[quote name='x_phir3' post='993784' date='Feb 2 2010, 09:09 PM']Good input :) ...without the possibility to modify the shutter sync there is no way this will work...anyway I had enough of 3D Vision I'm waiting for other vendors to release 3D products...This year is gonna be a 3D home revolution :D[/quote]
Yep I am too awaiting the new glasses, keen for dlp link (white light) instead of an ir emitter where I cannot play during day
Also keen on others shutter tech, perhaps Xpand or Bit Cauldron but here comes a good year.
Just be great if Nvidia worked with us a bit on helping resolve the search for the holy grail, ghost free stereo image.
Can't be this hard seriously :)
[quote name='x_phir3' post='993784' date='Feb 2 2010, 09:09 PM']Good input :) ...without the possibility to modify the shutter sync there is no way this will work...anyway I had enough of 3D Vision I'm waiting for other vendors to release 3D products...This year is gonna be a 3D home revolution :D
Yep I am too awaiting the new glasses, keen for dlp link (white light) instead of an ir emitter where I cannot play during day
Also keen on others shutter tech, perhaps Xpand or Bit Cauldron but here comes a good year.
Just be great if Nvidia worked with us a bit on helping resolve the search for the holy grail, ghost free stereo image.
[quote name='bullripper' post='993831' date='Feb 2 2010, 02:55 PM']Just be great if Nvidia worked with us a bit on helping resolve the search for the holy grail, ghost free stereo image.
Can't be this hard seriously :)[/quote]
This was their only advantage..only if...
Now other vendors learned about this problem and will boast with free ghost products ...and of course NVIDIA will lose their consumers..
but heck I wanna be a happy customer :D
[quote name='bullripper' post='993831' date='Feb 2 2010, 02:55 PM']Just be great if Nvidia worked with us a bit on helping resolve the search for the holy grail, ghost free stereo image.
Can't be this hard seriously :)
This was their only advantage..only if...
Now other vendors learned about this problem and will boast with free ghost products ...and of course NVIDIA will lose their consumers..
but heck I wanna be a happy customer :D
CASE: ThermalTake Armor+
CPU: Phenom II 720 X3
GPU: BFG Geforce GTX 295 REV B
RAM: 2 GB Corsair DDR3-1333 CL9
MB: ASUS Crosshair III Formula
PSU: Tagan Piperock 600 W
HDD: Seagate Baracuda 7200.12 1TB
SOUND: Creative X-Fi
DISPLAY: Samsung 2233RZ + Geforce 3D Vision
Call me silly but......... Am i right in saying people would like sync ajustment timings to help sovle the ghost issue? :huh:
Because in my little head im thinking it wont matter/fix anything? Due to the fact these LCD screens refresh from top to bottom (rather than entire frame) causing ghosting in the top segments ( the last segment to refresh)
There is a thread on this forum that already points this out? someone recorded playing with a 400 or something fps camera and it's cleary visable
Call me silly but......... Am i right in saying people would like sync ajustment timings to help sovle the ghost issue? :huh:
Because in my little head im thinking it wont matter/fix anything? Due to the fact these LCD screens refresh from top to bottom (rather than entire frame) causing ghosting in the top segments ( the last segment to refresh)
There is a thread on this forum that already points this out? someone recorded playing with a 400 or something fps camera and it's cleary visable
[quote name='Adz 3000' post='993941' date='Feb 2 2010, 05:05 PM']Call me silly but......... Am i right in saying people would like sync ajustment timings to help sovle the ghost issue? :huh:
Because in my little head im thinking it wont matter/fix anything? Due to the fact these LCD screens refresh from top to bottom (rather than entire frame) causing ghosting in the top segments ( the last segment to refresh)
There is a thread on this forum that already points this out? someone recorded playing with a 400 or something fps camera and it's cleary visable[/quote]
depends, i mean, if the ir signal is just a switch from eye to eye it's hard to fix, but maybe we can fine tune it and get a bit better view.
while if the ir signal sends events for opening and closing separately it's easy fixable, cause we can decide how long the shutter should be stay open, for example we could sacrifice a bit of brightness reducing the open time and eliminating ghosting.
[quote name='Adz 3000' post='993941' date='Feb 2 2010, 05:05 PM']Call me silly but......... Am i right in saying people would like sync ajustment timings to help sovle the ghost issue? :huh:
Because in my little head im thinking it wont matter/fix anything? Due to the fact these LCD screens refresh from top to bottom (rather than entire frame) causing ghosting in the top segments ( the last segment to refresh)
There is a thread on this forum that already points this out? someone recorded playing with a 400 or something fps camera and it's cleary visable
depends, i mean, if the ir signal is just a switch from eye to eye it's hard to fix, but maybe we can fine tune it and get a bit better view.
while if the ir signal sends events for opening and closing separately it's easy fixable, cause we can decide how long the shutter should be stay open, for example we could sacrifice a bit of brightness reducing the open time and eliminating ghosting.
