This is probably a really stupid idea, but I don't know any better. DHR said he doesn't know how to convery a 2.0 pixelshader to a 3.0. What if you just identified a working water shader in Portal 2 (which I think works fine in 3d), and copied that? Or even one in a totally unrelated game, like an Unreal game. Are shaders tied to engines, or could you just drop one in that was "close enough"?
What about just disabling the shader entirely, or swapping it for a really simple one?
This is the kind of stuff I'd like to be able to mess around with and experiment on myself without asking stupid questions, but I don't really know where I'd start to try.
Is it definitely too complicated for a guide for dummies to steal other fixes and hack together something functional? Maybe a wiki could be started to document common fixes.
This is probably a really stupid idea, but I don't know any better. DHR said he doesn't know how to convery a 2.0 pixelshader to a 3.0. What if you just identified a working water shader in Portal 2 (which I think works fine in 3d), and copied that? Or even one in a totally unrelated game, like an Unreal game. Are shaders tied to engines, or could you just drop one in that was "close enough"?
What about just disabling the shader entirely, or swapping it for a really simple one?
This is the kind of stuff I'd like to be able to mess around with and experiment on myself without asking stupid questions, but I don't really know where I'd start to try.
Is it definitely too complicated for a guide for dummies to steal other fixes and hack together something functional? Maybe a wiki could be started to document common fixes.
If I asked you to write a book report on a subject.
Then I ask someone on other side of world for book report on same subject.
It will be same subject but completely different.
Disabling is easy, I wrote a guide for that.
[url]http://helixmod.blogspot.com/2012/04/how-to-guide-remove-effects-from-game.html[/url]
Im not sure if water actually works right in portal 2. I just dont think there is any. Or its causes its indoors/ there fore different then outdoor water. Like black mesa water works indoors/ Not outdoors. Source engine is a lesson in abuse though imo. Black mesa is probably my worst project.
If I asked you to write a book report on a subject.
Then I ask someone on other side of world for book report on same subject.
It will be same subject but completely different.
Im not sure if water actually works right in portal 2. I just dont think there is any. Or its causes its indoors/ there fore different then outdoor water. Like black mesa water works indoors/ Not outdoors. Source engine is a lesson in abuse though imo. Black mesa is probably my worst project.
Co-founder of helixmod.blog.com
If you like one of my helixmod patches and want to donate. Can send to me through paypal - eqzitara@yahoo.com
So what would happen if I dropped in a working water shader from Bulletstorm? Would it work at all and just look a bit out of place, or would it cause the game to crash/the water to be even more broken because it's a totally different engine?
As for Portal 2, there's the big watery area underground. I'll test how well it works tonight.
So what would happen if I dropped in a working water shader from Bulletstorm? Would it work at all and just look a bit out of place, or would it cause the game to crash/the water to be even more broken because it's a totally different engine?
As for Portal 2, there's the big watery area underground. I'll test how well it works tonight.
[quote="Pirateguybrush"]This is probably a really stupid idea, but I don't know any better. DHR said he doesn't know how to convery a 2.0 pixelshader to a 3.0. What if you just identified a working water shader in Portal 2 (which I think works fine in 3d), and copied that? Or even one in a totally unrelated game, like an Unreal game. Are shaders tied to engines, or could you just drop one in that was "close enough"?[/quote]That's a really crazy idea, and I like it. There's a chance that would work. In general we are patching shaders to fix bugs, and in principle there is no reason not to replace the entire thing with something else.
The only tricky part will be matching the inputs and outputs. All shaders have some sort of input, like the v0 vertex location, and some output like the o0 output vertex. If the one you are replacing has different inputs/outputs you'd need to make them match. That's not necessarily a problem, because we can move stuff between registers.
There might be global constants that are just different though, in which case it wouldn't work. For example, a c50 parameter used in the good working shader, that doesn't exist in the broken one. We can't provide that extra, unknown, constant.
I've got both Portal and L4D 1 and 2, so give it a whirl. Hunt down the shaders with the debug dll, and save off copies of a working shader, and a broken shader. Either eqzitara or I can take a look and let you know if replacing will work.
Best to do that in the main Helix thread though, not here.
