120Hz 2D Mode Still Choppy Windows Desktop is NOT Smooth!
I am trying to use the Acer HN274H in 120Hz for 2D applications, like the Windows desktop. Although the Nvidia control panel (or Windows itself) will allow me to chose 1080P @ 120Hz, the Windows interface does not appear to be updating at that high speed. For example, dragging windows around the screen still has a lot of motion blur and the overall experience is very choppy. Now, I have seen this same monitor on another system, and it was smooth as butter. So I know exactly what 120Hz looks like. And this isn't it. Strangely, if I run FRAPS on the desktop it claims I'm getting 120fps, but that can't be true. Also, when running games (for example HL2) where I can get over 300fps, it still looks choppy. If I set VSync on, FRAPS again claims 120fps. But it doesn't look that smooth. Maybe it looks better than 60Hz, but its certainly not 120Hz. Whats the deal here? Is there some setting I am missing?
This is on a fresh install of Windows 7 64-bit SP1 with the latest Nvidia driver (270.61) on the following hardware:
GTX 470, 780i, E8400 @ 3.6Ghz, 6GB DDR2
And, yes, I am using a dual-link DVI cable that came with the monitor. I have no problems running 3D applications, using the glasses, etc. Its just 2D applications that are bugged. I have tried lowering the resolution, changing color depth, setting refresh to 110Hz or 100Hz, creating a custom resolution/refresh mode (1080P @ 120Hz), switching DVI ports on the video card, etc. Nothing works.
I am trying to use the Acer HN274H in 120Hz for 2D applications, like the Windows desktop. Although the Nvidia control panel (or Windows itself) will allow me to chose 1080P @ 120Hz, the Windows interface does not appear to be updating at that high speed. For example, dragging windows around the screen still has a lot of motion blur and the overall experience is very choppy. Now, I have seen this same monitor on another system, and it was smooth as butter. So I know exactly what 120Hz looks like. And this isn't it. Strangely, if I run FRAPS on the desktop it claims I'm getting 120fps, but that can't be true. Also, when running games (for example HL2) where I can get over 300fps, it still looks choppy. If I set VSync on, FRAPS again claims 120fps. But it doesn't look that smooth. Maybe it looks better than 60Hz, but its certainly not 120Hz. Whats the deal here? Is there some setting I am missing?
This is on a fresh install of Windows 7 64-bit SP1 with the latest Nvidia driver (270.61) on the following hardware:
GTX 470, 780i, E8400 @ 3.6Ghz, 6GB DDR2
And, yes, I am using a dual-link DVI cable that came with the monitor. I have no problems running 3D applications, using the glasses, etc. Its just 2D applications that are bugged. I have tried lowering the resolution, changing color depth, setting refresh to 110Hz or 100Hz, creating a custom resolution/refresh mode (1080P @ 120Hz), switching DVI ports on the video card, etc. Nothing works.
I think something is seriously wrong with either your monitor or gpu/drivers. I have same monitor with gtx 580 sli, windows 7 64 bit at 1080p. I have zero problems on both 2D and 3D
I think something is seriously wrong with either your monitor or gpu/drivers. I have same monitor with gtx 580 sli, windows 7 64 bit at 1080p. I have zero problems on both 2D and 3D
[quote name='cybereality' date='08 May 2011 - 08:00 PM' timestamp='1304877616' post='1234848']
the overall experience is very choppy[/quote]
Do you by any chance have a wireless mouse? I had a very similar problem, and it turned out that it was caused by the mouse not sending enough events per second to Windows. To check whether this is your case, with no need to buy anything, you can use this simple trick: pick an FPS game where you have a high frame rate, look towards a patterned wall, then slide laterally with the keys A-D. If sliding with the keyboard is smooth, while turning around with the mouse is choppy, you have found your problem!
[quote name='cybereality' date='08 May 2011 - 08:00 PM' timestamp='1304877616' post='1234848']
the overall experience is very choppy
Do you by any chance have a wireless mouse? I had a very similar problem, and it turned out that it was caused by the mouse not sending enough events per second to Windows. To check whether this is your case, with no need to buy anything, you can use this simple trick: pick an FPS game where you have a high frame rate, look towards a patterned wall, then slide laterally with the keys A-D. If sliding with the keyboard is smooth, while turning around with the mouse is choppy, you have found your problem!
@ AXWMajor: Thanks you so much! It was the mouse!!! The difference is night and day. Whats funny is that I was using a wired laser mouse, the Logitech M500 (which I paid like $60 for when it came out). The mouse that works is also Logitech but its some cheapo optical one I got for $5. WTH!?!? At least I know what the problem is, but I really liked that Logitech mouse with the frictionless scroll-wheel. What am I to do?
