[quote name='Th2PranKzTa' post='963619' date='Dec 12 2009, 08:32 PM']3D stereo should work just fine[/quote]
"Some ghosting on high contrast or dark scenes". Nvidia support have strange conception of the word "fine". Crosseyed ghosting is the seriously ARTEFACT, and not talking about this when _used with certified by nvidia_ LCDs is misleading of consumers. Many people were strongly disappointed by this product.
[quote]but i do think its drivers[/quote]
Nvidia will not fix this, because it's a hardware problem (they have said this) and the situation is "fine".
[quote name='Th2PranKzTa' post='963619' date='Dec 12 2009, 08:32 PM']3D stereo should work just fine
"Some ghosting on high contrast or dark scenes". Nvidia support have strange conception of the word "fine". Crosseyed ghosting is the seriously ARTEFACT, and not talking about this when _used with certified by nvidia_ LCDs is misleading of consumers. Many people were strongly disappointed by this product.
but i do think its drivers
Nvidia will not fix this, because it's a hardware problem (they have said this) and the situation is "fine".
[quote name='Nekto2' post='963997' date='Dec 13 2009, 06:15 PM']"Some ghosting on high contrast or dark scenes". Nvidia support have strange conception of the word "fine". Crosseyed ghosting is the seriously ARTEFACT, and not talking about this when _used with certified by nvidia_ LCDs is misleading of consumers. Many people were strongly disappointed by this product.
Nvidia will not fix this, because it's a hardware problem (they have said this) and the situation is "fine".[/quote]
Since it is much worse on some than on others using the same driver and the fact that the Viewsonic seems not to be affected that bad this [i]clearly[/i] points towards an hardware issue with the Samsung monitor. I could well imagine that Samsung needed to tweak the driving circuitry to compensate panel tolerances and realize a generic 120Hz refresh time with good brightness, color gammut and contrast. The difference to a 120Hz TV set, where the higher refresh rate is used to display almost identical pictures with usually minimal variances in content on S3D displays every successive frame differs by the whole parallax. This is very demanding and flaws will be quickly revealed. This in mind it actually is Samsung, not nvidia that promised and did not deliver. The sad thing is that Samsung is not offering a platform like this to go out and rant, however nvidia does and it is with their product the problem becomes evident.
Now of course you could blame them for certifying a display that doesn't come up to the expectations and requirements. However, we all can understand the process of "certifying": test a product that ought to be representive for the whole production line and give it an approval. I personally tested the monitor occasionally and, allthough in a very bright environment could not notice considerable ghosting (and you can believe me that dealing with shutter glasses since the very first Metabytes / H3D I know what to look for). I strongly believe what nividia considers to be "fine" is not the problem some people have with the monitor but the remainig ghosting on one of the good monitors.
Anyway as it stands actual production quality strays too far from the required specs and the easiest thing for nvidia to do was to point fingers and officially withdraw the certification - I highly doubt that would help the product and market penetration of S3D in general.
So since they are not taking this route, what is nvidia about supposedly to do then? With Avatar about to launch and 3D BluRay around the corner I don't think they're eager to drop a ball that gives them one of the few advantages over the competition at the moment.
Also I think we can asume they have received the message in the meantime and as forwarded by one of the admins here they apparently commited to adress the issue in an upcomming driver. There is still a rough road until S3D will be plug and play but I rather would esteem it mor effective and diplomatic if everybody experiencing the problem stating it in a non-offensive way so nvidia realizes the existence of the issue (done) and then give them some time to react and come up with the next release that hopefully brings relief. I do not know wether this [i]will[/i] help to solve the problem, but I'm absolutele definitive it will more than telling one of the admins to [url="http://forums.nvidia.com/index.php?s=&showtopic=150018&view=findpost&p=964013"]STFU[/url].
[quote name='Nekto2' post='963997' date='Dec 13 2009, 06:15 PM']"Some ghosting on high contrast or dark scenes". Nvidia support have strange conception of the word "fine". Crosseyed ghosting is the seriously ARTEFACT, and not talking about this when _used with certified by nvidia_ LCDs is misleading of consumers. Many people were strongly disappointed by this product.
Nvidia will not fix this, because it's a hardware problem (they have said this) and the situation is "fine".
Since it is much worse on some than on others using the same driver and the fact that the Viewsonic seems not to be affected that bad this clearly points towards an hardware issue with the Samsung monitor. I could well imagine that Samsung needed to tweak the driving circuitry to compensate panel tolerances and realize a generic 120Hz refresh time with good brightness, color gammut and contrast. The difference to a 120Hz TV set, where the higher refresh rate is used to display almost identical pictures with usually minimal variances in content on S3D displays every successive frame differs by the whole parallax. This is very demanding and flaws will be quickly revealed. This in mind it actually is Samsung, not nvidia that promised and did not deliver. The sad thing is that Samsung is not offering a platform like this to go out and rant, however nvidia does and it is with their product the problem becomes evident.
Now of course you could blame them for certifying a display that doesn't come up to the expectations and requirements. However, we all can understand the process of "certifying": test a product that ought to be representive for the whole production line and give it an approval. I personally tested the monitor occasionally and, allthough in a very bright environment could not notice considerable ghosting (and you can believe me that dealing with shutter glasses since the very first Metabytes / H3D I know what to look for). I strongly believe what nividia considers to be "fine" is not the problem some people have with the monitor but the remainig ghosting on one of the good monitors.
Anyway as it stands actual production quality strays too far from the required specs and the easiest thing for nvidia to do was to point fingers and officially withdraw the certification - I highly doubt that would help the product and market penetration of S3D in general.
So since they are not taking this route, what is nvidia about supposedly to do then? With Avatar about to launch and 3D BluRay around the corner I don't think they're eager to drop a ball that gives them one of the few advantages over the competition at the moment.
Also I think we can asume they have received the message in the meantime and as forwarded by one of the admins here they apparently commited to adress the issue in an upcomming driver. There is still a rough road until S3D will be plug and play but I rather would esteem it mor effective and diplomatic if everybody experiencing the problem stating it in a non-offensive way so nvidia realizes the existence of the issue (done) and then give them some time to react and come up with the next release that hopefully brings relief. I do not know wether this will help to solve the problem, but I'm absolutele definitive it will more than telling one of the admins to STFU.
