Assassin's creed Syndicate 3Dvision
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[quote="Blacksmith56"][quote="SubjectBucko"]I would also like to do some testing on my 6 core/12 thread I7 4960x. Forgive my ignorance but how are you disabling cores/threads: in the bios, in task manager set affinity or in msconfig windows boot. Also I know MSI afterburner allows use to display CPU core useage in the OSD but this does not display in many games like Mad Max or Star Wars Battlefront. What is the best way to test CPU useage with 3d vision? I would also like to test the differences, if they are any, in true 3d vision and CM 3d vision cpu useage. Did anyone else notice that in Star Wars Battlefront, the 3d compatability mode is not showing any haloing around character and player models? I just alt+tab out of the game and set affinity in taskmanager.[/quote][quote="Blacksmith56"][quote="SubjectBucko"]I would also like to do some testing on my 6 core/12 thread I7 4960x. Forgive my ignorance but how are you disabling cores/threads: in the bios, in task manager set affinity or in msconfig windows boot. Also I know MSI afterburner allows use to display CPU core useage in the OSD but this does not display in many games like Mad Max or Star Wars Battlefront. Thanks for the prompt reply. Are you able to use any OSD's to check cpu core useage or are you using fps performance as a indirect measure of cpu core performance/limitations?
Blacksmith56 said:
SubjectBucko said:I would also like to do some testing on my 6 core/12 thread I7 4960x. Forgive my ignorance but how are you disabling cores/threads: in the bios, in task manager set affinity or in msconfig windows boot. Also I know MSI afterburner allows use to display CPU core useage in the OSD but this does not display in many games like Mad Max or Star Wars Battlefront.

What is the best way to test CPU useage with 3d vision? I would also like to test the differences, if they are any, in true 3d vision and CM 3d vision cpu useage. Did anyone else notice that in Star Wars Battlefront, the 3d compatability mode is not showing any haloing around character and player models?

I just alt+tab out of the game and set affinity in taskmanager.
Blacksmith56 said:
SubjectBucko said:I would also like to do some testing on my 6 core/12 thread I7 4960x. Forgive my ignorance but how are you disabling cores/threads: in the bios, in task manager set affinity or in msconfig windows boot. Also I know MSI afterburner allows use to display CPU core useage in the OSD but this does not display in many games like Mad Max or Star Wars Battlefront.


Thanks for the prompt reply. Are you able to use any OSD's to check cpu core useage or are you using fps performance as a indirect measure of cpu core performance/limitations?

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#46
Posted 11/21/2015 06:30 PM   
I'm using the software provided with my graphic Card, namely EVGA precision X wich has OSD.
I'm using the software provided with my graphic Card, namely EVGA precision X wich has OSD.

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#47
Posted 11/21/2015 07:25 PM   
[quote="Blacksmith56"][quote="bo3b"]For that big a drop in performance, it seems like that is probably the 3 core problem again. Same as GTA5. If anybody gets a chance you can try the affinity test, to see if performance changes as you add cores. On GTA5, the performance stopped going up after 3 cores. https://forums.geforce.com/default/topic/832496/3d-vision/3d-vision-cpu-core-bottleneck/[/quote]Ok - have made a test ! I'm 99.9% certain of that it only uses 3 cores, I don't see any performance raise from 3 to 4 cores. Holy s... it's CPU dependent !!About 5 fps with one core :D Edit: I don't get it !! It's several years ago you could call 3 cores defacto.[/quote] Thanks for trying that experiment, that definitely is bad news for this game engine, as it's in the 3D driver where we think this 3 core problem exists. Pretty sure this is the 3D driver, because we have the problem on a couple of other "next-gen" games.
Blacksmith56 said:
bo3b said:For that big a drop in performance, it seems like that is probably the 3 core problem again. Same as GTA5.

If anybody gets a chance you can try the affinity test, to see if performance changes as you add cores. On GTA5, the performance stopped going up after 3 cores.


https://forums.geforce.com/default/topic/832496/3d-vision/3d-vision-cpu-core-bottleneck/
Ok - have made a test !
I'm 99.9% certain of that it only uses 3 cores, I don't see any performance raise from 3 to 4 cores.

