What is this, and fixable?
Playing The Secret World right now, and having these issues in game, happens in a couple others too. [url]http://photos.3dvisionlive.com/xDefianTx/[/url] They are in the TSW folder there. Can anyone tell me what I'm experiencing so I can figure out what I need to figure out? Thanks Acer GD235hz monitor 3d vision 2 gtx 670 win7x64
Playing The Secret World right now, and having these issues in game, happens in a couple others too.

http://photos.3dvisionlive.com/xDefianTx/

They are in the TSW folder there.

Can anyone tell me what I'm experiencing so I can figure out what I need to figure out? Thanks

Acer GD235hz monitor
3d vision 2
gtx 670
win7x64

#1
Posted 01/02/2013 04:28 AM   
Try playing under a different DirectX version? I haven't played this game in quite some time so I'm not sure what updates have gone in and what works/breaks under 3D these days. You may have to turn the shadows off completely.
Try playing under a different DirectX version? I haven't played this game in quite some time so I'm not sure what updates have gone in and what works/breaks under 3D these days. You may have to turn the shadows off completely.

The very powerful and the very stupid have one thing in common. Instead of altering their views to fit the facts, they alter the facts to fit their views ... which can be very uncomfortable if you happen to be one of the facts that needs altering.

-- Doctor Who, "Face of Evil"

#2
Posted 01/03/2013 03:30 AM   
I will try both of those and see if that works any better. It is not just in this game tho, I put some new pics up of Chivalry, you can see some of it in the menu. You do see what I am talking about tho right? Or do I need to take a pic of it thru the glasses? And in some areas if I close my one eye, the other screen isn't even properly placed on screen, like I can see menu option Return in the top right in one eye, then with other closed, I can only see "Re" like the other image is being pushed off screen. Hopefully this makes sense, please if not let me know and I'll try to explain better
I will try both of those and see if that works any better. It is not just in this game tho, I put some new pics up of Chivalry, you can see some of it in the menu.
You do see what I am talking about tho right? Or do I need to take a pic of it thru the glasses?
And in some areas if I close my one eye, the other screen isn't even properly placed on screen, like I can see menu option Return in the top right in one eye, then with other closed, I can only see "Re" like the other image is being pushed off screen.
Hopefully this makes sense, please if not let me know and I'll try to explain better

#3
Posted 01/03/2013 03:54 AM   
Well I've tried it in dx 9 and still the same problem happens. Same with shadows, in chivalry if I try to turn them off, it makes dbl vision all over the place much worse. So is this a bad user setting somewhere by me, or is something defective? Not much time left for a return either.
Well I've tried it in dx 9 and still the same problem happens. Same with shadows, in chivalry if I try to turn them off, it makes dbl vision all over the place much worse.
So is this a bad user setting somewhere by me, or is something defective? Not much time left for a return either.

#4
Posted 01/04/2013 08:16 AM   
If I understand your problem correctly, this is not a user setting exactly, it's a bug in the game. 3D vision games tend to have a lot of these sorts of glitches. NVidia only rates this game as "good", 3 out of 5 stars, because "some objects render at wrong depth. Some effects render incorrectly." Overall, that game looks pretty great. For this specific image: [url]http://photos.3dvisionlive.com/xDefianTx/image/50e3b402a3e067351e00000a/[/url] If we are talking about that blue tag/banner on the left edge, then that's a game glitch. This is something called Frustrum, and it is adjustable sometimes. Go to the NVidia control panel, in the Set up stereoscopic section. Choose Set Keyboard Shortcuts. Show Advanced Settings. Enable the check box for Advanced In game Settings. Remember the key of Ctrl-F11 as the Frustrum adjustment. Run the game, and use Ctrl-F11, and see if it fixes that glitch. (Frustum aligns the edges of the screens to handle stereoscopic. Too complicated to describe here, but it can make the screen edges match for both eyes.)
If I understand your problem correctly, this is not a user setting exactly, it's a bug in the game.

3D vision games tend to have a lot of these sorts of glitches. NVidia only rates this game as "good", 3 out of 5 stars, because "some objects render at wrong depth. Some effects render incorrectly."