Just thought I'd add my experience here as a CRT user. What I don't get is ghosting that's specific to an area of the screen or a break down in the 3d effect in a particular region. Instead I get a fairly uniform ghosting (double imaging, stereoscopic crossfeed) anywhere there's a colour contrast, and specifically anywhere that isn't 'in focus' with the convergence setting. Basically if I close one eye there's always a double image of anything that's not at the convergence depth. It's a shame cause it means I can only use low depth.
I don't know if it's because the glasses don't go fully opaque, or CRT afterglow, or a sync problem, but I'd say 3D Vision probably isn't worth it with a CRT. I hope nVidia do give us some sync controls though since I'm sure they would help everyone.
As for the LCD problems you guys are having, I wonder if input lag (even though it's called input lag, it's really screen lag) is throwing out the sync. Anyone tested those Sammy and Viewsonic screens for input lag (vs a CRT) ?
Just thought I'd add my experience here as a CRT user. What I don't get is ghosting that's specific to an area of the screen or a break down in the 3d effect in a particular region. Instead I get a fairly uniform ghosting (double imaging, stereoscopic crossfeed) anywhere there's a colour contrast, and specifically anywhere that isn't 'in focus' with the convergence setting. Basically if I close one eye there's always a double image of anything that's not at the convergence depth. It's a shame cause it means I can only use low depth.
I don't know if it's because the glasses don't go fully opaque, or CRT afterglow, or a sync problem, but I'd say 3D Vision probably isn't worth it with a CRT. I hope nVidia do give us some sync controls though since I'm sure they would help everyone.
As for the LCD problems you guys are having, I wonder if input lag (even though it's called input lag, it's really screen lag) is throwing out the sync. Anyone tested those Sammy and Viewsonic screens for input lag (vs a CRT) ?
[quote name='quadrophoeniX' post='964144' date='Dec 14 2009, 12:57 AM']Since it is much worse on[...].[/quote]
Agreed on everything.
I Really hope someone to make a good polarized monitor so we can drop this technology and switch to polarized one, the same technology used in Imax theatres
There are already a couple of monitor with this technology, main problem is that the panel sucks, also this technology requires an amount of pixel doubled, instead of an higher refresh rate.
So basically a good polarized lcd should have at least a 3360*1050 resolution at 60hz to be qualitatively competitive to a Samsung/Viewsonic one..
And Obviously we should need also nvidia support to that technology, that is FAR BETTER than any other, also glasses costs 4 euros and can be viewed from more people at the same time.
The real solution to 3d is to DROP shutter glasses.
[quote name='quadrophoeniX' post='964144' date='Dec 14 2009, 12:57 AM']Since it is much worse on[...].
Agreed on everything.
I Really hope someone to make a good polarized monitor so we can drop this technology and switch to polarized one, the same technology used in Imax theatres
There are already a couple of monitor with this technology, main problem is that the panel sucks, also this technology requires an amount of pixel doubled, instead of an higher refresh rate.
So basically a good polarized lcd should have at least a 3360*1050 resolution at 60hz to be qualitatively competitive to a Samsung/Viewsonic one..
And Obviously we should need also nvidia support to that technology, that is FAR BETTER than any other, also glasses costs 4 euros and can be viewed from more people at the same time.
The real solution to 3d is to DROP shutter glasses.
[quote name='tigerman' post='968828' date='Dec 22 2009, 12:29 PM']Agreed on everything.
I Really hope someone to make a good polarized monitor [...] that is FAR BETTER than any other, also glasses costs 4 euros and can be viewed from more people at the same time.
The real solution to 3d is to DROP shutter glasses.[/quote]
Well with a couple of problems:
- as you mention, we need an awful high resolution to match up with full HD. The highest resolution available to customers are 2560x1600 @ 30" - the prices still hover close to 2000,- USD on standard monitors - hardly an option for the avarage user.
- There are solutions like the IZ3D panels that use standard TFT panel with 2 layers of polarized filters in front. They need careful trim of polarizers in glasses and display to avoid color mismatch/color ghosting, additionally they loose some brightness due to multiple layers of filters. Also even IZ3D the pioneer of this technology was not successful in putting the 26" announced a year ago to market.
- nvidia does not support this (yet).
- displays in use to manufacture standars LCD TV sets allready support 120Hz and above, all needed to make a 3D ready TV is a different circuitry to drive the panel and thus much easier and likely route for the manufacturers to choose - preannounced Sony Bravias e.g. use shutter technology.
on a side note, german computer magazine ct' had a test display setup at IFA where people were able to A/B test available technologies with surprisingly clear preference of all participants for the shutter technology (mind, with a Samsung 2233RZ !)
[quote name='tigerman' post='968828' date='Dec 22 2009, 12:29 PM']Agreed on everything.
I Really hope someone to make a good polarized monitor [...] that is FAR BETTER than any other, also glasses costs 4 euros and can be viewed from more people at the same time.
The real solution to 3d is to DROP shutter glasses.
Well with a couple of problems:
- as you mention, we need an awful high resolution to match up with full HD. The highest resolution available to customers are 2560x1600 @ 30" - the prices still hover close to 2000,- USD on standard monitors - hardly an option for the avarage user.
- There are solutions like the IZ3D panels that use standard TFT panel with 2 layers of polarized filters in front. They need careful trim of polarizers in glasses and display to avoid color mismatch/color ghosting, additionally they loose some brightness due to multiple layers of filters. Also even IZ3D the pioneer of this technology was not successful in putting the 26" announced a year ago to market.
- nvidia does not support this (yet).
- displays in use to manufacture standars LCD TV sets allready support 120Hz and above, all needed to make a 3D ready TV is a different circuitry to drive the panel and thus much easier and likely route for the manufacturers to choose - preannounced Sony Bravias e.g. use shutter technology.
on a side note, german computer magazine ct' had a test display setup at IFA where people were able to A/B test available technologies with surprisingly clear preference of all participants for the shutter technology (mind, with a Samsung 2233RZ !)