[quote name='Rayx0r' post='992094' date='Jan 30 2010, 07:17 AM']I think part of the problem nVidia is having with this is people are calling this issue "ghosting". Which may be the case, but its actually a bi-product of the monitor not displaying full stereo. You end up with images splitting.
We're building several stereo extraction workstations that use 3d vision and the samsung syncmaster monitors. Several of our users are experiencing a strange mono band on the top vertical quarter of the monitor from edge to edge. Below this, stereo is fine. Nothing else seems to be effected, only the stereo display.
We're using the 191.78 Quadro drivers
Using the 191 USB drivers for the emitter
XP professional SP3[/quote]
I agree the terms ghosting is overloaded, but that's really what it looks like. Technically I think the term "stereo extinction ratio" is a more specific way of referring to what we're talking about. The system which displays the image to the left eye should extinguish all traces of the right eye image.
[quote name='Rayx0r' post='992094' date='Jan 30 2010, 07:17 AM']I think part of the problem nVidia is having with this is people are calling this issue "ghosting". Which may be the case, but its actually a bi-product of the monitor not displaying full stereo. You end up with images splitting.
We're building several stereo extraction workstations that use 3d vision and the samsung syncmaster monitors. Several of our users are experiencing a strange mono band on the top vertical quarter of the monitor from edge to edge. Below this, stereo is fine. Nothing else seems to be effected, only the stereo display.
We're using the 191.78 Quadro drivers
Using the 191 USB drivers for the emitter
XP professional SP3
I agree the terms ghosting is overloaded, but that's really what it looks like. Technically I think the term "stereo extinction ratio" is a more specific way of referring to what we're talking about. The system which displays the image to the left eye should extinguish all traces of the right eye image.
i had bad ghosting on my 65" Mitsubishi Dlp at anything above 25 percent convergence for months- i just assumed this was how they worked. i just upgraded to the newest drivers and to my suprise i have no ghosting at all- even at the hightest depth level! i am so stoked....what a difference it makes being able to run full depth! hope they get this fixed for everyone soon. you guys are missing out.
i had bad ghosting on my 65" Mitsubishi Dlp at anything above 25 percent convergence for months- i just assumed this was how they worked. i just upgraded to the newest drivers and to my suprise i have no ghosting at all- even at the hightest depth level! i am so stoked....what a difference it makes being able to run full depth! hope they get this fixed for everyone soon. you guys are missing out.
System:
Intel I7 920 overclocked to 4ghz
Asus Rampage Extreme II
2 Ge-force 480 in SLI
GTX 295 PhysX Card
12gb ddr3 2000mhz ram
Intel SSD in RAID 0
BR RW
1000w Sony surround sound
NVIDIA 3D Vision
3d displays tested:
Mitsubishi 65" DLP 3d HDTV (good old 1080p checkerboard since 2007!!!)
Panasonic VT25 (nice 2d but I returned it due to cross talk)
Acer H5360 720p on 130" screen (the best 3d)
23" Acer LCD monitor (horrible cross talk- sold it)
I'm one of the few Quadro/XP users contributing to this forum and thought I'd add a recent experience to this discussion. I noticed that Nvidia added a new Quadro driver on Feb 9 (version 191.87). I usually install these when they first come out to see if it performs better than the 190.58 OpenGL driver I've been using these last few months. Invariably there is flickering/ghosting. Installing this latest driver was, I'm sorry to say, no different. Forcing vsync off removed the flickering but the ghosting was still very apparent. I usually test the latest driver with the 3dtv Stereoscopic player and the "Fly Me To The Moon" stereo 3d montage referenced in [url="http://3dvision-blog.com/fly-me-to-the-moon-trailer-in-stereoscopic-3d-720p/"]Bloody's blog[/url] then try it out on one of our stereo applications using stereo models of aerial photography. With the OpenGL driver, there's virtually no ghosting and the 3D effect, top to bottom, is great. It's only the text at the very end - "Fly Me To The Moon" and "Maximum 3D Immersion" - that look strange. I cannot get them to fuse into a single image. With the 191.87 3D Vision Quadro driver, I had serious ghosting but the text looked perfect as it zoomed toward me.
Opening my aerial photo app (which operates in a window), the 3D effect was excellent for about 90% of the image. But there is a band where there is no stereo effect whatsoever. The image looks completely flat. I have never noticed this effect with the OpenGL driver, which generates perfect top-to-bottom stereo. What is it doing that the 3D Vision driver isn't?? I'll keep trying the latest 3D Vision drivers but it sure is nice to have a reliable backup driver when needed.
