in game or not. Something is broken in the 3d vision driver code? The games are perfect with 3d vision disabled in the Control Panel
The only thing that has changed in my system is going from a 660ti w/337.88 drivers to a 6GB 1060 running 372.70 drivers.
With both I am running Win 10 x64 on an FX-8350 w/8GB ram.
Here are the games I have tested and found stuttering issues on for now.
Watch Dogs
Far Cry 3 - DX11 (compatability mode)
Arkham Origins - really bad
Games I have tested that run with no issue
Far Cry 3 - DX9
Deus EX HR
Deus Ex MD
Tomb Raider 2013
Thief - new version
Talos Principle
Metro Redux/LL Redux
Aside from bad coding and other issues your CPU is not strong enough IMHO, so it will struggle with CPU dependant games. If you limit your fps to 30, stuttering will lessen greatly.
Aside from bad coding and other issues your CPU is not strong enough IMHO, so it will struggle with CPU dependant games. If you limit your fps to 30, stuttering will lessen greatly.
Asus Deluxe Gen3, Core i7 2700k@4.5Ghz, GTX 1080Ti, 16 GB RAM, Win 7 64bit
Samsung Pro 250 GB SSD, 4 TB WD Black (games)
Benq XL2720Z
[quote="lacuna"]Aside from bad coding and other issues your CPU is not strong enough IMHO, so it will struggle with CPU dependant games. If you limit your fps to 30, stuttering will lessen greatly.[/quote]
I disagree as I did not have the stuttering on this CPU when I used the 660ti and 337.88 drivers. For my tests I have kept the settings the same as I had them when I had the 660ti so I am not stressing my system more than before. Also the stuttering happens even if the 3d is disabled in game (CTRL+T) but enabled in the Control Panel. This appears to be 100% a 3d vision Driver issue, but I am not sure if it is just 370.72 or any driver after 337.88.
Also the 3 games I listed are not ones I would call CPU limited. I would say that Deus EX Mankind Divided is more CPU stressful than any game I listed and it runs fine without the stuttering I describe.
lacuna said:Aside from bad coding and other issues your CPU is not strong enough IMHO, so it will struggle with CPU dependant games. If you limit your fps to 30, stuttering will lessen greatly.
I disagree as I did not have the stuttering on this CPU when I used the 660ti and 337.88 drivers. For my tests I have kept the settings the same as I had them when I had the 660ti so I am not stressing my system more than before. Also the stuttering happens even if the 3d is disabled in game (CTRL+T) but enabled in the Control Panel. This appears to be 100% a 3d vision Driver issue, but I am not sure if it is just 370.72 or any driver after 337.88.
Also the 3 games I listed are not ones I would call CPU limited. I would say that Deus EX Mankind Divided is more CPU stressful than any game I listed and it runs fine without the stuttering I describe.
Newly tested games
Issues
Far Cry 3: Blood Dragon (DX11) - stutter
Arkham City GOTY - CPU load not evenly distributed between cores. Core 3 keeps a constant over 80% load.
No Issues
Hitman Absolution
Issues
Far Cry 3: Blood Dragon (DX11) - stutter
Arkham City GOTY - CPU load not evenly distributed between cores. Core 3 keeps a constant over 80% load.
Sounds like a CPU bottleneck to me too. Keep in mind that 20fps in 3D is actually rendering 40fps, as any measuring tools only take the framerate for a single eye. Before you upgraded, your CPU was limiting your overall framerates, so you had smoother (lower) performance. Now your GPU is faster than the CPU, and that causes stutter when your CPU is struggling to keep up.
It's likely your overall performance has increased significantly. But previously, if you were getting 320fps and had a drop down to 24 when the CPU hit a speedbump, you might not notice. But if you're getting 50 and you drop down to 24 in the same scenario, that drop is going to stick out much more.
The Far Cry games in particular tend to hit the CPU harder than the other games you're testing, which supports this. Mankind Divided actually goes pretty easy on the CPU.
If you have the cooling, overclocking a little might help.
Also, it looks like you're only testing officially supported games. Do you know about helixmod?
Sounds like a CPU bottleneck to me too. Keep in mind that 20fps in 3D is actually rendering 40fps, as any measuring tools only take the framerate for a single eye. Before you upgraded, your CPU was limiting your overall framerates, so you had smoother (lower) performance. Now your GPU is faster than the CPU, and that causes stutter when your CPU is struggling to keep up.
It's likely your overall performance has increased significantly. But previously, if you were getting 320fps and had a drop down to 24 when the CPU hit a speedbump, you might not notice. But if you're getting 50 and you drop down to 24 in the same scenario, that drop is going to stick out much more.
The Far Cry games in particular tend to hit the CPU harder than the other games you're testing, which supports this. Mankind Divided actually goes pretty easy on the CPU.
If you have the cooling, overclocking a little might help.
Also, it looks like you're only testing officially supported games. Do you know about helixmod?
[quote="Pirateguybrush"]Sounds like a CPU bottleneck to me too. Keep in mind that 20fps in 3D is actually rendering 40fps, as any measuring tools only take the framerate for a single eye. Before you upgraded, your CPU was limiting your overall framerates, so you had smoother (lower) performance. Now your GPU is faster than the CPU, and that causes stutter when your CPU is struggling to keep up.
