Decline of 3D Vision - Thought you all should know - Dark Times Ahead :(
  10 / 14    
Ok so an update. I got my 3D hardware, got it all set up, and i'm in disbelief. The realism is incredible!! I tried Diablo 3 using the fix by HelixMod.blog website and it really fixed the shader problem that I had when I first played it. Once I set the convergence where I liked it, and corrected the depth - the 3D really shined. Then i tried it on World of Warcraft - made an undead rogue and ran into the first cavern at the starter entrance and zoomed in one the table... my Jaw dropped. There was a skeleton skull and when I looked at it closely the eye would move back and forth.... Something that you would NEVER notice or even pay attention to in 2D.. I must have looked around in this room for a good 5 minutes. Blown Away!
Ok so an update. I got my 3D hardware, got it all set up, and i'm in disbelief.

The realism is incredible!! I tried Diablo 3 using the fix by HelixMod.blog website and it really fixed the shader problem that I had when I first played it.

Once I set the convergence where I liked it, and corrected the depth - the 3D really shined.

Then i tried it on World of Warcraft - made an undead rogue and ran into the first cavern at the starter entrance and zoomed in one the table... my Jaw dropped.

There was a skeleton skull and when I looked at it closely the eye would move back and forth.... Something that you would NEVER notice or even pay attention to in 2D.. I must have looked around in this room for a good 5 minutes.

Blown Away!

Posted 07/31/2014 05:14 AM   
The awesome thing with WoW, is that you can set a macro for custom graphic details that will let you swap between extreme high and low graphic details on the fly. Crank them up for flying around and questing. Then instantly swap them to low for a quick frame rate boost when you chance upon a flagged enemy. Search WoW Graphics Mod and Higher than Ultra Graphics for World of Warcraft on YouTube for a basic example.
The awesome thing with WoW, is that you can set a macro for custom graphic details that will let you swap between extreme high and low graphic details on the fly. Crank them up for flying around and questing. Then instantly swap them to low for a quick frame rate boost when you chance upon a flagged enemy.

Search WoW Graphics Mod and Higher than Ultra Graphics for World of Warcraft on YouTube for a basic example.

Posted 07/31/2014 06:11 AM   
Well written Bo3b and to the point. It should not be hidden at page 9 of this thread. It would make a really nice new thread about learning to fix shaders. As far as I know there is no dedicated thread about learning to fix shaders. It should not be more complicated than that to start one unless you disagree.
Well written Bo3b and to the point. It should not be hidden at page 9 of this thread.

It would make a really nice new thread about learning to fix shaders.
As far as I know there is no dedicated thread about learning to fix shaders.

It should not be more complicated than that to start one unless you disagree.

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Posted 07/31/2014 06:38 AM   
I really think we need a wiki (or something similar) for the documentation (and perhaps even the mods themselves, or at least info on the modded games and links to the mods) - when I was learning shader modding I found it quite frustrating that some of Helix' old posts mentioned options that you could add to the ini for logging etc that simply didn't work. Eventually I came across a post suggesting that those options have since been removed from the dll, but of course the original guide buried in the middle of some thread wasn't updated to mention that. I'm somewhat tempted to host a wiki myself (I already pay for shared hosting, VM hosting and my domain name), but I'm all too aware that lots of people have already started their own 3D gaming sites (and lets not forget ye olde wiki over at http://helixmod.wikispot.org ) and that would just add yet one more site to the mix (plus I'd much rather code than maintain a website and deal with wiki spammers). It looks like there is a bit of consensus that the blog isn't the ideal format - but it is a well known central place to look for 3D fixes, and that's probably it's most valuable feature which we would be foolish to throw away. Having said that, it could easily be converted into news of new mods that simply have a small excerpt from the real article elsewhere on a wiki. BTW my 3D Alienware laptop is finally back from service (yay) - now to work through my backlog of games then get back to learning shader modding ;-)
I really think we need a wiki (or something similar) for the documentation (and perhaps even the mods themselves, or at least info on the modded games and links to the mods) - when I was learning shader modding I found it quite frustrating that some of Helix' old posts mentioned options that you could add to the ini for logging etc that simply didn't work. Eventually I came across a post suggesting that those options have since been removed from the dll, but of course the original guide buried in the middle of some thread wasn't updated to mention that.

