3DTV Play - Playstation 3D Display 24" Support?
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I don't think it "was never meant" to work with Nvidia products. If everyone thought like you every cell phone would still have it's own unique charger. It's a 3d TV that was advertised as being able to work with a PC. Since the PS3 display is brand new it's not so far fetched to assume that Nvidia may not have posted any information on it. I shouldn't have to be a subscriber to "3d tech today" and do a month of research before I purchase anything. If you pay 400 bucks for a card that's says it 3d you shouldn't have to shell out more money for Nvidia for more software that should be included with the card in the first place. If they do they should say "if you pay us more money we'll kindly give you more access to the card you purchased." Apparently there has to be a bunch of shady backroom deals with display manufacturers, probably forcing them to pay Nvidia money to support their display. It's unfortunate that 3d is still within the "buyer beware" stage and I falsely believed I lucked out when I bought my new computer and the 3d display was coming out.
I don't think it "was never meant" to work with Nvidia products. If everyone thought like you every cell phone would still have it's own unique charger. It's a 3d TV that was advertised as being able to work with a PC. Since the PS3 display is brand new it's not so far fetched to assume that Nvidia may not have posted any information on it. I shouldn't have to be a subscriber to "3d tech today" and do a month of research before I purchase anything. If you pay 400 bucks for a card that's says it 3d you shouldn't have to shell out more money for Nvidia for more software that should be included with the card in the first place. If they do they should say "if you pay us more money we'll kindly give you more access to the card you purchased." Apparently there has to be a bunch of shady backroom deals with display manufacturers, probably forcing them to pay Nvidia money to support their display. It's unfortunate that 3d is still within the "buyer beware" stage and I falsely believed I lucked out when I bought my new computer and the 3d display was coming out.

#61
Posted 12/03/2011 12:34 PM   
Show a little compassion to a fellow gamer wanting to game in 3D.

It can be frustrating with all the BS that is involved at times, such as unsupported formats, unsupported hardware, malfunctioning hardware, broken drivers, to name a few.

I was mad at Nvidia myself when I bought my first 3D Display that was incompatible, it was solved by using EDID override solution I found at Brad Gearon's Blog. Once, I did the override I was able to game using 3DTV Play and everything was great other than I returned the display because I didn't like it.

Seemed stupid to me that Nvidia was intentionally sabotaging my GPU to not work with a display that was quite capable of working. I've always bought a new Nvidia card every year, with my first being a GTX 7800, and have never been disappointed in doing so. That is, until this experience. It has left a bad taste in my mouth, that is not likely to go away any time soon. I mean really? The display is by all means compatible and capable! But is black listed, shunned, sabotaged.... instead? Where do you see this as being right in any way? I CALL SHENANIGANS.
Show a little compassion to a fellow gamer wanting to game in 3D.



It can be frustrating with all the BS that is involved at times, such as unsupported formats, unsupported hardware, malfunctioning hardware, broken drivers, to name a few.



I was mad at Nvidia myself when I bought my first 3D Display that was incompatible, it was solved by using EDID override solution I found at Brad Gearon's Blog. Once, I did the override I was able to game using 3DTV Play and everything was great other than I returned the display because I didn't like it.



Seemed stupid to me that Nvidia was intentionally sabotaging my GPU to not work with a display that was quite capable of working. I've always bought a new Nvidia card every year, with my first being a GTX 7800, and have never been disappointed in doing so. That is, until this experience. It has left a bad taste in my mouth, that is not likely to go away any time soon. I mean really? The display is by all means compatible and capable! But is black listed, shunned, sabotaged.... instead? Where do you see this as being right in any way? I CALL SHENANIGANS.

#62
Posted 12/03/2011 12:42 PM   
I wonder if there's conflict with the HDMI licensing, does HDMI allow selective display support? Seems that would be detrimental to the image of HDMI and not allowed under it's manufacturing agreements with Licensees.

Maybe owner's of this display should do some reasearch and file a complaint with HDMI Licensing, LLC http://www.hdmi.org/contact/index.aspx

HDMI 1.4 was written so that manufacturers could opt to not support all of the 3D formats but there's nothing saying that they can at their whim, not support a capable 3D display with a 1.4 HDMI input.
I wonder if there's conflict with the HDMI licensing, does HDMI allow selective display support? Seems that would be detrimental to the image of HDMI and not allowed under it's manufacturing agreements with Licensees.