@ AXWMajor: Thanks you so much! It was the mouse!!! The difference is night and day. Whats funny is that I was using a wired laser mouse, the Logitech M500 (which I paid like $60 for when it came out). The mouse that works is also Logitech but its some cheapo optical one I got for $5. WTH!?!? At least I know what the problem is, but I really liked that Logitech mouse with the frictionless scroll-wheel. What am I to do?
Get a Razer Death Adder, w/ cord. I'm using one. only 50 bucks, 3500dpi res, good weight,5 buttons, cool glowy lights on it. Works beautifully in 120hz 2d mode.
Get a Razer Death Adder, w/ cord. I'm using one. only 50 bucks, 3500dpi res, good weight,5 buttons, cool glowy lights on it. Works beautifully in 120hz 2d mode.
AsRock X58 Extreme6 mobo
Intel Core-i7 950 @ 4ghz
12gb Corsair Dominator DDR3 1600
ASUS DirectCU II GTX 780 3gb
Corsair TX 950w PSU
NZXT Phantom Red/Black Case
3d Vision 1 w/ Samsung 2233rz Monitor
3d Vision 2 w/ ASUS VG278HE Monitor
@AcidBong: Yeah, I just picked up the DeathAdder today. With the 1000Hz polling rate, I think I'm good. Everything is silky smooth. Should have bought this a while ago.
@andrewf@nvidia: Thanks for looking into this. Hopefully this isn't a problem with a lot of mice. Would suck if people weren't getting the full 120Hz experience.
@AcidBong: Yeah, I just picked up the DeathAdder today. With the 1000Hz polling rate, I think I'm good. Everything is silky smooth. Should have bought this a while ago.
@andrewf@nvidia: Thanks for looking into this. Hopefully this isn't a problem with a lot of mice. Would suck if people weren't getting the full 120Hz experience.
Look, heres a research about this , why 2d 120hz on LCD monitors is a bit *tricky*
http://www.mpi-inf.mpg.de/resources/3DTemporalUpsampling/3DTemporalUpsampling.pdf
& even if you get it to work , the thing will be still limited by motion blur at 120hz.
Motion blur at 120hz, yes, sounds bad, but that's just 2D LCD... //hold display//
The motion blur is very much reduced from standard 60Hz displays. Most evident when using the monitor in 2D at 120Hz, but it also helps when running games in 3D. It is not perfect, there is still some blur, but it is within reasonable limits.
The motion blur is very much reduced from standard 60Hz displays. Most evident when using the monitor in 2D at 120Hz, but it also helps when running games in 3D. It is not perfect, there is still some blur, but it is within reasonable limits.
This is on a fresh install of Windows 7 64-bit SP1 with the latest Nvidia driver (270.61) on the following hardware:
GTX 470, 780i, E8400 @ 3.6Ghz, 6GB DDR2
And, yes, I am using a dual-link DVI cable that came with the monitor. I have no problems running 3D applications, using the glasses, etc. Its just 2D applications that are bugged. I have tried lowering the resolution, changing color depth, setting refresh to 110Hz or 100Hz, creating a custom resolution/refresh mode (1080P @ 120Hz), switching DVI ports on the video card, etc. Nothing works.
Please help.
This is on a fresh install of Windows 7 64-bit SP1 with the latest Nvidia driver (270.61) on the following hardware:
GTX 470, 780i, E8400 @ 3.6Ghz, 6GB DDR2
And, yes, I am using a dual-link DVI cable that came with the monitor. I have no problems running 3D applications, using the glasses, etc. Its just 2D applications that are bugged. I have tried lowering the resolution, changing color depth, setting refresh to 110Hz or 100Hz, creating a custom resolution/refresh mode (1080P @ 120Hz), switching DVI ports on the video card, etc. Nothing works.
Please help.
check my blog - cybereality.com
I7 8700K
Asrock Killer Z370
G.Skill 16gb DDR4 3000 Ram
Gigabyte RTX 2080
Corsair AX1200 watts Platinum PSU
1tb Samsung 840 Evo SSD
BenQ 27 inch 4K monitor
Asus VG278H 27 inch 3D monitor
check my blog - cybereality.com
I do think it's a videodriver program,but it could be something else...
This sounds strange ,but what are you using for your audio ?
Onboard or audio card ?
I do think it's a videodriver program,but it could be something else...
This sounds strange ,but what are you using for your audio ?
Onboard or audio card ?
