UE4 developer needs S3D specs and lay of land 3D Vision
Hello, new here, developing virtual environment content based on reality capture workflow, premium quality aimed at traveling exhibitions in museums worldwide, proven workflow into UE4, now tackling the display side. I'm schooled in S3D workflow for live-action acquisition and post, so here goes. The minimum acceptable quality for us is a full HD raster L/R, so I'm thinking frame-packing via HDMI 1.4 or 2.0 between UE4 through a 3D Vision-capable card out to a display solution, let's shave that last bit off for the meanwhile. If a card can kick out side-by-side (SBS), then obviously the card has to produce each L/R raster to begin with before anamorphically squeezing each into a single HD (or better) raster. Can somebody verify support for full HD resolution output of both L/R streams into HDMI 1.4 or 2.0? I'm less concerned with frame rates, 30 fps is still smooth enough, given users will explore at a stately pace, will script a governor into the physics camera in UE4, but optimizing image fidelity is what it's all about here. And though this is a forum devoted to GeForce, what might somebody be able to say to if and how things like ia (inter axial distance between virtual cameras) is set in UE4 or Unity, as well as control over convergence point? I'm aware UE4 now supports Oculus Rift and its variations, but the image fidelity simply won't cut it for our purposes. Thanks for shedding light on solutions to close the gap.
Hello, new here, developing virtual environment content based on reality capture workflow, premium quality aimed at traveling exhibitions in museums worldwide, proven workflow into UE4, now tackling the display side. I'm schooled in S3D workflow for live-action acquisition and post, so here goes. The minimum acceptable quality for us is a full HD raster L/R, so I'm thinking frame-packing via HDMI 1.4 or 2.0 between UE4 through a 3D Vision-capable card out to a display solution, let's shave that last bit off for the meanwhile. If a card can kick out side-by-side (SBS), then obviously the card has to produce each L/R raster to begin with before anamorphically squeezing each into a single HD (or better) raster. Can somebody verify support for full HD resolution output of both L/R streams into HDMI 1.4 or 2.0? I'm less concerned with frame rates, 30 fps is still smooth enough, given users will explore at a stately pace, will script a governor into the physics camera in UE4, but optimizing image fidelity is what it's all about here. And though this is a forum devoted to GeForce, what might somebody be able to say to if and how things like ia (inter axial distance between virtual cameras) is set in UE4 or Unity, as well as control over convergence point? I'm aware UE4 now supports Oculus Rift and its variations, but the image fidelity simply won't cut it for our purposes. Thanks for shedding light on solutions to close the gap.
I'm not completely certain of everything you're asking here, but I might be able to provide some answers:
-3D Vision does not support side-by-side output
-In terms of displays, you have several options. Output to a 3D TV over HDMI is limited to 720p@60hz (per eye), or 1080p@24hz (per eye). Or you could use a 3D Vision monitor. These come in sizes up to 27 inches, and the output is 1080p@120hz for most screens, or 1440p@120hz for the Asus ROG Swift.
-The drawback of the Swift is that it doesn't work with SLI, which is generally necessary for smooth performance in most applications
-You could also use a projector. This has the same resolution limitations as 3D TV, however 720p@60hz looks very good on a projector, and many people on these forums recommend this as the best experience.
-Convergence and depth (I think this is "ia") are set in the driver. This can be freely adjusted with hotkeys
-3D will activate in Unity and UE4, as long as they are running in exclusive fullscreen mode. Shaders will almost always need to be specifically configured to work correctly in stereo 3D.
I'm not completely certain of everything you're asking here, but I might be able to provide some answers:
-3D Vision does not support side-by-side output
-In terms of displays, you have several options. Output to a 3D TV over HDMI is limited to 720p@60hz (per eye), or 1080p@24hz (per eye). Or you could use a 3D Vision monitor. These come in sizes up to 27 inches, and the output is 1080p@120hz for most screens, or 1440p@120hz for the Asus ROG Swift.
-The drawback of the Swift is that it doesn't work with SLI, which is generally necessary for smooth performance in most applications
-You could also use a projector. This has the same resolution limitations as 3D TV, however 720p@60hz looks very good on a projector, and many people on these forums recommend this as the best experience.