Maybe owner's of this display should do some reasearch and file a complaint with HDMI Licensing, LLC http://www.hdmi.org/contact/index.aspx



HDMI 1.4 was written so that manufacturers could opt to not support all of the 3D formats but there's nothing saying that they can at their whim, not support a capable 3D display with a 1.4 HDMI input.

#63
Posted 12/03/2011 01:00 PM   
I don't know why nVida only supports a selected number of 3DTV sets. The point is that they're all listed on their website. So you can't really blame them if you buy a device which is not listed there and end up with a non-supported product.

It might be licensing, it might be a concience decision only to support tested hardware...

I understand if someone is disappointed because of that. But calling it a "rip off" and a scheme "to buy their crappy product" is just stupid.
I don't know why nVida only supports a selected number of 3DTV sets. The point is that they're all listed on their website. So you can't really blame them if you buy a device which is not listed there and end up with a non-supported product.



It might be licensing, it might be a concience decision only to support tested hardware...



I understand if someone is disappointed because of that. But calling it a "rip off" and a scheme "to buy their crappy product" is just stupid.

#64
Posted 12/03/2011 01:10 PM   
Well it would be nice if they also had a "BLACK LISTED/UNSUPPORTED LIST" that people could look at and see that the Display has been officially declared unsupported.

How hard would it be to add Displays to that list? They'd only need the model #, no testing involved/needed. If they have no intention of supporting a Display, it could be added to the list as soon as it's conceived, they wouldn't even have to wait for it to release. The list could be upated every day, every hour, every minute.

The thing is, if there was such a list. People would "KNOW" ahead of time. How long do you think Nvidia was planning on NOT supporting this Display? I would think, they knew as soon as the press release came out if not sooner.

Unfortunately for Nvidia, they have another batch of unhappy customers.

Will this experience influence their future purchase of Nvidia products, who knows? I'm sure it will for some.

The truth is AMD is a viable alternative. TriDef is a viable alternative. Customers have options!
http://www.tomshardware.co.uk/tridef-stereoscopic-3d-gaming,review-32285.html

So why alienate customers when your competitor is gaining marketshares year by year?

The link is not functioning for whatever reason, anyway the article is " Nvidia 3D Vision Vs. AMD HD3D: 18 Games, Evaluated "
Well it would be nice if they also had a "BLACK LISTED/UNSUPPORTED LIST" that people could look at and see that the Display has been officially declared unsupported.



How hard would it be to add Displays to that list? They'd only need the model #, no testing involved/needed. If they have no intention of supporting a Display, it could be added to the list as soon as it's conceived, they wouldn't even have to wait for it to release. The list could be upated every day, every hour, every minute.



The thing is, if there was such a list. People would "KNOW" ahead of time. How long do you think Nvidia was planning on NOT supporting this Display? I would think, they knew as soon as the press release came out if not sooner.



Unfortunately for Nvidia, they have another batch of unhappy customers.



Will this experience influence their future purchase of Nvidia products, who knows? I'm sure it will for some.



The truth is AMD is a viable alternative. TriDef is a viable alternative. Customers have options!

http://www.tomshardware.co.uk/tridef-stereoscopic-3d-gaming,review-32285.html



So why alienate customers when your competitor is gaining marketshares year by year?



The link is not functioning for whatever reason, anyway the article is " Nvidia 3D Vision Vs. AMD HD3D: 18 Games, Evaluated "

#65
Posted 12/03/2011 01:43 PM   
I really don't want to defend nVidia here, if you think that AMD might be the better solution, then by all means, go for it.

But you can't really put up a list of non-supported hardware, since that list by definition would never be complete. And it would cause even more trouble if someone buys a device, which is not listed there but still doesn't work.

Maybe Andrew can share some insight, why nVidia only supports a selected number of TV sets and Receivers and not just all HDMI 1.4 compatible devices?
I really don't want to defend nVidia here, if you think that AMD might be the better solution, then by all means, go for it.