It's likely your overall performance has increased significantly. But previously, if you were getting 320fps and had a drop down to 24 when the CPU hit a speedbump, you might not notice. But if you're getting 50 and you drop down to 24 in the same scenario, that drop is going to stick out much more.
The Far Cry games in particular tend to hit the CPU harder than the other games you're testing, which supports this. Mankind Divided actually goes pretty easy on the CPU.
If you have the cooling, overclocking a little might help.
Also, it looks like you're only testing officially supported games. Do you know about helixmod?[/quote]
I know what you are saying, but here is why I disagree with you. The stuttering only happens when the 3dvision driver is enabled in control panel. It does not matter if I have 3d on in the game or not.
For example I load up Far Cry 3 with 3d Vision enabled and 3d (CTRL+T) on in the game. I have a solid 60fps going. I then begin to walk down the roads/paths and as I walk or turn the camera I get a stutter where GPU usage drops and framerates take a momentary hit down to sub 30fps. I then turn off 3d (CTRL+T) and the max FPS jumps to over 60, as expected since I am not rendering twice for 3d, but as I walk around I get the same stutter and framerate drops as I did with 3d ON.
Next I exit the game and turn off the 3d Vision driver and load up the game again. I keep a constant smooth over 60fps rate (same as with 3d off in game) but without any stutter.
When I was on the 660ti I played the same game at the same settings and with 3d Vision driver enabled/enabled in game and while my framerate was lower it did not have these stalls. Same exact thing happens with Watch Dogs.
I understand that in some games my CPU is a bottleneck, but why does having the 3d Vision Driver enabled, but 3d Off in game cause stutter, but 3d Vision Driver disabled not?
Pirateguybrush said:Sounds like a CPU bottleneck to me too. Keep in mind that 20fps in 3D is actually rendering 40fps, as any measuring tools only take the framerate for a single eye. Before you upgraded, your CPU was limiting your overall framerates, so you had smoother (lower) performance. Now your GPU is faster than the CPU, and that causes stutter when your CPU is struggling to keep up.
It's likely your overall performance has increased significantly. But previously, if you were getting 320fps and had a drop down to 24 when the CPU hit a speedbump, you might not notice. But if you're getting 50 and you drop down to 24 in the same scenario, that drop is going to stick out much more.
The Far Cry games in particular tend to hit the CPU harder than the other games you're testing, which supports this. Mankind Divided actually goes pretty easy on the CPU.
If you have the cooling, overclocking a little might help.
Also, it looks like you're only testing officially supported games. Do you know about helixmod?
I know what you are saying, but here is why I disagree with you. The stuttering only happens when the 3dvision driver is enabled in control panel. It does not matter if I have 3d on in the game or not.
For example I load up Far Cry 3 with 3d Vision enabled and 3d (CTRL+T) on in the game. I have a solid 60fps going. I then begin to walk down the roads/paths and as I walk or turn the camera I get a stutter where GPU usage drops and framerates take a momentary hit down to sub 30fps. I then turn off 3d (CTRL+T) and the max FPS jumps to over 60, as expected since I am not rendering twice for 3d, but as I walk around I get the same stutter and framerate drops as I did with 3d ON.
Next I exit the game and turn off the 3d Vision driver and load up the game again. I keep a constant smooth over 60fps rate (same as with 3d off in game) but without any stutter.
When I was on the 660ti I played the same game at the same settings and with 3d Vision driver enabled/enabled in game and while my framerate was lower it did not have these stalls. Same exact thing happens with Watch Dogs.
I understand that in some games my CPU is a bottleneck, but why does having the 3d Vision Driver enabled, but 3d Off in game cause stutter, but 3d Vision Driver disabled not?
Also while Far Cry 3 is CPU heavy Far Cry 3 Blood Dragon is not. I have the exact same issue in Blood Dragon.
I do know of helixmod use it and love it, but I have not had the time to test every single game I own that does 3d yet.
Another CPU heavy game would be Hitman Absolution, but it does not stutter and stall. What happens in that game is in complex areas the GPU usage drops and the framerate drops, but it is more gradual and does not stutter/visible hitch and stall. The game runs slower, but much smoother. Those types of games I have tried I do not include on the list of games with issues as they are working as expected.
I will say that in no shape or form are the Arkham games that CPU intensive. If you read my notes on Arkham City you can see that with the 3D Vision driver enabled that the CPU core usage is drastically different than with the driver disabled, and with Arkham Origins I can turn all my settings down to the lowest and it still stalls like crazy.
Also while Far Cry 3 is CPU heavy Far Cry 3 Blood Dragon is not. I have the exact same issue in Blood Dragon.
I do know of helixmod use it and love it, but I have not had the time to test every single game I own that does 3d yet.
Another CPU heavy game would be Hitman Absolution, but it does not stutter and stall. What happens in that game is in complex areas the GPU usage drops and the framerate drops, but it is more gradual and does not stutter/visible hitch and stall. The game runs slower, but much smoother. Those types of games I have tried I do not include on the list of games with issues as they are working as expected.
I will say that in no shape or form are the Arkham games that CPU intensive. If you read my notes on Arkham City you can see that with the 3D Vision driver enabled that the CPU core usage is drastically different than with the driver disabled, and with Arkham Origins I can turn all my settings down to the lowest and it still stalls like crazy.