I'm one of the few Quadro/XP users contributing to this forum and thought I'd add a recent experience to this discussion. I noticed that Nvidia added a new Quadro driver on Feb 9 (version 191.87). I usually install these when they first come out to see if it performs better than the 190.58 OpenGL driver I've been using these last few months. Invariably there is flickering/ghosting. Installing this latest driver was, I'm sorry to say, no different. Forcing vsync off removed the flickering but the ghosting was still very apparent. I usually test the latest driver with the 3dtv Stereoscopic player and the "Fly Me To The Moon" stereo 3d montage referenced in Bloody's blog then try it out on one of our stereo applications using stereo models of aerial photography. With the OpenGL driver, there's virtually no ghosting and the 3D effect, top to bottom, is great. It's only the text at the very end - "Fly Me To The Moon" and "Maximum 3D Immersion" - that look strange. I cannot get them to fuse into a single image. With the 191.87 3D Vision Quadro driver, I had serious ghosting but the text looked perfect as it zoomed toward me.
Opening my aerial photo app (which operates in a window), the 3D effect was excellent for about 90% of the image. But there is a band where there is no stereo effect whatsoever. The image looks completely flat. I have never noticed this effect with the OpenGL driver, which generates perfect top-to-bottom stereo. What is it doing that the 3D Vision driver isn't?? I'll keep trying the latest 3D Vision drivers but it sure is nice to have a reliable backup driver when needed.
Using 3D Vision & Quadro 4000 for GIS apps on 64-bit Windows 7/Dell T7500 Workstation
[quote name='8cinq' post='993133' date='Feb 1 2010, 12:39 PM']Here some photos of my ghost issue. My config: ViewSonic VX2268wm + nvidia 3d vision + GeForce 8800GTS 512Mb. Gaming on 110Hz, because glasses flickering issue on 120Hz.
The lot of ghosting in GTA4:
[url="http://img.picsa.ru/pictures/0/000/028/610/28610.JPG"][img]http://img.picsa.ru/pictures/0/000/028/610/28610_640xg.JPG[/img][/url]
(All photos through one of the glasses. Clickable.)
Another one:
[url="http://img.picsa.ru/pictures/0/000/028/619/28619.JPG"][img]http://img.picsa.ru/pictures/0/000/028/619/28619_640xg.JPG[/img][/url]
Sometimes, ghosting can be seen in top of the screen, only:
[url="http://img.picsa.ru/pictures/0/000/028/618/28618.JPG"][img]http://img.picsa.ru/pictures/0/000/028/618/28618_640xg.JPG[/img][/url]
Fallout3 looks great, i cant find ghosting at all:
[url="http://img.picsa.ru/pictures/0/000/028/615/28615.JPG"][img]http://img.picsa.ru/pictures/0/000/028/615/28615_640xg.JPG[/img][/url]
(All "dark" games looks great)
Another game w/o ghosting (almost of scenes) - Mount & Blade:
[url="http://img.picsa.ru/pictures/0/000/028/612/28612.JPG"][img]http://img.picsa.ru/pictures/0/000/028/612/28612_640xg.JPG[/img][/url]
But most of games have a ghosting issue. Sometimes it very noticeable ("bright" games), sometimes almost can't see it.[/quote]
Hi, I entered the forum only for this topic, because I have ghosting problems too!
The same problems of 8cinq and I have a Samsung Syncmaster2233RZ with 3d vision and windows vista 32 bit.
(I have the kit from September 2009).
In my opinion in a monitor problem or a syncronization glasses/monitor problem.
If anyone can fix it, it will be great.
[quote name='8cinq' post='993133' date='Feb 1 2010, 12:39 PM']Here some photos of my ghost issue. My config: ViewSonic VX2268wm + nvidia 3d vision + GeForce 8800GTS 512Mb. Gaming on 110Hz, because glasses flickering issue on 120Hz.
The lot of ghosting in GTA4:
(All photos through one of the glasses. Clickable.)
Another one:
Sometimes, ghosting can be seen in top of the screen, only:
Fallout3 looks great, i cant find ghosting at all:
(All "dark" games looks great)
Another game w/o ghosting (almost of scenes) - Mount & Blade:
But most of games have a ghosting issue. Sometimes it very noticeable ("bright" games), sometimes almost can't see it.
Hi, I entered the forum only for this topic, because I have ghosting problems too!
The same problems of 8cinq and I have a Samsung Syncmaster2233RZ with 3d vision and windows vista 32 bit.
(I have the kit from September 2009).