[quote name='quadrophoeniX' post='968973' date='Dec 22 2009, 09:45 AM']Well with a couple of problems:
- as you mention, we need an awful high resolution to match up with full HD. The highest resolution available to customers are 2560x1600 @ 30" - the prices still hover close to 2000,- USD on standard monitors - hardly an option for the avarage user.
- There are solutions like the IZ3D panels that use standard TFT panel with 2 layers of polarized filters in front. They need careful trim of polarizers in glasses and display to avoid color mismatch/color ghosting, additionally they loose some brightness due to multiple layers of filters. Also even IZ3D the pioneer of this technology was not successful in putting the 26" announced a year ago to market.
- nvidia does not support this (yet).
- displays in use to manufacture standars LCD TV sets allready support 120Hz and above, all needed to make a 3D ready TV is a different circuitry to drive the panel and thus much easier and likely route for the manufacturers to choose - preannounced Sony Bravias e.g. use shutter technology.
on a side note, german computer magazine ct' had a test display setup at IFA where people were able to A/B test available technologies with surprisingly clear preference of all participants for the shutter technology (mind, with a Samsung 2233RZ !)[/quote]
Shutter technology to me seems inherently inferior as it has to block significantly more light due to duty cycle timing and the fact that the temporal resolution is inherently inaccurate, which makes horizontal motion look bouncy or jittery. But perhaps home 3d approaches haven't quite caught up yet.
[quote name='quadrophoeniX' post='968973' date='Dec 22 2009, 09:45 AM']Well with a couple of problems:
- as you mention, we need an awful high resolution to match up with full HD. The highest resolution available to customers are 2560x1600 @ 30" - the prices still hover close to 2000,- USD on standard monitors - hardly an option for the avarage user.
- There are solutions like the IZ3D panels that use standard TFT panel with 2 layers of polarized filters in front. They need careful trim of polarizers in glasses and display to avoid color mismatch/color ghosting, additionally they loose some brightness due to multiple layers of filters. Also even IZ3D the pioneer of this technology was not successful in putting the 26" announced a year ago to market.
- nvidia does not support this (yet).
- displays in use to manufacture standars LCD TV sets allready support 120Hz and above, all needed to make a 3D ready TV is a different circuitry to drive the panel and thus much easier and likely route for the manufacturers to choose - preannounced Sony Bravias e.g. use shutter technology.
on a side note, german computer magazine ct' had a test display setup at IFA where people were able to A/B test available technologies with surprisingly clear preference of all participants for the shutter technology (mind, with a Samsung 2233RZ !)
Shutter technology to me seems inherently inferior as it has to block significantly more light due to duty cycle timing and the fact that the temporal resolution is inherently inaccurate, which makes horizontal motion look bouncy or jittery. But perhaps home 3d approaches haven't quite caught up yet.
I was under the impression that IMAX theaters used shutter glasses, not polarized...
With polarized monitors / glasses, the screen will appear to go very dark if you turn your heap to the side, since the polarization of the electromagnetic waves will not match the glasses, therefore no light will make it through (this is in theory, in practice, some would, but this wouldn't be a good thing...).
I like the idea of shutter glasses ALOT more than polarized ones. Keep in mind that shutter glasses allows about 50% of the light through to each eye. Polarized glasses do exactly the same thing, the monitor will show up just as bright as normal, and half the light goes to one eye, and the other half to the other.
Also remember that there are NO TIMING ISSUES with newer 3D LCD's (like on the new 3D ready notebook). The only problem is that the Samsung monitor doesn't perform well enough... I am almost certain that the new ACER LCD's that will be released in the next month or two will not have any ghosting issues like the Samsung does. I don't think we can blame NVIDIA for making this so bad, when they did nothing wrong, Samsung failed to produce a good enough quality monitor, and that is all. Soon enough with new monitors, we will have next to no ghosting, and all will be well.
I say we should just wait a little longer, and see how it goes.
Nick
P.S. My CRT has very little ghosting at all :) If you are unhappy with your 2233RZ, maybe you should replace it with a CRT for the time being :P
I was under the impression that IMAX theaters used shutter glasses, not polarized...
With polarized monitors / glasses, the screen will appear to go very dark if you turn your heap to the side, since the polarization of the electromagnetic waves will not match the glasses, therefore no light will make it through (this is in theory, in practice, some would, but this wouldn't be a good thing...).
I like the idea of shutter glasses ALOT more than polarized ones. Keep in mind that shutter glasses allows about 50% of the light through to each eye. Polarized glasses do exactly the same thing, the monitor will show up just as bright as normal, and half the light goes to one eye, and the other half to the other.
Also remember that there are NO TIMING ISSUES with newer 3D LCD's (like on the new 3D ready notebook). The only problem is that the Samsung monitor doesn't perform well enough... I am almost certain that the new ACER LCD's that will be released in the next month or two will not have any ghosting issues like the Samsung does. I don't think we can blame NVIDIA for making this so bad, when they did nothing wrong, Samsung failed to produce a good enough quality monitor, and that is all. Soon enough with new monitors, we will have next to no ghosting, and all will be well.
I say we should just wait a little longer, and see how it goes.
Nick
P.S. My CRT has very little ghosting at all :) If you are unhappy with your 2233RZ, maybe you should replace it with a CRT for the time being :P
Twitter: @Dr_Inkduff
<b>Processor:</b> Intel Core i7 920 D0 (4Ghz) <b>Motherboard:</b> ASUS P6T
[quote name='Dr Nick' post='969177' date='Dec 23 2009, 01:24 AM']With polarized monitors / glasses, the screen will appear to go very dark if you turn your heap to the side[/quote]
shouldn't be the case with circular polarisation....
[quote name='Dr Nick' post='969177' date='Dec 23 2009, 01:24 AM']With polarized monitors / glasses, the screen will appear to go very dark if you turn your heap to the side
shouldn't be the case with circular polarisation....
[quote name='Dr Nick' post='969177' date='Dec 22 2009, 04:24 PM']I was under the impression that IMAX theaters used shutter glasses, not polarized...
