Vision 3D top of screen severe ghosting
  3 / 31    
I am a new user and can also report to having this problem. Top 15% of screen has permanent ghosting (No 3d). It happens on both games and screenshots. I'm using the 2233rz. Is it possible to have some official word on this. Unfortunately it's holding me back from really enjoying 3d vision.
I am a new user and can also report to having this problem. Top 15% of screen has permanent ghosting (No 3d). It happens on both games and screenshots. I'm using the 2233rz. Is it possible to have some official word on this. Unfortunately it's holding me back from really enjoying 3d vision.

#31
Posted 08/07/2009 11:57 AM   
I am using a 19" CRT from LG (Studioworks E900B) and am also suffering from this issue. No matter what resolution or refresh rate I use, I get severe ghosting in the lower half of the screen.
A little ghosting is visible across the whole screen (as with all CRTs), but it's much more noticeable in the lower half, growing worse towards the bottom.

I think this is what happens: A CRT displays the image line after line, from top to bottom. Say the monitor is done rendering the left image, so the left glass gets shut and the right one opens. But it takes some time for the left image to fade from the screen completely and since the bottom was displayed last, it takes the longest to fade.
If this is true, then I can think of no way to avoid this, because if the right glass stays shut longer to avoid showing the residue of the left image, the top of the right image is already fading. The only way to eliminate ghosting would be to insert a black frame between left and right image, but that would need quadruple the target refresh rate (i.e. 240 Hz instead of 120) and further reduce brightness in addition to the reduction by the glasses.

However, I don't know how all of this translates to LCDs like the 2233RZ. Does anyone know in what way the image is processed on those? I'd suspect from bottom to top, since the ghosting is worse near the top of the screen.

EDIT: I just tried using an ond 17" CRT from the dark ages of computing (Eizo F550i-W, 800x600 @ 90 Hz) and while ghosting was a little better overall, it was still very noticable on the lower half of the screen. So it's most definately not a faulty monitor that is causing this issue.
I am using a 19" CRT from LG (Studioworks E900B) and am also suffering from this issue. No matter what resolution or refresh rate I use, I get severe ghosting in the lower half of the screen.

A little ghosting is visible across the whole screen (as with all CRTs), but it's much more noticeable in the lower half, growing worse towards the bottom.



I think this is what happens: A CRT displays the image line after line, from top to bottom. Say the monitor is done rendering the left image, so the left glass gets shut and the right one opens. But it takes some time for the left image to fade from the screen completely and since the bottom was displayed last, it takes the longest to fade.

If this is true, then I can think of no way to avoid this, because if the right glass stays shut longer to avoid showing the residue of the left image, the top of the right image is already fading. The only way to eliminate ghosting would be to insert a black frame between left and right image, but that would need quadruple the target refresh rate (i.e. 240 Hz instead of 120) and further reduce brightness in addition to the reduction by the glasses.



However, I don't know how all of this translates to LCDs like the 2233RZ. Does anyone know in what way the image is processed on those? I'd suspect from bottom to top, since the ghosting is worse near the top of the screen.



EDIT: I just tried using an ond 17" CRT from the dark ages of computing (Eizo F550i-W, 800x600 @ 90 Hz) and while ghosting was a little better overall, it was still very noticable on the lower half of the screen. So it's most definately not a faulty monitor that is causing this issue.

CPU: Intel Core i7 920 @ 3.40 GHz

GPU: Geforce GTX 480 @ 850/2000 MHz, Geforce GTX 460 (PhysX/CUDA)

RAM: 6 GB OCZ DDR3-1333 CL7

MOBO: ASUS P6T

PSU: Enermax Pro82+ 625 W

HDD: SuperTalent Ultradrive GX2 128 GB, 2x Seagate Barracuda 1.5 TB

SOUND: Creative X-Fi Elite Pro

DISPLAY: Dell 3007 WFP, Geforce 3D Vision on eMachines V700

INPUT: Logitech G5 + G11

OS: Windows 7 Professional x64

#32
Posted 08/09/2009 12:23 PM   
I have the same problem...upper part of the 2233RZ is ghosting...
I have GTX 295 and Vista SP1.
Does someone else tried a different OS?!
I have the same problem...upper part of the 2233RZ is ghosting...

