3d Projectors
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So, my Viewsonic projector (PJD6531w) is coming back after being repaired under warranty, but I'm thinking of selling it and upgrading to a new 1080p 3d projector. The models I'm looking at are: BenQ W1070 Acer 6510BD Optoma HD131X (same as HD25 apparently). None of these are 3D vision certified, so I'll need to use via 3dtv play, unless I can use them with CRT mode and an EDID hack. Does anyone own any of these projectors or does anyone have any recommendations? The specifications of all three are very similar and I have no specific brand loyalty. I suppose 3d image quality/brightness are important as is input lag, although I do use my existing projector for 2d content most of the time. Can anyone help? Thanks, Russ.
So, my Viewsonic projector (PJD6531w) is coming back after being repaired under warranty, but I'm thinking of selling it and upgrading to a new 1080p 3d projector.

The models I'm looking at are:

BenQ W1070
Acer 6510BD
Optoma HD131X (same as HD25 apparently).

None of these are 3D vision certified, so I'll need to use via 3dtv play, unless I can use them with CRT mode and an EDID hack.

Does anyone own any of these projectors or does anyone have any recommendations?

The specifications of all three are very similar and I have no specific brand loyalty.
I suppose 3d image quality/brightness are important as is input lag, although I do use my existing projector for 2d content most of the time.

Can anyone help?

Thanks,

Russ.

GTX 1070 SLI, I7-6700k ~ 4.4Ghz, 3x BenQ XL2420T, BenQ TK800, LG 55EG960V (3D OLED), Samsung 850 EVO SSD, Crucial M4 SSD, 3D vision kit, Xpand x104 glasses, Corsair HX1000i, Win 10 pro 64/Win 7 64https://www.3dmark.com/fs/9529310

#1
Posted 04/19/2013 10:39 PM   
I kind of recommend getting a 720p 3d vision ready and a 1080P 2D one since its same price/cheaper and two lamps buts thats me. Especially since 3D vision 2 glasses are MUCH better then any DLP glasses but I guess edid overrides would work but I've never danced with that devil. I used 3d tv play when it was first introduced on my HDTV and it was a hassle in comparison to 3d vision. Id do a thorough search before going with a 1080P model. Not too many of us use them, like AVSFORUM. 1080p models are much less bright as well. Not to mention 1080P 3d on a HDMI1.4 projector is unplayable. Not sure why you want a 1080P model when you have a 720p and 3 monitors but *shrug*.
I kind of recommend getting a 720p 3d vision ready and a 1080P 2D one since its same price/cheaper and two lamps buts thats me. Especially since 3D vision 2 glasses are MUCH better then any DLP glasses but I guess edid overrides would work but I've never danced with that devil. I used 3d tv play when it was first introduced on my HDTV and it was a hassle in comparison to 3d vision.

Id do a thorough search before going with a 1080P model. Not too many of us use them, like AVSFORUM. 1080p models are much less bright as well. Not to mention 1080P 3d on a HDMI1.4 projector is unplayable.


Not sure why you want a 1080P model when you have a 720p and 3 monitors but *shrug*.

Co-founder of helixmod.blog.com

If you like one of my helixmod patches and want to donate. Can send to me through paypal - eqzitara@yahoo.com

#2
Posted 04/20/2013 12:09 AM   
I've been looking at the BenQ W1070 as an upgrade to my Acer H5360BD. I've read all 140 pages of the W1070 thread of AVS Forums. All around an awesome projector. Very bright, good color (RGBRGB color wheel which doesn't sacrifice colors for white brightness). For 720p gaming, an experienced gamer there says it has an excellent scaler, kind of like adding a layer of AA. There are good DLP-link glasses available, just avoid the cheap ones. If you're only looking at 720p 3D Vision gaming, then eqzitara is likely right that you'd be served well with a 720p 3D vision ready projector. If you want to use the projector for 3D Blu-rays and 2D content as well, I think the W1070 is a great choice.
I've been looking at the BenQ W1070 as an upgrade to my Acer H5360BD. I've read all 140 pages of the W1070 thread of AVS Forums.