Pirateguybrush said:This is probably a really stupid idea, but I don't know any better. DHR said he doesn't know how to convery a 2.0 pixelshader to a 3.0. What if you just identified a working water shader in Portal 2 (which I think works fine in 3d), and copied that? Or even one in a totally unrelated game, like an Unreal game. Are shaders tied to engines, or could you just drop one in that was "close enough"?
That's a really crazy idea, and I like it. There's a chance that would work. In general we are patching shaders to fix bugs, and in principle there is no reason not to replace the entire thing with something else.
The only tricky part will be matching the inputs and outputs. All shaders have some sort of input, like the v0 vertex location, and some output like the o0 output vertex. If the one you are replacing has different inputs/outputs you'd need to make them match. That's not necessarily a problem, because we can move stuff between registers.
There might be global constants that are just different though, in which case it wouldn't work. For example, a c50 parameter used in the good working shader, that doesn't exist in the broken one. We can't provide that extra, unknown, constant.
I've got both Portal and L4D 1 and 2, so give it a whirl. Hunt down the shaders with the debug dll, and save off copies of a working shader, and a broken shader. Either eqzitara or I can take a look and let you know if replacing will work.
Best to do that in the main Helix thread though, not here.
Acer H5360 (1280x720@120Hz) - ASUS VG248QE with GSync mod - 3D Vision 1&2 - Driver 372.54
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[quote="eqzitara"]No. Wont work.
Dont. Water works underground/indoors in source. Not outdoors.[/quote]Very interesting and odd. Since you've looked at it a fair amount, any idea why it would work for indoor vs. outdoor? Different shaders?
Nvidia has a online book you can read that's a CG tutorial (Nvidia shader code)
https://developer.nvidia.com/content/cg-tutorial-chapter-1-introduction
Check out the whitepapers on the Nvidia shader Library
http://developer.download.nvidia.com/shaderlibrary/webpages/shader_library.html
There are lots of tutorials online
http://rbwhitaker.wikidot.com/hlsl-tutorials
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-IEjJpyPe7I
Some more links
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/High_Level_Shader_Language
http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/windows/desktop/ff471419(v=vs.85).aspx
http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/windows/desktop/bb147365(v=vs.85).aspx
I'm not sure how much these links will help, I bookmarked them last month when I started having the same thoughts as you guys. I only read a little so far.
I'm not sure how much these links will help, I bookmarked them last month when I started having the same thoughts as you guys. I only read a little so far.
[quote="bo3b"][quote="eqzitara"]No. Wont work.
Dont. Water works underground/indoors in source. Not outdoors.[/quote]Very interesting and odd. Since you've looked at it a fair amount, any idea why it would work for indoor vs. outdoor? Different shaders? [/quote]
Im not 100% sure its all indoors it might be a mixed batch. Though I know all outdoors are wrong and I know off the top of my head some indoors are right.
I think it has to do with reflections. Like the ones without reflection from world are fine. My guess is they use one shader if there is a "major light source" and another if there isnt.
Id wait for this oculus rift[renderer] support to be finalized before messing with it. Id assume theyd have to change shaders but I dont know much about that tbh. I am kind of curious how they are handling it since weapons go all over the place. Theyd have to reposition each individually.
It's probably good that more people have an interest. I think I am retiring from old games at the end of this month tbh[Unless I actually run into a game that I want to play].
Dont. Water works underground/indoors in source. Not outdoors.
Very interesting and odd. Since you've looked at it a fair amount, any idea why it would work for indoor vs. outdoor? Different shaders?
Im not 100% sure its all indoors it might be a mixed batch. Though I know all outdoors are wrong and I know off the top of my head some indoors are right.
I think it has to do with reflections. Like the ones without reflection from world are fine. My guess is they use one shader if there is a "major light source" and another if there isnt.
Id wait for this oculus rift[renderer] support to be finalized before messing with it. Id assume theyd have to change shaders but I dont know much about that tbh. I am kind of curious how they are handling it since weapons go all over the place. Theyd have to reposition each individually.
It's probably good that more people have an interest. I think I am retiring from old games at the end of this month tbh[Unless I actually run into a game that I want to play].
Co-founder of helixmod.blog.com
If you like one of my helixmod patches and want to donate. Can send to me through paypal - eqzitara@yahoo.com
OK, cool. Might be a possible path for water fixes, to map in a shader that doesn't do reflections at all. That would allow settings to stay high, but avoid the need to remove shaders completely.