In my opinion in a monitor problem or a syncronization glasses/monitor problem.
the acer gd245hq has the same top screen sync ghosting issues. it's really bad for me. its 100% both images at the top of the screen and blends down to full 3d at the bottom. So in the middle you see 50% ghosting and it gets worse the further up you go. It unusable. I would prefer to have a sync delay/offset adjustment to allow the middle of the screen to be in full 3d and the top and bottom to be 50% ghosting.
the acer gd245hq has the same top screen sync ghosting issues. it's really bad for me. its 100% both images at the top of the screen and blends down to full 3d at the bottom. So in the middle you see 50% ghosting and it gets worse the further up you go. It unusable. I would prefer to have a sync delay/offset adjustment to allow the middle of the screen to be in full 3d and the top and bottom to be 50% ghosting.
still waiting a ghost-free monitor model, maybe one day.... sooner or later.... before the end of the world.... ora maybe we can just fix.... one day.... when they give us controls.... before next century if it's possible....
in addiction my 22'' is not compatible for upcoming 3d blueray aswell, indeed a nice choice, my sage always say to wait before buying new technologies, he's so true!!
well. shutter glasses are a 15 years old technology for home computers, that was my excuse /blarg.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':/' />
still waiting a ghost-free monitor model, maybe one day.... sooner or later.... before the end of the world.... ora maybe we can just fix.... one day.... when they give us controls.... before next century if it's possible....
in addiction my 22'' is not compatible for upcoming 3d blueray aswell, indeed a nice choice, my sage always say to wait before buying new technologies, he's so true!!
well. shutter glasses are a 15 years old technology for home computers, that was my excuse /blarg.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':/' />
I also, like everyone here have a ghosting issue. I take some comfort in the fact that 'ghosting' is the exact word I used for it before I found out most people have this problem.
I do still use 3D sometimes, some things I have found that helps:
-reduce the brightness
-let the monitor warm up
-use at absolute minimum depth (but then why am I playing 3D I ask myself)
I contacted NVidia last week and they did tell me they were aware of this issue with the samsung 2233rz. The suggested some acer monitor, but it is hard to believe them considering they put the 3D sticker on the samsung in the first place.
Thanks to those who have posted about their monitors that Do work, I will be looking into a replacement soon. But just in case anyone from samsung or nvidia reads this, you can go fornicate yourself with a rusted railspike as far as i am concerned.
I also, like everyone here have a ghosting issue. I take some comfort in the fact that 'ghosting' is the exact word I used for it before I found out most people have this problem.
I do still use 3D sometimes, some things I have found that helps:
-reduce the brightness
-let the monitor warm up
-use at absolute minimum depth (but then why am I playing 3D I ask myself)
I contacted NVidia last week and they did tell me they were aware of this issue with the samsung 2233rz. The suggested some acer monitor, but it is hard to believe them considering they put the 3D sticker on the samsung in the first place.
Thanks to those who have posted about their monitors that Do work, I will be looking into a replacement soon. But just in case anyone from samsung or nvidia reads this, you can go fornicate yourself with a rusted railspike as far as i am concerned.
[quote name='fmben' post='1071058' date='Jun 10 2010, 01:09 AM']I also, like everyone here have a ghosting issue. I take some comfort in the fact that 'ghosting' is the exact word I used for it before I found out most people have this problem.
I do still use 3D sometimes, some things I have found that helps:
-reduce the brightness
-let the monitor warm up
-use at absolute minimum depth (but then why am I playing 3D I ask myself)
I contacted NVidia last week and they did tell me they were aware of this issue with the samsung 2233rz. The suggested some acer monitor, but it is hard to believe them considering they put the 3D sticker on the samsung in the first place.
Thanks to those who have posted about their monitors that Do work, I will be looking into a replacement soon. But just in case anyone from samsung or nvidia reads this, you can go fornicate yourself with a rusted railspike as far as i am concerned.[/quote]
I want to try sony shutter ( cheap, but Im afraid its not 50/50 duty cycle but, 240hz opened only while the LED backlight is pulsed behind the LCD TV panel.
[quote name='fmben' post='1071058' date='Jun 10 2010, 01:09 AM']I also, like everyone here have a ghosting issue. I take some comfort in the fact that 'ghosting' is the exact word I used for it before I found out most people have this problem.
I do still use 3D sometimes, some things I have found that helps:
-reduce the brightness
-let the monitor warm up
-use at absolute minimum depth (but then why am I playing 3D I ask myself)
I contacted NVidia last week and they did tell me they were aware of this issue with the samsung 2233rz. The suggested some acer monitor, but it is hard to believe them considering they put the 3D sticker on the samsung in the first place.
Thanks to those who have posted about their monitors that Do work, I will be looking into a replacement soon. But just in case anyone from samsung or nvidia reads this, you can go fornicate yourself with a rusted railspike as far as i am concerned.
I want to try sony shutter ( cheap, but Im afraid its not 50/50 duty cycle but, 240hz opened only while the LED backlight is pulsed behind the LCD TV panel.
I wanted to chime in on this a bit... Something I think should be mentioned.
I'm no expert, but I think this makes sense. There's different types of ghosting in 3D Gaming...