I have GTX 295 and Vista SP1.

Does someone else tried a different OS?!

CASE: ThermalTake Armor+
CPU: Phenom II 720 X3
GPU: BFG Geforce GTX 295 REV B
RAM: 2 GB Corsair DDR3-1333 CL9
MB: ASUS Crosshair III Formula
PSU: Tagan Piperock 600 W
HDD: Seagate Baracuda 7200.12 1TB
SOUND: Creative X-Fi
DISPLAY: Samsung 2233RZ + Geforce 3D Vision

#33
Posted 08/11/2009 07:40 AM   
Me too !

Apparently the cause is a bad timing between shutter glasses and screen refresh, but the question is : is it a hardware limitation or can it be resolved with new drivers ? Andrew from nVidia hasn't posted in this topic for 6 months... we don't know if nVidia is aware of the problem.
Me too !



Apparently the cause is a bad timing between shutter glasses and screen refresh, but the question is : is it a hardware limitation or can it be resolved with new drivers ? Andrew from nVidia hasn't posted in this topic for 6 months... we don't know if nVidia is aware of the problem.

#34
Posted 08/11/2009 09:45 AM   
Well I hope it is a software limitation. I have tried different drivers 1.08, 1.09 and 1.10 none seems to work
I will try to change the cable from the front USB on my case to the back directly to one of my MB USB connectors.
I also tried to switch the cables(due to their length)
Hope nVIDIA is aware about this. Also does anyone tried to register the product and get in contact with the tech support?
Maybe they can help
Well I hope it is a software limitation. I have tried different drivers 1.08, 1.09 and 1.10 none seems to work

I will try to change the cable from the front USB on my case to the back directly to one of my MB USB connectors.

I also tried to switch the cables(due to their length)

Hope nVIDIA is aware about this. Also does anyone tried to register the product and get in contact with the tech support?

Maybe they can help

CASE: ThermalTake Armor+
CPU: Phenom II 720 X3
GPU: BFG Geforce GTX 295 REV B
RAM: 2 GB Corsair DDR3-1333 CL9
MB: ASUS Crosshair III Formula
PSU: Tagan Piperock 600 W
HDD: Seagate Baracuda 7200.12 1TB
SOUND: Creative X-Fi
DISPLAY: Samsung 2233RZ + Geforce 3D Vision

#35
Posted 08/11/2009 09:52 AM   
I can confirm ghosting problems on top and bottom of the Samsung 2233

I did a test using Stereophotomaker on XP64 and my Quadro FX4600. I enabled page flipping in opengl quad buffered mode.

I did a stereo rendered image, I attached it here.

The same problem is visible on another different system: Vista 64 and a Quadro CX, in this case I used Nvidia Photo Viewer

I tested three pairs of glasses.

If you drag the image you will see how the lamp on the right of the image will be ghosted on top and bottom of the screen....on the center you will see less ghosting.

Btw, Samsung 2233 is not a professional monitor, I donno if iz3d, Viewsonic and dlp projectors/tv displays suffer of the same problem...

I hope that Nvidia will investigate and find a workaround to eliminate this iusse...

I think that Nvidia already knew this "bug"....

Waiting for a professional solution...
I can confirm ghosting problems on top and bottom of the Samsung 2233



I did a test using Stereophotomaker on XP64 and my Quadro FX4600. I enabled page flipping in opengl quad buffered mode.



I did a stereo rendered image, I attached it here.



The same problem is visible on another different system: Vista 64 and a Quadro CX, in this case I used Nvidia Photo Viewer



I tested three pairs of glasses.



If you drag the image you will see how the lamp on the right of the image will be ghosted on top and bottom of the screen....on the center you will see less ghosting.