Holy s... it's CPU dependent !!About 5 fps with one core :D

Edit: I don't get it !! It's several years ago you could call 3 cores defacto.

Thanks for trying that experiment, that definitely is bad news for this game engine, as it's in the 3D driver where we think this 3 core problem exists.

Pretty sure this is the 3D driver, because we have the problem on a couple of other "next-gen" games.

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#48
Posted 11/22/2015 01:50 AM   
[quote="bo3b"][quote="Blacksmith56"][quote="bo3b"]For that big a drop in performance, it seems like that is probably the 3 core problem again. Same as GTA5. If anybody gets a chance you can try the affinity test, to see if performance changes as you add cores. On GTA5, the performance stopped going up after 3 cores. https://forums.geforce.com/default/topic/832496/3d-vision/3d-vision-cpu-core-bottleneck/[/quote]Ok - have made a test ! I'm 99.9% certain of that it only uses 3 cores, I don't see any performance raise from 3 to 4 cores. Holy s... it's CPU dependent !!About 5 fps with one core :D Edit: I don't get it !! It's several years ago you could call 3 cores defacto.[/quote] Thanks for trying that experiment, that definitely is bad news for this game engine, as it's in the 3D driver where we think this 3 core problem exists. Pretty sure this is the 3D driver, because we have the problem on a couple of other "next-gen" games.[/quote] What makes you think that it's driver, what about my result from the Witcher 3 "test" ? As you can see that game really takes advantage of all cores.. With my limited knowlege - I would say it's the game engine.. Edit: Maybee SubjectBucko could provide us with some info about how the games behave with 6 cores ?
bo3b said:
Blacksmith56 said:
bo3b said:For that big a drop in performance, it seems like that is probably the 3 core problem again. Same as GTA5.

If anybody gets a chance you can try the affinity test, to see if performance changes as you add cores. On GTA5, the performance stopped going up after 3 cores.

https://forums.geforce.com/default/topic/832496/3d-vision/3d-vision-cpu-core-bottleneck/
Ok - have made a test !
I'm 99.9% certain of that it only uses 3 cores, I don't see any performance raise from 3 to 4 cores.

Holy s... it's CPU dependent !!About 5 fps with one core :D

Edit: I don't get it !! It's several years ago you could call 3 cores defacto.

Thanks for trying that experiment, that definitely is bad news for this game engine, as it's in the 3D driver where we think this 3 core problem exists.

Pretty sure this is the 3D driver, because we have the problem on a couple of other "next-gen" games.


What makes you think that it's driver, what about my result from the Witcher 3 "test" ?
As you can see that game really takes advantage of all cores..

With my limited knowlege - I would say it's the game engine..

Edit: Maybee SubjectBucko could provide us with some info about how the games behave with 6 cores ?

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#49
Posted 11/22/2015 09:48 AM   
[quote="Blacksmith56"][quote="bo3b"][quote="Blacksmith56"][quote="bo3b"]For that big a drop in performance, it seems like that is probably the 3 core problem again. Same as GTA5. If anybody gets a chance you can try the affinity test, to see if performance changes as you add cores. On GTA5, the performance stopped going up after 3 cores. https://forums.geforce.com/default/topic/832496/3d-vision/3d-vision-cpu-core-bottleneck/[/quote]Ok - have made a test ! I'm 99.9% certain of that it only uses 3 cores, I don't see any performance raise from 3 to 4 cores. Holy s... it's CPU dependent !!About 5 fps with one core :D Edit: I don't get it !! It's several years ago you could call 3 cores defacto.[/quote] Thanks for trying that experiment, that definitely is bad news for this game engine, as it's in the 3D driver where we think this 3 core problem exists. Pretty sure this is the 3D driver, because we have the problem on a couple of other "next-gen" games.[/quote]What makes you think that it's driver, what about my result from the Witcher 3 "test" ? As you can see that game really takes advantage of all cores.. With my limited knowlege - I would say it's the game engine.. Edit: Maybee SubjectBucko could provide us with some info about how the games behave with 6 cores ?[/quote] GTA5 and Dying Light both have the same problem. I'm less sure about Witcher3 and how it might be using more cores. Could be as simple as Witcher3 is GPU bound to begin with.
Blacksmith56 said:
bo3b said:
Blacksmith56 said:
bo3b said:For that big a drop in performance, it seems like that is probably the 3 core problem again. Same as GTA5.