But you can't really put up a list of non-supported hardware, since that list by definition would never be complete. And it would cause even more trouble if someone buys a device, which is not listed there but still doesn't work.



Maybe Andrew can share some insight, why nVidia only supports a selected number of TV sets and Receivers and not just all HDMI 1.4 compatible devices?

#66
Posted 12/03/2011 01:52 PM   
Uhh, when did I say I thought AMD was a better solution? I said it's a viable alternative. viable = practicable; workable: a viable alternative.

Oh, and the supported list is complete?

If there was a "unsupported list", then a person could see that the recently released PS3 Display has been "officially" declared shunned by Nvidia.

Meanwhile, people WILL continue to buy it and post complaining "how was I supposed to know it was unsupported, it was just released, why would I assume that it would not work?"

This has happened with the recently released monitors from LG, Samsung and now Sony. The world is full of us "stupid" people assuming that these monitors will work with our Nvidia GPUs. We are so "stupid" that we, for whatever reason, are not assuming that Nvidia is making a perfectly compatible 3D Display, incompatible. If you do not see the argument made here, I will assume you are "stupid"

I'm just saying that the situation is continually happening, customers are continually posting their frustration, you see it again and again. Nvidia should be taking a "close look" at these negative experiences, least they lose more ground to AMD. It's easy for a customer to look at the grass on the other side of the fence and think it's greener, once they jump the fence, depending on their experience, you may not be able to drag them back over.

Word of mouth has long been some of the greatest and best marketing a good product can have. While I haven't bad mouthed Nvidia to any of my friends, being that I'm a fanboy, many of these disgruntled costomers easily could do so. I'm just saying that perhaps it would be good to implement damage control sooner than later. In the early days of 3D Vision until recently, it was pretty cut and dry as to what was supported. Now with 3DTV Play thrown in the mix and new displays releasing all the time, it would be nice to see some of the confusion eliminated somehow, someway.

Or I suppose the better thing to do, is ignore it, as if there isn't a problem, when there obviously is.
Uhh, when did I say I thought AMD was a better solution? I said it's a viable alternative. viable = practicable; workable: a viable alternative.



Oh, and the supported list is complete?



If there was a "unsupported list", then a person could see that the recently released PS3 Display has been "officially" declared shunned by Nvidia.



Meanwhile, people WILL continue to buy it and post complaining "how was I supposed to know it was unsupported, it was just released, why would I assume that it would not work?"



This has happened with the recently released monitors from LG, Samsung and now Sony. The world is full of us "stupid" people assuming that these monitors will work with our Nvidia GPUs. We are so "stupid" that we, for whatever reason, are not assuming that Nvidia is making a perfectly compatible 3D Display, incompatible. If you do not see the argument made here, I will assume you are "stupid"



I'm just saying that the situation is continually happening, customers are continually posting their frustration, you see it again and again. Nvidia should be taking a "close look" at these negative experiences, least they lose more ground to AMD. It's easy for a customer to look at the grass on the other side of the fence and think it's greener, once they jump the fence, depending on their experience, you may not be able to drag them back over.



Word of mouth has long been some of the greatest and best marketing a good product can have. While I haven't bad mouthed Nvidia to any of my friends, being that I'm a fanboy, many of these disgruntled costomers easily could do so. I'm just saying that perhaps it would be good to implement damage control sooner than later. In the early days of 3D Vision until recently, it was pretty cut and dry as to what was supported. Now with 3DTV Play thrown in the mix and new displays releasing all the time, it would be nice to see some of the confusion eliminated somehow, someway.



Or I suppose the better thing to do, is ignore it, as if there isn't a problem, when there obviously is.

#67
Posted 12/03/2011 02:59 PM   
[quote name='D-Man11' date='03 December 2011 - 03:59 PM' timestamp='1322924393' post='1336961']
Oh, and the supported list is complete?[/quote]Does it have to be? But a negative list would have to be complete, otherwise nVidia would face legal problems (if a device is not listed there, but it's still not working).