Btw, Samsung 2233 is not a professional monitor, I donno if iz3d, Viewsonic and dlp projectors/tv displays suffer of the same problem...



I hope that Nvidia will investigate and find a workaround to eliminate this iusse...



I think that Nvidia already knew this "bug"....



Waiting for a professional solution...

#36
Posted 08/11/2009 11:41 AM   
Yes indeed they should come up with a solution and it better be fast.
This is frustrating...
Yes indeed they should come up with a solution and it better be fast.

This is frustrating...

CASE: ThermalTake Armor+
CPU: Phenom II 720 X3
GPU: BFG Geforce GTX 295 REV B
RAM: 2 GB Corsair DDR3-1333 CL9
MB: ASUS Crosshair III Formula
PSU: Tagan Piperock 600 W
HDD: Seagate Baracuda 7200.12 1TB
SOUND: Creative X-Fi
DISPLAY: Samsung 2233RZ + Geforce 3D Vision

#37
Posted 08/11/2009 12:46 PM   
You are right the 2233RZ it is not state of the art but from the information of other users not the monitor is the problem, cause it occurs also on CRTs or any other TV LCD models. So... different OS won't do it...nor other monitor....nor other pair of glasses...

[quote name='gabriele' post='576899' date='Aug 11 2009, 02:41 PM']I can confirm ghosting problems on top and bottom of the Samsung 2233

I did a test using Stereophotomaker on XP64 and my Quadro FX4600. I enabled page flipping in opengl quad buffered mode.

I did a stereo rendered image, I attached it here.

The same problem is visible on another different system: Vista 64 and a Quadro CX, in this case I used Nvidia Photo Viewer

I tested three pairs of glasses.

If you drag the image you will see how the lamp on the right of the image will be ghosted on top and bottom of the screen....on the center you will see less ghosting.

Btw, Samsung 2233 is not a professional monitor, I donno if iz3d, Viewsonic and dlp projectors/tv displays suffer of the same problem...

I hope that Nvidia will investigate and find a workaround to eliminate this iusse...

I think that Nvidia already knew this "bug"....

Waiting for a professional solution...[/quote]
You are right the 2233RZ it is not state of the art but from the information of other users not the monitor is the problem, cause it occurs also on CRTs or any other TV LCD models. So... different OS won't do it...nor other monitor....nor other pair of glasses...



[quote name='gabriele' post='576899' date='Aug 11 2009, 02:41 PM']I can confirm ghosting problems on top and bottom of the Samsung 2233



I did a test using Stereophotomaker on XP64 and my Quadro FX4600. I enabled page flipping in opengl quad buffered mode.



I did a stereo rendered image, I attached it here.



The same problem is visible on another different system: Vista 64 and a Quadro CX, in this case I used Nvidia Photo Viewer



I tested three pairs of glasses.



If you drag the image you will see how the lamp on the right of the image will be ghosted on top and bottom of the screen....on the center you will see less ghosting.



Btw, Samsung 2233 is not a professional monitor, I donno if iz3d, Viewsonic and dlp projectors/tv displays suffer of the same problem...



I hope that Nvidia will investigate and find a workaround to eliminate this iusse...



I think that Nvidia already knew this "bug"....



Waiting for a professional solution...

CASE: ThermalTake Armor+
CPU: Phenom II 720 X3
GPU: BFG Geforce GTX 295 REV B
RAM: 2 GB Corsair DDR3-1333 CL9
MB: ASUS Crosshair III Formula
PSU: Tagan Piperock 600 W
HDD: Seagate Baracuda 7200.12 1TB
SOUND: Creative X-Fi
DISPLAY: Samsung 2233RZ + Geforce 3D Vision

#38
Posted 08/11/2009 12:52 PM   
[quote name='logoliv' post='576845' date='Aug 11 2009, 07:45 PM']Me too !