The most simplistic comparison:
http://cpuboss.com/cpus/Intel-Core-i7-4790K-vs-AMD-FX-8350
It doesn't talk about a lot of important things:
- HyperThreading which AMD lacks
- Virtualization which AMD lacks
- Bandwidth and etc...
Also why in the world would you pair a AMD CPU with a Nvidia GPU ???
If you want an AMD CPU go with an AMD GPU. For Nvidia go with Intel.
It's DOWN to the so-called "north-bridge" (as it was used to be called) controller.
I bet there is where your problem is.
As for the Nvidia Driver. It has many flaws and issues but what you are describing is absolutely NOT PRESENT.
The problem for you is most likely in a totally different place.
It would also be good to update ALL your drivers.
Run DDU
Install the semi-last nvidia driver (previous driver from 372.77).
Maybe this will solve it for you as the behaviour is weird to say the least.
It doesn't talk about a lot of important things:
- HyperThreading which AMD lacks
- Virtualization which AMD lacks
- Bandwidth and etc...
Also why in the world would you pair a AMD CPU with a Nvidia GPU ???
If you want an AMD CPU go with an AMD GPU. For Nvidia go with Intel.
It's DOWN to the so-called "north-bridge" (as it was used to be called) controller.
I bet there is where your problem is.
As for the Nvidia Driver. It has many flaws and issues but what you are describing is absolutely NOT PRESENT.
The problem for you is most likely in a totally different place.
It would also be good to update ALL your drivers.
Run DDU
Install the semi-last nvidia driver (previous driver from 372.77).
Maybe this will solve it for you as the behaviour is weird to say the least.
1x Palit RTX 2080Ti Pro Gaming OC(watercooled and overclocked to hell)
3x 3D Vision Ready Asus VG278HE monitors (5760x1080).
Intel i9 9900K (overclocked to 5.3 and watercooled ofc).
Asus Maximus XI Hero Mobo.
16 GB Team Group T-Force Dark Pro DDR4 @ 3600.
Lots of Disks:
- Raid 0 - 256GB Sandisk Extreme SSD.
- Raid 0 - WD Black - 2TB.
- SanDisk SSD PLUS 480 GB.
- Intel 760p 256GB M.2 PCIe NVMe SSD.
Creative Sound Blaster Z.
Windows 10 x64 Pro.
etc
[quote="helifax"]The most simplistic comparison:
http://cpuboss.com/cpus/Intel-Core-i7-4790K-vs-AMD-FX-8350
It doesn't talk about a lot of important things:
- HyperThreading which AMD lacks
- Virtualization which AMD lacks
- Bandwidth and etc...
Also why in the world would you pair a AMD CPU with a Nvidia GPU ???
If you want an AMD CPU go with an AMD GPU. For Nvidia go with Intel.
It's DOWN to the so-called "north-bridge" (as it was used to be called) controller.
I bet there is where your problem is.
As for the Nvidia Driver. It has many flaws and issues but what you are describing is absolutely NOT PRESENT.
The problem for you is most likely in a totally different place.
It would also be good to update ALL your drivers.
Run DDU
Install the semi-last nvidia driver (previous driver from 372.77).
Maybe this will solve it for you as the behaviour is weird to say the least.[/quote]
So what your telling me is even though the 3d Vision Driver has serious issues in the Arkham games since 337.88 https://forums.geforce.com/default/topic/809465/3d-vision/poor-3dvision-performance-in-all-batman-arkham-games/ that the driver in no shape or form can be the cause of my issue and it is all due to some 'phantom' incompatibility between an AMD CPU/MB and the Nvidia card? An incompatibility that did not happen on any of my previous Nvidia cards in my AMD systems?
I know the FX-8350 is weaker than the Intel CPU. My reasons for having it are my own and I do not have to defend them. So far everyone's response seems to be just to blame the AMD CPU for the problems. There seems to be quite a bias against those whose systems are either not Intel or not the absolute fastest specs out there. Anything less and ALL issues are on the system and NEVER on the driver.
BTW - All my drivers are up to date and I completely uninstalled and cleaned the previous Nvidia drivers before installing the 1060.
It doesn't talk about a lot of important things:
- HyperThreading which AMD lacks
- Virtualization which AMD lacks
- Bandwidth and etc...
Also why in the world would you pair a AMD CPU with a Nvidia GPU ???
If you want an AMD CPU go with an AMD GPU. For Nvidia go with Intel.
It's DOWN to the so-called "north-bridge" (as it was used to be called) controller.
I bet there is where your problem is.
As for the Nvidia Driver. It has many flaws and issues but what you are describing is absolutely NOT PRESENT.
The problem for you is most likely in a totally different place.
It would also be good to update ALL your drivers.
Run DDU
Install the semi-last nvidia driver (previous driver from 372.77).
Maybe this will solve it for you as the behaviour is weird to say the least.
So what your telling me is even though the 3d Vision Driver has serious issues in the Arkham games since 337.88 https://forums.geforce.com/default/topic/809465/3d-vision/poor-3dvision-performance-in-all-batman-arkham-games/ that the driver in no shape or form can be the cause of my issue and it is all due to some 'phantom' incompatibility between an AMD CPU/MB and the Nvidia card? An incompatibility that did not happen on any of my previous Nvidia cards in my AMD systems?
