Wrote my first article for UploadVR about Alien Isolation.
3 / 3
Cheers Libertine. Haven't shared a photo before but here goes...
[img]https://photos.google.com/album/AF1QipNHfa9fFO4gnJKRI2sxiYTRHNibTtUUkM_5xYoD[/img]
Edit: Nope, cant figure out how...?
Edit2: There we go, thanks D-man...so many loops XD
[img]https://forums.geforce.com/cmd/default/download-comment-attachment/70973/[/img]
To add a photo
[url]https://forums.geforce.com/default/topic/391133/forum-feedback/how-to-attach-thumbnails-on-forum-post-how-/post/4867626/#4867626[/url]
Not completely unrelated to this thread, because we were talking about supersampling and how it impacts the image in VR. Plus this is a good article and a good thread, and I want to bump it.
I got tired of the stupid debug tool and editing the files, so I wrote a small test app, that lets you play with the RenderScale parameter, the supersampling knob. The image is simplistic, but gives you a good feel for how much difference it makes for different objects.
The performance fps is not super helpful, as reprojection or timewarp make it stick to 90 for the most part. You can still tell where your system will top out, and most importantly, where the diminishing returns kick in.
Runs on Rift and Vive. I'm going to post it to Reddit in a couple of days.
http://bo3b.net/vr/Renderrr.zip
Not completely unrelated to this thread, because we were talking about supersampling and how it impacts the image in VR. Plus this is a good article and a good thread, and I want to bump it.
I got tired of the stupid debug tool and editing the files, so I wrote a small test app, that lets you play with the RenderScale parameter, the supersampling knob. The image is simplistic, but gives you a good feel for how much difference it makes for different objects.
The performance fps is not super helpful, as reprojection or timewarp make it stick to 90 for the most part. You can still tell where your system will top out, and most importantly, where the diminishing returns kick in.
That's a very useful tool!
PSA: Use arrow keys to cycle the super-sampling resolution. Above 1.5 makes no difference. 1.4 would seems to be optimum (set in debug tool).
@bo3b, would you kindly enlighten me a little bit on the supersampling and the rendering resolution?
Above 1.5 supersampling doesn't make any difference - aliasing is always present. On a monitor in a traditional sense, upping the render resolution would really help aliasing.
Is it possible to set the rendering resolution to something far higher before passing it over for supersampling? In theory, this should greatly reduce aliasing encountered at supersampling at 1.5+
This works great in games which allow you to set the HMD resolution, such as Dirt VR, but I can't be sure as VR support for this game was added retroactively.
For example, the pin holes you see in the tree at supersampling 1.5+ shouldn't be visible as pin holes but rather antialiased pixels with varying degrees of 'brightness' if the render resolution is set higher combined with supersampling.
PSA: Use arrow keys to cycle the super-sampling resolution. Above 1.5 makes no difference. 1.4 would seems to be optimum (set in debug tool).
@bo3b, would you kindly enlighten me a little bit on the supersampling and the rendering resolution?
Above 1.5 supersampling doesn't make any difference - aliasing is always present. On a monitor in a traditional sense, upping the render resolution would really help aliasing.
Is it possible to set the rendering resolution to something far higher before passing it over for supersampling? In theory, this should greatly reduce aliasing encountered at supersampling at 1.5+
This works great in games which allow you to set the HMD resolution, such as Dirt VR, but I can't be sure as VR support for this game was added retroactively.
For example, the pin holes you see in the tree at supersampling 1.5+ shouldn't be visible as pin holes but rather antialiased pixels with varying degrees of 'brightness' if the render resolution is set higher combined with supersampling.
Windows 10 64-bit, Intel 7700K @ 5.1GHz, 16GB 3600MHz CL15 DDR4 RAM, 2x GTX 1080 SLI, Asus Maximus IX Hero, Sound Blaster ZxR, PCIe Quad SSD, Oculus Rift CV1, DLP Link PGD-150 glasses, ViewSonic PJD6531w 3D DLP Projector @ 1280x800 120Hz native / 2560x1600 120Hz DSR 3D Gaming.