I'm somewhat tempted to host a wiki myself (I already pay for shared hosting, VM hosting and my domain name), but I'm all too aware that lots of people have already started their own 3D gaming sites (and lets not forget ye olde wiki over at http://helixmod.wikispot.org ) and that would just add yet one more site to the mix (plus I'd much rather code than maintain a website and deal with wiki spammers).

It looks like there is a bit of consensus that the blog isn't the ideal format - but it is a well known central place to look for 3D fixes, and that's probably it's most valuable feature which we would be foolish to throw away. Having said that, it could easily be converted into news of new mods that simply have a small excerpt from the real article elsewhere on a wiki.

BTW my 3D Alienware laptop is finally back from service (yay) - now to work through my backlog of games then get back to learning shader modding ;-)

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Posted 07/31/2014 08:10 AM   
Flugan, this thread is long and cluttered, but seems to have a lot of information. https://forums.geforce.com/default/topic/513190/3d-vision/how-to-fix-disable-shaders-in-games-dll-guide-and-fixes-/
Flugan, this thread is long and cluttered, but seems to have a lot of information.


https://forums.geforce.com/default/topic/513190/3d-vision/how-to-fix-disable-shaders-in-games-dll-guide-and-fixes-/

Posted 07/31/2014 04:08 PM   
Well, the HelixModBlog already has a Guides section in the main navbar: [url]http://helixmod.blogspot.com/2010/12/how-to-guides.html[/url] It's perhaps not ideal, but it does have a lot of this info. Also, I made a reasonably comprehensive page awhile back, that points to every resource I knew of: [url]http://helixmod.blogspot.com/2014/01/learning-how-to-fix-games.html[/url] I think I agree with Flugan though, that we might want to start a new thread to have a conversation with the new people. The old thread is certainly valid for that as well, and has the advantage of being in one spot and has a wealth of prior information and detail. I'm not sure exactly the right format for this sort of thing. The forum software seems fairly primitive, but is very convenient. The blog is less convenient, but has historically had very good conversations. If eqzitara is reading this, I'm sure he is smiling to himself, because he did all this once before.
Well, the HelixModBlog already has a Guides section in the main navbar:

http://helixmod.blogspot.com/2010/12/how-to-guides.html


It's perhaps not ideal, but it does have a lot of this info.

Also, I made a reasonably comprehensive page awhile back, that points to every resource I knew of:

http://helixmod.blogspot.com/2014/01/learning-how-to-fix-games.html


I think I agree with Flugan though, that we might want to start a new thread to have a conversation with the new people. The old thread is certainly valid for that as well, and has the advantage of being in one spot and has a wealth of prior information and detail.

I'm not sure exactly the right format for this sort of thing. The forum software seems fairly primitive, but is very convenient. The blog is less convenient, but has historically had very good conversations.

If eqzitara is reading this, I'm sure he is smiling to himself, because he did all this once before.

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Posted 08/01/2014 12:50 AM   
A new thread with clear info on how to make fixes would probably push me to finally trying some specific fixes for games. It seems something that's reasonably doable, but I've always been avoiding it because the instructions I was able to find around were usually fairly vague. I've spent hours looking through PSHash's to figure out the appropriate way to render a video game without a HUD, I'm sure if I understood how I would be willing to do something similar to get acceptable 3D in some games I'm excited for.
A new thread with clear info on how to make fixes would probably push me to finally trying some specific fixes for games.

It seems something that's reasonably doable, but I've always been avoiding it because the instructions I was able to find around were usually fairly vague.

I've spent hours looking through PSHash's to figure out the appropriate way to render a video game without a HUD, I'm sure if I understood how I would be willing to do something similar to get acceptable 3D in some games I'm excited for.