Apparently the cause is a bad timing between shutter glasses and screen refresh, but the question is : is it a hardware limitation or can it be resolved with new drivers ? Andrew from nVidia hasn't posted in this topic for 6 months... we don't know if nVidia is aware of the problem.[/quote]

I have registered and asked support for help with this issue. I encourage others with this problem to do the same as it appears to be a wide spread issue and we can hopefully get nvidia to provide a solution.
[quote name='logoliv' post='576845' date='Aug 11 2009, 07:45 PM']Me too !



Apparently the cause is a bad timing between shutter glasses and screen refresh, but the question is : is it a hardware limitation or can it be resolved with new drivers ? Andrew from nVidia hasn't posted in this topic for 6 months... we don't know if nVidia is aware of the problem.



I have registered and asked support for help with this issue. I encourage others with this problem to do the same as it appears to be a wide spread issue and we can hopefully get nvidia to provide a solution.

#39
Posted 08/12/2009 12:16 AM   
[quote name='BigDubs' post='577157' date='Aug 12 2009, 03:16 AM']I have registered and asked support for help with this issue. I encourage others with this problem to do the same as it appears to be a wide spread issue and we can hopefully get nvidia to provide a solution.[/quote]

Did nVIDIA answer?
[quote name='BigDubs' post='577157' date='Aug 12 2009, 03:16 AM']I have registered and asked support for help with this issue. I encourage others with this problem to do the same as it appears to be a wide spread issue and we can hopefully get nvidia to provide a solution.



Did nVIDIA answer?

CASE: ThermalTake Armor+
CPU: Phenom II 720 X3
GPU: BFG Geforce GTX 295 REV B
RAM: 2 GB Corsair DDR3-1333 CL9
MB: ASUS Crosshair III Formula
PSU: Tagan Piperock 600 W
HDD: Seagate Baracuda 7200.12 1TB
SOUND: Creative X-Fi
DISPLAY: Samsung 2233RZ + Geforce 3D Vision

#40
Posted 08/13/2009 07:27 AM   
Not yet
Not yet

#41
Posted 08/13/2009 10:37 AM   
Did you have an answer from nVidia BigDubs ?

I've found this thread on MTBS3D forums : [url="http://www.mtbs3d.com/phpBB/viewtopic.php?f=7&t=3796"]http://www.mtbs3d.com/phpBB/viewtopic.php?f=7&t=3796[/url]

Nobsi said : [i]"This must be a synchronisation issue. Since the emitter is no longer synchronized by a signal at the video output (which would of course perfectly be in sync) but through an USB port, the sync is purely "virtual". Unfortunatelly there seems to be no sync delay adjustment possible in the currrent 3D vision driver, even with registry hacks.

So all we can do at the moment is to hope that nvidia will include a sync delay adjustment in an upcoming driver release."[/i]

I'm convinced we must find a way to adjust synchronisation delay between screen and glasses... It must be possible to hack registry values like GlassesDelayMinus, GlassesDelayPlus and GlassesSwitchDelay in Stereo3D global settings.
Did you have an answer from nVidia BigDubs ?



I've found this thread on MTBS3D forums : http://www.mtbs3d.com/phpBB/viewtopic.php?f=7&t=3796



Nobsi said : "This must be a synchronisation issue. Since the emitter is no longer synchronized by a signal at the video output (which would of course perfectly be in sync) but through an USB port, the sync is purely "virtual". Unfortunatelly there seems to be no sync delay adjustment possible in the currrent 3D vision driver, even with registry hacks.



So all we can do at the moment is to hope that nvidia will include a sync delay adjustment in an upcoming driver release."




I'm convinced we must find a way to adjust synchronisation delay between screen and glasses... It must be possible to hack registry values like GlassesDelayMinus, GlassesDelayPlus and GlassesSwitchDelay in Stereo3D global settings.

#42
Posted 08/17/2009 09:39 AM   
I have received an answer from nVIDIA support.
And they said they have never heard of this.
Also I have sent them the link to this thread.
Waiting for further info ....
I would suggest everyone that has this issue to contact the support team.
I have received an answer from nVIDIA support.

And they said they have never heard of this.

Also I have sent them the link to this thread.