[quote name='D-Man11' date='03 December 2011 - 03:59 PM' timestamp='1322924393' post='1336961']
If there was a "unsupported list", then a person could see that the recently released PS3 Display has been "officially" declared shunned by Nvidia.[/quote]Without knowing anything about the internal dealings, noone knows if nVidia is shunning Sony or the other way round. You just keep making up things without any facts, this sounds more and more like a conspiracy theory.

Usually things are much simpler than that. Maybe it just comes down to the manufacturors providing the EDID data and/or a test model to nVidia. And maybe Sony just refused to do that, for obvious reasons.

[quote name='D-Man11' date='03 December 2011 - 03:59 PM' timestamp='1322924393' post='1336961']
Meanwhile, people WILL continue to buy it and post complaining "how was I supposed to know it was unsupported, it was just released, why would I assume that it would not work?"[/quote]Well, maybe by checking the list of [b][i]supported devices[/i][/b] first? If the display is not listed there, one can still ask around if it's supported anyway. But just assuming that it should be supported and then being angry because it's not, is... well not very intelligent.

[quote name='D-Man11' date='03 December 2011 - 03:59 PM' timestamp='1322924393' post='1336961']
This has happened with the recently released monitors from LG, Samsung and now Sony. The world is full of us "stupid" people assuming that these monitors will work with our Nvidia GPUs. We are so "stupid" that we, for whatever reason, are not assuming that Nvidia is making a perfectly compatible 3D Display, incompatible. If you do not see the argument made here, I will assume you are "stupid"[/quote]At least it's a case of someone not getting well informed before investing his money. nVidia made it very clear, that 3DVision and 3DTV Play doesn't support all devices.

I'll leave it up to you to guess whether I think I'm stupid because I actually DON'T follow your argument here.

[quote name='D-Man11' date='03 December 2011 - 03:59 PM' timestamp='1322924393' post='1336961']
I'm just saying that the situation is continually happening, customers are continually posting their frustration, you see it again and again. Nvidia should be taking a "close look" at these negative experiences, least they lose more ground to AMD. It's easy for a customer to look at the grass on the other side of the fence and think it's greener, once they jump the fence, depending on their experience, you may not be able to drag them back over.[/quote]Hm, I see one or two postings to that regard every week. So it seems that most people get informed before they buy. Or do you think that only 5 people or so buy 3DVision hardware/software per week?

I agree that it's nVidia's responsibility to communicate supported hardware as good as possible. I also agree that it would be much better if all available hardware would just work.

But a "negative-list" as you're suggesting just doesn't make any sense to me, sorry.


By the way, you might want to reread my statement about what I think is stupid. And after you've done that, you should consider if it was really necessary to call me stupid directly into my face.
[quote name='D-Man11' date='03 December 2011 - 03:59 PM' timestamp='1322924393' post='1336961']

Oh, and the supported list is complete?Does it have to be? But a negative list would have to be complete, otherwise nVidia would face legal problems (if a device is not listed there, but it's still not working).



[quote name='D-Man11' date='03 December 2011 - 03:59 PM' timestamp='1322924393' post='1336961']

If there was a "unsupported list", then a person could see that the recently released PS3 Display has been "officially" declared shunned by Nvidia.Without knowing anything about the internal dealings, noone knows if nVidia is shunning Sony or the other way round. You just keep making up things without any facts, this sounds more and more like a conspiracy theory.



Usually things are much simpler than that. Maybe it just comes down to the manufacturors providing the EDID data and/or a test model to nVidia. And maybe Sony just refused to do that, for obvious reasons.



[quote name='D-Man11' date='03 December 2011 - 03:59 PM' timestamp='1322924393' post='1336961']

Meanwhile, people WILL continue to buy it and post complaining "how was I supposed to know it was unsupported, it was just released, why would I assume that it would not work?"Well, maybe by checking the list of supported devices first? If the display is not listed there, one can still ask around if it's supported anyway. But just assuming that it should be supported and then being angry because it's not, is... well not very intelligent.



[quote name='D-Man11' date='03 December 2011 - 03:59 PM' timestamp='1322924393' post='1336961']

This has happened with the recently released monitors from LG, Samsung and now Sony. The world is full of us "stupid" people assuming that these monitors will work with our Nvidia GPUs. We are so "stupid" that we, for whatever reason, are not assuming that Nvidia is making a perfectly compatible 3D Display, incompatible. If you do not see the argument made here, I will assume you are "stupid"At least it's a case of someone not getting well informed before investing his money. nVidia made it very clear, that 3DVision and 3DTV Play doesn't support all devices.