Overall, that game looks pretty great.


For this specific image:
http://photos.3dvisionlive.com/xDefianTx/image/50e3b402a3e067351e00000a/

If we are talking about that blue tag/banner on the left edge, then that's a game glitch.

This is something called Frustrum, and it is adjustable sometimes. Go to the NVidia control panel, in the Set up stereoscopic section. Choose Set Keyboard Shortcuts. Show Advanced Settings. Enable the check box for Advanced In game Settings.

Remember the key of Ctrl-F11 as the Frustrum adjustment.

Run the game, and use Ctrl-F11, and see if it fixes that glitch.

(Frustum aligns the edges of the screens to handle stereoscopic. Too complicated to describe here, but it can make the screen edges match for both eyes.)

Acer H5360 (1280x720@120Hz) - ASUS VG248QE with GSync mod - 3D Vision 1&2 - Driver 372.54
GTX 970 - i5-4670K@4.2GHz - 12GB RAM - Win7x64+evilKB2670838 - 4 Disk X25 RAID
SAGER NP9870-S - GTX 980 - i7-6700K - Win10 Pro 1607
Latest 3Dmigoto Release
Bo3b's School for ShaderHackers

#5
Posted 01/04/2013 10:49 AM   
Thanks for the reply! Glad to hear its not my hardware, I've been playing Trine 1/2 and everything seems to work ok in there. Yes on that picture, that is one of the problems, and adjusting frustrum doesn't help unfortunately. What about wwhen I use my onscreen laser sight, should I have two separated images of that in 3d, or do i adjust convergence/depth to have that line up as well? I noticed when I get it lined up some of the problems go away, but it puts a hurtin on my eyes. I've also read about helix mods -- Is this what helix is for with shader editing? If so I read it has to be DX9. If I am using a dx11 game, what benefits do I lose from going to dx9? Also do you have a game that you could suggest that runs perfect for you, and I can try that out and see how it looks for me as well? Sorry for many more questions, not many people responding so I have tons of em! Thanks again and any replies help.
Thanks for the reply!

Glad to hear its not my hardware, I've been playing Trine 1/2 and everything seems to work ok in there.

Yes on that picture, that is one of the problems, and adjusting frustrum doesn't help unfortunately.

What about wwhen I use my onscreen laser sight, should I have two separated images of that in 3d, or do i adjust convergence/depth to have that line up as well? I noticed when I get it lined up some of the problems go away, but it puts a hurtin on my eyes.

I've also read about helix mods -- Is this what helix is for with shader editing? If so I read it has to be DX9. If I am using a dx11 game, what benefits do I lose from going to dx9?

Also do you have a game that you could suggest that runs perfect for you, and I can try that out and see how it looks for me as well?

Sorry for many more questions, not many people responding so I have tons of em!

Thanks again and any replies help.

#6
Posted 01/04/2013 06:04 PM   
Well, for good quality games you can use Nvidia's list of 3D Vision Ready games at: [url]http://www.nvidia.com/object/3d-vision-games.html[/url] Their other ratings seem to be getting worse (less accurate) over time, not sure why. Seems like the wheels are falling off the NVidia bus. You can also look at the list of Helix modded games here, if you are willing to install the helix modification dll: [url]http://helixmod.wikispot.org/gamelist[/url] The helix mods are for fixing busted shaders, exactly like the ones you've seen. It's basically the developers being too lazy too even test their app once in stereoscopic, and see that they have bugs. It does have to be DX9 presently. The visual difference to me between DX9 and DX11 on actual games has been non-existent, so I don't mind playing in DX9. Stereoscopic easily trumps any of the advances for DX11 like tesselation and depth of field. Some comparisons: [url]http://www.overclock.net/t/597046/dx11-vs-dx10-vs-dx-9-pics[/url] DX11 makes for much more detailed pictures here, and it makes the devs job easier. It's just not been used much in real games, even 2 years later. It takes a long time for people to upgrade to capable cards, and the devs don't have much incentive. Different people have different tastes in games, so it's hard to make a recommendation outside of what works well in 3D. I play GTA4 in 3D for example, but I have to turn off the shadows. It's enough fun that I don't mind. For specific games I've played where 3D really enhanced the game- Metro 2033, Defense Grid, Deus Ex, Dead Space with Helix. These aren't all flawless, but I really like the stereoscopic. For the laser sight, I'm not sure what you mean. The in-game sight, or the one provided by NVidia driver? For the one provided by NVidia, you should never see doubling when using it, that's the whole point. It changes the depth of the reticule to match the depth of where you are aiming. In game versions tend to be broken for the same reason above- devs typically never bother to even test it. If you can turn off the in-game version, and enable the Nvidia version, you generally have better results. Some of the Helix modded games actually fix the sights to work properly. The stereoscopic world is pretty complicated. I understand when the haters get all incensed about it as a "fad" and "never any good." In my judgment, they've just never seen it run correctly on good quality hardware. When it's right, it is truly amazing. But... It's challenging to get it right, no doubt.
Well, for good quality games you can use Nvidia's list of 3D Vision Ready games at:

http://www.nvidia.com/object/3d-vision-games.html

Their other ratings seem to be getting worse (less accurate) over time, not sure why. Seems like the wheels are falling off the NVidia bus.

You can also look at the list of Helix modded games here, if you are willing to install the helix modification dll:

http://helixmod.wikispot.org/gamelist

The helix mods are for fixing busted shaders, exactly like the ones you've seen. It's basically the developers being too lazy too even test their app once in stereoscopic, and see that they have bugs.

It does have to be DX9 presently. The visual difference to me between DX9 and DX11 on actual games has been non-existent, so I don't mind playing in DX9. Stereoscopic easily trumps any of the advances for DX11 like tesselation and depth of field.

Some comparisons:

http://www.overclock.net/t/597046/dx11-vs-dx10-vs-dx-9-pics

DX11 makes for much more detailed pictures here, and it makes the devs job easier. It's just not been used much in real games, even 2 years later. It takes a long time for people to upgrade to capable cards, and the devs don't have much incentive.


Different people have different tastes in games, so it's hard to make a recommendation outside of what works well in 3D. I play GTA4 in 3D for example, but I have to turn off the shadows. It's enough fun that I don't mind.

For specific games I've played where 3D really enhanced the game- Metro 2033, Defense Grid, Deus Ex, Dead Space with Helix. These aren't all flawless, but I really like the stereoscopic.


For the laser sight, I'm not sure what you mean. The in-game sight, or the one provided by NVidia driver?

For the one provided by NVidia, you should never see doubling when using it, that's the whole point. It changes the depth of the reticule to match the depth of where you are aiming.

In game versions tend to be broken for the same reason above- devs typically never bother to even test it. If you can turn off the in-game version, and enable the Nvidia version, you generally have better results. Some of the Helix modded games actually fix the sights to work properly.


The stereoscopic world is pretty complicated. I understand when the haters get all incensed about it as a "fad" and "never any good." In my judgment, they've just never seen it run correctly on good quality hardware. When it's right, it is truly amazing. But... It's challenging to get it right, no doubt.

Acer H5360 (1280x720@120Hz) - ASUS VG248QE with GSync mod - 3D Vision 1&2 - Driver 372.54
GTX 970 - i5-4670K@4.2GHz - 12GB RAM - Win7x64+evilKB2670838 - 4 Disk X25 RAID
SAGER NP9870-S - GTX 980 - i7-6700K - Win10 Pro 1607
Latest 3Dmigoto Release
Bo3b's School for ShaderHackers

#7
Posted 01/04/2013 09:15 PM   
Laser Sight doesnt work in a few games. Dx9 vs dx 10 is generally very small as far as visuals. DX9/10 vs 11 [u]can be huge[/u] A game could be dx10/11 and use any of the additional visual features. Such as Call of duty / Sniper v2
Laser Sight doesnt work in a few games.

Dx9 vs dx 10 is generally very small as far as visuals.