With polarized monitors / glasses, the screen will appear to go very dark if you turn your heap to the side, since the polarization of the electromagnetic waves will not match the glasses, therefore no light will make it through (this is in theory, in practice, some would, but this wouldn't be a good thing...).
I like the idea of shutter glasses ALOT more than polarized ones. Keep in mind that shutter glasses allows about 50% of the light through to each eye. Polarized glasses do exactly the same thing, the monitor will show up just as bright as normal, and half the light goes to one eye, and the other half to the other.
Also remember that there are NO TIMING ISSUES with newer 3D LCD's (like on the new 3D ready notebook). The only problem is that the Samsung monitor doesn't perform well enough... I am almost certain that the new ACER LCD's that will be released in the next month or two will not have any ghosting issues like the Samsung does. I don't think we can blame NVIDIA for making this so bad, when they did nothing wrong, Samsung failed to produce a good enough quality monitor, and that is all. Soon enough with new monitors, we will have next to no ghosting, and all will be well.
I say we should just wait a little longer, and see how it goes.
Nick
P.S. My CRT has very little ghosting at all :) If you are unhappy with your 2233RZ, maybe you should replace it with a CRT for the time being :P[/quote]
Shuttler glasses only allow 50% light through per eye theoretically ... in the real world, the screen itself takes some amount of that time to transition to the other eye's view, which means the shutters cannot be open during that time or else the wrong image will leak through. And of course the light blocked by the shutters is not perfect. Again, the duty cycle on the Samsung is about 25% light per eye and that's pretty bad.
The temporal inaccuracy per eye is a fundamental limitation and probably worse on a long term basis. The polarized approach is better here because the same scene can be shown at the same time per eye. Offsetting the second eye's image ahead by 1/120th of a second causes motion to appear jittery or bouncy. The only way a shutter approach can make this better is to increase the refresh rate even further ... perhaps 240 or 480 Hz. Which brings us back to the light per eye issue... In the meantime, it is very important to have a video card that can maintain the full frame rate so that motion jitters are minimized.
With all that said, I think if the ghosting issues of the Samsung are addressed in newer projector/monitor technologies, 3d vision as a whole becomes much more palatable. I would not be that tempted to upgrade my display again once I got a decent size screen with no ghosting up and running at 720p or 1680x1050.
[quote name='Dr Nick' post='969177' date='Dec 22 2009, 04:24 PM']I was under the impression that IMAX theaters used shutter glasses, not polarized...
With polarized monitors / glasses, the screen will appear to go very dark if you turn your heap to the side, since the polarization of the electromagnetic waves will not match the glasses, therefore no light will make it through (this is in theory, in practice, some would, but this wouldn't be a good thing...).
I like the idea of shutter glasses ALOT more than polarized ones. Keep in mind that shutter glasses allows about 50% of the light through to each eye. Polarized glasses do exactly the same thing, the monitor will show up just as bright as normal, and half the light goes to one eye, and the other half to the other.
Also remember that there are NO TIMING ISSUES with newer 3D LCD's (like on the new 3D ready notebook). The only problem is that the Samsung monitor doesn't perform well enough... I am almost certain that the new ACER LCD's that will be released in the next month or two will not have any ghosting issues like the Samsung does. I don't think we can blame NVIDIA for making this so bad, when they did nothing wrong, Samsung failed to produce a good enough quality monitor, and that is all. Soon enough with new monitors, we will have next to no ghosting, and all will be well.
I say we should just wait a little longer, and see how it goes.
Nick
P.S. My CRT has very little ghosting at all :) If you are unhappy with your 2233RZ, maybe you should replace it with a CRT for the time being :P
Shuttler glasses only allow 50% light through per eye theoretically ... in the real world, the screen itself takes some amount of that time to transition to the other eye's view, which means the shutters cannot be open during that time or else the wrong image will leak through. And of course the light blocked by the shutters is not perfect. Again, the duty cycle on the Samsung is about 25% light per eye and that's pretty bad.
The temporal inaccuracy per eye is a fundamental limitation and probably worse on a long term basis. The polarized approach is better here because the same scene can be shown at the same time per eye. Offsetting the second eye's image ahead by 1/120th of a second causes motion to appear jittery or bouncy. The only way a shutter approach can make this better is to increase the refresh rate even further ... perhaps 240 or 480 Hz. Which brings us back to the light per eye issue... In the meantime, it is very important to have a video card that can maintain the full frame rate so that motion jitters are minimized.
With all that said, I think if the ghosting issues of the Samsung are addressed in newer projector/monitor technologies, 3d vision as a whole becomes much more palatable. I would not be that tempted to upgrade my display again once I got a decent size screen with no ghosting up and running at 720p or 1680x1050.
Since the human eye cannot detect 120Hz, I don't see how motion can be made jittery because of this... Also, since normal displays only display at 60Hz, wouldn't this also be just as jittery (since S3D has 60Hz per eye)? It should be exactly the same.
I can certainly say more than 25% of light is making it through my glasses for my CRT, the image is not dark at all...
Just wait for the ACER monitors, I have a good feeling about them :P
Since the human eye cannot detect 120Hz, I don't see how motion can be made jittery because of this... Also, since normal displays only display at 60Hz, wouldn't this also be just as jittery (since S3D has 60Hz per eye)? It should be exactly the same.
I can certainly say more than 25% of light is making it through my glasses for my CRT, the image is not dark at all...
Just wait for the ACER monitors, I have a good feeling about them :P
Twitter: @Dr_Inkduff
<b>Processor:</b> Intel Core i7 920 D0 (4Ghz) <b>Motherboard:</b> ASUS P6T
[quote name='Dr Nick' post='969756' date='Dec 23 2009, 05:07 PM']Since the human eye cannot detect 120Hz, I don't see how motion can be made jittery because of this... Also, since normal displays only display at 60Hz, wouldn't this also be just as jittery (since S3D has 60Hz per eye)? It should be exactly the same.
I can certainly say more than 25% of light is making it through my glasses for my CRT, the image is not dark at all...