All around an awesome projector. Very bright, good color (RGBRGB color wheel which doesn't sacrifice colors for white brightness). For 720p gaming, an experienced gamer there says it has an excellent scaler, kind of like adding a layer of AA. There are good DLP-link glasses available, just avoid the cheap ones.

If you're only looking at 720p 3D Vision gaming, then eqzitara is likely right that you'd be served well with a 720p 3D vision ready projector. If you want to use the projector for 3D Blu-rays and 2D content as well, I think the W1070 is a great choice.

#3
Posted 04/20/2013 12:59 AM   
I've heard some bad things about input lag with 3DTV play, but I think there are also plenty of ppl with no real problems, so I think it depends on the display. I know in 3d vision with my curent PJ there is no real lag, but I don't really play FPS games in 3d either, so I think a compromise would be ok. The new drivers definitely have CRT mode back in them, so I'm not relying on that but it could be a plan B if the lag in frame-packed is too bad. I know the 3d vision glasses give better contrast, but honestly, having used DLP glasses recently I don't think it's that much of an issue, particularly for gaming. I've read a lot of reviews on avsforums and the UK equivalent and in terms of picture quality they are all full of praise. Thanks for the reply, I'm looking forward to contributions from others. I'm sure I'm not the only one in this kind of position :-)
I've heard some bad things about input lag with 3DTV play, but I think there are also plenty of ppl with no real problems, so I think it depends on the display.
I know in 3d vision with my curent PJ there is no real lag, but I don't really play FPS games in 3d either, so I think a compromise would be ok.

The new drivers definitely have CRT mode back in them, so I'm not relying on that but it could be a plan B if the lag in frame-packed is too bad.

I know the 3d vision glasses give better contrast, but honestly, having used DLP glasses recently I don't think it's that much of an issue, particularly for gaming.

I've read a lot of reviews on avsforums and the UK equivalent and in terms of picture quality they are all full of praise.

Thanks for the reply, I'm looking forward to contributions from others.
I'm sure I'm not the only one in this kind of position :-)

GTX 1070 SLI, I7-6700k ~ 4.4Ghz, 3x BenQ XL2420T, BenQ TK800, LG 55EG960V (3D OLED), Samsung 850 EVO SSD, Crucial M4 SSD, 3D vision kit, Xpand x104 glasses, Corsair HX1000i, Win 10 pro 64/Win 7 64https://www.3dmark.com/fs/9529310

#4
Posted 04/20/2013 01:01 AM   
Thanks for the reply Airion. Just curious, given that you say the W1070 is a great projector, why would I be better with a 720p 3d vision projector? Is it because of lag or some other issue with 3dtv play? I'm not dead set on upgrading, but I've saved some money and given that I watch a lot of 2d, now seems like a good time to make the change. In the UK I can buy a W1070 for £700 including a 5 year warranty and I'm trying to find reasons not to!
Thanks for the reply Airion.

Just curious, given that you say the W1070 is a great projector, why would I be better with a 720p 3d vision projector? Is it because of lag or some other issue with 3dtv play?

I'm not dead set on upgrading, but I've saved some money and given that I watch a lot of 2d, now seems like a good time to make the change.

In the UK I can buy a W1070 for £700 including a 5 year warranty and I'm trying to find reasons not to!

GTX 1070 SLI, I7-6700k ~ 4.4Ghz, 3x BenQ XL2420T, BenQ TK800, LG 55EG960V (3D OLED), Samsung 850 EVO SSD, Crucial M4 SSD, 3D vision kit, Xpand x104 glasses, Corsair HX1000i, Win 10 pro 64/Win 7 64https://www.3dmark.com/fs/9529310

#5
Posted 04/20/2013 01:05 AM   
I was referring to the ghosting more then the contrast. I play at like 110% depth according to 3d vision's standard. And its much better on 3d vision 2's on shows in very particular situations and quite minimal. Can listen to airion though, he knows projectors better then me.
I was referring to the ghosting more then the contrast. I play at like 110% depth according to 3d vision's standard. And its much better on 3d vision 2's on shows in very particular situations and quite minimal.