DX9/10 vs 11 can be huge

A game could be dx10/11 and use any of the additional visual features. Such as Call of duty / Sniper v2

Co-founder of helixmod.blog.com

If you like one of my helixmod patches and want to donate. Can send to me through paypal - eqzitara@yahoo.com

#8
Posted 01/04/2013 10:27 PM   
I think I'll try some of your tested games, because on some the profile is Excellent but still having a few probs, so I would rather take your opinion. I don't quite know my 3d tastes yet, so more options to choose from will help me tune it where I need it. I see about the helix mods now, was unsure if thats what it was for or not, I might have to bite the bullet and go to DX 9 and edit some shaders. Although I am a graphic enthusiast and have a passion for the lil new techs like TSAA, it seems I will lose that with dx 9, and a bit of the lighting features? But like you said, 3d trumps that. I did mean the Nvidia laser sight, if I turn it on in some games I see it separated in game and have to mess with settings to get it lined up. Sometimes it like my eyes will cross to get it to focus, but I guess it doesn't work right in a few games so that may be it. I haven't tried that laser sight in FPS, just in MMO open worlds, so maybe that could be a cause? I agree from what I've seen, 3d really is amazing and like anything, it just takes a bit of fine tuning to get it where it needs to be. I will try a few other games and see how things go there
I think I'll try some of your tested games, because on some the profile is Excellent but still having a few probs, so I would rather take your opinion. I don't quite know my 3d tastes yet, so more options to choose from will help me tune it where I need it.

I see about the helix mods now, was unsure if thats what it was for or not, I might have to bite the bullet and go to DX 9 and edit some shaders. Although I am a graphic enthusiast and have a passion for the lil new techs like TSAA, it seems I will lose that with dx 9, and a bit of the lighting features? But like you said, 3d trumps that.

I did mean the Nvidia laser sight, if I turn it on in some games I see it separated in game and have to mess with settings to get it lined up. Sometimes it like my eyes will cross to get it to focus, but I guess it doesn't work right in a few games so that may be it. I haven't tried that laser sight in FPS, just in MMO open worlds, so maybe that could be a cause?

I agree from what I've seen, 3d really is amazing and like anything, it just takes a bit of fine tuning to get it where it needs to be.

I will try a few other games and see how things go there

#9
Posted 01/04/2013 10:54 PM   
Oh yeah, and in a couple games my cursor is doubled and my hit bot for selection is not where I point, is that because it doesn't have a 3d cursor? Like in a UDK game its like that. . < x <
Oh yeah, and in a couple games my cursor is doubled and my hit bot for selection is not where I point, is that because it doesn't have a 3d cursor? Like in a UDK game its like that.
. < x <

#10
Posted 01/04/2013 11:00 PM   
hit wrong button, but from txt above .< being the placement of the visual cursor with opposite eye closed and x being the actual hit target. So if I had my cursor lined up on the selection of a word, I would have to aim near the middle of the word for it to actually target the area. How can I get the cursor to line up? And this happens in a UDK game too, u can see it on my pics, the chivalry one, but with weapon icons selected.
hit wrong button, but from txt above
.< being the placement of the visual cursor with opposite eye closed
and x being the actual hit target. So if I had my cursor lined up on the selection of a word, I would have to aim near the middle of the word for it to actually target the area. How can I get the cursor to line up?
And this happens in a UDK game too, u can see it on my pics, the chivalry one, but with weapon icons selected.

#11
Posted 01/04/2013 11:03 PM   
[quote="xDefianTx"]And in some areas if I close my one eye, the other screen isn't even properly placed on screen, like I can see menu option Return in the top right in one eye, then with other closed, I can only see "Re" like the other image is being pushed off screen.[/quote] You mean in this image? http://photos.3dvisionlive.com/xDefianTx/image/50e4b1c4a3e0675436000008/ That's working as intended. The menu is, for whatever reason, pushed far away from you. A distant object near the side of the screen will show up for one eye but not another. That's the way it is in real life, too. If you look out the right edge of a window then your left can see a little further to the right than your right eye. Since this does happen all the time, your brain should take what your left eye sees and make it appear just as far off as the rest of the object. Or is that menu popping out of the screen at you? If that's happening then you have the right and left eyes swapped. The 2D sight problem is the same kind of thing. Look at something fairly far away that's small. Now put your finger a couple of feet in front of your face and try to cover the object. You can't! If you focus on your finger, there's two objects and if you focus on the object, you've got two fingers! (That's why people looking down the barrel of a gun like to shut one eye.) If the sight is 3D then it can go to the depth of the object, which works pretty well (though it can still get confusing if you've got things that are a lot closer on either side of the object). HeliX mods typically just push the sight out which works pretty well as long as the thing you are trying to shoot isn't right in front of you (and in that case, I would hope you could hit it with your eyes closed!). Another option is the "Dominant Eye" solution but, after years of begging, NVIDIA still hasn't made that available.
xDefianTx said:And in some areas if I close my one eye, the other screen isn't even properly placed on screen, like I can see menu option Return in the top right in one eye, then with other closed, I can only see "Re" like the other image is being pushed off screen.