If anybody gets a chance you can try the affinity test, to see if performance changes as you add cores. On GTA5, the performance stopped going up after 3 cores.


https://forums.geforce.com/default/topic/832496/3d-vision/3d-vision-cpu-core-bottleneck/
Ok - have made a test !
I'm 99.9% certain of that it only uses 3 cores, I don't see any performance raise from 3 to 4 cores.

Holy s... it's CPU dependent !!About 5 fps with one core :D

Edit: I don't get it !! It's several years ago you could call 3 cores defacto.

Thanks for trying that experiment, that definitely is bad news for this game engine, as it's in the 3D driver where we think this 3 core problem exists.

Pretty sure this is the 3D driver, because we have the problem on a couple of other "next-gen" games.
What makes you think that it's driver, what about my result from the Witcher 3 "test" ?
As you can see that game really takes advantage of all cores..

With my limited knowlege - I would say it's the game engine..

Edit: Maybee SubjectBucko could provide us with some info about how the games behave with 6 cores ?

GTA5 and Dying Light both have the same problem. I'm less sure about Witcher3 and how it might be using more cores. Could be as simple as Witcher3 is GPU bound to begin with.

Acer H5360 (1280x720@120Hz) - ASUS VG248QE with GSync mod - 3D Vision 1&2 - Driver 372.54
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#50
Posted 11/22/2015 11:11 AM   
[quote="bo3b"][quote="Blacksmith56"][quote="bo3b"][quote="Blacksmith56"][quote="bo3b"] Edit: Maybee SubjectBucko could provide us with some info about how the games behave with 6 cores ?[/quote] GTA5 and Dying Light both have the same problem. I'm less sure about Witcher3 and how it might be using more cores. Could be as simple as Witcher3 is GPU bound to begin with. [/quote] [/quote] [/quote] [/quote] I did some testing with Mad Max in 3d vision surround (5760x1080). 2 cores 3ds 16-20fps, 3 cores 3ds 55-60fps, 4 cores 3ds 75-80fps, small increase by between 2-5fps until 6 cores and then no increase in fps noted. I think this helps show that the 3d vision driver is not hardlocked to limiting cpu core useage to 3 cores. Also if a game is gpu bound then increasing cpu performance/core useage will not yield higher fps as the gpu is the rate limting factor... So would this not be more sense in applying to GTA5 as an explanation for the cpu core findings.
bo3b said:
Blacksmith56 said:
bo3b said:
Blacksmith56 said:
bo3b said:

Edit: Maybee SubjectBucko could provide us with some info about how the games behave with 6 cores ?

GTA5 and Dying Light both have the same problem. I'm less sure about Witcher3 and how it might be using more cores. Could be as simple as Witcher3 is GPU bound to begin with.


I did some testing with Mad Max in 3d vision surround (5760x1080). 2 cores 3ds 16-20fps, 3 cores 3ds 55-60fps, 4 cores 3ds 75-80fps, small increase by between 2-5fps until 6 cores and then no increase in fps noted.

I think this helps show that the 3d vision driver is not hardlocked to limiting cpu core useage to 3 cores.

Also if a game is gpu bound then increasing cpu performance/core useage will not yield higher fps as the gpu is the rate limting factor... So would this not be more sense in applying to GTA5 as an explanation for the cpu core findings.