Cool, thanks for giving that a try. I set the RenderScale bump to 0.25 for each tick, but it seems like you might prefer a 0.10 bump instead.
I see a difference up to 2.0, but it's probably not worth the hit to performance as a tradeoff. Sweet spot seems to be about 1.5.
I put in a help text box, right behind you. You can also navigate in the image if you want to get closer or farther away. The spaceship is a cartoony object, the rocks are from a photorealistic gallery, the tree is for a high detail, high polygon object, the text is intended to be decent size.
This is built with Unity, so it may not directly relate to native apps, or apps built on Unreal4, but can give you a better idea of what is happening in Unity apps for sure. This uses their default forward renderer for VR, not the Valve one.
I've set it to maximum image quality because the scene is very simple. That includes 8x MSAA for the 'fantastic' quality setting. You can see lesser aliasing settings and quality by holding Ctrl at launch to change settings. Other settings are 4x MSAA, except Fast/Fastest are at disabled AA.
The Renderscale is the internal VR setting that the debug tools set. This is a multiplier over top of whatever a scene would provide. In this test case, the scene is setup using VR defaults. You can see the size of the 'screen' in the parentheses. So, default of 1.0 is no change for the game resolution, and the preferred resolution from the SDK is used.
It would be possible to set the game resolution higher, but there is no difference between that and using SS/RenderScale. They are simply multiplied together to get a final resolution that is drawn into, then downsampled when output to the hardware. So if you can set in-game resolution, there is no need or value to also using the Debug/SS sampling tools.
I'm not sure about the tree pinholes. That could easily be simply an artifact of the free model that I used. Basically, I have no idea what I'm doing here when using Unity, just experimenting. Try moving closer using wasd, xbox left stick, or grip+left vive touch.
Cool, thanks for giving that a try. I set the RenderScale bump to 0.25 for each tick, but it seems like you might prefer a 0.10 bump instead.
I see a difference up to 2.0, but it's probably not worth the hit to performance as a tradeoff. Sweet spot seems to be about 1.5.
I put in a help text box, right behind you. You can also navigate in the image if you want to get closer or farther away. The spaceship is a cartoony object, the rocks are from a photorealistic gallery, the tree is for a high detail, high polygon object, the text is intended to be decent size.
This is built with Unity, so it may not directly relate to native apps, or apps built on Unreal4, but can give you a better idea of what is happening in Unity apps for sure. This uses their default forward renderer for VR, not the Valve one.
I've set it to maximum image quality because the scene is very simple. That includes 8x MSAA for the 'fantastic' quality setting. You can see lesser aliasing settings and quality by holding Ctrl at launch to change settings. Other settings are 4x MSAA, except Fast/Fastest are at disabled AA.
The Renderscale is the internal VR setting that the debug tools set. This is a multiplier over top of whatever a scene would provide. In this test case, the scene is setup using VR defaults. You can see the size of the 'screen' in the parentheses. So, default of 1.0 is no change for the game resolution, and the preferred resolution from the SDK is used.
It would be possible to set the game resolution higher, but there is no difference between that and using SS/RenderScale. They are simply multiplied together to get a final resolution that is drawn into, then downsampled when output to the hardware. So if you can set in-game resolution, there is no need or value to also using the Debug/SS sampling tools.
I'm not sure about the tree pinholes. That could easily be simply an artifact of the free model that I used. Basically, I have no idea what I'm doing here when using Unity, just experimenting. Try moving closer using wasd, xbox left stick, or grip+left vive touch.
Acer H5360 (1280x720@120Hz) - ASUS VG248QE with GSync mod - 3D Vision 1&2 - Driver 372.54
GTX 970 - i5-4670K@4.2GHz - 12GB RAM - Win7x64+evilKB2670838 - 4 Disk X25 RAID
SAGER NP9870-S - GTX 980 - i7-6700K - Win10 Pro 1607 Latest 3Dmigoto Release Bo3b's School for ShaderHackers
Brilliant, I'll experiment with it. I hadn't noticed the text box behind me as I use the rift as a seated experience, I have never needed to turn all the way around! :P
Brilliant, I'll experiment with it. I hadn't noticed the text box behind me as I use the rift as a seated experience, I have never needed to turn all the way around! :P
Windows 10 64-bit, Intel 7700K @ 5.1GHz, 16GB 3600MHz CL15 DDR4 RAM, 2x GTX 1080 SLI, Asus Maximus IX Hero, Sound Blaster ZxR, PCIe Quad SSD, Oculus Rift CV1, DLP Link PGD-150 glasses, ViewSonic PJD6531w 3D DLP Projector @ 1280x800 120Hz native / 2560x1600 120Hz DSR 3D Gaming.
