1080p Oculus Rift
  3 / 10    
Forgive this completely useless comment but doesn't the thought of sitting in and looking around the cockpit of a spaceship or racecar with the OR excite you? Sitting in a 'fixed' cockpit, where forward is always forward, with the world moving around your bubble is the thrill of VR for me. I think OR will easily nail that experience and you can't do that with triple monitors and 3D vision. Also looking around the world, with greater FoV in 3rd person wargames might be compelling too. However, FPSs in the OR hold no interest for me. I can look at what my gun looks at already and the outside world blurs once I am in the zone. My 2 pence.
Forgive this completely useless comment but doesn't the thought of sitting in and looking around the cockpit of a spaceship or racecar with the OR excite you? Sitting in a 'fixed' cockpit, where forward is always forward, with the world moving around your bubble is the thrill of VR for me. I think OR will easily nail that experience and you can't do that with triple monitors and 3D vision. Also looking around the world, with greater FoV in 3rd person wargames might be compelling too.


However, FPSs in the OR hold no interest for me. I can look at what my gun looks at already and the outside world blurs once I am in the zone.

My 2 pence.

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#31
Posted 06/12/2013 03:35 PM   
They've not 100% confirmed the final price yet, however they have said with the drops in the costs of components, they could likely offer the 1080p consumer version for the same price as the current dev kit ($300). They also recently said 1080p was the /minimum/ resolution they'll launch with for the consumer version, which either implies they're now considering a range of different options, or they're considering a higher resolution in general. Or they may just stick with 1080p for v1.
They've not 100% confirmed the final price yet, however they have said with the drops in the costs of components, they could likely offer the 1080p consumer version for the same price as the current dev kit ($300). They also recently said 1080p was the /minimum/ resolution they'll launch with for the consumer version, which either implies they're now considering a range of different options, or they're considering a higher resolution in general. Or they may just stick with 1080p for v1.

#32
Posted 06/12/2013 04:05 PM   
first hands on with the 1080p version: "After trying out the new headset, the visual improvements are immediately noticeable. The "screen door" effect so noticeable in the current 720p development kit is significantly reduced, and the lighting effects on display in the Unreal Engine 4 engine look fantastic." "Unfortunately, there's still no word on when that consumer headset is going to ship. But after experiencing the drastic difference that comes with a higher resolution panel, the promise of effective VR gaming is really starting to feel like a reality." http://www.ign.com/articles/2013/06/11/hands-on-new-1080p-oculus-rift-with-unreal-engine-4 It looks like 1080p makes a lot of difference.
first hands on with the 1080p version:

"After trying out the new headset, the visual improvements are immediately noticeable. The "screen door" effect so noticeable in the current 720p development kit is significantly reduced, and the lighting effects on display in the Unreal Engine 4 engine look fantastic."

"Unfortunately, there's still no word on when that consumer headset is going to ship. But after experiencing the drastic difference that comes with a higher resolution panel, the promise of effective VR gaming is really starting to feel like a reality."

http://www.ign.com/articles/2013/06/11/hands-on-new-1080p-oculus-rift-with-unreal-engine-4

It looks like 1080p makes a lot of difference.

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#33
Posted 06/12/2013 04:18 PM   
I don't think its generated as much interest as we might like to think. We are the ones into something enough that we are sitting on a forum talking about it, the only exposure you have to other people on this topic ard the same types of people. If you went up to someone random on the street and asked them what they thought of the Oculus Rift, they wouldn't know what the hell you are talking about. I still think $300 is expensive. Not for what you get, but for the dive into the unknown. You don't put down $300 on something you just want to try out, in the same way that if you didn't know any better you might put down $100 for the Ouya, just because its next to nothing. At that price people are probably going to need to be pretty shit sure its something they will take an interest in. If it has a slow launch, its not going to go anywhere, because who is going to develop games for a system no one owns, and then, because the Rift has no games, no one will buy it.
I don't think its generated as much interest as we might like to think. We are the ones into something enough that we are sitting on a forum talking about it, the only exposure you have to other people on this topic ard the same types of people. If you went up to someone random on the street and asked them what they thought of the Oculus Rift, they wouldn't know what the hell you are talking about.

