ALERT: Windows 10 KB3213986 Update Cripples Multi-monitor Gaming
https://www.techpowerup.com/229501/windows-10-kb3213986-update-cripples-multi-monitor-gaming
How is 3D Vision support for Windows 10 nowadays? With the advent of the new Intel Kaby Lake and AMD Ryzen which only support windows 10, we are going to all have to move from windows 7 sooner or later. I am building a new Kaby system and am lucky that Win 10 works mostly still. The ONLY reason I am staying with Windows 7 is the troubles have had getting games to work in 3D Vision under windows 10. Steam users have just recently become a windows 10 majority. For PC gaming now and into the future, I'm afraid windows 10 is the only real platform :(
How is 3D Vision support for Windows 10 nowadays?

With the advent of the new Intel Kaby Lake and AMD Ryzen which only support windows 10, we are going to all have to move from windows 7 sooner or later.

I am building a new Kaby system and am lucky that Win 10 works mostly still. The ONLY reason I am staying with Windows 7 is the troubles have had getting games to work in 3D Vision under windows 10.

Steam users have just recently become a windows 10 majority.

For PC gaming now and into the future, I'm afraid windows 10 is the only real platform :(

Windows 10 64-bit, Intel 7700K @ 5.1GHz, 16GB 3600MHz CL15 DDR4 RAM, 2x GTX 1080 SLI, Asus Maximus IX Hero, Sound Blaster ZxR, PCIe Quad SSD, Oculus Rift CV1, DLP Link PGD-150 glasses, ViewSonic PJD6531w 3D DLP Projector @ 1280x800 120Hz native / 2560x1600 120Hz DSR 3D Gaming.

#2
Posted 01/12/2017 04:12 PM   
I moved over a couple months ago - 3D support is fine, no issues so far.
I moved over a couple months ago - 3D support is fine, no issues so far.

#3
Posted 01/12/2017 04:18 PM   
3D vision support is for me even better than under win7, but maybe just the drivers got better and annoying things like going back to discovery mode are not happening at all. On the other hand, I had a lot of freezes since the anniversary update and you cannot (easy) fix those. Since the new update I did not have a single freeze. Maybe they fixed it???
3D vision support is for me even better than under win7, but maybe just the drivers got better and annoying things like going back to discovery mode are not happening at all. On the other hand, I had a lot of freezes since the anniversary update and you cannot (easy) fix those. Since the new update I did not have a single freeze. Maybe they fixed it???

Intel Core i7-3820, 4 X 3,60 GHz overclocked to 4,50 GHz ; EVGA Titan X 12VRAM ; 16 GB Corsair Vengeance DDR-1600 (4x 4 GB) ; Asus VG278H 27-inch incl. 3D vision 2 glasses, integrated transmitter ; Xbox One Elite wireless controller ; Windows 10HTC VIVE 2,5 m2 roomscale3D VISION GAMERS - VISIT ME ON STEAM and feel free to add me: http://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561198064106555 YOUTUBE: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC1UE5TPoF0HX0HVpF_E4uPQ STEAM CURATOR: https://store.steampowered.com/curator/33611530-Streaming-Deluxe/ Image

#4
Posted 01/12/2017 05:46 PM   
3D Vision support on Win 10 is fine, now if they would only fix their start menu rendering bugs... [url=https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10154384757319091&set=a.10150206678974091.321189.593604090&type=3&theater] [img]https://scontent-syd2-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/15977906_10154384757319091_2697203595753978060_n.jpg?oh=5a9cd459ae4d6839e25dcc7111efb8e2&oe=58DFF747[/img] [/url]
3D Vision support on Win 10 is fine, now if they would only fix their start menu rendering bugs...