-There's always going to be ghosting with 3D GAMES no matter what... Especially games that utilize full 3d worlds that let you completely zoom in and out
and around. This happens in real-life too... It'll happen whenever the 2 images seen by either eye becomes too split. As an example, you can just take your finger and move it close to your face and watch as you start seeing double/ghosting. That's why adjusting convergence and depth is important... if it's too high, you see a lot of double image. This type of ghosting just has to do with your brain.
-The bad type of ghosting... and the type I hope all of you are talking about is when you see a "ghost" of the other image with one eye closed. This has the effect of killing the 3D image in a lot of cases and causes you to see double more often.
I just want to make this clear... As I'm wondering if some of the people complaining about ghosting on the Officially supported displays are just getting the first type. I have terrible ghosting on my FW900 Sony CRT... The bad type.
I wanted to chime in on this a bit... Something I think should be mentioned.
I'm no expert, but I think this makes sense. There's different types of ghosting in 3D Gaming...
-There's always going to be ghosting with 3D GAMES no matter what... Especially games that utilize full 3d worlds that let you completely zoom in and out
and around. This happens in real-life too... It'll happen whenever the 2 images seen by either eye becomes too split. As an example, you can just take your finger and move it close to your face and watch as you start seeing double/ghosting. That's why adjusting convergence and depth is important... if it's too high, you see a lot of double image. This type of ghosting just has to do with your brain.
-The bad type of ghosting... and the type I hope all of you are talking about is when you see a "ghost" of the other image with one eye closed. This has the effect of killing the 3D image in a lot of cases and causes you to see double more often.
I just want to make this clear... As I'm wondering if some of the people complaining about ghosting on the Officially supported displays are just getting the first type. I have terrible ghosting on my FW900 Sony CRT... The bad type.
I wanted to chime in on this a bit... Something I think should be mentioned.
I'm no expert, but I think this makes sense. There's different types of ghosting in 3D Gaming...
-There's always going to be ghosting with 3D GAMES no matter what... Especially games that utilize full 3d worlds that let you completely zoom in and out
and around. This happens in real-life too... It'll happen whenever the 2 images seen by either eye becomes too split. As an example, you can just take your finger and move it close to your face and watch as you start seeing double/ghosting. That's why adjusting convergence and depth is important... if it's too high, you see a lot of double image. This type of ghosting just has to do with your brain.
-The bad type of ghosting... and the type I hope all of you are talking about is when you see a "ghost" of the other image with one eye closed. This has the effect of killing the 3D image in a lot of cases and causes you to see double more often.
I just want to make this clear... As I'm wondering if some of the people complaining about ghosting on the Officially supported displays are just getting the first type. I have terrible ghosting on my FW900 Sony CRT... The bad type.
I wanted to chime in on this a bit... Something I think should be mentioned.
I'm no expert, but I think this makes sense. There's different types of ghosting in 3D Gaming...
-There's always going to be ghosting with 3D GAMES no matter what... Especially games that utilize full 3d worlds that let you completely zoom in and out
and around. This happens in real-life too... It'll happen whenever the 2 images seen by either eye becomes too split. As an example, you can just take your finger and move it close to your face and watch as you start seeing double/ghosting. That's why adjusting convergence and depth is important... if it's too high, you see a lot of double image. This type of ghosting just has to do with your brain.
-The bad type of ghosting... and the type I hope all of you are talking about is when you see a "ghost" of the other image with one eye closed. This has the effect of killing the 3D image in a lot of cases and causes you to see double more often.
I just want to make this clear... As I'm wondering if some of the people complaining about ghosting on the Officially supported displays are just getting the first type. I have terrible ghosting on my FW900 Sony CRT... The bad type.
Yep I am too awaiting the new glasses, keen for dlp link (white light) instead of an ir emitter where I cannot play during day
Also keen on others shutter tech, perhaps Xpand or Bit Cauldron but here comes a good year.
Just be great if Nvidia worked with us a bit on helping resolve the search for the holy grail, ghost free stereo image.
Can't be this hard seriously :)
Yep I am too awaiting the new glasses, keen for dlp link (white light) instead of an ir emitter where I cannot play during day
Also keen on others shutter tech, perhaps Xpand or Bit Cauldron but here comes a good year.
Just be great if Nvidia worked with us a bit on helping resolve the search for the holy grail, ghost free stereo image.
Can't be this hard seriously :)
Can't be this hard seriously :)[/quote]
This was their only advantage..only if...
Now other vendors learned about this problem and will boast with free ghost products ...and of course NVIDIA will lose their consumers..
but heck I wanna be a happy customer :D
Can't be this hard seriously :)
This was their only advantage..only if...