I still think $300 is expensive. Not for what you get, but for the dive into the unknown. You don't put down $300 on something you just want to try out, in the same way that if you didn't know any better you might put down $100 for the Ouya, just because its next to nothing. At that price people are probably going to need to be pretty shit sure its something they will take an interest in. If it has a slow launch, its not going to go anywhere, because who is going to develop games for a system no one owns, and then, because the Rift has no games, no one will buy it.

#34
Posted 06/12/2013 07:24 PM   
Of course it makes a difference, it is a huge upgrade from the current screen :-) i think the problem is, the current or is called a developer version. Really, what that means is it is BETA. it was never intended to be used for playing games. It was designed for devs to get a handle on VR and for enthusiasts to give it a try. The consumer model will be much better. It will be miles away from perfect, but will correct many of the problems of the beta version (as was always intended via feedback. I think we all have to remeber that this is a beta pre- launch. And for a beta product it has got mass attention and for me largly positive reviews with critisms that can mostly be fixed with the consumer model. For me the idea of bending down to look at the carpet ina. Game, or have the thrill of looking down to see a snake crawling past my legs to be trully awesome. Tue potential is limitless if implemented correctly. The only true concern is, can humans get used to the motion sickness apparant in vr. Everything else can be fixed via technology.
Of course it makes a difference, it is a huge upgrade from the current screen :-) i think the problem is, the current or is called a developer version. Really, what that means is it is BETA. it was never intended to be used for playing games. It was designed for devs to get a handle on VR and for enthusiasts to give it a try. The consumer model will be much better. It will be miles away from perfect, but will correct many of the problems of the beta version (as was always intended via feedback.

I think we all have to remeber that this is a beta pre- launch. And for a beta product it has got mass attention and for me largly positive reviews with critisms that can mostly be fixed with the consumer model.

For me the idea of bending down to look at the carpet ina. Game, or have the thrill of looking down to see a snake crawling past my legs to be trully awesome. Tue potential is limitless if implemented correctly. The only true concern is, can humans get used to the motion sickness apparant in vr. Everything else can be fixed via technology.

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#35
Posted 06/12/2013 07:28 PM   
[quote="andysonofbob"]However, FPSs in the OR hold no interest for me. I can look at what my gun looks at already and the outside world blurs once I am in the zone.[/quote]Imagine playing a shooter where you can look in one direction while shooting in another (eg. shoot your most immediate target while already hunting around for the next one). Personally, that idea appeals to me a lot. [quote="Cookybiscuit"]I don't think its generated as much interest as we might like to think. We are the ones into something enough that we are sitting on a forum talking about it, the only exposure you have to other people on this topic ard the same types of people. [/quote]That's not true in my case. I've only owned a 3d monitor (and been on this forum) for a few weeks. And the buzz I heard about the Oculus Rift before then was huge. Articles about it frequently appear in mainstream gaming websites, and comments on those articles are usually positive. Last month's Edge magazine (pretty prestigious as far as gaming magazines go) devoted their front cover to the Rift, and wrote a glowing article. Then there's the fact that the kickstarter raised 1000% of its target. If that's not public interest, I don't know what is. [quote="Cookybiscuit"]I still think $300 is expensive. Not for what you get, but for the dive into the unknown. You don't put down $300 on something you just want to try out[/quote] Yes you do. People pay $2000 to go on short holidays to exotic countries they know nothing about. People pay $400 to try skydiving for the first time. A hell of a lot of people paid $300 for the Nintendo Wii without knowing exactly what to expect.
andysonofbob said:However, FPSs in the OR hold no interest for me. I can look at what my gun looks at already and the outside world blurs once I am in the zone.
Imagine playing a shooter where you can look in one direction while shooting in another (eg. shoot your most immediate target while already hunting around for the next one). Personally, that idea appeals to me a lot.

Cookybiscuit said:I don't think its generated as much interest as we might like to think. We are the ones into something enough that we are sitting on a forum talking about it, the only exposure you have to other people on this topic ard the same types of people.
That's not true in my case. I've only owned a 3d monitor (and been on this forum) for a few weeks. And the buzz I heard about the Oculus Rift before then was huge.

Articles about it frequently appear in mainstream gaming websites, and comments on those articles are usually positive. Last month's Edge magazine (pretty prestigious as far as gaming magazines go) devoted their front cover to the Rift, and wrote a glowing article. Then there's the fact that the kickstarter raised 1000% of its target. If that's not public interest, I don't know what is.