Posted 08/01/2014 01:15 AM   
3D gaming has always been something you have had to see in order to believe. In order to truly understand what 3D gaming is all about you have to actually play a game in 3D. Unfortunately, that's the rob and is where everything falls apart. Despite what people say about NVidia, I don't believe they have given up, they just haven’t answered this question yet. -How do you show the public how amazing this tech is ?. Most of us here know that once you see it, you’re hooked. The first time you ever play a game in 3D is like the first time you see a great magic trick. Your mind is just blown away and almost doesn’t want to accept what it’s seeing. Don’t you think NVidia sees how amazing this tech is? This isn’t NVidias fault guys, it’s the publics and that’s the cruel ugly truth. Even though thousands of people were swearing 3D was a gimmick and YouTubers screaming (Angry Joe) at the camera how useless 3D is, NVidia was still here supporting it the best way they can. They get it guys, they know it’s amazing, the problem has always been trying to get the public to actually put those glasses on and sit down and play some Tomb Raider in 3D. Like catching rain drops with a spoon, NVidia has had to show one person at a time. The answer has always been the same –If the public doesn’t show enthusiasm for it, then the developers don’t. It’s just the way it is…and it sucks. In regards to 3D, I don't know half the stuff people do on these forums. I couldn't tell you in a million years how to properly fix shaders. I read some of the things people are posting on here and can't fathom how intelligent they must be in order to create these amazing fixes/programs. I'm constantly amazed at how much passion there is here for 3D gaming. Sometimes, I come here just to read about all the cool stuff people are working on and what projects they have finished/released. This community inspired me to start S3DGamerZone, you inspired me to help make others aware threw making 3D video Reviews/Previews. (I was also very lucky on this front because I met a great person who shared the same passion as me and has made amazing 3D game reviews.) So much good has come from this little place we have here and in the 20+ years I have been posting on forums, I have never EVER met a better community of people. Somehow, I think you guys all know that this is a pretty special place for us 3D gamers. We got lucky, we have wonderful smart people here who are willing to help each other out. I refuse to believe that we can’t find a way to make it possible for more people to fix 3D game issues. If ever there was a group of people that where able to find a way, I believe it is this one. I’m going to work on finding a way to make a portable 3D gaming rig and start going to local malls. I would need NVidias permission so I will be sending them an E-Mail asking for their approval. It’s the only way I can think of to actually help out. It’s going to take some time but if anyone’s interested in giving me a hand pls let me know. For now, I’m going to try acquiring a portable 3D tablet to simply show gamers what it looks like and build from there.
3D gaming has always been something you have had to see in order to believe. In order to truly understand what 3D gaming is all about you have to actually play a game in 3D. Unfortunately, that's the rob and is where everything falls apart. Despite what people say about NVidia, I don't believe they have given up, they just haven’t answered this question yet. -How do you show the public how amazing this tech is ?. Most of us here know that once you see it, you’re hooked. The first time you ever play a game in 3D is like the first time you see a great magic trick. Your mind is just blown away and almost doesn’t want to accept what it’s seeing. Don’t you think NVidia sees how amazing this tech is? This isn’t NVidias fault guys, it’s the publics and that’s the cruel ugly truth. Even though thousands of people were swearing 3D was a gimmick and YouTubers screaming (Angry Joe) at the camera how useless 3D is, NVidia was still here supporting it the best way they can. They get it guys, they know it’s amazing, the problem has always been trying to get the public to actually put those glasses on and sit down and play some Tomb Raider in 3D. Like catching rain drops with a spoon, NVidia has had to show one person at a time. The answer has always been the same –If the public doesn’t show enthusiasm for it, then the developers don’t. It’s just the way it is…and it sucks.

In regards to 3D, I don't know half the stuff people do on these forums. I couldn't tell you in a million years how to properly fix shaders. I read some of the things people are posting on here and can't fathom how intelligent they must be in order to create these amazing fixes/programs. I'm constantly amazed at how much passion there is here for 3D gaming. Sometimes, I come here just to read about all the cool stuff people are working on and what projects they have finished/released. This community inspired me to start S3DGamerZone, you inspired me to help make others aware threw making 3D video Reviews/Previews. (I was also very lucky on this front because I met a great person who shared the same passion as me and has made amazing 3D game reviews.) So much good has come from this little place we have here and in the 20+ years I have been posting on forums, I have never EVER met a better community of people. Somehow, I think you guys all know that this is a pretty special place for us 3D gamers. We got lucky, we have wonderful smart people here who are willing to help each other out. I refuse to believe that we can’t find a way to make it possible for more people to fix 3D game issues. If ever there was a group of people that where able to find a way, I believe it is this one.