-Convergence and depth (I think this is "ia") are set in the driver. This can be freely adjusted with hotkeys
-3D will activate in Unity and UE4, as long as they are running in exclusive fullscreen mode. Shaders will almost always need to be specifically configured to work correctly in stereo 3D.
Hi and thanks. So, your great info raises more questions, if we can continue. Nice to know that 3d-capable monitors or projector over HDMI works, and how there's the trade-off between frame rate and resolution. If it's a solid 24hz, our slow moving world may remain under the threshold of hanging up. Not closed to native 3D Vision monitors, just checked Nvidia's glasses and display page, see Asus, Planar, LG, and various brands listed supporting 1080p down to 23" (am interested in smallest). What differentiates "3D TV" from "3D Vision monitor"? I own a couple 3D plasma TVs and a 3D monitor from Vizio, both take HDMI, is there something I'm missing or am I confusing what's being compared?
I'm newb to how UE4 handles 3d and how to control it. I'm mainly Mac, but have a Windows machine just for this purpose, added "-emulatestereo -fullscreen" behind the path using Properties of the Shortcut. Yes? Can you further educate me what's possible within the Editor or otherwise to control stereo in UE4? I checked the stereo template simply using those commands above, which results in side-by-side fullscreen, but the ia is off the chart aggressive, like pixel offset between L/R images is 20% relative to horizontal screen size, cinema best practices (which admittedly are lame 3D) call for max of 1% negative parallax and 2% positive. My eyes are trained to accommodate way aggressive 3D, love me some robust 3D, but 20% hurts my head big time, which is why I'm asking about control over ia, where does that happen?
Convergence and depth, just a note, from my experience filming native 3D I can say the distance between cameras controls the volume (or as you say, depth), eyes close together for getting really close to things or down into the micro world, really far apart (hyperstereo) so see any appreciable depth when distant, e.g. mountain tops, large stadiums, etc. Convergence controls where an object in the scene is positioned in depth relative to the screen plane. If the two rasters converge on the object nearest to the camera pair, everything else falls back behind that point into "window mode" or positive parallax. Conversely, anything falling closer to whatever object the stereo cams converge on is forward projected, negative parallax or space, appears to come out of the screen. Just clarifying.
Again, much appreciated the airtime and your time.
Hi and thanks. So, your great info raises more questions, if we can continue. Nice to know that 3d-capable monitors or projector over HDMI works, and how there's the trade-off between frame rate and resolution. If it's a solid 24hz, our slow moving world may remain under the threshold of hanging up. Not closed to native 3D Vision monitors, just checked Nvidia's glasses and display page, see Asus, Planar, LG, and various brands listed supporting 1080p down to 23" (am interested in smallest). What differentiates "3D TV" from "3D Vision monitor"? I own a couple 3D plasma TVs and a 3D monitor from Vizio, both take HDMI, is there something I'm missing or am I confusing what's being compared?
I'm newb to how UE4 handles 3d and how to control it. I'm mainly Mac, but have a Windows machine just for this purpose, added "-emulatestereo -fullscreen" behind the path using Properties of the Shortcut. Yes? Can you further educate me what's possible within the Editor or otherwise to control stereo in UE4? I checked the stereo template simply using those commands above, which results in side-by-side fullscreen, but the ia is off the chart aggressive, like pixel offset between L/R images is 20% relative to horizontal screen size, cinema best practices (which admittedly are lame 3D) call for max of 1% negative parallax and 2% positive. My eyes are trained to accommodate way aggressive 3D, love me some robust 3D, but 20% hurts my head big time, which is why I'm asking about control over ia, where does that happen?
Convergence and depth, just a note, from my experience filming native 3D I can say the distance between cameras controls the volume (or as you say, depth), eyes close together for getting really close to things or down into the micro world, really far apart (hyperstereo) so see any appreciable depth when distant, e.g. mountain tops, large stadiums, etc. Convergence controls where an object in the scene is positioned in depth relative to the screen plane. If the two rasters converge on the object nearest to the camera pair, everything else falls back behind that point into "window mode" or positive parallax. Conversely, anything falling closer to whatever object the stereo cams converge on is forward projected, negative parallax or space, appears to come out of the screen. Just clarifying.