Cookybiscuit said:I still think $300 is expensive. Not for what you get, but for the dive into the unknown. You don't put down $300 on something you just want to try out
Yes you do. People pay $2000 to go on short holidays to exotic countries they know nothing about. People pay $400 to try skydiving for the first time. A hell of a lot of people paid $300 for the Nintendo Wii without knowing exactly what to expect.

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#36
Posted 06/13/2013 12:23 AM   
All sorts of crap goes way over its target on Kickstarter, it doesn't mean anything. The Ouya for example, way over, now its fell off the face of the Earth and hasn't even came out yet. I'm not so sure about the Rift's success. I feel with the new consoles hitting devs will be tied up with that rather than the Rift. Honestly I hope it does really well, I want it to be good and have plenty of games support it, if that were to happen, I'd buy one in a heartbeat. If it were to spawn a new age of virtual reality orientated games, where no one wanted to play games as they are now, that would be great, but I think its a little far fetched. I really just don't see it taking off, people like their mouse+keyboard+monitor, once you disrupt that, then you're going to run into trouble. Someone made the point earlier about people not wanting to use 3D because of the glasses, this is that but 100x worse.
All sorts of crap goes way over its target on Kickstarter, it doesn't mean anything. The Ouya for example, way over, now its fell off the face of the Earth and hasn't even came out yet.

I'm not so sure about the Rift's success. I feel with the new consoles hitting devs will be tied up with that rather than the Rift. Honestly I hope it does really well, I want it to be good and have plenty of games support it, if that were to happen, I'd buy one in a heartbeat. If it were to spawn a new age of virtual reality orientated games, where no one wanted to play games as they are now, that would be great, but I think its a little far fetched. I really just don't see it taking off, people like their mouse+keyboard+monitor, once you disrupt that, then you're going to run into trouble. Someone made the point earlier about people not wanting to use 3D because of the glasses, this is that but 100x worse.

#37
Posted 06/13/2013 12:34 AM   
[quote="Cookybiscuit"]All sorts of crap goes way over its target on Kickstarter, it doesn't mean anything. The Ouya for example, way over, now its fell off the face of the Earth and hasn't even came out yet.[/quote] ... It's sitting on my entertainment center. :)
Cookybiscuit said:All sorts of crap goes way over its target on Kickstarter, it doesn't mean anything. The Ouya for example, way over, now its fell off the face of the Earth and hasn't even came out yet.
... It's sitting on my entertainment center. :)
#38
Posted 06/13/2013 12:54 AM   
[quote="Cookybiscuit"]people like their mouse+keyboard+monitor, once you disrupt that, then you're going to run into trouble. [/quote]Before people liked gaming with mice, they preferred to game with the keyboard. Before people liked gaming with keyboards, they preferred joysticks. Before people liked gaming on monitors, they preferred arcade machines. I take your point that perhaps some of us optimists are being a bit too unrealistic in our expectations. But I think the same could be said about your level of pessimism.
Cookybiscuit said:people like their mouse+keyboard+monitor, once you disrupt that, then you're going to run into trouble.
Before people liked gaming with mice, they preferred to game with the keyboard.
Before people liked gaming with keyboards, they preferred joysticks.
Before people liked gaming on monitors, they preferred arcade machines.

I take your point that perhaps some of us optimists are being a bit too unrealistic in our expectations. But I think the same could be said about your level of pessimism.

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#39
Posted 06/13/2013 01:17 AM   
I used to like playing hunt the wumpus with punched cards
I used to like playing hunt the wumpus with punched cards

#40
Posted 06/13/2013 01:33 AM   
[quote="Cookybiscuit"]All sorts of crap goes way over its target on Kickstarter, it doesn't mean anything. The Ouya for example, way over, now its fell off the face of the Earth and hasn't even came out yet.[/quote] Quote me now on this. Ouya has a system seller.[No I didn't buy one] Towerfall is the best "couch game" I've ever seen. Though it wouldnt surprise me if its one day on every platform[sides pc] Balance is a non-issue, levels/items/everything amazing. I doubt it will ever beat out Smash Bros. but I bet everyone will agree its more fun. [url]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q9K9ijBn2q4[/url] The person who designed it has to be a genius or OCD. [I checked if they had stocks, and they don't = ( ] Regardless, even as a person who has 0 interest in the Ouya I can tell its going to flourish or at least do well enough. I can understand the relunctance especially due to the kickstarter nature. Its such a weird crowd mentalitity that will one day just die when too many people get bad beats and all they have to show for it is a coffee cup/t-shirt. Anywho, Its a simple reason that not one person has thought of or at least that I know of... Newgrounds / Flash Highly experienced/ unpaid/ passionate designers building games that should be played on controller... On keyboard/mouse. No companies, no publishers, no overhead.
Cookybiscuit said:All sorts of crap goes way over its target on Kickstarter, it doesn't mean anything. The Ouya for example, way over, now its fell off the face of the Earth and hasn't even came out yet.