I know the FX-8350 is weaker than the Intel CPU. My reasons for having it are my own and I do not have to defend them. So far everyone's response seems to be just to blame the AMD CPU for the problems. There seems to be quite a bias against those whose systems are either not Intel or not the absolute fastest specs out there. Anything less and ALL issues are on the system and NEVER on the driver.
BTW - All my drivers are up to date and I completely uninstalled and cleaned the previous Nvidia drivers before installing the 1060.
Arkham games run perfectly here mate. That is what I am saying... Check your config before starting blaming things...
Man, I don't care what CPU you run. You can run an ARM for all I care... Problem is Nvidia WORKS BEST on Intel because of the partnership.
Nvidia nor anyone will care about AMD, unless AMD wants this supported. But remember AMD was the FIRST to ditch stereo 3D (not that they did actually anything for it...).
So, if you have a problem why some software runs poor on AMD hardware go to AMD and let them KNOW it, so they could fix it with Nvidia...
You expect too much...
All we are saying is what you can do to make things better for you. Take it as it is.
You don't like it? Fine. If AMD doesn't care...well I bet Nvidia cares even less...
(I had LOTS of issues with my AMD CPU + Nvidia GPU back in the GTX400 era when nvidia 3D Vision launched. I ditched AMD for Intel. All problems solved. Especially compatibility and such...)
But since you already know better... I don't understand what the purpose of this thread is? Getting Nvidia to fix something that it runs on AMD (competition) ? Never gonna happen mate. Sorry!
Arkham games run perfectly here mate. That is what I am saying... Check your config before starting blaming things...
Man, I don't care what CPU you run. You can run an ARM for all I care... Problem is Nvidia WORKS BEST on Intel because of the partnership.
Nvidia nor anyone will care about AMD, unless AMD wants this supported. But remember AMD was the FIRST to ditch stereo 3D (not that they did actually anything for it...).
So, if you have a problem why some software runs poor on AMD hardware go to AMD and let them KNOW it, so they could fix it with Nvidia...
You expect too much...
All we are saying is what you can do to make things better for you. Take it as it is.
You don't like it? Fine. If AMD doesn't care...well I bet Nvidia cares even less...
(I had LOTS of issues with my AMD CPU + Nvidia GPU back in the GTX400 era when nvidia 3D Vision launched. I ditched AMD for Intel. All problems solved. Especially compatibility and such...)
But since you already know better... I don't understand what the purpose of this thread is? Getting Nvidia to fix something that it runs on AMD (competition) ? Never gonna happen mate. Sorry!
1x Palit RTX 2080Ti Pro Gaming OC(watercooled and overclocked to hell)
3x 3D Vision Ready Asus VG278HE monitors (5760x1080).
Intel i9 9900K (overclocked to 5.3 and watercooled ofc).
Asus Maximus XI Hero Mobo.
16 GB Team Group T-Force Dark Pro DDR4 @ 3600.
Lots of Disks:
- Raid 0 - 256GB Sandisk Extreme SSD.
- Raid 0 - WD Black - 2TB.
- SanDisk SSD PLUS 480 GB.
- Intel 760p 256GB M.2 PCIe NVMe SSD.
Creative Sound Blaster Z.
Windows 10 x64 Pro.
etc
Fine then we will just disagree. I searched for quite a while and I could not find any concrete verifiable evidence that 3d Vision works best - or Nvidia GPUS for that matter - on Intel CPUs and Intel Motherboards. I think you are living in the past. The days of AMD CPUs being incompatible are long gone. I have run AMD CPUs since the K5 days and besides a short jump to Intel with Celeron 300A have always run AMD. I have never experienced any incompatibility or issues caused by running an AMD board/CPU. Not with my 3dfx boards, nor my Geforce 2,4,6,9800,260, or 660ti.
Intel CPUs are much faster than AMD so yes they will give the best performance, but performance vs bugs are a different matter.
If Nvidia wants to publicly state that they do not recommend or support their cards on AMD systems then I will have no choice but to shut-up. Until that day all you said is your opinion not fact.
As you stated this thread is done and I have no further business posting here.
P.S. - Nvidia might be in competition with the AMD Graphics division, but they are no more in competition with AMD CPUs and Motherboards than they are with Intel. In fact Nvidia is in competition with Intel so by that logic they should not fix issues with their graphics cards on Intel systems either. http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2016/08/nvidia-intel-xeon-phi-deep-learning-gpu/
Nvidia is in the business to make money by selling their cards to as many people as possible. If there attitude is to exclude AMD based systems that would be very idiotic.
The reason I am blaming the drivers is simple troubleshooting logic. If things are working fine and you change item Y then the odds favor item Y as being the issue not item X. I changed my Card/Drivers so the probability of the Card/Drivers being the issue is higher than my CPU/MB being the issue. If I had changed CPU or MB or both and not the card and had this issue then you would be correct to assume that those items are the issue and not the Card/Drivers.