Again, much appreciated the airtime and your time.
Nvidia has a GameWorks section for developers. With a NDA agreement, you can get the full version.
https://developer.nvidia.com/gameworks
The developer forum is generally dead, so hopefully we can help you here, but this is a consumer user to user forum.
https://devtalk.nvidia.com/
Nvidia's stereoscopic drivers for gameplay can be accessed in one of 4 ways using a consumer GPU.
1. 3D Vision Discover = anaglyph format
http://www.nvidia.com/object/3D-Vision-Discover-Main.html
2. Optomized for Nvidia GeForce = "certified" Passive Displays
http://www.nvidia.com/object/optimized-for-geforce-3d-overview.html
3. 3DTV Play = HDMI 1.4 compliant 3D HDTV/Projector/VR Headset
http://www.nvidia.com/object/3dtv-play-overview.html
4. 3D Vision = "certified" 120Hz Monitors/Projectors
http://www.nvidia.com/object/3d-vision-main.html
EDIT: 3DTV Play costs $40 or is free if you have a 3D Vision emitter or Quadro GPU. With 3DTV Play, you are required to use the display manufacturer's glasses, the emitter is deactivated.
Also 3DTV Play does not output line interleaved, an unofficial workaround is required using a different EDID.
EDIT: 3DTV Play costs $40 or is free if you have a 3D Vision emitter or Quadro GPU. With 3DTV Play, you are required to use the display manufacturer's glasses, the emitter is deactivated.
Also 3DTV Play does not output line interleaved, an unofficial workaround is required using a different EDID.
UE3 had Nvidia stereoscopic support implemented, unfortunately it doesn't seem to be the case with UE4. Have a look at this thread.
https://forums.geforce.com/default/topic/819180/
Cryengine has stereoscopic support.
[url]http://docs.cryengine.com/display/CRYAUTOGEN/CONSOLEPREFIXR#AnchorRSTEREOMODE[/url]
[quote="Pirateguybrush"]
-3D Vision does not support side-by-side output
-In terms of displays, you have several options. Output to a 3D TV over HDMI is limited to 720p@60hz (per eye), or 1080p@24hz (per eye). Or you could use a 3D Vision monitor. These come in sizes up to 27 inches, and the output is 1080p@120hz for most screens, or 1440p@120hz for the Asus ROG Swift.[/quote]With recent EDID mod, LG (passive) HDMI 2.0 UHD TVs support interleaved 3840x2160 (3840x1080 per eye) at 60 fps. For reasonable performance with 4K displays and DX11 games like Dragon Age Inquisition, an overclocked 980 is suggested, at a minimum (SLI is better). The 3DVisionEye Swapper utility is required, in addition to the EDID override.
Note that TriDef's Ignition provides SBS format support, but official product support has stopped.
Pirateguybrush said:
-3D Vision does not support side-by-side output
-In terms of displays, you have several options. Output to a 3D TV over HDMI is limited to 720p@60hz (per eye), or 1080p@24hz (per eye). Or you could use a 3D Vision monitor. These come in sizes up to 27 inches, and the output is 1080p@120hz for most screens, or 1440p@120hz for the Asus ROG Swift.
With recent EDID mod, LG (passive) HDMI 2.0 UHD TVs support interleaved 3840x2160 (3840x1080 per eye) at 60 fps. For reasonable performance with 4K displays and DX11 games like Dragon Age Inquisition, an overclocked 980 is suggested, at a minimum (SLI is better). The 3DVisionEye Swapper utility is required, in addition to the EDID override.
Note that TriDef's Ignition provides SBS format support, but official product support has stopped.
[quote="whyme466"]Note that TriDef's Ignition provides SBS format support, but official product support has stopped.[/quote]
I believe you are mistaken, TriDef 3D has slowed down but hasn't stopped. Version 6.5 was released March 6th, 2015. http://www.tridef.com/download/TriDef-3D-latest.html
Last Ignition release included only one new game profile (non-AAA game), adding to the two other profiles created in almost one year (by the way, I corrected one of these profiles - Elite Dangerous - with a user profile mod). Only Ignition change in one year - an inconsistent fix that plagues only some users with Steam-based games. 3 profiles in almost one year, with NO forum interaction. Not dead, but...