Image

2x Geforce GTX 980 in SLI provided by NVIDIA, i7 6700K 4GHz CPU, Asus 27" VG278HE 144Hz 3D Monitor, BenQ W1070 3D Projector, 120" Elite Screens YardMaster 2, 32GB Corsair DDR4 3200MHz RAM, Samsung 850 EVO 500G SSD, 4x750GB HDD in RAID5, Gigabyte Z170X-Gaming 7 Motherboard, Corsair Obsidian 750D Airflow Edition Case, Corsair RM850i PSU, HTC Vive, Win 10 64bit

Alienware M17x R4 w/ built in 3D, Intel i7 3740QM, GTX 680m 2GB, 16GB DDR3 1600MHz RAM, Win7 64bit, 1TB SSD, 1TB HDD, 750GB HDD

Pre-release 3D fixes, shadertool.py and other goodies: http://github.com/DarkStarSword/3d-fixes
Support me on Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/DarkStarSword or PayPal: https://www.paypal.me/DarkStarSword

#5
Posted 01/12/2017 07:02 PM   
I concur that Win10 support for 3D Vision and our fixes are not causing unfixable problems. As a general idea, I see more problems/glitches with Win10 that require time to work out, but no showstoppers. On HelixModBlog, the questions are mostly problems with Win10 glitches, so the only real problem on Win10 is that it's not a particularly smooth experience. The reason I hate Win10 is because of all the weird inconsistencies, and bizarre problems that pop up for no reason. I spend too much time dicking around fixing stuff that should just be stable. Microsoft has a much lower bar for quality on Win10 than they have had historically. The broken patches they keep forcing out are really bad. I don't agree that anyone needs to move from Win7 anytime soon. While Win10 is in the majority, Win7 is still at 29% of all Steam Users. It's a bold publisher that can afford to skip 30% of the market, when Win10 brings nothing new to the table. 32 bit is dead, no question. x32 is about 8% of Steam Users, and publishers have no hesitation to require x64. The Kaby Lake OS support is partly propaganda from Microsoft, trying to force everyone to switch to Win10. Win7 installs fine on Kaby Lake processors, as long as you use a Series100 chipset. Intel has so far agreed to never release Win7 drivers for Series200 chipset. If they hold fast to that promise, then Win7 will die at Kaby Lake. Right now a Kaby processor will run in a Skylake motherboard, it's pin compatible, and there is essentially zero difference between them. If I were building now, I'd skip Kaby because of the retarded restrictions and lack of performance and use SkyLake. Having noted all that, I don't disagree that as some point Win7 will run out of gas, and Win10 will be required. That day is not this year, but maybe in two years. When that day comes, I think I'm done with Windows. The absolute [i]only [/i]reason I use this f* Windows is because of the freedom it provides. The reason Windows crushed all contenders was because of the freedom, and the very deliberate backwards compatibility. If these fools break that promise, they will have destroyed their platform.
I concur that Win10 support for 3D Vision and our fixes are not causing unfixable problems. As a general idea, I see more problems/glitches with Win10 that require time to work out, but no showstoppers. On HelixModBlog, the questions are mostly problems with Win10 glitches, so the only real problem on Win10 is that it's not a particularly smooth experience.

The reason I hate Win10 is because of all the weird inconsistencies, and bizarre problems that pop up for no reason. I spend too much time dicking around fixing stuff that should just be stable. Microsoft has a much lower bar for quality on Win10 than they have had historically. The broken patches they keep forcing out are really bad.


I don't agree that anyone needs to move from Win7 anytime soon. While Win10 is in the majority, Win7 is still at 29% of all Steam Users. It's a bold publisher that can afford to skip 30% of the market, when Win10 brings nothing new to the table.

32 bit is dead, no question. x32 is about 8% of Steam Users, and publishers have no hesitation to require x64.

The Kaby Lake OS support is partly propaganda from Microsoft, trying to force everyone to switch to Win10. Win7 installs fine on Kaby Lake processors, as long as you use a Series100 chipset. Intel has so far agreed to never release Win7 drivers for Series200 chipset. If they hold fast to that promise, then Win7 will die at Kaby Lake.

Right now a Kaby processor will run in a Skylake motherboard, it's pin compatible, and there is essentially zero difference between them.

If I were building now, I'd skip Kaby because of the retarded restrictions and lack of performance and use SkyLake.


Having noted all that, I don't disagree that as some point Win7 will run out of gas, and Win10 will be required. That day is not this year, but maybe in two years.