Just wait for the ACER monitors, I have a good feeling about them :P[/quote]
The human eye can easily see more than 120 hz ... Depends on the situation. Bright flashes, for example.
The stuttering in motion with shutter glasses is because you see the second eye of each frame ahead of the first eye. This is visually disorienting and incorrect. If you were to close one eye it wouldn't be a problem because it won't be out of sync with your other eye.
I took a high speed video of the glasses and am not wrong on the duty cycle. Please stick to speaking on topics you have actual knowledge of.
[quote name='Dr Nick' post='969756' date='Dec 23 2009, 05:07 PM']Since the human eye cannot detect 120Hz, I don't see how motion can be made jittery because of this... Also, since normal displays only display at 60Hz, wouldn't this also be just as jittery (since S3D has 60Hz per eye)? It should be exactly the same.
I can certainly say more than 25% of light is making it through my glasses for my CRT, the image is not dark at all...
Just wait for the ACER monitors, I have a good feeling about them :P
The human eye can easily see more than 120 hz ... Depends on the situation. Bright flashes, for example.
The stuttering in motion with shutter glasses is because you see the second eye of each frame ahead of the first eye. This is visually disorienting and incorrect. If you were to close one eye it wouldn't be a problem because it won't be out of sync with your other eye.
I took a high speed video of the glasses and am not wrong on the duty cycle. Please stick to speaking on topics you have actual knowledge of.
OK, well, i will just add that personally, i see no jittering whatsoever... I don't know if I'm doing something different, or my eyes are different or something, but I certainly have no problem with even 85Hz (except if the light is on in the room, i see flashing in my peripheral vision)
OK, well, i will just add that personally, i see no jittering whatsoever... I don't know if I'm doing something different, or my eyes are different or something, but I certainly have no problem with even 85Hz (except if the light is on in the room, i see flashing in my peripheral vision)
Nick
Twitter: @Dr_Inkduff
<b>Processor:</b> Intel Core i7 920 D0 (4Ghz) <b>Motherboard:</b> ASUS P6T
[quote name='Mouse1989' post='946498' date='Nov 6 2009, 10:59 AM']I am the same, albeit I do not like ghosting whatsoever, as mine is only the top 2/3 cm of the screen its hardly noticeable so I plan to keep my tech and see where it leads to with compatibility on other games and newer drivers (not that it will fix the ghosting) but see how it fares on games to come, most notably CoD MW2 :)
Although it should not have been released as stated above, I just got paid so £340 wasn't a huge hit, plus I ordered mine online and I don't want all that hassle of sending it back for 2/3cm[/quote]
Someone on Iracing pointed out this thread to me, so I am new and just joined .He was also stating that he had severe gocraping at the top of the monitor. I have 4 of the samsung sync monitors, one which is stand alone, and I use that one for 3d gaming. I have never once experience ANY such ghosting. None, zero, zilch. I bought the first one ( will have to look at the exact date) when they first came out, so I want to say march or may. I will check.
He reports ghosting in Iracing which is pretty much a "bright" sim. I did not set mine up, I have a guy who does it , so i will ask him about this issue, because I am unable to duplicate it on the single system
My system is an I7 920 ( no I don't over clock it) GTX 260 card . Windows Vista Ultimate 64. I run 12 g DDR 3 1600 Tripple channel ram .
I notice many list the Samsung sync monitor, but say Acer, or some other monitor , including CRT's and still have the same monitor. Most of you obviously know more than I do, but maybe being new at this thread, I noticed some things regarding the samsung monitor as being the cause , yet, you are posting the results being the same on different monitors. Could it be said then it is not the monitor? In iRacing, he expressed that he had the 80/20 ghosting going on . or should I say 20/80, the 20 being at the top? I have used the glasses on and off, mostly off, because i do get headaches from them sometimes, and i am absouletly stunned by the quality of the grpahics with the monitor along in iRacing . Simply amazing. As i said before, I have ZERO ghosting when I do use them , but sometimes the headaches. I have heard several people say that, and that right there says alot. My wife is a DR , and she used them a couple of times, and in time, she said "it caused her eyes to blur. " I am not a DR either, and I will have her post with her thoughts on that, but she had a perfectly reasonable and medically competent reason for it. I will ask her to explain it. i will stick with what I know. I know when I saw a 3g movie the other day, I had the same problem
It makes no sense to blame the monitor. Especially since the same thing is duplicated at lower refresh, and on Various and different monitors. By itself, these samsund monitors ROCK ! I average 400 FPS in Iracing, full field, everything on. In 3d, I take a slight hit, but still average 300-325. It's not the monitor.
The guy who set up the original with the 3d, it took him a while to get it right , with the glasses. It surprised me, as i thought it would be 1-2-3 go. It took him a couple of hours, but I have NEVER had a Ghosting issue. So replying to my fellow Iracer , he doesn't have something set right. I called my builder earlier, and he said it IS a setting issue, and or a driver issue. Being tomorrow is x-mas, I will try to get him to post exactly how he set mine up. I do know that on my own I downloaded the latest drivers for Nvidia ( I have a driver update program) and he told me to roll it back. So I am not sure which I am using so I will wait until I have ore time with him. I don't want to lead anyone into 5 hours of guessing, but he said there is a particular set of drivers to use with the 3d glasses.
He did say emphatically , it is NOT the monitor. The monitor itself in my opinion has totally changed gaming for me. It was exactly what every review said it was, even down to the one issue that said was horrible. Inserting the monitor into the base. I litterally had to use KY jelly to get it in ( no pun intended) . That was the only bad reported in every review I read before i bought the first one. The base is also a little shakey for me. other than that I am so thrilled, i bought 3 more.
So, I first wanted to post, as several people asked , NO I do not have the ghosting problem. From the photo's, i am not playing some of the same games as the photo's posted, but I can say 100 % , no ghosting in iRacing. Never once.
The fellow iRacer who said he was, I don't know, it looked like he had 3 g of some older ram etc etc, but in my experience, and after reading the entire thread, it has to be the settings, or the glasses themselves. or both.