Recent update to RE7's Beginning Hour PSVR demo has enabled true VR mode - it looks great. I hope this mode exists throughout entire release version of game.
Recent update to RE7's Beginning Hour PSVR demo has enabled true VR mode - it looks great. I hope this mode exists throughout entire release version of game.
[quote="Conan481"]check it out http://uploadvr.com/alien-isolation-vr-horror/
I've been a regular here since 2005 and I've loved being part of this amazing community.
I've finally decided to give game journalism a shot...
I'm going to pitch a feature article about 3D vision and this 3D vision community as it was 3D vision that really got me back into gaming and it's still in many ways superior to what an average VR experience can provide - thanks to the great contributors here![/quote]
Just thought it was interesting to note, that you just crossed over 1M readers of your article. That's pretty impressive, so congratulations!
[quote="bo3b"]I got tired of the stupid debug tool and editing the files, so I wrote a small test app, that lets you play with the RenderScale parameter, the supersampling knob. The image is simplistic, but gives you a good feel for how much difference it makes for different objects.
[url]http://bo3b.net/vr/Renderrr.zip[/url][/quote]
Also worth noting that I updated this sample (same link), to also include setting MSAA up and down. So Dpad up/down is MSAA, left/right is RenderScale/SuperSampling.
It's interesting to play with the quality settings and see the result. Sweet spot for performance versus quality seems to be 1.5x with 2x MSAA.
I've been a regular here since 2005 and I've loved being part of this amazing community.
I've finally decided to give game journalism a shot...
I'm going to pitch a feature article about 3D vision and this 3D vision community as it was 3D vision that really got me back into gaming and it's still in many ways superior to what an average VR experience can provide - thanks to the great contributors here!
Just thought it was interesting to note, that you just crossed over 1M readers of your article. That's pretty impressive, so congratulations!
bo3b said:I got tired of the stupid debug tool and editing the files, so I wrote a small test app, that lets you play with the RenderScale parameter, the supersampling knob. The image is simplistic, but gives you a good feel for how much difference it makes for different objects.
Also worth noting that I updated this sample (same link), to also include setting MSAA up and down. So Dpad up/down is MSAA, left/right is RenderScale/SuperSampling.
It's interesting to play with the quality settings and see the result. Sweet spot for performance versus quality seems to be 1.5x with 2x MSAA.
Acer H5360 (1280x720@120Hz) - ASUS VG248QE with GSync mod - 3D Vision 1&2 - Driver 372.54
GTX 970 - i5-4670K@4.2GHz - 12GB RAM - Win7x64+evilKB2670838 - 4 Disk X25 RAID
SAGER NP9870-S - GTX 980 - i7-6700K - Win10 Pro 1607 Latest 3Dmigoto Release Bo3b's School for ShaderHackers
[quote="RAGEdemon"]I might have the wrong end of the stick here, but I feel that the developers lack understanding of VR resolutions. They think game resolution = sampling resolution. This is fundamentally an unforgivable misconception by someone who is supposedly a know-all making a game.[/quote]After arguing with a developer because their game was not using exclusive full screen and ended up having to show them screenshots from API monitor to prove that they were creating the swap chain with pDesc->Windowed=true I lost all faith that most game developers actually know what they are doing.
RAGEdemon said:I might have the wrong end of the stick here, but I feel that the developers lack understanding of VR resolutions. They think game resolution = sampling resolution. This is fundamentally an unforgivable misconception by someone who is supposedly a know-all making a game.
After arguing with a developer because their game was not using exclusive full screen and ended up having to show them screenshots from API monitor to prove that they were creating the swap chain with pDesc->Windowed=true I lost all faith that most game developers actually know what they are doing.