I'll leave it up to you to guess whether I think I'm stupid because I actually DON'T follow your argument here.



[quote name='D-Man11' date='03 December 2011 - 03:59 PM' timestamp='1322924393' post='1336961']

I'm just saying that the situation is continually happening, customers are continually posting their frustration, you see it again and again. Nvidia should be taking a "close look" at these negative experiences, least they lose more ground to AMD. It's easy for a customer to look at the grass on the other side of the fence and think it's greener, once they jump the fence, depending on their experience, you may not be able to drag them back over.Hm, I see one or two postings to that regard every week. So it seems that most people get informed before they buy. Or do you think that only 5 people or so buy 3DVision hardware/software per week?



I agree that it's nVidia's responsibility to communicate supported hardware as good as possible. I also agree that it would be much better if all available hardware would just work.



But a "negative-list" as you're suggesting just doesn't make any sense to me, sorry.





By the way, you might want to reread my statement about what I think is stupid. And after you've done that, you should consider if it was really necessary to call me stupid directly into my face.

#68
Posted 12/03/2011 09:03 PM   
I just returned the Playstation display and got Acer GD235HZ http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16824009222 and A Duke Nukem Nvidia Vision kit http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814998059 . All together cost a little bit less then The Playstion display but is supported.
I just returned the Playstation display and got Acer GD235HZ http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16824009222 and A Duke Nukem Nvidia Vision kit http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814998059 . All together cost a little bit less then The Playstion display but is supported.

#69
Posted 12/03/2011 09:21 PM   
To summarize, from what I've gathered so far, the following 2D modes should be supported, right?
1920x1080 at 24hz
1280x720 at 60hz

Would 1920x1080 at 60hz work in 2D mode? (if so, the display is great as a computer screen)

As for 3D, would the playstation display be able to output 120hz 3D from a 1280x720 image at 60hz in side-by-side (or top-bottom) mode?

I don't know if it makes any difference, but I own a GTX550TI card and run linux. I have contacted SONY support by email to try and gather more specific information about the display but they are not even willing to release the user manuals at this time and their support staff does not seem to know the product well.

As this would be my first 3D monitor, I would be grateful if anyone can help me clarify things a bit.
To summarize, from what I've gathered so far, the following 2D modes should be supported, right?

1920x1080 at 24hz

1280x720 at 60hz



Would 1920x1080 at 60hz work in 2D mode? (if so, the display is great as a computer screen)



As for 3D, would the playstation display be able to output 120hz 3D from a 1280x720 image at 60hz in side-by-side (or top-bottom) mode?



I don't know if it makes any difference, but I own a GTX550TI card and run linux. I have contacted SONY support by email to try and gather more specific information about the display but they are not even willing to release the user manuals at this time and their support staff does not seem to know the product well.



As this would be my first 3D monitor, I would be grateful if anyone can help me clarify things a bit.

#70
Posted 12/04/2011 07:30 AM   
[quote name='osmac' date='04 December 2011 - 02:30 AM' timestamp='1322983827' post='1337312']
To summarize, from what I've gathered so far, the following 2D modes should be supported, right?
1920x1080 at 24hz
1280x720 at 60hz

Would 1920x1080 at 60hz work in 2D mode? (if so, the display is great as a computer screen)

As for 3D, would the playstation display be able to output 120hz 3D from a 1280x720 image at 60hz in side-by-side (or top-bottom) mode?

I don't know if it makes any difference, but I own a GTX550TI card and run linux. I have contacted SONY support by email to try and gather more specific information about the display but they are not even willing to release the user manuals at this time and their support staff does not seem to know the product well.

As this would be my first 3D monitor, I would be grateful if anyone can help me clarify things a bit.
[/quote]

In 2D mode the native which is the best resolution it can display is in 1920X1080@60hz and of course you can change to a smaller resolution at 60hz as well.