One other thing I can do now there is an iRacing thread, is ask the developers to ask Nvidia. We have found it very interesting that Nividia has opened a Boston Lab right across the hall from Iracing Being that Dave Krammer and John Henry own iRacing, it's probably no coincedence . They are doing something together. good news for us i think.
I am sorry for the long thread, but having read all this one, and knowing the time that it took my computer guy to hook mine up, and he said it sounded like it was a configuration /driver issue, I thought i would post here. I would hate to see people go through the hassel of returning an incrediable monitor ( my opinion) or go buy another one or 2 because as my CPU guy said regarding my fellow iRacer " it is how he has it set up " , meaning the glasses and configuration. As someone expressed, and my wife has said, there is also a possible "medical" reason that people have problems with 3d. May be an issue for some, but I doubt this many people have it. But it may help some.
Until the fellow iRacing started this thread, I have never heard of this issue, and never experienced it myself. Still, as many have helped me over the years, if i can have someone who would know, share how mine was set up ( since it works 100 % excellent) I will pass it along. I wish I could use the 3d all the time in iRacing, but i just cant. At lap 150 at Richmond, a blinding headache spoils the fun. Using 3 of these samsung monitors for Iracing, all I can say is WOW !!!!!!!
This is a good site, and i learned some things , so thank you . My computer guy said he would look at the thread saturday, and hopefully he can post something that will help . Like I said, mine works perfrectly.
And for the record, I don't work for samsung or Nvidia, I am just another fellow gammer who also gets fustrated at issues like this. 5%-10% or 20 % as my iracing friend is experiencing , would drive me crazy too !
Merry Christmas .
So, whoever was writing the posts regarding the ability to adjust the timing on the glasses , is probably a lot closer to the anser than those blaming the monitor.
[quote name='Mouse1989' post='946498' date='Nov 6 2009, 10:59 AM']I am the same, albeit I do not like ghosting whatsoever, as mine is only the top 2/3 cm of the screen its hardly noticeable so I plan to keep my tech and see where it leads to with compatibility on other games and newer drivers (not that it will fix the ghosting) but see how it fares on games to come, most notably CoD MW2 :)
Although it should not have been released as stated above, I just got paid so £340 wasn't a huge hit, plus I ordered mine online and I don't want all that hassle of sending it back for 2/3cm
Someone on Iracing pointed out this thread to me, so I am new and just joined .He was also stating that he had severe gocraping at the top of the monitor. I have 4 of the samsung sync monitors, one which is stand alone, and I use that one for 3d gaming. I have never once experience ANY such ghosting. None, zero, zilch. I bought the first one ( will have to look at the exact date) when they first came out, so I want to say march or may. I will check.
He reports ghosting in Iracing which is pretty much a "bright" sim. I did not set mine up, I have a guy who does it , so i will ask him about this issue, because I am unable to duplicate it on the single system
My system is an I7 920 ( no I don't over clock it) GTX 260 card . Windows Vista Ultimate 64. I run 12 g DDR 3 1600 Tripple channel ram .
I notice many list the Samsung sync monitor, but say Acer, or some other monitor , including CRT's and still have the same monitor. Most of you obviously know more than I do, but maybe being new at this thread, I noticed some things regarding the samsung monitor as being the cause , yet, you are posting the results being the same on different monitors. Could it be said then it is not the monitor? In iRacing, he expressed that he had the 80/20 ghosting going on . or should I say 20/80, the 20 being at the top? I have used the glasses on and off, mostly off, because i do get headaches from them sometimes, and i am absouletly stunned by the quality of the grpahics with the monitor along in iRacing . Simply amazing. As i said before, I have ZERO ghosting when I do use them , but sometimes the headaches. I have heard several people say that, and that right there says alot. My wife is a DR , and she used them a couple of times, and in time, she said "it caused her eyes to blur. " I am not a DR either, and I will have her post with her thoughts on that, but she had a perfectly reasonable and medically competent reason for it. I will ask her to explain it. i will stick with what I know. I know when I saw a 3g movie the other day, I had the same problem
It makes no sense to blame the monitor. Especially since the same thing is duplicated at lower refresh, and on Various and different monitors. By itself, these samsund monitors ROCK ! I average 400 FPS in Iracing, full field, everything on. In 3d, I take a slight hit, but still average 300-325. It's not the monitor.
The guy who set up the original with the 3d, it took him a while to get it right , with the glasses. It surprised me, as i thought it would be 1-2-3 go. It took him a couple of hours, but I have NEVER had a Ghosting issue. So replying to my fellow Iracer , he doesn't have something set right. I called my builder earlier, and he said it IS a setting issue, and or a driver issue. Being tomorrow is x-mas, I will try to get him to post exactly how he set mine up. I do know that on my own I downloaded the latest drivers for Nvidia ( I have a driver update program) and he told me to roll it back. So I am not sure which I am using so I will wait until I have ore time with him. I don't want to lead anyone into 5 hours of guessing, but he said there is a particular set of drivers to use with the 3d glasses.
He did say emphatically , it is NOT the monitor. The monitor itself in my opinion has totally changed gaming for me. It was exactly what every review said it was, even down to the one issue that said was horrible. Inserting the monitor into the base. I litterally had to use KY jelly to get it in ( no pun intended) . That was the only bad reported in every review I read before i bought the first one. The base is also a little shakey for me. other than that I am so thrilled, i bought 3 more.
So, I first wanted to post, as several people asked , NO I do not have the ghosting problem. From the photo's, i am not playing some of the same games as the photo's posted, but I can say 100 % , no ghosting in iRacing. Never once.
The fellow iRacer who said he was, I don't know, it looked like he had 3 g of some older ram etc etc, but in my experience, and after reading the entire thread, it has to be the settings, or the glasses themselves. or both.
One other thing I can do now there is an iRacing thread, is ask the developers to ask Nvidia. We have found it very interesting that Nividia has opened a Boston Lab right across the hall from Iracing Being that Dave Krammer and John Henry own iRacing, it's probably no coincedence . They are doing something together. good news for us i think.