2x Geforce GTX 980 in SLI provided by NVIDIA, i7 6700K 4GHz CPU, Asus 27" VG278HE 144Hz 3D Monitor, BenQ W1070 3D Projector, 120" Elite Screens YardMaster 2, 32GB Corsair DDR4 3200MHz RAM, Samsung 850 EVO 500G SSD, 4x750GB HDD in RAID5, Gigabyte Z170X-Gaming 7 Motherboard, Corsair Obsidian 750D Airflow Edition Case, Corsair RM850i PSU, HTC Vive, Win 10 64bit
BTW Conan481/Bart wrote a second article Dec 11th, but never mentioned it.
Deafening Silence: Where Is Valve’s ‘Killer App’ VR Game We’ve All Been Waiting For?
https://uploadvr.com/valve-killer-app-vr-game/
Edit: Nope, cant figure out how...?
Edit2: There we go, thanks D-man...so many loops XD
https://forums.geforce.com/default/topic/391133/forum-feedback/how-to-attach-thumbnails-on-forum-post-how-/post/4867626/#4867626
I got tired of the stupid debug tool and editing the files, so I wrote a small test app, that lets you play with the RenderScale parameter, the supersampling knob. The image is simplistic, but gives you a good feel for how much difference it makes for different objects.
The performance fps is not super helpful, as reprojection or timewarp make it stick to 90 for the most part. You can still tell where your system will top out, and most importantly, where the diminishing returns kick in.
Runs on Rift and Vive. I'm going to post it to Reddit in a couple of days.
http://bo3b.net/vr/Renderrr.zip
Acer H5360 (1280x720@120Hz) - ASUS VG248QE with GSync mod - 3D Vision 1&2 - Driver 372.54
GTX 970 - i5-4670K@4.2GHz - 12GB RAM - Win7x64+evilKB2670838 - 4 Disk X25 RAID
SAGER NP9870-S - GTX 980 - i7-6700K - Win10 Pro 1607
Latest 3Dmigoto Release
Bo3b's School for ShaderHackers
PSA: Use arrow keys to cycle the super-sampling resolution. Above 1.5 makes no difference. 1.4 would seems to be optimum (set in debug tool).
@bo3b, would you kindly enlighten me a little bit on the supersampling and the rendering resolution?
Above 1.5 supersampling doesn't make any difference - aliasing is always present. On a monitor in a traditional sense, upping the render resolution would really help aliasing.
Is it possible to set the rendering resolution to something far higher before passing it over for supersampling? In theory, this should greatly reduce aliasing encountered at supersampling at 1.5+
This works great in games which allow you to set the HMD resolution, such as Dirt VR, but I can't be sure as VR support for this game was added retroactively.
For example, the pin holes you see in the tree at supersampling 1.5+ shouldn't be visible as pin holes but rather antialiased pixels with varying degrees of 'brightness' if the render resolution is set higher combined with supersampling.
Windows 10 64-bit, Intel 7700K @ 5.1GHz, 16GB 3600MHz CL15 DDR4 RAM, 2x GTX 1080 SLI, Asus Maximus IX Hero, Sound Blaster ZxR, PCIe Quad SSD, Oculus Rift CV1, DLP Link PGD-150 glasses, ViewSonic PJD6531w 3D DLP Projector @ 1280x800 120Hz native / 2560x1600 120Hz DSR 3D Gaming.
I see a difference up to 2.0, but it's probably not worth the hit to performance as a tradeoff. Sweet spot seems to be about 1.5.
I put in a help text box, right behind you. You can also navigate in the image if you want to get closer or farther away. The spaceship is a cartoony object, the rocks are from a photorealistic gallery, the tree is for a high detail, high polygon object, the text is intended to be decent size.
This is built with Unity, so it may not directly relate to native apps, or apps built on Unreal4, but can give you a better idea of what is happening in Unity apps for sure. This uses their default forward renderer for VR, not the Valve one.
I've set it to maximum image quality because the scene is very simple. That includes 8x MSAA for the 'fantastic' quality setting. You can see lesser aliasing settings and quality by holding Ctrl at launch to change settings. Other settings are 4x MSAA, except Fast/Fastest are at disabled AA.