When that day comes, I think I'm done with Windows. The absolute only reason I use this f* Windows is because of the freedom it provides. The reason Windows crushed all contenders was because of the freedom, and the very deliberate backwards compatibility. If these fools break that promise, they will have destroyed their platform.

Acer H5360 (1280x720@120Hz) - ASUS VG248QE with GSync mod - 3D Vision 1&2 - Driver 372.54
GTX 970 - i5-4670K@4.2GHz - 12GB RAM - Win7x64+evilKB2670838 - 4 Disk X25 RAID
SAGER NP9870-S - GTX 980 - i7-6700K - Win10 Pro 1607
Latest 3Dmigoto Release
Bo3b's School for ShaderHackers

#6
Posted 01/12/2017 09:59 PM   
I suggest using a dual boot setup - it has worked great for some of us. I bought another SSD, mirror copied my original Windows 8.1 disk (version shipped with my computer), and then migrated the new disk copy to Windows 10. I maintain both OSs, with virtually all my current gaming using the Windows 10 boot disk. I have encountered only 2 games out of the MANY 3D Vision games I have played with Windows 10 related problems (on my setup) - XCOM 2 and Lords of the Fallen (potentially Just Cause 3, also). Both XCOM 2 and LotF work great under Windows 8.1, however. bo3b - I hope you never finish with Windows... Your contributions to this community have been critical to the success of most current mods, and you provide sage advice to this community overall.
I suggest using a dual boot setup - it has worked great for some of us. I bought another SSD, mirror copied my original Windows 8.1 disk (version shipped with my computer), and then migrated the new disk copy to Windows 10. I maintain both OSs, with virtually all my current gaming using the Windows 10 boot disk.

I have encountered only 2 games out of the MANY 3D Vision games I have played with Windows 10 related problems (on my setup) - XCOM 2 and Lords of the Fallen (potentially Just Cause 3, also). Both XCOM 2 and LotF work great under Windows 8.1, however.

bo3b - I hope you never finish with Windows... Your contributions to this community have been critical to the success of most current mods, and you provide sage advice to this community overall.

#7
Posted 01/12/2017 11:46 PM   
This pisses me off mightily. I learnt of this yesturday, made sure my os was set to defer updates, and then an hour later received the dreaded message my computer needed to shutdown to update. Although 3D in general has been fine I have had myltiple annoying problems with the OS it self. I had a problem for ages where my games would silently minimize especially annoying with competitive fighting games where "ragequiting" Is punished or path of exile with permadeath leagues. Only solution after troubleshooting for hours was to completely reinstall the OS. Currently 1. Some games refuse to run unless steam is running as admin. (Which makes it refuse to auto start with Windows. 2. Running any youtube video in full screen results in 3dvision kicking in and causing green screens. Anyone else have this and a solution? 3. My g27 racing wheel refuses to work with gta5 (completely fine in 7) And now this nonsense, how the hell did this update get green lit. They better damn well be fixing this or I'm going back to 7 and staying there.
This pisses me off mightily.

I learnt of this yesturday, made sure my os was set to defer updates, and then an hour later received the dreaded message my computer needed to shutdown to update.

Although 3D in general has been fine I have had myltiple annoying problems with the OS it self.
I had a problem for ages where my games would silently minimize especially annoying with competitive fighting games where "ragequiting" Is punished or path of exile with permadeath leagues.

Only solution after troubleshooting for hours was to completely reinstall the OS.

Currently

1. Some games refuse to run unless steam is running as admin. (Which makes it refuse to auto start with Windows.

2. Running any youtube video in full screen results in 3dvision kicking in and causing green screens. Anyone else have this and a solution?

3. My g27 racing wheel refuses to work with gta5 (completely fine in 7)

And now this nonsense, how the hell did this update get green lit. They better damn well be fixing this or I'm going back to 7 and staying there.

i7-4790K CPU 4.8Ghz stable overclock.
16 GB RAM Corsair
EVGA 1080TI SLI
Samsung SSD 840Pro
ASUS Z97-WS
3D Surround ASUS Rog Swift PG278Q(R), 2x PG278Q (yes it works)
Obutto R3volution.
Windows 10 pro 64x (Windows 7 Dual boot)

#8
Posted 01/13/2017 12:22 AM   
From my POV everything is working fine under Windows 10. There are some WINDOWS glitches when Surround is enabled, but is not related to gaming. Still have my Win7 SSD just to try things out. If you are single monitor Windows 10 will not hamper anything related to 3D Vision. If you are a Surround user, Windows 10 is still the way to go. This is ONLY if you want something above Windows 7. If you are FINE with WIN7 I suggest sticking with that (Makes your life easier).
From my POV everything is working fine under Windows 10.
There are some WINDOWS glitches when Surround is enabled, but is not related to gaming.