Waiting for further info ....

I would suggest everyone that has this issue to contact the support team.

CASE: ThermalTake Armor+
CPU: Phenom II 720 X3
GPU: BFG Geforce GTX 295 REV B
RAM: 2 GB Corsair DDR3-1333 CL9
MB: ASUS Crosshair III Formula
PSU: Tagan Piperock 600 W
HDD: Seagate Baracuda 7200.12 1TB
SOUND: Creative X-Fi
DISPLAY: Samsung 2233RZ + Geforce 3D Vision

#43
Posted 08/17/2009 09:53 AM   
Having bought the 2233RZ last week, I can now confirm that ghosting occurs for me as well. It's very visible at the top and bottom of the screen and quite similar to what I observed on the CRT (except that the latter one only had severe ghosting near the bottom, but in a much larger area).

One more thing to note is that there is no clear border between ghosting and no ghosting, it gets worse gradually towards the top and bottom edges. With a CRT, I can understand this behaviour (see my post above) but I can't see any reason while a LCD shouldn't refresh the whole image at once.

I agree that it would be very helpful to have advanced synchronization controls, even if they are only available via registry hacks. I for one would gladly sacrifice a little bit of brightness by increasing the shut time of the glasses, if it helps to alleviate the ghosting.

I guess I'll take the time to register my glasses and contact NVIDIA support, if only to make them aware of this issue.
Having bought the 2233RZ last week, I can now confirm that ghosting occurs for me as well. It's very visible at the top and bottom of the screen and quite similar to what I observed on the CRT (except that the latter one only had severe ghosting near the bottom, but in a much larger area).



One more thing to note is that there is no clear border between ghosting and no ghosting, it gets worse gradually towards the top and bottom edges. With a CRT, I can understand this behaviour (see my post above) but I can't see any reason while a LCD shouldn't refresh the whole image at once.



I agree that it would be very helpful to have advanced synchronization controls, even if they are only available via registry hacks. I for one would gladly sacrifice a little bit of brightness by increasing the shut time of the glasses, if it helps to alleviate the ghosting.



I guess I'll take the time to register my glasses and contact NVIDIA support, if only to make them aware of this issue.

CPU: Intel Core i7 920 @ 3.40 GHz

GPU: Geforce GTX 480 @ 850/2000 MHz, Geforce GTX 460 (PhysX/CUDA)

RAM: 6 GB OCZ DDR3-1333 CL7

MOBO: ASUS P6T

PSU: Enermax Pro82+ 625 W

HDD: SuperTalent Ultradrive GX2 128 GB, 2x Seagate Barracuda 1.5 TB

SOUND: Creative X-Fi Elite Pro

DISPLAY: Dell 3007 WFP, Geforce 3D Vision on eMachines V700

INPUT: Logitech G5 + G11

OS: Windows 7 Professional x64

#44
Posted 08/17/2009 10:22 AM   
[quote name='logoliv' post='579270' date='Aug 17 2009, 07:39 PM']Did you have an answer from nVidia BigDubs ?[/quote]

I have not received a response as yet.

[quote name='x_phir3' post='579275' date='Aug 17 2009, 07:53 PM']I have received an answer from nVIDIA support.
And they said they have never heard of this.
Also I have sent them the link to this thread.
Waiting for further info ....
I would suggest everyone that has this issue to contact the support team.[/quote]

I too urge everybody with this issue to put in a formal support query.
[quote name='logoliv' post='579270' date='Aug 17 2009, 07:39 PM']Did you have an answer from nVidia BigDubs ?



I have not received a response as yet.



[quote name='x_phir3' post='579275' date='Aug 17 2009, 07:53 PM']I have received an answer from nVIDIA support.

And they said they have never heard of this.

Also I have sent them the link to this thread.

Waiting for further info ....

I would suggest everyone that has this issue to contact the support team.



I too urge everybody with this issue to put in a formal support query.

#45
Posted 08/17/2009 11:56 AM   
  3 / 31    
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