I’m going to work on finding a way to make a portable 3D gaming rig and start going to local malls. I would need NVidias permission so I will be sending them an E-Mail asking for their approval. It’s the only way I can think of to actually help out. It’s going to take some time but if anyone’s interested in giving me a hand pls let me know. For now, I’m going to try acquiring a portable 3D tablet to simply show gamers what it looks like and build from there.

Posted 08/01/2014 07:15 AM   
I played so many games with the helixmods. It was the reason I always bought Nvidia cards and the 3dVision glasses. I'm sad to read that the modders leave, cause there is no support of Nvidia. Hopefully some good guys will carry on working on real 3d, doing the things that Nvidia is supposed to do.
I played so many games with the helixmods. It was the reason I always bought Nvidia cards and the 3dVision glasses. I'm sad to read that the modders leave, cause there is no support of Nvidia. Hopefully some good guys will carry on working on real 3d, doing the things that Nvidia is supposed to do.

Posted 08/01/2014 02:49 PM   
[quote="Recostar"]..............So much good has come from this little place we have here and in the 20+ years I have been posting on forums, I have never EVER met a better community of people. Somehow, I think you guys all know that this is a pretty special place for us 3D gamers. We got lucky, we have wonderful smart people here who are willing to help each other out. I refuse to believe that we can’t find a way to make it possible for more people to fix 3D game issues. If ever there was a group of people that where able to find a way, I believe it is this one................ [/quote] Totally agree. I was once part of a forum back in about 2001-2003 that was comparably special, but apart from that, nowhere else has even come close. Certainly not in the gaming world, where most forums are toxic dumps. One of the good things about this forum is that not only do people take the time to write thoughtful posts, but people actually take the time to read them and properly respond to them. That's pretty rare. Even in forums that are generally friendly places, the mouths tend to outnumber the ears 10 to 1. I think you're also right about nvidia. They have a moral obligation to only do things that make money - not only to their shareholders, but to all their employees. It's the public that has made the situation the way it is, not nvidia. But I can't shake the feeling that nvidia hasn't actually done their homework right, and that 3dvision makes more money for them than they think. Either way, the thing that really puzzles me is why 3D and VR are so different. No one had to convert people to the Oculus Rift "one person at a time". People salivate about it in droves, even though almost none of them have even tried it. There's clearly something about VR that has captured the collective imagination. And therein seems to lie the problem. 3Dvision is amazing in reality, but people don't imagine that it is. In reality, the Oculus Rift is still pretty lousy (for now), but people imagine that it is amazing. Nvidia has had reality on their side, but reality has not been enough when pitted against people's imagination and preconceptions.
Recostar said:..............So much good has come from this little place we have here and in the 20+ years I have been posting on forums, I have never EVER met a better community of people. Somehow, I think you guys all know that this is a pretty special place for us 3D gamers. We got lucky, we have wonderful smart people here who are willing to help each other out. I refuse to believe that we can’t find a way to make it possible for more people to fix 3D game issues. If ever there was a group of people that where able to find a way, I believe it is this one................

Totally agree. I was once part of a forum back in about 2001-2003 that was comparably special, but apart from that, nowhere else has even come close. Certainly not in the gaming world, where most forums are toxic dumps.

One of the good things about this forum is that not only do people take the time to write thoughtful posts, but people actually take the time to read them and properly respond to them. That's pretty rare. Even in forums that are generally friendly places, the mouths tend to outnumber the ears 10 to 1.

I think you're also right about nvidia. They have a moral obligation to only do things that make money - not only to their shareholders, but to all their employees. It's the public that has made the situation the way it is, not nvidia. But I can't shake the feeling that nvidia hasn't actually done their homework right, and that 3dvision makes more money for them than they think.

Either way, the thing that really puzzles me is why 3D and VR are so different. No one had to convert people to the Oculus Rift "one person at a time". People salivate about it in droves, even though almost none of them have even tried it. There's clearly something about VR that has captured the collective imagination.

And therein seems to lie the problem. 3Dvision is amazing in reality, but people don't imagine that it is. In reality, the Oculus Rift is still pretty lousy (for now), but people imagine that it is amazing. Nvidia has had reality on their side, but reality has not been enough when pitted against people's imagination and preconceptions.