[b]1920x1080@24hz and 1280x720@60hz is only when you have 3D enabled.[/b]

[quote name='osmac' date='04 December 2011 - 02:30 AM' timestamp='1322983827' post='1337312']As for 3D, would the playstation display be able to output 120hz 3D from a 1280x720 image at 60hz in side-by-side (or top-bottom) mode?[/quote]

As for that I do not know.
[quote name='osmac' date='04 December 2011 - 02:30 AM' timestamp='1322983827' post='1337312']

To summarize, from what I've gathered so far, the following 2D modes should be supported, right?

1920x1080 at 24hz

1280x720 at 60hz



Would 1920x1080 at 60hz work in 2D mode? (if so, the display is great as a computer screen)



As for 3D, would the playstation display be able to output 120hz 3D from a 1280x720 image at 60hz in side-by-side (or top-bottom) mode?



I don't know if it makes any difference, but I own a GTX550TI card and run linux. I have contacted SONY support by email to try and gather more specific information about the display but they are not even willing to release the user manuals at this time and their support staff does not seem to know the product well.



As this would be my first 3D monitor, I would be grateful if anyone can help me clarify things a bit.





In 2D mode the native which is the best resolution it can display is in 1920X1080@60hz and of course you can change to a smaller resolution at 60hz as well.



1920x1080@24hz and 1280x720@60hz is only when you have 3D enabled.



[quote name='osmac' date='04 December 2011 - 02:30 AM' timestamp='1322983827' post='1337312']As for 3D, would the playstation display be able to output 120hz 3D from a 1280x720 image at 60hz in side-by-side (or top-bottom) mode?



As for that I do not know.

#71
Posted 12/04/2011 02:28 PM   
Alright thanks for the clarifications, can someone confirm that 720p@60hz side-by-side is supported by the monitor? (and perhaps 1080p@60hz sbs)
Alright thanks for the clarifications, can someone confirm that 720p@60hz side-by-side is supported by the monitor? (and perhaps 1080p@60hz sbs)

#72
Posted 12/04/2011 07:07 PM   
[quote name='osmac' date='04 December 2011 - 02:07 PM' timestamp='1323025636' post='1337510']
Alright thanks for the clarifications, can someone confirm that 720p@60hz side-by-side is supported by the monitor? (and perhaps 1080p@60hz sbs)
[/quote]
I believe that the monitor can not accept 1080p@60hz but it processes everything at 240hz so in a way it makes all signals look as if they are 240hz. Somebody tell me if I am wrong.
[quote name='osmac' date='04 December 2011 - 02:07 PM' timestamp='1323025636' post='1337510']

Alright thanks for the clarifications, can someone confirm that 720p@60hz side-by-side is supported by the monitor? (and perhaps 1080p@60hz sbs)



I believe that the monitor can not accept 1080p@60hz but it processes everything at 240hz so in a way it makes all signals look as if they are 240hz. Somebody tell me if I am wrong.

#73
Posted 12/05/2011 08:12 PM   
It's not a 120hz monitor, guys. Why bother? Seriously, why bother.
It's not a 120hz monitor, guys. Why bother? Seriously, why bother.

#74
Posted 12/05/2011 09:22 PM   
[quote name='f3likx' date='05 December 2011 - 09:22 PM' timestamp='1323120149' post='1338051']
It's not a 120hz monitor, guys. Why bother? Seriously, why bother.
[/quote]

Because by feeding it 1080p side-by-side images, the display would output 120hz even if you'd lose half the horizontal resolution.
I'm thinking that it might still be a nice monitor until proper support is added to the drivers.

Do you guys know in what circumstances the display interpolates to 240hz? (was it worth advertising the monitor as 240hz?)
[quote name='f3likx' date='05 December 2011 - 09:22 PM' timestamp='1323120149' post='1338051']

It's not a 120hz monitor, guys. Why bother? Seriously, why bother.





Because by feeding it 1080p side-by-side images, the display would output 120hz even if you'd lose half the horizontal resolution.

I'm thinking that it might still be a nice monitor until proper support is added to the drivers.



Do you guys know in what circumstances the display interpolates to 240hz? (was it worth advertising the monitor as 240hz?)

#75
Posted 12/05/2011 10:38 PM   
  5 / 18    
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