I am sorry for the long thread, but having read all this one, and knowing the time that it took my computer guy to hook mine up, and he said it sounded like it was a configuration /driver issue, I thought i would post here. I would hate to see people go through the hassel of returning an incrediable monitor ( my opinion) or go buy another one or 2 because as my CPU guy said regarding my fellow iRacer " it is how he has it set up " , meaning the glasses and configuration. As someone expressed, and my wife has said, there is also a possible "medical" reason that people have problems with 3d. May be an issue for some, but I doubt this many people have it. But it may help some.
Until the fellow iRacing started this thread, I have never heard of this issue, and never experienced it myself. Still, as many have helped me over the years, if i can have someone who would know, share how mine was set up ( since it works 100 % excellent) I will pass it along. I wish I could use the 3d all the time in iRacing, but i just cant. At lap 150 at Richmond, a blinding headache spoils the fun. Using 3 of these samsung monitors for Iracing, all I can say is WOW !!!!!!!
This is a good site, and i learned some things , so thank you . My computer guy said he would look at the thread saturday, and hopefully he can post something that will help . Like I said, mine works perfrectly.
And for the record, I don't work for samsung or Nvidia, I am just another fellow gammer who also gets fustrated at issues like this. 5%-10% or 20 % as my iracing friend is experiencing , would drive me crazy too !
Merry Christmas .
So, whoever was writing the posts regarding the ability to adjust the timing on the glasses , is probably a lot closer to the anser than those blaming the monitor.
i dl'd the newest nvidia gpu drivers
i dl'd the newest nvidia 3d vision drivers
i uninstalled my old gpu driver with driver sweeper
rebooted
installed newest gpu drivers
rebooted
installed newest 3d vision drivers
rebooted
went into my monitor settings and set it to 120hz
had 3d work in every game no problem on the compatibility list. not one problem everything went smooth as butter. i get no headaches, i get a great 3d effect, batman and assassins creed completely blow me away it looks so incredible.
i am taking a nice hit in performance when 3d is enabled. i only get a max of 60fps in iRacing and every other game i've tested. I have set the 3d to 120hz in the 3d control panel.
i'm thinking, you're getting headaches and getting very high fps, do me a favor and right click the desktop and go to the nvidia control panel/ stereoscopic 3d/ set up stereoscopic 3d/ test stereoscopic 3d and check the refresh rate. What is it set at?
also right click the desktop again click personalize/ display settings/ advanced settings/ monitor/ screen refresh rate- what is that set to?
i uninstalled my old gpu driver with driver sweeper
rebooted
installed newest gpu drivers
rebooted
installed newest 3d vision drivers
rebooted
went into my monitor settings and set it to 120hz
had 3d work in every game no problem on the compatibility list. not one problem everything went smooth as butter. i get no headaches, i get a great 3d effect, batman and assassins creed completely blow me away it looks so incredible.
i am taking a nice hit in performance when 3d is enabled. i only get a max of 60fps in iRacing and every other game i've tested. I have set the 3d to 120hz in the 3d control panel.
i'm thinking, you're getting headaches and getting very high fps, do me a favor and right click the desktop and go to the nvidia control panel/ stereoscopic 3d/ set up stereoscopic 3d/ test stereoscopic 3d and check the refresh rate. What is it set at?
also right click the desktop again click personalize/ display settings/ advanced settings/ monitor/ screen refresh rate- what is that set to?
[quote name='HolyGost' post='970345' date='Dec 25 2009, 01:34 AM']So, whoever was writing the posts regarding the ability to adjust the timing on the glasses , is probably a lot closer to the anser than those blaming the monitor.[/quote]
Well you're either A. simply wrong, or B. a very lucky individual. The cause of the ghosting has already been shown to be the time the monitor takes to scan from top to bottom combined with the glasses shutter timing. I posted high speed videos a while ago that demonstrated this. For that to not be your monitor it would need to mean that Samsung made some sort of invisible revision to this monitor and that you happened to get one.
The majority of new posters have no idea how to check these things or even what they are looking at, so you'll have to excuse the skepticism, but the burden of proof is you to show otherwise. Take a photo through your shutter glasses on a known high contrast/ghosting 3d screenshot and we'll believe you.
[quote name='HolyGost' post='970345' date='Dec 25 2009, 01:34 AM']So, whoever was writing the posts regarding the ability to adjust the timing on the glasses , is probably a lot closer to the anser than those blaming the monitor.
Well you're either A. simply wrong, or B. a very lucky individual. The cause of the ghosting has already been shown to be the time the monitor takes to scan from top to bottom combined with the glasses shutter timing. I posted high speed videos a while ago that demonstrated this. For that to not be your monitor it would need to mean that Samsung made some sort of invisible revision to this monitor and that you happened to get one.
The majority of new posters have no idea how to check these things or even what they are looking at, so you'll have to excuse the skepticism, but the burden of proof is you to show otherwise. Take a photo through your shutter glasses on a known high contrast/ghosting 3d screenshot and we'll believe you.
"Some ghosting on high contrast or dark scenes". Nvidia support have strange conception of the word "fine". Crosseyed ghosting is the seriously ARTEFACT, and not talking about this when _used with certified by nvidia_ LCDs is misleading of consumers. Many people were strongly disappointed by this product.
[quote]but i do think its drivers[/quote]
Nvidia will not fix this, because it's a hardware problem (they have said this) and the situation is "fine".
"Some ghosting on high contrast or dark scenes". Nvidia support have strange conception of the word "fine". Crosseyed ghosting is the seriously ARTEFACT, and not talking about this when _used with certified by nvidia_ LCDs is misleading of consumers. Many people were strongly disappointed by this product.
Nvidia will not fix this, because it's a hardware problem (they have said this) and the situation is "fine".
Nvidia will not fix this, because it's a hardware problem (they have said this) and the situation is "fine".[/quote]
Since it is much worse on some than on others using the same driver and the fact that the Viewsonic seems not to be affected that bad this [i]clearly[/i] points towards an hardware issue with the Samsung monitor. I could well imagine that Samsung needed to tweak the driving circuitry to compensate panel tolerances and realize a generic 120Hz refresh time with good brightness, color gammut and contrast. The difference to a 120Hz TV set, where the higher refresh rate is used to display almost identical pictures with usually minimal variances in content on S3D displays every successive frame differs by the whole parallax. This is very demanding and flaws will be quickly revealed. This in mind it actually is Samsung, not nvidia that promised and did not deliver. The sad thing is that Samsung is not offering a platform like this to go out and rant, however nvidia does and it is with their product the problem becomes evident.