Still have my Win7 SSD just to try things out.
If you are single monitor Windows 10 will not hamper anything related to 3D Vision.
If you are a Surround user, Windows 10 is still the way to go.

This is ONLY if you want something above Windows 7. If you are FINE with WIN7 I suggest sticking with that (Makes your life easier).

1x Palit RTX 2080Ti Pro Gaming OC(watercooled and overclocked to hell)
3x 3D Vision Ready Asus VG278HE monitors (5760x1080).
Intel i9 9900K (overclocked to 5.3 and watercooled ofc).
Asus Maximus XI Hero Mobo.
16 GB Team Group T-Force Dark Pro DDR4 @ 3600.
Lots of Disks:
- Raid 0 - 256GB Sandisk Extreme SSD.
- Raid 0 - WD Black - 2TB.
- SanDisk SSD PLUS 480 GB.
- Intel 760p 256GB M.2 PCIe NVMe SSD.
Creative Sound Blaster Z.
Windows 10 x64 Pro.
etc


My website with my fixes and OpenGL to 3D Vision wrapper:
http://3dsurroundgaming.com

(If you like some of the stuff that I've done and want to donate something, you can do it with PayPal at tavyhome@gmail.com)

#9
Posted 01/13/2017 12:22 AM   
I had to DDU and reinstall driver after the recent Windows 10 update, Fallout 4 went from being a reasonably smooth 60fps to 2-5fps (with afterburner reporting 100% gpu usage), obviously unplayable. The only thing that had changed was the Windows 10 update. After DDU and driver reinstall everything seems to be back to normal!
I had to DDU and reinstall driver after the recent Windows 10 update, Fallout 4 went from being a reasonably smooth 60fps to 2-5fps (with afterburner reporting 100% gpu usage), obviously unplayable.

The only thing that had changed was the Windows 10 update. After DDU and driver reinstall everything seems to be back to normal!

OS & Driver: Win 10 w/417.35
CPU & GPU: i7 4790k, Gigabyte 980Ti G1 Gaming
MB & RAM: Asrock Z97 Extreme4, GSkill Trident 16Gb DDR3 2400Mhz
Audio: Realtek HD, Steinberg UR44
Display: Acer XB271HUA w/3D Vision 2 Kit

#10
Posted 01/13/2017 07:29 AM   
That's why I rolled back to my good old W7.
That's why I rolled back to my good old W7.

#11
Posted 01/13/2017 11:10 AM   
I haven't had any game breaking 3D Vision bugs after migrating to Windows 10. But as others have mentioned, the OS itself is buggy as all get-out. I merely tolerate Windows 10, I do not like it.
I haven't had any game breaking 3D Vision bugs after migrating to Windows 10. But as others have mentioned, the OS itself is buggy as all get-out. I merely tolerate Windows 10, I do not like it.

|CPU: i7-2700k @ 4.5Ghz
|Cooler: Zalman 9900 Max
|MB: MSI Military Class II Z68 GD-80
|RAM: Corsair Vengence 16GB DDR3
|SSDs: Seagate 600 240GB; Crucial M4 128GB
|HDDs: Seagate Barracuda 1TB; Seagate Barracuda 500GB
|PS: OCZ ZX Series 1250watt
|Case: Antec 1200 V3
|Monitors: Asus 3D VG278HE; Asus 3D VG236H; Samsung 3D 51" Plasma;
|GPU:MSI 1080GTX "Duke"
|OS: Windows 10 Pro X64