The Renderscale is the internal VR setting that the debug tools set. This is a multiplier over top of whatever a scene would provide. In this test case, the scene is setup using VR defaults. You can see the size of the 'screen' in the parentheses. So, default of 1.0 is no change for the game resolution, and the preferred resolution from the SDK is used.
It would be possible to set the game resolution higher, but there is no difference between that and using SS/RenderScale. They are simply multiplied together to get a final resolution that is drawn into, then downsampled when output to the hardware. So if you can set in-game resolution, there is no need or value to also using the Debug/SS sampling tools.
I'm not sure about the tree pinholes. That could easily be simply an artifact of the free model that I used. Basically, I have no idea what I'm doing here when using Unity, just experimenting. Try moving closer using wasd, xbox left stick, or grip+left vive touch.
Acer H5360 (1280x720@120Hz) - ASUS VG248QE with GSync mod - 3D Vision 1&2 - Driver 372.54
GTX 970 - i5-4670K@4.2GHz - 12GB RAM - Win7x64+evilKB2670838 - 4 Disk X25 RAID
SAGER NP9870-S - GTX 980 - i7-6700K - Win10 Pro 1607
Latest 3Dmigoto Release
Bo3b's School for ShaderHackers
Windows 10 64-bit, Intel 7700K @ 5.1GHz, 16GB 3600MHz CL15 DDR4 RAM, 2x GTX 1080 SLI, Asus Maximus IX Hero, Sound Blaster ZxR, PCIe Quad SSD, Oculus Rift CV1, DLP Link PGD-150 glasses, ViewSonic PJD6531w 3D DLP Projector @ 1280x800 120Hz native / 2560x1600 120Hz DSR 3D Gaming.
46" Samsung ES7500 3DTV (checkerboard, high FOV as desktop monitor, highly recommend!) - Metro 2033 3D PNG screens - Metro LL filter realism mod - Flugan's Deus Ex:HR Depth changers - Nvidia tech support online form - Nvidia support: 1-800-797-6530
Just thought it was interesting to note, that you just crossed over 1M readers of your article. That's pretty impressive, so congratulations!
Also worth noting that I updated this sample (same link), to also include setting MSAA up and down. So Dpad up/down is MSAA, left/right is RenderScale/SuperSampling.
It's interesting to play with the quality settings and see the result. Sweet spot for performance versus quality seems to be 1.5x with 2x MSAA.
Acer H5360 (1280x720@120Hz) - ASUS VG248QE with GSync mod - 3D Vision 1&2 - Driver 372.54
GTX 970 - i5-4670K@4.2GHz - 12GB RAM - Win7x64+evilKB2670838 - 4 Disk X25 RAID
SAGER NP9870-S - GTX 980 - i7-6700K - Win10 Pro 1607
Latest 3Dmigoto Release
Bo3b's School for ShaderHackers
2x Geforce GTX 980 in SLI provided by NVIDIA, i7 6700K 4GHz CPU, Asus 27" VG278HE 144Hz 3D Monitor, BenQ W1070 3D Projector, 120" Elite Screens YardMaster 2, 32GB Corsair DDR4 3200MHz RAM, Samsung 850 EVO 500G SSD, 4x750GB HDD in RAID5, Gigabyte Z170X-Gaming 7 Motherboard, Corsair Obsidian 750D Airflow Edition Case, Corsair RM850i PSU, HTC Vive, Win 10 64bit
Alienware M17x R4 w/ built in 3D, Intel i7 3740QM, GTX 680m 2GB, 16GB DDR3 1600MHz RAM, Win7 64bit, 1TB SSD, 1TB HDD, 750GB HDD
Pre-release 3D fixes, shadertool.py and other goodies: http://github.com/DarkStarSword/3d-fixes
Support me on Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/DarkStarSword or PayPal: https://www.paypal.me/DarkStarSword
Deafening Silence: Where Is Valve’s ‘Killer App’ VR Game We’ve All Been Waiting For?
https://uploadvr.com/valve-killer-app-vr-game/