The big hitch in my proof is I was running 337.88 on my 660ti. That is known to be a really good driver for 3d. However I cannot install that driver on my 1060 to see if the driver is 100% the issue. It seems highly likely, but is something I cannot beyond a shadow of doubt prove.
Fine then we will just disagree. I searched for quite a while and I could not find any concrete verifiable evidence that 3d Vision works best - or Nvidia GPUS for that matter - on Intel CPUs and Intel Motherboards. I think you are living in the past. The days of AMD CPUs being incompatible are long gone. I have run AMD CPUs since the K5 days and besides a short jump to Intel with Celeron 300A have always run AMD. I have never experienced any incompatibility or issues caused by running an AMD board/CPU. Not with my 3dfx boards, nor my Geforce 2,4,6,9800,260, or 660ti.
Intel CPUs are much faster than AMD so yes they will give the best performance, but performance vs bugs are a different matter.
If Nvidia wants to publicly state that they do not recommend or support their cards on AMD systems then I will have no choice but to shut-up. Until that day all you said is your opinion not fact.
As you stated this thread is done and I have no further business posting here.
P.S. - Nvidia might be in competition with the AMD Graphics division, but they are no more in competition with AMD CPUs and Motherboards than they are with Intel. In fact Nvidia is in competition with Intel so by that logic they should not fix issues with their graphics cards on Intel systems either. http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2016/08/nvidia-intel-xeon-phi-deep-learning-gpu/
Nvidia is in the business to make money by selling their cards to as many people as possible. If there attitude is to exclude AMD based systems that would be very idiotic.
The reason I am blaming the drivers is simple troubleshooting logic. If things are working fine and you change item Y then the odds favor item Y as being the issue not item X. I changed my Card/Drivers so the probability of the Card/Drivers being the issue is higher than my CPU/MB being the issue. If I had changed CPU or MB or both and not the card and had this issue then you would be correct to assume that those items are the issue and not the Card/Drivers.
The big hitch in my proof is I was running 337.88 on my 660ti. That is known to be a really good driver for 3d. However I cannot install that driver on my 1060 to see if the driver is 100% the issue. It seems highly likely, but is something I cannot beyond a shadow of doubt prove.
[quote="terintamel"]Fine then we will just disagree. I searched for quite a while and I could not find any concrete verifiable evidence that 3d Vision works best - or Nvidia GPUS for that matter - on Intel CPUs and Intel Motherboards. I think you are living in the past. The days of AMD CPUs being incompatible are long gone. I have run AMD CPUs since the K5 days and besides a short jump to Intel with Celeron 300A have always run AMD. I have never experienced any incompatibility or issues caused by running an AMD board/CPU. Not with my 3dfx boards, nor my Geforce 2,4,6,9800,260, or 660ti.
Intel CPUs are much faster than AMD so yes they will give the best performance, but performance vs bugs are a different matter.
If Nvidia wants to publicly state that they do not recommend or support their cards on AMD systems then I will have no choice but to shut-up. Until that day all you said is your opinion not fact.
As you stated this thread is done and I have no further business posting here.
P.S. - Nvidia might be in competition with the AMD Graphics division, but they are no more in competition with AMD CPUs and Motherboards than they are with Intel. In fact Nvidia is in competition with Intel so by that logic they should not fix issues with their graphics cards on Intel systems either. http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2016/08/nvidia-intel-xeon-phi-deep-learning-gpu/
Nvidia is in the business to make money by selling their cards to as many people as possible. If there attitude is to exclude AMD based systems that would be very idiotic.
[/quote]
Whatever man.
You asked for help, we tried to help you but it seems that you don't need/want help.
"You just want it to work" :) I get it now.
Sadly that is not how things work in the real world.
terintamel said:Fine then we will just disagree. I searched for quite a while and I could not find any concrete verifiable evidence that 3d Vision works best - or Nvidia GPUS for that matter - on Intel CPUs and Intel Motherboards. I think you are living in the past. The days of AMD CPUs being incompatible are long gone. I have run AMD CPUs since the K5 days and besides a short jump to Intel with Celeron 300A have always run AMD. I have never experienced any incompatibility or issues caused by running an AMD board/CPU. Not with my 3dfx boards, nor my Geforce 2,4,6,9800,260, or 660ti.
Intel CPUs are much faster than AMD so yes they will give the best performance, but performance vs bugs are a different matter.
If Nvidia wants to publicly state that they do not recommend or support their cards on AMD systems then I will have no choice but to shut-up. Until that day all you said is your opinion not fact.
As you stated this thread is done and I have no further business posting here.
P.S. - Nvidia might be in competition with the AMD Graphics division, but they are no more in competition with AMD CPUs and Motherboards than they are with Intel. In fact Nvidia is in competition with Intel so by that logic they should not fix issues with their graphics cards on Intel systems either. http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2016/08/nvidia-intel-xeon-phi-deep-learning-gpu/
Nvidia is in the business to make money by selling their cards to as many people as possible. If there attitude is to exclude AMD based systems that would be very idiotic.
Whatever man.
You asked for help, we tried to help you but it seems that you don't need/want help.
"You just want it to work" :) I get it now.
Sadly that is not how things work in the real world.
1x Palit RTX 2080Ti Pro Gaming OC(watercooled and overclocked to hell)
3x 3D Vision Ready Asus VG278HE monitors (5760x1080).