Quote me now on this.

Ouya has a system seller.[No I didn't buy one]
Towerfall is the best "couch game" I've ever seen. Though it wouldnt surprise me if its one day on every platform[sides pc]
Balance is a non-issue, levels/items/everything amazing. I doubt it will ever beat out Smash Bros. but I bet everyone will agree its more fun.
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The person who designed it has to be a genius or OCD. [I checked if they had stocks, and they don't = ( ]


Regardless, even as a person who has 0 interest in the Ouya I can tell its going to flourish or at least do well enough. I can understand the relunctance especially due to the kickstarter nature. Its such a weird crowd mentalitity that will one day just die when too many people get bad beats and all they have to show for it is a coffee cup/t-shirt. Anywho, Its a simple reason that not one person has thought of or at least that I know of...
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#41
Posted 06/13/2013 02:58 AM   
err...won't and cannot pour any more rain on the OR parade; I've never paid much attention to OR (VR - immersion has never been what I want from gaming in general and 3D gaming in specific), therefore isn't qualified to talk about its possible shortcomings as are bo3b and eqzitara. yet, just saw my name mentioned somehow??!! so I feel that I need to jump in and say that this 1080p discussion is completely different from the one I had with fellow 3D visioners here, as far as I conceive of the resolution issue. lastly, though my understanding of OR is very limited, I'd think that the construct of its resolution (gamer as part of the gameworld literally) might be very different from that of standard stereoscopic 3D (gamer as observer looking at a screen). therefore I find this bit very interesting: [quote="bo3b"]The resolution will still be sketchy on the consumer version, based on the math from that forum post I linked. Doing the same math for my projector, I get a view field of 47 degrees. And his angular pixel density measurement of 27. (assuming I didn't blow the math) I sit 10 feet from a 105" wide screen. This spot is what I would consider to be a bare minimum of resolution before it's noticeable and annoying. If I sit closer than this, it starts to break down. Even at 1080p, the Rift is going to have an angular pixel density of 21. Pretty far below what I would consider a bare minimum. The reason is because the Rift also stretches the pixels out for 90 degree FOV, double my 47 degrees. [/quote]
err...won't and cannot pour any more rain on the OR parade; I've never paid much attention to OR (VR - immersion has never been what I want from gaming in general and 3D gaming in specific), therefore isn't qualified to talk about its possible shortcomings as are bo3b and eqzitara.

yet, just saw my name mentioned somehow??!! so I feel that I need to jump in and say that this 1080p discussion is completely different from the one I had with fellow 3D visioners here, as far as I conceive of the resolution issue.

lastly, though my understanding of OR is very limited, I'd think that the construct of its resolution (gamer as part of the gameworld literally) might be very different from that of standard stereoscopic 3D (gamer as observer looking at a screen). therefore I find this bit very interesting:

bo3b said:The resolution will still be sketchy on the consumer version, based on the math from that forum post I linked. Doing the same math for my projector, I get a view field of 47 degrees. And his angular pixel density measurement of 27. (assuming I didn't blow the math) I sit 10 feet from a 105" wide screen.

This spot is what I would consider to be a bare minimum of resolution before it's noticeable and annoying. If I sit closer than this, it starts to break down.

Even at 1080p, the Rift is going to have an angular pixel density of 21. Pretty far below what I would consider a bare minimum.

The reason is because the Rift also stretches the pixels out for 90 degree FOV, double my 47 degrees.