I pretty much agree it's probably best to wait for Rift fixes to stabilize, because they need to fix the glitches for Rift as much as they do for 3D Vision. Since it's Riftmania all the time now, maybe we get some benefit out of that. BTW, just got put into 'processing.'
OK, cool. Might be a possible path for water fixes, to map in a shader that doesn't do reflections at all. That would allow settings to stay high, but avoid the need to remove shaders completely.
I pretty much agree it's probably best to wait for Rift fixes to stabilize, because they need to fix the glitches for Rift as much as they do for 3D Vision. Since it's Riftmania all the time now, maybe we get some benefit out of that. BTW, just got put into 'processing.'
Acer H5360 (1280x720@120Hz) - ASUS VG248QE with GSync mod - 3D Vision 1&2 - Driver 372.54
GTX 970 - i5-4670K@4.2GHz - 12GB RAM - Win7x64+evilKB2670838 - 4 Disk X25 RAID
SAGER NP9870-S - GTX 980 - i7-6700K - Win10 Pro 1607 Latest 3Dmigoto Release Bo3b's School for ShaderHackers
Yep, if they update from a version of the Valve source engine to a newer version to add bug fixes, or something like Rift support, it's all new CRCs for the shaders, which of course breaks our fixes.
Yep, if they update from a version of the Valve source engine to a newer version to add bug fixes, or something like Rift support, it's all new CRCs for the shaders, which of course breaks our fixes.
Acer H5360 (1280x720@120Hz) - ASUS VG248QE with GSync mod - 3D Vision 1&2 - Driver 372.54
GTX 970 - i5-4670K@4.2GHz - 12GB RAM - Win7x64+evilKB2670838 - 4 Disk X25 RAID
SAGER NP9870-S - GTX 980 - i7-6700K - Win10 Pro 1607 Latest 3Dmigoto Release Bo3b's School for ShaderHackers
Doesn't seem all that bad to me. As long as the shaders are the same, it's surely just a matter of hunting down their new CRCs and pasting the fixed code in? Unless of course they make huge sweeping engine changes.
Doesn't seem all that bad to me. As long as the shaders are the same, it's surely just a matter of hunting down their new CRCs and pasting the fixed code in? Unless of course they make huge sweeping engine changes.
What about just disabling the shader entirely, or swapping it for a really simple one?
This is the kind of stuff I'd like to be able to mess around with and experiment on myself without asking stupid questions, but I don't really know where I'd start to try.
Is it definitely too complicated for a guide for dummies to steal other fixes and hack together something functional? Maybe a wiki could be started to document common fixes.
Then I ask someone on other side of world for book report on same subject.
It will be same subject but completely different.
Disabling is easy, I wrote a guide for that.
http://helixmod.blogspot.com/2012/04/how-to-guide-remove-effects-from-game.html
Im not sure if water actually works right in portal 2. I just dont think there is any. Or its causes its indoors/ there fore different then outdoor water. Like black mesa water works indoors/ Not outdoors. Source engine is a lesson in abuse though imo. Black mesa is probably my worst project.
Co-founder of helixmod.blog.com
If you like one of my helixmod patches and want to donate. Can send to me through paypal - eqzitara@yahoo.com
As for Portal 2, there's the big watery area underground. I'll test how well it works tonight.
Dont. Water works underground/indoors in source. Not outdoors.
Co-founder of helixmod.blog.com
If you like one of my helixmod patches and want to donate. Can send to me through paypal - eqzitara@yahoo.com
The only tricky part will be matching the inputs and outputs. All shaders have some sort of input, like the v0 vertex location, and some output like the o0 output vertex. If the one you are replacing has different inputs/outputs you'd need to make them match. That's not necessarily a problem, because we can move stuff between registers.
There might be global constants that are just different though, in which case it wouldn't work. For example, a c50 parameter used in the good working shader, that doesn't exist in the broken one. We can't provide that extra, unknown, constant.
I've got both Portal and L4D 1 and 2, so give it a whirl. Hunt down the shaders with the debug dll, and save off copies of a working shader, and a broken shader. Either eqzitara or I can take a look and let you know if replacing will work.
Best to do that in the main Helix thread though, not here.