Now other vendors learned about this problem and will boast with free ghost products ...and of course NVIDIA will lose their consumers..
but heck I wanna be a happy customer :D
CASE: ThermalTake Armor+
CPU: Phenom II 720 X3
GPU: BFG Geforce GTX 295 REV B
RAM: 2 GB Corsair DDR3-1333 CL9
MB: ASUS Crosshair III Formula
PSU: Tagan Piperock 600 W
HDD: Seagate Baracuda 7200.12 1TB
SOUND: Creative X-Fi
DISPLAY: Samsung 2233RZ + Geforce 3D Vision
Because in my little head im thinking it wont matter/fix anything? Due to the fact these LCD screens refresh from top to bottom (rather than entire frame) causing ghosting in the top segments ( the last segment to refresh)
There is a thread on this forum that already points this out? someone recorded playing with a 400 or something fps camera and it's cleary visable
Because in my little head im thinking it wont matter/fix anything? Due to the fact these LCD screens refresh from top to bottom (rather than entire frame) causing ghosting in the top segments ( the last segment to refresh)
There is a thread on this forum that already points this out? someone recorded playing with a 400 or something fps camera and it's cleary visable
Because in my little head im thinking it wont matter/fix anything? Due to the fact these LCD screens refresh from top to bottom (rather than entire frame) causing ghosting in the top segments ( the last segment to refresh)
There is a thread on this forum that already points this out? someone recorded playing with a 400 or something fps camera and it's cleary visable[/quote]
depends, i mean, if the ir signal is just a switch from eye to eye it's hard to fix, but maybe we can fine tune it and get a bit better view.
while if the ir signal sends events for opening and closing separately it's easy fixable, cause we can decide how long the shutter should be stay open, for example we could sacrifice a bit of brightness reducing the open time and eliminating ghosting.
i would love to be able to do that
Because in my little head im thinking it wont matter/fix anything? Due to the fact these LCD screens refresh from top to bottom (rather than entire frame) causing ghosting in the top segments ( the last segment to refresh)
There is a thread on this forum that already points this out? someone recorded playing with a 400 or something fps camera and it's cleary visable
depends, i mean, if the ir signal is just a switch from eye to eye it's hard to fix, but maybe we can fine tune it and get a bit better view.
while if the ir signal sends events for opening and closing separately it's easy fixable, cause we can decide how long the shutter should be stay open, for example we could sacrifice a bit of brightness reducing the open time and eliminating ghosting.
i would love to be able to do that
this is a clip from a thread I posted yesterday.
-------------------------------------------------------
We're building several stereo extraction workstations that use 3d vision and the samsung syncmaster monitors. Several of our users are experiencing a strange mono band on the top vertical quarter of the monitor from edge to edge. Below this, stereo is fine. Nothing else seems to be effected, only the stereo display.
We're using the 191.78 Quadro drivers
Using the 191 USB drivers for the emitter
XP professional SP3[/quote]
I agree the terms ghosting is overloaded, but that's really what it looks like. Technically I think the term "stereo extinction ratio" is a more specific way of referring to what we're talking about. The system which displays the image to the left eye should extinguish all traces of the right eye image.
this is a clip from a thread I posted yesterday.
-------------------------------------------------------
We're building several stereo extraction workstations that use 3d vision and the samsung syncmaster monitors. Several of our users are experiencing a strange mono band on the top vertical quarter of the monitor from edge to edge. Below this, stereo is fine. Nothing else seems to be effected, only the stereo display.
We're using the 191.78 Quadro drivers
Using the 191 USB drivers for the emitter
XP professional SP3
I agree the terms ghosting is overloaded, but that's really what it looks like. Technically I think the term "stereo extinction ratio" is a more specific way of referring to what we're talking about. The system which displays the image to the left eye should extinguish all traces of the right eye image.
System:
Intel I7 920 overclocked to 4ghz
Asus Rampage Extreme II
2 Ge-force 480 in SLI
GTX 295 PhysX Card
12gb ddr3 2000mhz ram
Intel SSD in RAID 0
BR RW
1000w Sony surround sound
NVIDIA 3D Vision
3d displays tested:
Mitsubishi 65" DLP 3d HDTV (good old 1080p checkerboard since 2007!!!)
Panasonic VT25 (nice 2d but I returned it due to cross talk)
Acer H5360 720p on 130" screen (the best 3d)
23" Acer LCD monitor (horrible cross talk- sold it)
Samsung 65D8000
Opening my aerial photo app (which operates in a window), the 3D effect was excellent for about 90% of the image. But there is a band where there is no stereo effect whatsoever. The image looks completely flat. I have never noticed this effect with the OpenGL driver, which generates perfect top-to-bottom stereo. What is it doing that the 3D Vision driver isn't?? I'll keep trying the latest 3D Vision drivers but it sure is nice to have a reliable backup driver when needed.