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#42
Posted 06/13/2013 10:10 AM   
[quote="andysonofbob"]Forgive this completely useless comment but doesn't the thought of sitting in and looking around the cockpit of a spaceship or racecar with the OR excite you? Sitting in a 'fixed' cockpit, where forward is always forward, with the world moving around your bubble is the thrill of VR for me. I think OR will easily nail that experience and you can't do that with triple monitors and 3D vision.[/quote]There is a demo available right now called First Law that allows you to fly an X-Wing type space fighter, and it's exactly that. Fighting in an asteroid field. Scary good on how impressive it is to turn your head and see your wings and fuselage. It's easily the most impressive demo I've run. (Bizarrely small skydome, so small you can see the curvature of the bowl. Must be some Unity glitch) [quote="Cookybiscuit"]I don't think its generated as much interest as we might like to think. We are the ones into something enough that we are sitting on a forum talking about it, the only exposure you have to other people on this topic ard the same types of people. If you went up to someone random on the street and asked them what they thought of the Oculus Rift, they wouldn't know what the hell you are talking about.[/quote]This is exactly right. We suffer heavily from Confirmation Bias. (An actual psychology term, that GTA spoofed by having you see the car you are driving show up a lot more often.) Worth a read: [url]http://youarenotsosmart.com/2010/06/23/confirmation-bias/[/url] I have some professional software pals, deeply into software and technology, that meet for dinners. Of 12 people there, only 1 had heard of Rift. Even the hard core Steam gamer hadn't heard of it.
andysonofbob said:Forgive this completely useless comment but doesn't the thought of sitting in and looking around the cockpit of a spaceship or racecar with the OR excite you? Sitting in a 'fixed' cockpit, where forward is always forward, with the world moving around your bubble is the thrill of VR for me. I think OR will easily nail that experience and you can't do that with triple monitors and 3D vision.
There is a demo available right now called First Law that allows you to fly an X-Wing type space fighter, and it's exactly that. Fighting in an asteroid field. Scary good on how impressive it is to turn your head and see your wings and fuselage. It's easily the most impressive demo I've run. (Bizarrely small skydome, so small you can see the curvature of the bowl. Must be some Unity glitch)

Cookybiscuit said:I don't think its generated as much interest as we might like to think. We are the ones into something enough that we are sitting on a forum talking about it, the only exposure you have to other people on this topic ard the same types of people. If you went up to someone random on the street and asked them what they thought of the Oculus Rift, they wouldn't know what the hell you are talking about.
This is exactly right. We suffer heavily from Confirmation Bias. (An actual psychology term, that GTA spoofed by having you see the car you are driving show up a lot more often.)

Worth a read:
http://youarenotsosmart.com/2010/06/23/confirmation-bias/

I have some professional software pals, deeply into software and technology, that meet for dinners. Of 12 people there, only 1 had heard of Rift. Even the hard core Steam gamer hadn't heard of it.

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#43
Posted 06/13/2013 10:07 AM   
[quote="teardropmina"]yet, just saw my name mentioned somehow??!! so I feel that I need to jump in and say that this 1080p discussion is completely different from the one I had with fellow 3D visioners here, as far as I conceive of the resolution issue.[/quote] It was me that mentioned you in regard to your impressions of resolutions. I'm just going off of memory, but I remember you posting about being unimpressed with your friend's 720p projector in comparison to your 1080p monitors. Maybe I'm remembering the wrong user name, if so I'm sorry. Some people are more sensitive to resolution than others. While 1080p might be 10% better to me, it might be 50% better to you. Who knows? I'd like to hear you elaborate on this though: [quote="teardropmina"]this 1080p discussion is completely different from the one I had with fellow 3D visioners here, as far as I conceive of the resolution issue.[/quote] How is it different? How do you conceive of the resolution issue? I don't mean to challenge you, I'm genuinely curious and want to learn. My impression is that a 1080p Rift would be just good enough for me, but still lacking for a lot of people out there. Perhaps I'm curious what you expect out of 3D if not immersion, if that's your point.
teardropmina said:yet, just saw my name mentioned somehow??!! so I feel that I need to jump in and say that this 1080p discussion is completely different from the one I had with fellow 3D visioners here, as far as I conceive of the resolution issue.


It was me that mentioned you in regard to your impressions of resolutions. I'm just going off of memory, but I remember you posting about being unimpressed with your friend's 720p projector in comparison to your 1080p monitors. Maybe I'm remembering the wrong user name, if so I'm sorry.

Some people are more sensitive to resolution than others. While 1080p might be 10% better to me, it might be 50% better to you. Who knows? I'd like to hear you elaborate on this though:

teardropmina said:this 1080p discussion is completely different from the one I had with fellow 3D visioners here, as far as I conceive of the resolution issue.