Last Ignition release included only one new game profile (non-AAA game), adding to the two other profiles created in almost one year (by the way, I corrected one of these profiles - Elite Dangerous - with a user profile mod). Only Ignition change in one year - an inconsistent fix that plagues only some users with Steam-based games. 3 profiles in almost one year, with NO forum interaction. Not dead, but...
-3D Vision does not support side-by-side output
-In terms of displays, you have several options. Output to a 3D TV over HDMI is limited to 720p@60hz (per eye), or 1080p@24hz (per eye). Or you could use a 3D Vision monitor. These come in sizes up to 27 inches, and the output is 1080p@120hz for most screens, or 1440p@120hz for the Asus ROG Swift.
-The drawback of the Swift is that it doesn't work with SLI, which is generally necessary for smooth performance in most applications
-You could also use a projector. This has the same resolution limitations as 3D TV, however 720p@60hz looks very good on a projector, and many people on these forums recommend this as the best experience.
-Convergence and depth (I think this is "ia") are set in the driver. This can be freely adjusted with hotkeys
-3D will activate in Unity and UE4, as long as they are running in exclusive fullscreen mode. Shaders will almost always need to be specifically configured to work correctly in stereo 3D.
I'm newb to how UE4 handles 3d and how to control it. I'm mainly Mac, but have a Windows machine just for this purpose, added "-emulatestereo -fullscreen" behind the path using Properties of the Shortcut. Yes? Can you further educate me what's possible within the Editor or otherwise to control stereo in UE4? I checked the stereo template simply using those commands above, which results in side-by-side fullscreen, but the ia is off the chart aggressive, like pixel offset between L/R images is 20% relative to horizontal screen size, cinema best practices (which admittedly are lame 3D) call for max of 1% negative parallax and 2% positive. My eyes are trained to accommodate way aggressive 3D, love me some robust 3D, but 20% hurts my head big time, which is why I'm asking about control over ia, where does that happen?
Convergence and depth, just a note, from my experience filming native 3D I can say the distance between cameras controls the volume (or as you say, depth), eyes close together for getting really close to things or down into the micro world, really far apart (hyperstereo) so see any appreciable depth when distant, e.g. mountain tops, large stadiums, etc. Convergence controls where an object in the scene is positioned in depth relative to the screen plane. If the two rasters converge on the object nearest to the camera pair, everything else falls back behind that point into "window mode" or positive parallax. Conversely, anything falling closer to whatever object the stereo cams converge on is forward projected, negative parallax or space, appears to come out of the screen. Just clarifying.
Again, much appreciated the airtime and your time.
https://developer.nvidia.com/gameworks
The developer forum is generally dead, so hopefully we can help you here, but this is a consumer user to user forum.
https://devtalk.nvidia.com/
Nvidia's stereoscopic drivers for gameplay can be accessed in one of 4 ways using a consumer GPU.
1. 3D Vision Discover = anaglyph format
http://www.nvidia.com/object/3D-Vision-Discover-Main.html
2. Optomized for Nvidia GeForce = "certified" Passive Displays
http://www.nvidia.com/object/optimized-for-geforce-3d-overview.html
3. 3DTV Play = HDMI 1.4 compliant 3D HDTV/Projector/VR Headset
http://www.nvidia.com/object/3dtv-play-overview.html
4. 3D Vision = "certified" 120Hz Monitors/Projectors
http://www.nvidia.com/object/3d-vision-main.html
EDIT: 3DTV Play costs $40 or is free if you have a 3D Vision emitter or Quadro GPU. With 3DTV Play, you are required to use the display manufacturer's glasses, the emitter is deactivated.
Also 3DTV Play does not output line interleaved, an unofficial workaround is required using a different EDID.
https://forums.geforce.com/default/topic/819180/
Cryengine has stereoscopic support.
http://docs.cryengine.com/display/CRYAUTOGEN/CONSOLEPREFIXR#AnchorRSTEREOMODE
Note that TriDef's Ignition provides SBS format support, but official product support has stopped.
I believe you are mistaken, TriDef 3D has slowed down but hasn't stopped. Version 6.5 was released March 6th, 2015. http://www.tridef.com/download/TriDef-3D-latest.html