Opening my aerial photo app (which operates in a window), the 3D effect was excellent for about 90% of the image. But there is a band where there is no stereo effect whatsoever. The image looks completely flat. I have never noticed this effect with the OpenGL driver, which generates perfect top-to-bottom stereo. What is it doing that the 3D Vision driver isn't?? I'll keep trying the latest 3D Vision drivers but it sure is nice to have a reliable backup driver when needed.
Using 3D Vision & Quadro 4000 for GIS apps on 64-bit Windows 7/Dell T7500 Workstation
The lot of ghosting in GTA4:
[url="http://img.picsa.ru/pictures/0/000/028/610/28610.JPG"][img]http://img.picsa.ru/pictures/0/000/028/610/28610_640xg.JPG[/img][/url]
(All photos through one of the glasses. Clickable.)
Another one:
[url="http://img.picsa.ru/pictures/0/000/028/619/28619.JPG"][img]http://img.picsa.ru/pictures/0/000/028/619/28619_640xg.JPG[/img][/url]
Sometimes, ghosting can be seen in top of the screen, only:
[url="http://img.picsa.ru/pictures/0/000/028/618/28618.JPG"][img]http://img.picsa.ru/pictures/0/000/028/618/28618_640xg.JPG[/img][/url]
Fallout3 looks great, i cant find ghosting at all:
[url="http://img.picsa.ru/pictures/0/000/028/615/28615.JPG"][img]http://img.picsa.ru/pictures/0/000/028/615/28615_640xg.JPG[/img][/url]
(All "dark" games looks great)
Another game w/o ghosting (almost of scenes) - Mount & Blade:
[url="http://img.picsa.ru/pictures/0/000/028/612/28612.JPG"][img]http://img.picsa.ru/pictures/0/000/028/612/28612_640xg.JPG[/img][/url]
But most of games have a ghosting issue. Sometimes it very noticeable ("bright" games), sometimes almost can't see it.[/quote]
Hi, I entered the forum only for this topic, because I have ghosting problems too!
The same problems of 8cinq and I have a Samsung Syncmaster2233RZ with 3d vision and windows vista 32 bit.
(I have the kit from September 2009).
In my opinion in a monitor problem or a syncronization glasses/monitor problem.
If anyone can fix it, it will be great.
The lot of ghosting in GTA4:
(All photos through one of the glasses. Clickable.)
Another one:
Sometimes, ghosting can be seen in top of the screen, only:
Fallout3 looks great, i cant find ghosting at all:
(All "dark" games looks great)
Another game w/o ghosting (almost of scenes) - Mount & Blade:
But most of games have a ghosting issue. Sometimes it very noticeable ("bright" games), sometimes almost can't see it.
Hi, I entered the forum only for this topic, because I have ghosting problems too!
The same problems of 8cinq and I have a Samsung Syncmaster2233RZ with 3d vision and windows vista 32 bit.
(I have the kit from September 2009).
In my opinion in a monitor problem or a syncronization glasses/monitor problem.
If anyone can fix it, it will be great.
in addiction my 22'' is not compatible for upcoming 3d blueray aswell, indeed a nice choice, my sage always say to wait before buying new technologies, he's so true!!
well. shutter glasses are a 15 years old technology for home computers, that was my excuse
in addiction my 22'' is not compatible for upcoming 3d blueray aswell, indeed a nice choice, my sage always say to wait before buying new technologies, he's so true!!
well. shutter glasses are a 15 years old technology for home computers, that was my excuse
100% transmittance 100% opaque.
100% transmittance 100% opaque.
I do still use 3D sometimes, some things I have found that helps:
-reduce the brightness
-let the monitor warm up
-use at absolute minimum depth (but then why am I playing 3D I ask myself)
I contacted NVidia last week and they did tell me they were aware of this issue with the samsung 2233rz. The suggested some acer monitor, but it is hard to believe them considering they put the 3D sticker on the samsung in the first place.
Thanks to those who have posted about their monitors that Do work, I will be looking into a replacement soon. But just in case anyone from samsung or nvidia reads this, you can go fornicate yourself with a rusted railspike as far as i am concerned.
I do still use 3D sometimes, some things I have found that helps:
-reduce the brightness
-let the monitor warm up
-use at absolute minimum depth (but then why am I playing 3D I ask myself)
I contacted NVidia last week and they did tell me they were aware of this issue with the samsung 2233rz. The suggested some acer monitor, but it is hard to believe them considering they put the 3D sticker on the samsung in the first place.
Thanks to those who have posted about their monitors that Do work, I will be looking into a replacement soon. But just in case anyone from samsung or nvidia reads this, you can go fornicate yourself with a rusted railspike as far as i am concerned.
I do still use 3D sometimes, some things I have found that helps:
-reduce the brightness
-let the monitor warm up
-use at absolute minimum depth (but then why am I playing 3D I ask myself)
I contacted NVidia last week and they did tell me they were aware of this issue with the samsung 2233rz. The suggested some acer monitor, but it is hard to believe them considering they put the 3D sticker on the samsung in the first place.