How is it different? How do you conceive of the resolution issue? I don't mean to challenge you, I'm genuinely curious and want to learn. My impression is that a 1080p Rift would be just good enough for me, but still lacking for a lot of people out there.

Perhaps I'm curious what you expect out of 3D if not immersion, if that's your point.

#44
Posted 06/13/2013 12:07 PM   
[quote="Airion"] It was me that mentioned you in regard to your impressions of resolutions. I'm just going off of memory, but I remember you posting about being unimpressed with your friend's 720p projector in comparison to your 1080p monitors. Maybe I'm remembering the wrong user name, if so I'm sorry. Some people are more sensitive to resolution than others. While 1080p might be 10% better to me, it might be 50% better to you. Who knows? I'd like to hear you elaborate on this though:[/quote] that was me; however, to me, 1080p vs. 720p OR discussion here and the 1080p discussion back when are quite different. a simple indicator: some 720 dlp users are actually skeptical of 1080p OR. furthermore, I did have experience with both 720p DLP and 1080p (and I mostly refer to 6100x1080 instead of 1920x1080), yet I haven't tried OR "beta," and so there's no way for me to know how it looks @720p and guess how it'll look @1080p. no one in this thread has ever experienced 1080p OR, there's only guess; few had actual experience with the 720p beta. that is, the current OR discussion is more of a "guessing" game but the resolution discussion back then was mostly based on our actual experiences. these two are totally different for me. [quote="Airion"] How is it different? How do you conceive of the resolution issue? I don't mean to challenge you, I'm genuinely curious and want to learn. My impression is that a 1080p Rift would be just good enough for me, but still lacking for a lot of people out there. Perhaps I'm curious what you expect out of 3D if not immersion, if that's your point.[/quote] what I meant was that regardless of display methods, when playing 3D vision games, we keep a distinct distance from the screen (even huge DLP screen doesn't wrap around us, the screen plane is always "flat"). OR or the idea of VR is that the gameworld would be "wrapped around" us. the resolution (I "guess") needs to be constructed (or calculated) in a different way from that of 3D vision. as for what I want out of 3D gaming? I play games for aesthetic pleasure (the artistic presentation of gameworld and characters) and gameplay; 3D Surround just provides me with the highest degree of aesthetic pleasure so far.
Airion said:

It was me that mentioned you in regard to your impressions of resolutions. I'm just going off of memory, but I remember you posting about being unimpressed with your friend's 720p projector in comparison to your 1080p monitors. Maybe I'm remembering the wrong user name, if so I'm sorry.

Some people are more sensitive to resolution than others. While 1080p might be 10% better to me, it might be 50% better to you. Who knows? I'd like to hear you elaborate on this though:


that was me; however, to me, 1080p vs. 720p OR discussion here and the 1080p discussion back when are quite different. a simple indicator: some 720 dlp users are actually skeptical of 1080p OR.

furthermore, I did have experience with both 720p DLP and 1080p (and I mostly refer to 6100x1080 instead of 1920x1080), yet I haven't tried OR "beta," and so there's no way for me to know how it looks @720p and guess how it'll look @1080p.
no one in this thread has ever experienced 1080p OR, there's only guess; few had actual experience with the 720p beta. that is, the current OR discussion is more of a "guessing" game but the resolution discussion back then was mostly based on our actual experiences. these two are totally different for me.



Airion said:
How is it different? How do you conceive of the resolution issue? I don't mean to challenge you, I'm genuinely curious and want to learn. My impression is that a 1080p Rift would be just good enough for me, but still lacking for a lot of people out there.

Perhaps I'm curious what you expect out of 3D if not immersion, if that's your point.


what I meant was that regardless of display methods, when playing 3D vision games, we keep a distinct distance from the screen (even huge DLP screen doesn't wrap around us, the screen plane is always "flat"). OR or the idea of VR is that the gameworld would be "wrapped around" us. the resolution (I "guess") needs to be constructed (or calculated) in a different way from that of 3D vision.

as for what I want out of 3D gaming? I play games for aesthetic pleasure (the artistic presentation of gameworld and characters) and gameplay; 3D Surround just provides me with the highest degree of aesthetic pleasure so far.

epenny size =/= nerdiness

#45
Posted 06/13/2013 12:47 PM   
  3 / 10    
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