Acer H5360 (1280x720@120Hz) - ASUS VG248QE with GSync mod - 3D Vision 1&2 - Driver 372.54
GTX 970 - i5-4670K@4.2GHz - 12GB RAM - Win7x64+evilKB2670838 - 4 Disk X25 RAID
SAGER NP9870-S - GTX 980 - i7-6700K - Win10 Pro 1607
Latest 3Dmigoto Release
Bo3b's School for ShaderHackers
Acer H5360 (1280x720@120Hz) - ASUS VG248QE with GSync mod - 3D Vision 1&2 - Driver 372.54
GTX 970 - i5-4670K@4.2GHz - 12GB RAM - Win7x64+evilKB2670838 - 4 Disk X25 RAID
SAGER NP9870-S - GTX 980 - i7-6700K - Win10 Pro 1607
Latest 3Dmigoto Release
Bo3b's School for ShaderHackers
https://developer.nvidia.com/content/cg-tutorial-chapter-1-introduction
Check out the whitepapers on the Nvidia shader Library
http://developer.download.nvidia.com/shaderlibrary/webpages/shader_library.html
There are lots of tutorials online
http://rbwhitaker.wikidot.com/hlsl-tutorials
Some more links
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/High_Level_Shader_Language
http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/windows/desktop/ff471419(v=vs.85).aspx
http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/windows/desktop/bb147365(v=vs.85).aspx
I'm not sure how much these links will help, I bookmarked them last month when I started having the same thoughts as you guys. I only read a little so far.
Love it!
first person view + dark/horror + no weapons + unique perspective/story = very immersive and exciting
Thief 1/2/gold in 3D
https://forums.geforce.com/default/topic/523535/3d-vision/thief-1-2-and-system-shock-2-perfect-3d-with-unofficial-patch-1-19
http://photos.3dvisionlive.com/Partol/album/509eb580a3e067153c000020/
[Acer GD245HQ - 1920x1080 120Hz] [Nvidia 3D Vision]
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[Asus GTX 750 Ti @ 1350MHz] [Intel SSD 330 - 240GB]
[Creative Titanium HD + Beyerdynamic DT 880 (250ohm) headphones] [Windows 7 64bit]
Im not 100% sure its all indoors it might be a mixed batch. Though I know all outdoors are wrong and I know off the top of my head some indoors are right.
I think it has to do with reflections. Like the ones without reflection from world are fine. My guess is they use one shader if there is a "major light source" and another if there isnt.
Id wait for this oculus rift[renderer] support to be finalized before messing with it. Id assume theyd have to change shaders but I dont know much about that tbh. I am kind of curious how they are handling it since weapons go all over the place. Theyd have to reposition each individually.
It's probably good that more people have an interest. I think I am retiring from old games at the end of this month tbh[Unless I actually run into a game that I want to play].
Co-founder of helixmod.blog.com
If you like one of my helixmod patches and want to donate. Can send to me through paypal - eqzitara@yahoo.com
I pretty much agree it's probably best to wait for Rift fixes to stabilize, because they need to fix the glitches for Rift as much as they do for 3D Vision. Since it's Riftmania all the time now, maybe we get some benefit out of that. BTW, just got put into 'processing.'
Acer H5360 (1280x720@120Hz) - ASUS VG248QE with GSync mod - 3D Vision 1&2 - Driver 372.54
GTX 970 - i5-4670K@4.2GHz - 12GB RAM - Win7x64+evilKB2670838 - 4 Disk X25 RAID
SAGER NP9870-S - GTX 980 - i7-6700K - Win10 Pro 1607
Latest 3Dmigoto Release
Bo3b's School for ShaderHackers
Co-founder of helixmod.blog.com
If you like one of my helixmod patches and want to donate. Can send to me through paypal - eqzitara@yahoo.com
Acer H5360 (1280x720@120Hz) - ASUS VG248QE with GSync mod - 3D Vision 1&2 - Driver 372.54
GTX 970 - i5-4670K@4.2GHz - 12GB RAM - Win7x64+evilKB2670838 - 4 Disk X25 RAID
SAGER NP9870-S - GTX 980 - i7-6700K - Win10 Pro 1607
Latest 3Dmigoto Release
Bo3b's School for ShaderHackers