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#51
Posted 11/22/2015 02:36 PM   
I did some testing on Dying Light, single screen 3d (real and CM) with single card 980 ti and 980 ti 2-way sli. On a single card, in 1920x1080 resolution, performance stops increasing after 3 cpu cores/threads are enabled. I getting approx. 120-160fps with one 980 ti in CM mode. Dropping down from 3 cpu cores to 1 cpu core, I was still getting around 100fps. With sli enabled, performance was 200-260 fps CM mode and 120-160 real 3d on 12 cpu cores/threads. Dropping down to 6 or 3 cores showed significant drop in fps with 80-100 fps on 3 core real 3d and 120-160 on CM mode 3 cores.Peformance increased slightly even going from 10 to 12 cores. I think this also shows the problem does not appear to be with the 3d vision driver, but rather that the newer games tend to be gpu bound to one degree or another. I was walking around the first safe house using EVGA Precision X OSD and ALt-tabbing to change set affinity in Task manager. Unfortunately MSI Afterburner OSD which does display cpu core useage does not work in this game. Does anyone know of another OSD or another method that cpu core useage can be looked at directly in real time or recorded in real time?
I did some testing on Dying Light, single screen 3d (real and CM) with single card 980 ti and 980 ti 2-way sli. On a single card, in 1920x1080 resolution, performance stops increasing after 3 cpu cores/threads are enabled. I getting approx. 120-160fps with one 980 ti in CM mode. Dropping down from 3 cpu cores to 1 cpu core, I was still getting around 100fps.

With sli enabled, performance was 200-260 fps CM mode and 120-160 real 3d on 12 cpu cores/threads. Dropping down to 6 or 3 cores showed significant drop in fps with 80-100 fps on 3 core real 3d and 120-160 on CM mode 3 cores.Peformance increased slightly even going from 10 to 12 cores.

I think this also shows the problem does not appear to be with the 3d vision driver, but rather that the newer games tend to be gpu bound to one degree or another.

I was walking around the first safe house using EVGA Precision X OSD and ALt-tabbing to change set affinity in Task manager. Unfortunately MSI Afterburner OSD which does display cpu core useage does not work in this game. Does anyone know of another OSD or another method that cpu core useage can be looked at directly in real time or recorded in real time?

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#52
Posted 11/22/2015 03:32 PM   
I starting to thing that is issue is related to game engine....that explain why Mad Max have great performance and TW3 also (engines use all cores)...and crappy performance in GTA V and AC Unity/AC Syndicate. Lazy developers will explaing that 2-3 core issue, more cores supported by the engine means more time and effort in develop it. And if you add the poor optimization with the last 2 AC games....we get this results.
I starting to thing that is issue is related to game engine....that explain why Mad Max have great performance and TW3 also (engines use all cores)...and crappy performance in GTA V and AC Unity/AC Syndicate. Lazy developers will explaing that 2-3 core issue, more cores supported by the engine means more time and effort in develop it. And if you add the poor optimization with the last 2 AC games....we get this results.

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#53
Posted 11/22/2015 03:53 PM   
[quote="DHR"]I starting to thing that is issue is related to game engine....that explain why Mad Max have great performance and TW3 also (engines use all cores)...and crappy performance in GTA V and AC Unity/AC Syndicate. Lazy developers will explaing that 2-3 core issue, more cores supported by the engine means more time and effort in develop it. And if you add the poor optimization with the last 2 AC games....we get this results.[/quote] Thanks SubjectBucko ! DHR - agreed, but AC Syndicate doesn't seem very poor optimized. There's something odd going on when you get 110-120 fps in 2d and 15-25 fps in 3D. In GTA well I get arround 90 fps in 2D and 40 in 3D, thats is you might say normal for games with half the fps in 3D, and it's at least playable.
DHR said:I starting to thing that is issue is related to game engine....that explain why Mad Max have great performance and TW3 also (engines use all cores)...and crappy performance in GTA V and AC Unity/AC Syndicate. Lazy developers will explaing that 2-3 core issue, more cores supported by the engine means more time and effort in develop it. And if you add the poor optimization with the last 2 AC games....we get this results.


Thanks SubjectBucko !