#12
Posted 01/13/2017 01:35 PM   
Thank you for the input guys. bo3b, I agree with everything you say, except maybe abandoning windows - Unless there is another better gaming OS. Gaming is the only reason I stick with Windows, and I am treading very cautiously in this new territory. Due to what you guys said, I have done what to me was unthinkable a few weeks ago - I am now on windows 10. Due to the impact of the 3D Vision CPU bug, I was after the best single core performance CPU (RyZen was thus immediately disqualified with heavy heart), and although not different from SkyLake, KabyLake clocked ~300MHz higher and had support for faster memory (and updated chipset) and was only fractionally more in cost compared with SkyLake. On the down side, I took a risk with it not being compatible with windows 7. I got lucky there but unfortunately, not so lucky in the silicon lottery. Ramblings below this point... ======= I have made a backup image of Windows7, and then upgraded to Windows 10. I have had to reinstall and reconfigure most of the apps - the upgrade in that sense was useless. I should have installed a fresh copy. I did in fact at one point get annoyed with the windows 10 problems, and decided to go back to Windows 7. I rebooted to boot from the imaging software but the imaging software also showing troubles also reminded me of the bugs in Windows 7, which were annoying at the time but which I have gotten used to as time passed. This realisation made me reboot to Windows 10 and give it another try. I was able to fix the annoyances and well... So far so good. I have taken the opportunity to investigate some bugs in windows 7 apps which were still occurring in windows 10 - now bug free, it seems to be the only real 'upgrade'. I'll be trying some games over the coming weeks. That's where the real test is of course. I might yet revert back to Windows 7. Having had numerous dual boot systems in the past, I am not fond of the idea - there is too much fragmentation and duplication of tweaks and settings which ends up doubling the workload and headache. I guess the endeavour has been mostly successful, and so perhaps I ought to change my listed specs with a light sprinkle of confidence and caution in equal measure.
Thank you for the input guys.

bo3b, I agree with everything you say, except maybe abandoning windows - Unless there is another better gaming OS. Gaming is the only reason I stick with Windows, and I am treading very cautiously in this new territory.

Due to what you guys said, I have done what to me was unthinkable a few weeks ago - I am now on windows 10.

Due to the impact of the 3D Vision CPU bug, I was after the best single core performance CPU (RyZen was thus immediately disqualified with heavy heart), and although not different from SkyLake, KabyLake clocked ~300MHz higher and had support for faster memory (and updated chipset) and was only fractionally more in cost compared with SkyLake. On the down side, I took a risk with it not being compatible with windows 7. I got lucky there but unfortunately, not so lucky in the silicon lottery.

Ramblings below this point...
=======

I have made a backup image of Windows7, and then upgraded to Windows 10. I have had to reinstall and reconfigure most of the apps - the upgrade in that sense was useless. I should have installed a fresh copy.

I did in fact at one point get annoyed with the windows 10 problems, and decided to go back to Windows 7. I rebooted to boot from the imaging software but the imaging software also showing troubles also reminded me of the bugs in Windows 7, which were annoying at the time but which I have gotten used to as time passed. This realisation made me reboot to Windows 10 and give it another try. I was able to fix the annoyances and well...

So far so good. I have taken the opportunity to investigate some bugs in windows 7 apps which were still occurring in windows 10 - now bug free, it seems to be the only real 'upgrade'.

I'll be trying some games over the coming weeks. That's where the real test is of course. I might yet revert back to Windows 7.

Having had numerous dual boot systems in the past, I am not fond of the idea - there is too much fragmentation and duplication of tweaks and settings which ends up doubling the workload and headache.

I guess the endeavour has been mostly successful, and so perhaps I ought to change my listed specs with a light sprinkle of confidence and caution in equal measure.

Windows 10 64-bit, Intel 7700K @ 5.1GHz, 16GB 3600MHz CL15 DDR4 RAM, 2x GTX 1080 SLI, Asus Maximus IX Hero, Sound Blaster ZxR, PCIe Quad SSD, Oculus Rift CV1, DLP Link PGD-150 glasses, ViewSonic PJD6531w 3D DLP Projector @ 1280x800 120Hz native / 2560x1600 120Hz DSR 3D Gaming.

#13
Posted 01/16/2017 01:49 PM   
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