Intel I7 3820 3.8 Ghz,MSI MS7760 Motherboard, 6GB )2x MSI GTX670 (SLI),OCZ Vertex 230Gb SSD,OCZ Agility 120Gb SSD, Asus 3D VG278HR ,Optoma HD67 3D DLP Beamer with 95inch 2.5 gain screen.
the overall experience is very choppy[/quote]
Do you by any chance have a wireless mouse? I had a very similar problem, and it turned out that it was caused by the mouse not sending enough events per second to Windows. To check whether this is your case, with no need to buy anything, you can use this simple trick: pick an FPS game where you have a high frame rate, look towards a patterned wall, then slide laterally with the keys A-D. If sliding with the keyboard is smooth, while turning around with the mouse is choppy, you have found your problem!
the overall experience is very choppy
Do you by any chance have a wireless mouse? I had a very similar problem, and it turned out that it was caused by the mouse not sending enough events per second to Windows. To check whether this is your case, with no need to buy anything, you can use this simple trick: pick an FPS game where you have a high frame rate, look towards a patterned wall, then slide laterally with the keys A-D. If sliding with the keyboard is smooth, while turning around with the mouse is choppy, you have found your problem!
check my blog - cybereality.com
AsRock X58 Extreme6 mobo
Intel Core-i7 950 @ 4ghz
12gb Corsair Dominator DDR3 1600
ASUS DirectCU II GTX 780 3gb
Corsair TX 950w PSU
NZXT Phantom Red/Black Case
3d Vision 1 w/ Samsung 2233rz Monitor
3d Vision 2 w/ ASUS VG278HE Monitor
We will investigate this issue and get back to you, thanks.
We will investigate this issue and get back to you, thanks.
@andrewf@nvidia: Thanks for looking into this. Hopefully this isn't a problem with a lot of mice. Would suck if people weren't getting the full 120Hz experience.
@andrewf@nvidia: Thanks for looking into this. Hopefully this isn't a problem with a lot of mice. Would suck if people weren't getting the full 120Hz experience.
check my blog - cybereality.com
hold display + 120hz = 0% full 120Hz experience.
Seriously, you think 8ms hold time wouldn't hurt?
Think again! 8.3mS hold time / 120hz is BS , CRT has 1.5-3ms !!!
[img]http://scien.stanford.edu/pages/labsite/2010/psych221/projects/2010/LievenVerslegers/LCD_Motion_Blur_Lieven_Verslegers_files/image002.png[/img]
hold display + 120hz = 0% full 120Hz experience.
Seriously, you think 8ms hold time wouldn't hurt?
Think again! 8.3mS hold time / 120hz is BS , CRT has 1.5-3ms !!!
hold display + 120hz = 0% full 120Hz experience.
Seriously, you think 8ms hold time wouldn't hurt?
Think again! 8.3mS hold time / 120hz is BS , CRT has 1.5-3ms !!!
[img]http://scien.stanford.edu/pages/labsite/2010/psych221/projects/2010/LievenVerslegers/LCD_Motion_Blur_Lieven_Verslegers_files/image002.png[/img]
[/quote]
These panels do not have a response time of 8ms. Not sure where you are getting this info.
hold display + 120hz = 0% full 120Hz experience.
Seriously, you think 8ms hold time wouldn't hurt?
Think again! 8.3mS hold time / 120hz is BS , CRT has 1.5-3ms !!!
These panels do not have a response time of 8ms. Not sure where you are getting this info.
1 sec /120 = 0.00833 = 8.3ms
http://scien.stanford.edu/pages/labsite/2010/psych221/projects/2010/LievenVerslegers/LCD_Motion_Blur_Lieven_Verslegers.htm
1 sec /120 = 0.00833 = 8.3ms
http://scien.stanford.edu/pages/labsite/2010/psych221/projects/2010/LievenVerslegers/LCD_Motion_Blur_Lieven_Verslegers.htm
120hz = ~8mS
1 sec /120 = 0.00833 = 8.3ms
http://scien.stanford.edu/pages/labsite/2010/psych221/projects/2010/LievenVerslegers/LCD_Motion_Blur_Lieven_Verslegers.htm
[/quote]
Our monitors have 3ms response time in 2D.
120hz = ~8mS
1 sec /120 = 0.00833 = 8.3ms
http://scien.stanford.edu/pages/labsite/2010/psych221/projects/2010/LievenVerslegers/LCD_Motion_Blur_Lieven_Verslegers.htm
Our monitors have 3ms response time in 2D.
http://www.mpi-inf.mpg.de/resources/3DTemporalUpsampling/3DTemporalUpsampling.pdf
& even if you get it to work , the thing will be still limited by motion blur at 120hz.
Motion blur at 120hz, yes, sounds bad, but that's just 2D LCD... //hold display//
http://www.mpi-inf.mpg.de/resources/3DTemporalUpsampling/3DTemporalUpsampling.pdf
& even if you get it to work , the thing will be still limited by motion blur at 120hz.
Motion blur at 120hz, yes, sounds bad, but that's just 2D LCD... //hold display//
check my blog - cybereality.com