Intel i9 9900K (overclocked to 5.3 and watercooled ofc).
Asus Maximus XI Hero Mobo.
16 GB Team Group T-Force Dark Pro DDR4 @ 3600.
Lots of Disks:
- Raid 0 - 256GB Sandisk Extreme SSD.
- Raid 0 - WD Black - 2TB.
- SanDisk SSD PLUS 480 GB.
- Intel 760p 256GB M.2 PCIe NVMe SSD.
Creative Sound Blaster Z.
Windows 10 x64 Pro.
etc
Currently I upgraded to a 1060 from a 660ti and now find that games that ran fine before, albeit at a lower framerate, now exhibit stuttering where the scene hitches like it is waiting to load assets and during the hight the fps might drop from 60+ to 20-30 and then go right back up. Also the GPU usage drops to less than 30% during the stutters.
What is also odd is that the stutters and drops only occur if 3d vision is enabled in the Control Panel. It does not matter if I have 3d enabled in game or not. Something is broken in the 3d vision driver code? The games are perfect with 3d vision disabled in the Control Panel
The only thing that has changed in my system is going from a 660ti w/337.88 drivers to a 6GB 1060 running 372.70 drivers.
With both I am running Win 10 x64 on an FX-8350 w/8GB ram.
Here are the games I have tested and found stuttering issues on for now.
Watch Dogs
Far Cry 3 - DX11 (compatability mode)
Arkham Origins - really bad
Games I have tested that run with no issue
Far Cry 3 - DX9
Deus EX HR
Deus Ex MD
Tomb Raider 2013
Thief - new version
Talos Principle
Metro Redux/LL Redux
AMD FX-8350 4GHz
Gigabyte 990FXA-UD3 Rev 4.0
G-Skill PC3-10700- 16GB
Gigabyte Windforce GTX 1060 OC 6GB - 417.01
Creative Soundblaster Z
ViewSonic VX2268WM Black 22" 1680x1050 5ms 120Hz 3Dvision
Windows 10 x64 1709
Asus Deluxe Gen3, Core i7 2700k@4.5Ghz, GTX 1080Ti, 16 GB RAM, Win 7 64bit
Samsung Pro 250 GB SSD, 4 TB WD Black (games)
Benq XL2720Z
I disagree as I did not have the stuttering on this CPU when I used the 660ti and 337.88 drivers. For my tests I have kept the settings the same as I had them when I had the 660ti so I am not stressing my system more than before. Also the stuttering happens even if the 3d is disabled in game (CTRL+T) but enabled in the Control Panel. This appears to be 100% a 3d vision Driver issue, but I am not sure if it is just 370.72 or any driver after 337.88.
Also the 3 games I listed are not ones I would call CPU limited. I would say that Deus EX Mankind Divided is more CPU stressful than any game I listed and it runs fine without the stuttering I describe.
AMD FX-8350 4GHz
Gigabyte 990FXA-UD3 Rev 4.0
G-Skill PC3-10700- 16GB
Gigabyte Windforce GTX 1060 OC 6GB - 417.01
Creative Soundblaster Z
ViewSonic VX2268WM Black 22" 1680x1050 5ms 120Hz 3Dvision
Windows 10 x64 1709
Issues
Far Cry 3: Blood Dragon (DX11) - stutter
Arkham City GOTY - CPU load not evenly distributed between cores. Core 3 keeps a constant over 80% load.
No Issues
Hitman Absolution
AMD FX-8350 4GHz
Gigabyte 990FXA-UD3 Rev 4.0
G-Skill PC3-10700- 16GB
Gigabyte Windforce GTX 1060 OC 6GB - 417.01
Creative Soundblaster Z
ViewSonic VX2268WM Black 22" 1680x1050 5ms 120Hz 3Dvision
Windows 10 x64 1709
AMD FX-8350 4GHz
Gigabyte 990FXA-UD3 Rev 4.0
G-Skill PC3-10700- 16GB
Gigabyte Windforce GTX 1060 OC 6GB - 417.01
Creative Soundblaster Z
ViewSonic VX2268WM Black 22" 1680x1050 5ms 120Hz 3Dvision
Windows 10 x64 1709
It's likely your overall performance has increased significantly. But previously, if you were getting 320fps and had a drop down to 24 when the CPU hit a speedbump, you might not notice. But if you're getting 50 and you drop down to 24 in the same scenario, that drop is going to stick out much more.
The Far Cry games in particular tend to hit the CPU harder than the other games you're testing, which supports this. Mankind Divided actually goes pretty easy on the CPU.
If you have the cooling, overclocking a little might help.
Also, it looks like you're only testing officially supported games. Do you know about helixmod?
I know what you are saying, but here is why I disagree with you. The stuttering only happens when the 3dvision driver is enabled in control panel. It does not matter if I have 3d on in the game or not.
For example I load up Far Cry 3 with 3d Vision enabled and 3d (CTRL+T) on in the game. I have a solid 60fps going. I then begin to walk down the roads/paths and as I walk or turn the camera I get a stutter where GPU usage drops and framerates take a momentary hit down to sub 30fps. I then turn off 3d (CTRL+T) and the max FPS jumps to over 60, as expected since I am not rendering twice for 3d, but as I walk around I get the same stutter and framerate drops as I did with 3d ON.