DHR - agreed, but AC Syndicate doesn't seem very poor optimized.
There's something odd going on when you get 110-120 fps in 2d and 15-25 fps in 3D.

In GTA well I get arround 90 fps in 2D and 40 in 3D, thats is you might say normal for games with half the fps in 3D, and it's at least playable.

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#54
Posted 11/22/2015 04:25 PM   
AC Syndicate seems to have normal performance in 2D (suppose using 9X% of 3 cores or almost near 99%%), so when you activate 3D CPU is already full, so the hit in fps is not half.....is way higher because of the CPU 3 core bottleneck. With GTA V i have great performance using 720p (50 - 60 fps) after some patches and newer driver, so i suppose with 720p i'm in the limit. But a lot of user says the performance is bad (1080p users)...so i add to the example.
AC Syndicate seems to have normal performance in 2D (suppose using 9X% of 3 cores or almost near 99%%), so when you activate 3D CPU is already full, so the hit in fps is not half.....is way higher because of the CPU 3 core bottleneck.

With GTA V i have great performance using 720p (50 - 60 fps) after some patches and newer driver, so i suppose with 720p i'm in the limit. But a lot of user says the performance is bad (1080p users)...so i add to the example.

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#55
Posted 11/22/2015 05:42 PM   
Interesting results. It's always possible that they fixed the bug in the most recent drivers, it's from a different code branch and fixed a bunch of other stuff. If someone is motivated, the easiest example to see this problem was GTA5. In 2D, there is clear multi-core scaling using all cores available. In 3D, it was equally clear that the multi-core part was no longer working.
Interesting results. It's always possible that they fixed the bug in the most recent drivers, it's from a different code branch and fixed a bunch of other stuff.

If someone is motivated, the easiest example to see this problem was GTA5. In 2D, there is clear multi-core scaling using all cores available. In 3D, it was equally clear that the multi-core part was no longer working.

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#56
Posted 11/23/2015 07:34 AM   
So , Does this game enter to the "unfixable games list" same as Call of duty:BO3 destiny?
So , Does this game enter to the "unfixable games list" same as Call of duty:BO3 destiny?

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#57
Posted 11/23/2015 10:01 AM   
So far, it doesn't seem like anyone is actively looking to fix it.
So far, it doesn't seem like anyone is actively looking to fix it.

#58
Posted 11/23/2015 10:51 AM   
[quote="bo3b"]Interesting results. It's always possible that they fixed the bug in the most recent drivers, it's from a different code branch and fixed a bunch of other stuff. If someone is motivated, the easiest example to see this problem was GTA5. In 2D, there is clear multi-core scaling using all cores available. In 3D, it was equally clear that the multi-core part was no longer working.[/quote] Tried it in GTA V, measured on the same spot, a crowded corner in the city on foot. 3 cores, 2D, 65 fps 3 cores, 3D, 30 fps 4 cores, 2D, 90 fps 4 cores, 3D, 40 fps
bo3b said:Interesting results. It's always possible that they fixed the bug in the most recent drivers, it's from a different code branch and fixed a bunch of other stuff.

If someone is motivated, the easiest example to see this problem was GTA5. In 2D, there is clear multi-core scaling using all cores available. In 3D, it was equally clear that the multi-core part was no longer working.


Tried it in GTA V, measured on the same spot, a crowded corner in the city on foot.
3 cores, 2D, 65 fps
3 cores, 3D, 30 fps
4 cores, 2D, 90 fps
4 cores, 3D, 40 fps

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#59
Posted 11/23/2015 10:57 AM   
[quote="dekgol"]So , Does this game enter to the "unfixable games list" same as Call of duty:BO3 destiny? [/quote] I would have loved a fix, but if the 3D performance doesn't get any better, it will be a waste of time.
dekgol said:So , Does this game enter to the "unfixable games list" same as Call of duty:BO3 destiny?


I would have loved a fix, but if the 3D performance doesn't get any better, it will be a waste of time.

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#60
Posted 11/23/2015 11:03 AM   
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