Can listen to airion though, he knows projectors better then me.

Co-founder of helixmod.blog.com

If you like one of my helixmod patches and want to donate. Can send to me through paypal - eqzitara@yahoo.com

#6
Posted 04/20/2013 01:18 AM   
A 720p projector would win on price, and it's all you need for 720p gaming. But if you watch a lot of 2D then I think it's very simple: W1070. You also don't have to worry about input lag with it. It measures very well in that regard as well.
A 720p projector would win on price, and it's all you need for 720p gaming.

But if you watch a lot of 2D then I think it's very simple: W1070.

You also don't have to worry about input lag with it. It measures very well in that regard as well.

#7
Posted 04/20/2013 01:31 AM   
Ok thanks for clarifying. I have some thinking to do. Look forward to any other comments as well. Do you have any specific knowledge of the other projectors and how they compare?
Ok thanks for clarifying. I have some thinking to do.

Look forward to any other comments as well.

Do you have any specific knowledge of the other projectors and how they compare?

GTX 1070 SLI, I7-6700k ~ 4.4Ghz, 3x BenQ XL2420T, BenQ TK800, LG 55EG960V (3D OLED), Samsung 850 EVO SSD, Crucial M4 SSD, 3D vision kit, Xpand x104 glasses, Corsair HX1000i, Win 10 pro 64/Win 7 64https://www.3dmark.com/fs/9529310

#8
Posted 04/20/2013 01:59 AM   
[quote="eqzitara"] Not sure why you want a 1080P model when you have a 720p and 3 monitors but *shrug*.[/quote] Call it the upgrade itch! I went for 3 screens purely on the recommendation of someone else on here, and I don't regret it, but for some games and some occasions, the single big screen rules. Plus, the 690 on it's own runs most games perfectly well but struggles on others in 3d. I go though phases of gaming purely on the projector for a month, then just on the monitors. It's nice, but upgrades are nice too :-)
eqzitara said:


Not sure why you want a 1080P model when you have a 720p and 3 monitors but *shrug*.


Call it the upgrade itch!

I went for 3 screens purely on the recommendation of someone else on here, and I don't regret it, but for some games and some occasions, the single big screen rules.

Plus, the 690 on it's own runs most games perfectly well but struggles on others in 3d.

I go though phases of gaming purely on the projector for a month, then just on the monitors. It's nice, but upgrades are nice too :-)

GTX 1070 SLI, I7-6700k ~ 4.4Ghz, 3x BenQ XL2420T, BenQ TK800, LG 55EG960V (3D OLED), Samsung 850 EVO SSD, Crucial M4 SSD, 3D vision kit, Xpand x104 glasses, Corsair HX1000i, Win 10 pro 64/Win 7 64https://www.3dmark.com/fs/9529310

#9
Posted 04/20/2013 02:07 AM   
I'm also getting the Benq w1070 at some point, I've heard lots of praise about it. My reasons, other than my H5360 is slowly dying of blind pixels: 1) Much better image quality overall, I've read it's picture quality is simply stunning, richer colors and great contrast, so even if you're playing 3d on 720p, it should look better in comparison. 2) 2d 1080p of course. Other than movies, this is particularly interesting since it looks like next gen consoles are going to output the games at 1080p, so having a projector with 1080p native resolution would be great for next gen 2d games. 3) Future proof. It's 3d TV Play compliant, so it'll work straight out of the box with our Nvidia 3d ready games, helix mods etc. It also should work with Tridef from the get go since it's HDMI 1.4 output so you have a bigger chance of newer PC games working in 3d if Helix can't make a DX11 wrapper, also both current gen console 3d games and whatever next gen 3d we may get will be supported since it's HDMI 1.4 standard. About input lag, I have a Sony HMZ-T1 using 3d tv play and I don't see any lag. 4) Many people hate it, but I do fine with playing 3d at 1080p 24hz on my HMZ-T1, I'd heard it was so bad I never even tried it, but I gave it a try recently and I don't see that much of an issue, well worth the extra resolution, and currently I play most of my games like that. I can't wait to try 1080p 3d games on a 100'' screen. 5) Glasses should be cheaper than Nvidia's if you want to watch 3d movies with family / friends.
I'm also getting the Benq w1070 at some point, I've heard lots of praise about it. My reasons, other than my H5360 is slowly dying of blind pixels:

1) Much better image quality overall, I've read it's picture quality is simply stunning, richer colors and great contrast, so even if you're playing 3d on 720p, it should look better in comparison.

2) 2d 1080p of course. Other than movies, this is particularly interesting since it looks like next gen consoles are going to output the games at 1080p, so having a projector with 1080p native resolution would be great for next gen 2d games.

3) Future proof. It's 3d TV Play compliant, so it'll work straight out of the box with our Nvidia 3d ready games, helix mods etc. It also should work with Tridef from the get go since it's HDMI 1.4 output so you have a bigger chance of newer PC games working in 3d if Helix can't make a DX11 wrapper, also both current gen console 3d games and whatever next gen 3d we may get will be supported since it's HDMI 1.4 standard. About input lag, I have a Sony HMZ-T1 using 3d tv play and I don't see any lag.

4) Many people hate it, but I do fine with playing 3d at 1080p 24hz on my HMZ-T1, I'd heard it was so bad I never even tried it, but I gave it a try recently and I don't see that much of an issue, well worth the extra resolution, and currently I play most of my games like that. I can't wait to try 1080p 3d games on a 100'' screen.

5) Glasses should be cheaper than Nvidia's if you want to watch 3d movies with family / friends.

All hail 3d modders DHR, MasterOtaku, Losti, Necropants, Helifax, bo3b, mike_ar69, Flugan, DarkStarSword, 4everAwake, 3d4dd and so many more helping to keep the 3d dream alive, find their 3d fixes at http://helixmod.blogspot.com/ Also check my site for spanish VR and mobile gaming news: www.gamermovil.com

#10
Posted 04/20/2013 09:01 AM   
Not that I have a projector, but I have no issues playing 3D games at 1080p 24hz with 3DTV Play. I have forced the Dead Space series to play in 3D with 1920x1080@24hz and the graphic quality is significantly higher and notable in comparison to 720P(1280x720)@60hz. I do have slight framerate drops when running at 1080P but is worth it considering the trade off of graphic quality. I will always play in 1080P wherever I can. I suppose it is the compatibilty and performance quality of the PC that will determine the best results. I follow the projector threads because of my eventual plans to get this type of set up....I have no personal experience with projectors. Is BenQ a good brand to look into considering someone who has a limited budget...opinions are much appreciated...
Not that I have a projector, but I have no issues playing 3D games at 1080p 24hz with 3DTV Play. I have forced the Dead Space series to play in 3D with 1920x1080@24hz and the graphic quality is significantly higher and notable in comparison to 720P(1280x720)@60hz. I do have slight framerate drops when running at 1080P but is worth it considering the trade off of graphic quality. I will always play in 1080P wherever I can. I suppose it is the compatibilty and performance quality of the PC that will determine the best results. I follow the projector threads because of my eventual plans to get this type of set up....I have no personal experience with projectors. Is BenQ a good brand to look into considering someone who has a limited budget...opinions are much appreciated...