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Posted 08/02/2014 10:56 AM   
TriDef states "Over 41 million units shipped worldwide" http://www.tridef.com/ If that's the number of people using their product, it's a huge number. Sure some are using it for photos or video playback, etc.. Regardless, that's a lot of stereoscopic users.
TriDef states "Over 41 million units shipped worldwide"


http://www.tridef.com/


If that's the number of people using their product, it's a huge number.

Sure some are using it for photos or video playback, etc..

Regardless, that's a lot of stereoscopic users.

Posted 08/02/2014 12:18 PM   
[quote="D-Man11"]TriDef states "Over 41 million units shipped worldwide" http://www.tridef.com/ If that's the number of people using their product, it's a huge number. Sure some are using it for photos or video playback, etc.. Regardless, that's a lot of stereoscopic users.[/quote] Wow, So you would think with a number like that you can better support I currently own Tridef software and found lately there updates are slowing down also users are complaining on the forums about updates.
D-Man11 said:TriDef states "Over 41 million units shipped worldwide"


http://www.tridef.com/


If that's the number of people using their product, it's a huge number.

Sure some are using it for photos or video playback, etc..

Regardless, that's a lot of stereoscopic users.



Wow,
So you would think with a number like that you can better support

I currently own Tridef software and found lately there updates are slowing down also users are complaining on the forums about updates.

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Posted 08/02/2014 12:51 PM   
I think that it may also include mobile licensing, since they were the providers of LG Optimus 3D tools and several other chinese tablets that use 3d screens, together with 3DTVs software. It really seems way too much for PC imho.
I think that it may also include mobile licensing, since they were the providers of LG Optimus 3D tools and several other chinese tablets that use 3d screens, together with 3DTVs software. It really seems way too much for PC imho.

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Posted 08/02/2014 02:46 PM   
[quote="Laast"]Please, and for the last time: Nvidia -as a company- has not the right to use or alter software parts of external studios and redistribute them. Copyright laws does not allow that. So stop blame Nvidia not wanting or being able to do what has been done by helix modders. All they can do is to "hack" shaders on-the-fly using specific drivers, or use fake 3D methods. That's why they will never hire Helix, or anyone else, to do a full time job fixing games.[/quote] They don't need to alter the game files, they can just make a shader layer that redirects calls to their fixed shaders. It can all be done inside the nvidia drivers without ever touching the game files. This is what Helix has done (Helix also does not alter game files btw), just he's had to use a replacement dx9 dll you dump in the game folder since he doesn't have access to the driver code. So no, nvidia absolutely could fix games if they wanted to. 3D vision already messes with how games are rendered at the driver level to achieve the stereo separation and to add their crosshair.
Laast said:Please, and for the last time: Nvidia -as a company- has not the right to use or alter software parts of external studios and redistribute them. Copyright laws does not allow that. So stop blame Nvidia not wanting or being able to do what has been done by helix modders. All they can do is to "hack" shaders on-the-fly using specific drivers, or use fake 3D methods.

That's why they will never hire Helix, or anyone else, to do a full time job fixing games.

They don't need to alter the game files, they can just make a shader layer that redirects calls to their fixed shaders. It can all be done inside the nvidia drivers without ever touching the game files. This is what Helix has done (Helix also does not alter game files btw), just he's had to use a replacement dx9 dll you dump in the game folder since he doesn't have access to the driver code.

So no, nvidia absolutely could fix games if they wanted to. 3D vision already messes with how games are rendered at the driver level to achieve the stereo separation and to add their crosshair.

Posted 08/02/2014 10:10 PM   
I was also thinking that with Oculus Rift or whatever coming out, that it won't be so bad and I'm sure the Oculus Rift will be awesome for additional reasons besides having the illusion of depth. Seems strange to drop 3D Vision just now though considering how long it would obviously take for such an expensive and inaccessible feature to become accepted by a wider audience.
I was also thinking that with Oculus Rift or whatever coming out, that it won't be so bad and I'm sure the Oculus Rift will be awesome for additional reasons besides having the illusion of depth. Seems strange to drop 3D Vision just now though considering how long it would obviously take for such an expensive and inaccessible feature to become accepted by a wider audience.

Posted 08/02/2014 10:14 PM   
  10 / 14    
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