Next I exit the game and turn off the 3d Vision driver and load up the game again. I keep a constant smooth over 60fps rate (same as with 3d off in game) but without any stutter.
When I was on the 660ti I played the same game at the same settings and with 3d Vision driver enabled/enabled in game and while my framerate was lower it did not have these stalls. Same exact thing happens with Watch Dogs.
I understand that in some games my CPU is a bottleneck, but why does having the 3d Vision Driver enabled, but 3d Off in game cause stutter, but 3d Vision Driver disabled not?
AMD FX-8350 4GHz
Gigabyte 990FXA-UD3 Rev 4.0
G-Skill PC3-10700- 16GB
Gigabyte Windforce GTX 1060 OC 6GB - 417.01
Creative Soundblaster Z
ViewSonic VX2268WM Black 22" 1680x1050 5ms 120Hz 3Dvision
Windows 10 x64 1709
I do know of helixmod use it and love it, but I have not had the time to test every single game I own that does 3d yet.
Another CPU heavy game would be Hitman Absolution, but it does not stutter and stall. What happens in that game is in complex areas the GPU usage drops and the framerate drops, but it is more gradual and does not stutter/visible hitch and stall. The game runs slower, but much smoother. Those types of games I have tried I do not include on the list of games with issues as they are working as expected.
I will say that in no shape or form are the Arkham games that CPU intensive. If you read my notes on Arkham City you can see that with the 3D Vision driver enabled that the CPU core usage is drastically different than with the driver disabled, and with Arkham Origins I can turn all my settings down to the lowest and it still stalls like crazy.
AMD FX-8350 4GHz
Gigabyte 990FXA-UD3 Rev 4.0
G-Skill PC3-10700- 16GB
Gigabyte Windforce GTX 1060 OC 6GB - 417.01
Creative Soundblaster Z
ViewSonic VX2268WM Black 22" 1680x1050 5ms 120Hz 3Dvision
Windows 10 x64 1709
AMD FX-8350 4GHz
Gigabyte 990FXA-UD3 Rev 4.0
G-Skill PC3-10700- 16GB
Gigabyte Windforce GTX 1060 OC 6GB - 417.01
Creative Soundblaster Z
ViewSonic VX2268WM Black 22" 1680x1050 5ms 120Hz 3Dvision
Windows 10 x64 1709
AMD FX-8350 4GHz
Gigabyte 990FXA-UD3 Rev 4.0
G-Skill PC3-10700- 16GB
Gigabyte Windforce GTX 1060 OC 6GB - 417.01
Creative Soundblaster Z
ViewSonic VX2268WM Black 22" 1680x1050 5ms 120Hz 3Dvision
Windows 10 x64 1709
http://cpuboss.com/cpus/Intel-Core-i7-4790K-vs-AMD-FX-8350
It doesn't talk about a lot of important things:
- HyperThreading which AMD lacks
- Virtualization which AMD lacks
- Bandwidth and etc...
Also why in the world would you pair a AMD CPU with a Nvidia GPU ???
If you want an AMD CPU go with an AMD GPU. For Nvidia go with Intel.
It's DOWN to the so-called "north-bridge" (as it was used to be called) controller.
I bet there is where your problem is.
As for the Nvidia Driver. It has many flaws and issues but what you are describing is absolutely NOT PRESENT.
The problem for you is most likely in a totally different place.
It would also be good to update ALL your drivers.
Run DDU
Install the semi-last nvidia driver (previous driver from 372.77).
Maybe this will solve it for you as the behaviour is weird to say the least.
1x Palit RTX 2080Ti Pro Gaming OC(watercooled and overclocked to hell)
3x 3D Vision Ready Asus VG278HE monitors (5760x1080).
Intel i9 9900K (overclocked to 5.3 and watercooled ofc).
Asus Maximus XI Hero Mobo.
16 GB Team Group T-Force Dark Pro DDR4 @ 3600.
Lots of Disks:
- Raid 0 - 256GB Sandisk Extreme SSD.
- Raid 0 - WD Black - 2TB.
- SanDisk SSD PLUS 480 GB.
- Intel 760p 256GB M.2 PCIe NVMe SSD.
Creative Sound Blaster Z.
Windows 10 x64 Pro.
etc
My website with my fixes and OpenGL to 3D Vision wrapper:
http://3dsurroundgaming.com
(If you like some of the stuff that I've done and want to donate something, you can do it with PayPal at tavyhome@gmail.com)
So what your telling me is even though the 3d Vision Driver has serious issues in the Arkham games since 337.88 https://forums.geforce.com/default/topic/809465/3d-vision/poor-3dvision-performance-in-all-batman-arkham-games/ that the driver in no shape or form can be the cause of my issue and it is all due to some 'phantom' incompatibility between an AMD CPU/MB and the Nvidia card? An incompatibility that did not happen on any of my previous Nvidia cards in my AMD systems?
I know the FX-8350 is weaker than the Intel CPU. My reasons for having it are my own and I do not have to defend them. So far everyone's response seems to be just to blame the AMD CPU for the problems. There seems to be quite a bias against those whose systems are either not Intel or not the absolute fastest specs out there. Anything less and ALL issues are on the system and NEVER on the driver.