#11
Posted 04/20/2013 03:58 PM   
birthright, I largely agree with your assessment of the W1070, but two things: [quote="birthright"]It also should work with Tridef[/quote] One quirk of the W1070 is that it can't accept a side by side 3D image in 1080[b]p[/b]. It has to be sbs 1080[b]i[/b]. I'm not familiar enough with Tridef as I would like, but from what I've read I doubt Tridef supports 1080i sbs nor 720p frame packed 3D. In other words, I fear the W1070 isn't compatible with Tridef. I'd love it if someone could speak definitively about this though. [quote="birthright"]I do fine with playing 3d at 1080p 24hz on my HMZ-T1[/quote] Isn't the HMZ-T1 a native 720p device? Downscaling a 1080p signal to 720p will reduce aliasing vs a native 720p signal, but the end result is still 720p. ...Perhaps this is Tridef related?
birthright, I largely agree with your assessment of the W1070, but two things:

birthright said:It also should work with Tridef


One quirk of the W1070 is that it can't accept a side by side 3D image in 1080p. It has to be sbs 1080i. I'm not familiar enough with Tridef as I would like, but from what I've read I doubt Tridef supports 1080i sbs nor 720p frame packed 3D. In other words, I fear the W1070 isn't compatible with Tridef. I'd love it if someone could speak definitively about this though.

birthright said:I do fine with playing 3d at 1080p 24hz on my HMZ-T1


Isn't the HMZ-T1 a native 720p device? Downscaling a 1080p signal to 720p will reduce aliasing vs a native 720p signal, but the end result is still 720p. ...Perhaps this is Tridef related?

#12
Posted 04/20/2013 05:30 PM   
[quote="rustyk"]Do you have any specific knowledge of the other projectors and how they compare?[/quote] I don't know anything about the Optoma, but I have looked into the Acer H6510BD. Projector Central's review of the H6510 is a great overview and includes a direct comparison to the W1070 on the last page. [url]http://www.projectorcentral.com/acer_h6510bd_3d_home_video_projector_review.htm?page=Key-Features[/url] In short, the Acer has problems with both color accuracy and color brightness. Its RGBCMY color wheel prioritizes white brightness over color brightness, which gives them high lumen measurements at the cost of picture quality compared to the W1070's RGBRGB. How they match up for 720p60hz 3D gaming is an open question because of how these work with DLP-link, they give up either a white or red segment of the color wheel, so they [i]might[/i] have equivalent color and brightness in 3D. But if you factor in 3D Blu-rays and 2D content, the W1070 is clearly superior. The Acer is a bit cheaper though.
rustyk said:Do you have any specific knowledge of the other projectors and how they compare?


I don't know anything about the Optoma, but I have looked into the Acer H6510BD.

Projector Central's review of the H6510 is a great overview and includes a direct comparison to the W1070 on the last page.

http://www.projectorcentral.com/acer_h6510bd_3d_home_video_projector_review.htm?page=Key-Features

In short, the Acer has problems with both color accuracy and color brightness. Its RGBCMY color wheel prioritizes white brightness over color brightness, which gives them high lumen measurements at the cost of picture quality compared to the W1070's RGBRGB. How they match up for 720p60hz 3D gaming is an open question because of how these work with DLP-link, they give up either a white or red segment of the color wheel, so they might have equivalent color and brightness in 3D. But if you factor in 3D Blu-rays and 2D content, the W1070 is clearly superior. The Acer is a bit cheaper though.

#13
Posted 04/20/2013 06:12 PM   
I didn't know about that Airion, thanks for the info. I've found this though about Tridef on 1080i with the w1070: "Tridef drivers only work in interlaced mode in 1080/60 with SBS, but it's really smooth and nice. Can't notice the interlacing at all, even though the sharpness is less" http://www.avsforum.com/t/1435626/benq-w1070-dlp-full-hd-3d-ready-with-lens-shift-for-1000/840 Looks like it works even though it's a less than perfect solution. I don't know how exactly HMZ-T1 does 1080p/24 sorry, i'm not that tech savvy, yet it looks great imho, the extra resolution adds a lot and I'm ok with the lesser refresh rate. @Stryker_66 I've read a lot about the W1070 and it's mostly very positive, the AVS forum users that got it seem to be pretty happy with it, and most reviews have been very good, I recommend this one since it also give some suggestions about what to tweak to make it look better: http://www.trustedreviews.com/benq-w1070_Projector_review An excerpt: "With our initial black level and noise issues largely resolved, we were suddenly able to appreciate just how much better the W1070's pictures are than they've any right to be for under £700" Conclusion: "Once we'd managed to work round its setup limitations and figured out how to avoid a couple of initial picture niggles, we were left with pictures from the BenQ W1070 that comfortably surpassed our expectations, making it just the latest entry on a freakishly long list of 2012 projector bargains. People on the hunt for an exceptionally cheap but still movie-loving projector have never had it so good."
I didn't know about that Airion, thanks for the info. I've found this though about Tridef on 1080i with the w1070:

"Tridef drivers only work in interlaced mode in 1080/60 with SBS, but it's really smooth and nice. Can't notice the interlacing at all, even though the sharpness is less"

http://www.avsforum.com/t/1435626/benq-w1070-dlp-full-hd-3d-ready-with-lens-shift-for-1000/840

Looks like it works even though it's a less than perfect solution.

I don't know how exactly HMZ-T1 does 1080p/24 sorry, i'm not that tech savvy, yet it looks great imho, the extra resolution adds a lot and I'm ok with the lesser refresh rate.

@Stryker_66 I've read a lot about the W1070 and it's mostly very positive, the AVS forum users that got it seem to be pretty happy with it, and most reviews have been very good, I recommend this one since it also give some suggestions about what to tweak to make it look better:

http://www.trustedreviews.com/benq-w1070_Projector_review

An excerpt:

"With our initial black level and noise issues largely resolved, we were suddenly able to appreciate just how much better the W1070's pictures are than they've any right to be for under £700"

Conclusion:

"Once we'd managed to work round its setup limitations and figured out how to avoid a couple of initial picture niggles, we were left with pictures from the BenQ W1070 that comfortably surpassed our expectations, making it just the latest entry on a freakishly long list of 2012 projector bargains. People on the hunt for an exceptionally cheap but still movie-loving projector have never had it so good."

All hail 3d modders DHR, MasterOtaku, Losti, Necropants, Helifax, bo3b, mike_ar69, Flugan, DarkStarSword, 4everAwake, 3d4dd and so many more helping to keep the 3d dream alive, find their 3d fixes at http://helixmod.blogspot.com/ Also check my site for spanish VR and mobile gaming news: www.gamermovil.com

#14
Posted 04/20/2013 06:11 PM   
[quote="birthright"]I've found this though about Tridef on 1080i with the w1070:[/quote] Awesome, thanks for this. I remember reading that post now but unfortunately I didn't fully absorb it! [quote="birthright"]I don't know how exactly HMZ-T1 does 1080p/24 sorry, i'm not that tech savvy, yet it looks great imho, the extra resolution adds a lot and I'm ok with the lesser refresh rate.[/quote] Well, the reason it looks better than native 720p is because of downscaling. You're seeing a 720p image, because that's all the pixels the HMZ-T1 has, but basically with great anti-aliasing thanks to downscaling your PC's 1080p video signal. Your HMZ-T1 has to throw out half the pixels your PC is rendering though. If you set your games to 720p and turn up the anti-aliasing settings, you can probably get the same picture quality at 30fps or more.
birthright said:I've found this though about Tridef on 1080i with the w1070:


Awesome, thanks for this. I remember reading that post now but unfortunately I didn't fully absorb it!

birthright said:I don't know how exactly HMZ-T1 does 1080p/24 sorry, i'm not that tech savvy, yet it looks great imho, the extra resolution adds a lot and I'm ok with the lesser refresh rate.


Well, the reason it looks better than native 720p is because of downscaling. You're seeing a 720p image, because that's all the pixels the HMZ-T1 has, but basically with great anti-aliasing thanks to downscaling your PC's 1080p video signal. Your HMZ-T1 has to throw out half the pixels your PC is rendering though. If you set your games to 720p and turn up the anti-aliasing settings, you can probably get the same picture quality at 30fps or more.

#15
Posted 04/20/2013 06:36 PM   
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