You mean in this image? http://photos.3dvisionlive.com/xDefianTx/image/50e4b1c4a3e0675436000008/


That's working as intended. The menu is, for whatever reason, pushed far away from you. A distant object near the side of the screen will show up for one eye but not another. That's the way it is in real life, too. If you look out the right edge of a window then your left can see a little further to the right than your right eye. Since this does happen all the time, your brain should take what your left eye sees and make it appear just as far off as the rest of the object.

Or is that menu popping out of the screen at you? If that's happening then you have the right and left eyes swapped.

The 2D sight problem is the same kind of thing. Look at something fairly far away that's small. Now put your finger a couple of feet in front of your face and try to cover the object. You can't! If you focus on your finger, there's two objects and if you focus on the object, you've got two fingers! (That's why people looking down the barrel of a gun like to shut one eye.)

If the sight is 3D then it can go to the depth of the object, which works pretty well (though it can still get confusing if you've got things that are a lot closer on either side of the object). HeliX mods typically just push the sight out which works pretty well as long as the thing you are trying to shoot isn't right in front of you (and in that case, I would hope you could hit it with your eyes closed!). Another option is the "Dominant Eye" solution but, after years of begging, NVIDIA still hasn't made that available.

The very powerful and the very stupid have one thing in common. Instead of altering their views to fit the facts, they alter the facts to fit their views ... which can be very uncomfortable if you happen to be one of the facts that needs altering.

-- Doctor Who, "Face of Evil"

#12
Posted 01/05/2013 12:21 AM   
Yeah thats the image, sorry I didn't link :\ I get what your saying, makes sense, looking at the menu does seem far away. Is there anything I can do to help train my eyes for that, or should I close an eye when picking-- I usually have to anyways, or just randomly click in that area. The "Dominant eye" is with Tridef? Is that something I can use with 3d vision?
Yeah thats the image, sorry I didn't link :\
I get what your saying, makes sense, looking at the menu does seem far away. Is there anything I can do to help train my eyes for that, or should I close an eye when picking-- I usually have to anyways, or just randomly click in that area.

The "Dominant eye" is with Tridef? Is that something I can use with 3d vision?

#13
Posted 01/05/2013 02:20 AM   
I neglected to add the MTBS3D database, as a source of good reviews. These guys are more demanding and when they say it's good in stereo, it's good. [url]http://www.mtbs3d.com/gg3d/[/url] I've also had the NVidia ratings work properly, but only for 3D Vision Ready games. When it's 3D Vision Ready, I think you can trust it.
I neglected to add the MTBS3D database, as a source of good reviews. These guys are more demanding and when they say it's good in stereo, it's good.

http://www.mtbs3d.com/gg3d/


I've also had the NVidia ratings work properly, but only for 3D Vision Ready games. When it's 3D Vision Ready, I think you can trust it.

Acer H5360 (1280x720@120Hz) - ASUS VG248QE with GSync mod - 3D Vision 1&2 - Driver 372.54
GTX 970 - i5-4670K@4.2GHz - 12GB RAM - Win7x64+evilKB2670838 - 4 Disk X25 RAID
SAGER NP9870-S - GTX 980 - i7-6700K - Win10 Pro 1607
Latest 3Dmigoto Release
Bo3b's School for ShaderHackers

#14
Posted 01/05/2013 03:17 AM   
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