Thanks to those who have posted about their monitors that Do work, I will be looking into a replacement soon. But just in case anyone from samsung or nvidia reads this, you can go fornicate yourself with a rusted railspike as far as i am concerned.[/quote]
I want to try sony shutter ( cheap, but Im afraid its not 50/50 duty cycle but, 240hz opened only while the LED backlight is pulsed behind the LCD TV panel.
I do still use 3D sometimes, some things I have found that helps:
-reduce the brightness
-let the monitor warm up
-use at absolute minimum depth (but then why am I playing 3D I ask myself)
I contacted NVidia last week and they did tell me they were aware of this issue with the samsung 2233rz. The suggested some acer monitor, but it is hard to believe them considering they put the 3D sticker on the samsung in the first place.
Thanks to those who have posted about their monitors that Do work, I will be looking into a replacement soon. But just in case anyone from samsung or nvidia reads this, you can go fornicate yourself with a rusted railspike as far as i am concerned.
I want to try sony shutter ( cheap, but Im afraid its not 50/50 duty cycle but, 240hz opened only while the LED backlight is pulsed behind the LCD TV panel.
I'm no expert, but I think this makes sense. There's different types of ghosting in 3D Gaming...
-There's always going to be ghosting with 3D GAMES no matter what... Especially games that utilize full 3d worlds that let you completely zoom in and out
and around. This happens in real-life too... It'll happen whenever the 2 images seen by either eye becomes too split. As an example, you can just take your finger and move it close to your face and watch as you start seeing double/ghosting. That's why adjusting convergence and depth is important... if it's too high, you see a lot of double image. This type of ghosting just has to do with your brain.
-The bad type of ghosting... and the type I hope all of you are talking about is when you see a "ghost" of the other image with one eye closed. This has the effect of killing the 3D image in a lot of cases and causes you to see double more often.
I just want to make this clear... As I'm wondering if some of the people complaining about ghosting on the Officially supported displays are just getting the first type. I have terrible ghosting on my FW900 Sony CRT... The bad type.
I'm no expert, but I think this makes sense. There's different types of ghosting in 3D Gaming...
-There's always going to be ghosting with 3D GAMES no matter what... Especially games that utilize full 3d worlds that let you completely zoom in and out
and around. This happens in real-life too... It'll happen whenever the 2 images seen by either eye becomes too split. As an example, you can just take your finger and move it close to your face and watch as you start seeing double/ghosting. That's why adjusting convergence and depth is important... if it's too high, you see a lot of double image. This type of ghosting just has to do with your brain.
-The bad type of ghosting... and the type I hope all of you are talking about is when you see a "ghost" of the other image with one eye closed. This has the effect of killing the 3D image in a lot of cases and causes you to see double more often.
I just want to make this clear... As I'm wondering if some of the people complaining about ghosting on the Officially supported displays are just getting the first type. I have terrible ghosting on my FW900 Sony CRT... The bad type.
I'm no expert, but I think this makes sense. There's different types of ghosting in 3D Gaming...
-There's always going to be ghosting with 3D GAMES no matter what... Especially games that utilize full 3d worlds that let you completely zoom in and out
and around. This happens in real-life too... It'll happen whenever the 2 images seen by either eye becomes too split. As an example, you can just take your finger and move it close to your face and watch as you start seeing double/ghosting. That's why adjusting convergence and depth is important... if it's too high, you see a lot of double image. This type of ghosting just has to do with your brain.
-The bad type of ghosting... and the type I hope all of you are talking about is when you see a "ghost" of the other image with one eye closed. This has the effect of killing the 3D image in a lot of cases and causes you to see double more often.
I just want to make this clear... As I'm wondering if some of the people complaining about ghosting on the Officially supported displays are just getting the first type. I have terrible ghosting on my FW900 Sony CRT... The bad type.
I'm no expert, but I think this makes sense. There's different types of ghosting in 3D Gaming...
-There's always going to be ghosting with 3D GAMES no matter what... Especially games that utilize full 3d worlds that let you completely zoom in and out
and around. This happens in real-life too... It'll happen whenever the 2 images seen by either eye becomes too split. As an example, you can just take your finger and move it close to your face and watch as you start seeing double/ghosting. That's why adjusting convergence and depth is important... if it's too high, you see a lot of double image. This type of ghosting just has to do with your brain.
-The bad type of ghosting... and the type I hope all of you are talking about is when you see a "ghost" of the other image with one eye closed. This has the effect of killing the 3D image in a lot of cases and causes you to see double more often.
I just want to make this clear... As I'm wondering if some of the people complaining about ghosting on the Officially supported displays are just getting the first type. I have terrible ghosting on my FW900 Sony CRT... The bad type.