BTW - All my drivers are up to date and I completely uninstalled and cleaned the previous Nvidia drivers before installing the 1060.
AMD FX-8350 4GHz
Gigabyte 990FXA-UD3 Rev 4.0
G-Skill PC3-10700- 16GB
Gigabyte Windforce GTX 1060 OC 6GB - 417.01
Creative Soundblaster Z
ViewSonic VX2268WM Black 22" 1680x1050 5ms 120Hz 3Dvision
Windows 10 x64 1709
Man, I don't care what CPU you run. You can run an ARM for all I care... Problem is Nvidia WORKS BEST on Intel because of the partnership.
Nvidia nor anyone will care about AMD, unless AMD wants this supported. But remember AMD was the FIRST to ditch stereo 3D (not that they did actually anything for it...).
So, if you have a problem why some software runs poor on AMD hardware go to AMD and let them KNOW it, so they could fix it with Nvidia...
You expect too much...
All we are saying is what you can do to make things better for you. Take it as it is.
You don't like it? Fine. If AMD doesn't care...well I bet Nvidia cares even less...
(I had LOTS of issues with my AMD CPU + Nvidia GPU back in the GTX400 era when nvidia 3D Vision launched. I ditched AMD for Intel. All problems solved. Especially compatibility and such...)
But since you already know better... I don't understand what the purpose of this thread is? Getting Nvidia to fix something that it runs on AMD (competition) ? Never gonna happen mate. Sorry!
1x Palit RTX 2080Ti Pro Gaming OC(watercooled and overclocked to hell)
3x 3D Vision Ready Asus VG278HE monitors (5760x1080).
Intel i9 9900K (overclocked to 5.3 and watercooled ofc).
Asus Maximus XI Hero Mobo.
16 GB Team Group T-Force Dark Pro DDR4 @ 3600.
Lots of Disks:
- Raid 0 - 256GB Sandisk Extreme SSD.
- Raid 0 - WD Black - 2TB.
- SanDisk SSD PLUS 480 GB.
- Intel 760p 256GB M.2 PCIe NVMe SSD.
Creative Sound Blaster Z.
Windows 10 x64 Pro.
etc
My website with my fixes and OpenGL to 3D Vision wrapper:
http://3dsurroundgaming.com
(If you like some of the stuff that I've done and want to donate something, you can do it with PayPal at tavyhome@gmail.com)
Intel CPUs are much faster than AMD so yes they will give the best performance, but performance vs bugs are a different matter.
If Nvidia wants to publicly state that they do not recommend or support their cards on AMD systems then I will have no choice but to shut-up. Until that day all you said is your opinion not fact.
As you stated this thread is done and I have no further business posting here.
P.S. - Nvidia might be in competition with the AMD Graphics division, but they are no more in competition with AMD CPUs and Motherboards than they are with Intel. In fact Nvidia is in competition with Intel so by that logic they should not fix issues with their graphics cards on Intel systems either. http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2016/08/nvidia-intel-xeon-phi-deep-learning-gpu/
Nvidia is in the business to make money by selling their cards to as many people as possible. If there attitude is to exclude AMD based systems that would be very idiotic.
The reason I am blaming the drivers is simple troubleshooting logic. If things are working fine and you change item Y then the odds favor item Y as being the issue not item X. I changed my Card/Drivers so the probability of the Card/Drivers being the issue is higher than my CPU/MB being the issue. If I had changed CPU or MB or both and not the card and had this issue then you would be correct to assume that those items are the issue and not the Card/Drivers.
The big hitch in my proof is I was running 337.88 on my 660ti. That is known to be a really good driver for 3d. However I cannot install that driver on my 1060 to see if the driver is 100% the issue. It seems highly likely, but is something I cannot beyond a shadow of doubt prove.
AMD FX-8350 4GHz
Gigabyte 990FXA-UD3 Rev 4.0
G-Skill PC3-10700- 16GB
Gigabyte Windforce GTX 1060 OC 6GB - 417.01
Creative Soundblaster Z
ViewSonic VX2268WM Black 22" 1680x1050 5ms 120Hz 3Dvision
Windows 10 x64 1709
Whatever man.
You asked for help, we tried to help you but it seems that you don't need/want help.
"You just want it to work" :) I get it now.
Sadly that is not how things work in the real world.
1x Palit RTX 2080Ti Pro Gaming OC(watercooled and overclocked to hell)
3x 3D Vision Ready Asus VG278HE monitors (5760x1080).
Intel i9 9900K (overclocked to 5.3 and watercooled ofc).
Asus Maximus XI Hero Mobo.
16 GB Team Group T-Force Dark Pro DDR4 @ 3600.
Lots of Disks:
- Raid 0 - 256GB Sandisk Extreme SSD.
- Raid 0 - WD Black - 2TB.
- SanDisk SSD PLUS 480 GB.
- Intel 760p 256GB M.2 PCIe NVMe SSD.
Creative Sound Blaster Z.
Windows 10 x64 Pro.
etc
My website with my fixes and OpenGL to 3D Vision wrapper:
http://3dsurroundgaming.com
(If you like some of the stuff that I've done and want to donate something, you can do it with PayPal at tavyhome@gmail.com)