Now of course you could blame them for certifying a display that doesn't come up to the expectations and requirements. However, we all can understand the process of "certifying": test a product that ought to be representive for the whole production line and give it an approval. I personally tested the monitor occasionally and, allthough in a very bright environment could not notice considerable ghosting (and you can believe me that dealing with shutter glasses since the very first Metabytes / H3D I know what to look for). I strongly believe what nividia considers to be "fine" is not the problem some people have with the monitor but the remainig ghosting on one of the good monitors.
Anyway as it stands actual production quality strays too far from the required specs and the easiest thing for nvidia to do was to point fingers and officially withdraw the certification - I highly doubt that would help the product and market penetration of S3D in general.
So since they are not taking this route, what is nvidia about supposedly to do then? With Avatar about to launch and 3D BluRay around the corner I don't think they're eager to drop a ball that gives them one of the few advantages over the competition at the moment.
Also I think we can asume they have received the message in the meantime and as forwarded by one of the admins here they apparently commited to adress the issue in an upcomming driver. There is still a rough road until S3D will be plug and play but I rather would esteem it mor effective and diplomatic if everybody experiencing the problem stating it in a non-offensive way so nvidia realizes the existence of the issue (done) and then give them some time to react and come up with the next release that hopefully brings relief. I do not know wether this [i]will[/i] help to solve the problem, but I'm absolutele definitive it will more than telling one of the admins to [url="http://forums.nvidia.com/index.php?s=&showtopic=150018&view=findpost&p=964013"]STFU[/url].
Nvidia will not fix this, because it's a hardware problem (they have said this) and the situation is "fine".
Since it is much worse on some than on others using the same driver and the fact that the Viewsonic seems not to be affected that bad this clearly points towards an hardware issue with the Samsung monitor. I could well imagine that Samsung needed to tweak the driving circuitry to compensate panel tolerances and realize a generic 120Hz refresh time with good brightness, color gammut and contrast. The difference to a 120Hz TV set, where the higher refresh rate is used to display almost identical pictures with usually minimal variances in content on S3D displays every successive frame differs by the whole parallax. This is very demanding and flaws will be quickly revealed. This in mind it actually is Samsung, not nvidia that promised and did not deliver. The sad thing is that Samsung is not offering a platform like this to go out and rant, however nvidia does and it is with their product the problem becomes evident.
Now of course you could blame them for certifying a display that doesn't come up to the expectations and requirements. However, we all can understand the process of "certifying": test a product that ought to be representive for the whole production line and give it an approval. I personally tested the monitor occasionally and, allthough in a very bright environment could not notice considerable ghosting (and you can believe me that dealing with shutter glasses since the very first Metabytes / H3D I know what to look for). I strongly believe what nividia considers to be "fine" is not the problem some people have with the monitor but the remainig ghosting on one of the good monitors.
Anyway as it stands actual production quality strays too far from the required specs and the easiest thing for nvidia to do was to point fingers and officially withdraw the certification - I highly doubt that would help the product and market penetration of S3D in general.
So since they are not taking this route, what is nvidia about supposedly to do then? With Avatar about to launch and 3D BluRay around the corner I don't think they're eager to drop a ball that gives them one of the few advantages over the competition at the moment.
Also I think we can asume they have received the message in the meantime and as forwarded by one of the admins here they apparently commited to adress the issue in an upcomming driver. There is still a rough road until S3D will be plug and play but I rather would esteem it mor effective and diplomatic if everybody experiencing the problem stating it in a non-offensive way so nvidia realizes the existence of the issue (done) and then give them some time to react and come up with the next release that hopefully brings relief. I do not know wether this will help to solve the problem, but I'm absolutele definitive it will more than telling one of the admins to STFU.
I don't know if it's because the glasses don't go fully opaque, or CRT afterglow, or a sync problem, but I'd say 3D Vision probably isn't worth it with a CRT. I hope nVidia do give us some sync controls though since I'm sure they would help everyone.
As for the LCD problems you guys are having, I wonder if input lag (even though it's called input lag, it's really screen lag) is throwing out the sync. Anyone tested those Sammy and Viewsonic screens for input lag (vs a CRT) ?
I don't know if it's because the glasses don't go fully opaque, or CRT afterglow, or a sync problem, but I'd say 3D Vision probably isn't worth it with a CRT. I hope nVidia do give us some sync controls though since I'm sure they would help everyone.
As for the LCD problems you guys are having, I wonder if input lag (even though it's called input lag, it's really screen lag) is throwing out the sync. Anyone tested those Sammy and Viewsonic screens for input lag (vs a CRT) ?
Agreed on everything.
I Really hope someone to make a good polarized monitor so we can drop this technology and switch to polarized one, the same technology used in Imax theatres
There are already a couple of monitor with this technology, main problem is that the panel sucks, also this technology requires an amount of pixel doubled, instead of an higher refresh rate.
So basically a good polarized lcd should have at least a 3360*1050 resolution at 60hz to be qualitatively competitive to a Samsung/Viewsonic one..
And Obviously we should need also nvidia support to that technology, that is FAR BETTER than any other, also glasses costs 4 euros and can be viewed from more people at the same time.
The real solution to 3d is to DROP shutter glasses.
Agreed on everything.
I Really hope someone to make a good polarized monitor so we can drop this technology and switch to polarized one, the same technology used in Imax theatres
There are already a couple of monitor with this technology, main problem is that the panel sucks, also this technology requires an amount of pixel doubled, instead of an higher refresh rate.
So basically a good polarized lcd should have at least a 3360*1050 resolution at 60hz to be qualitatively competitive to a Samsung/Viewsonic one..
And Obviously we should need also nvidia support to that technology, that is FAR BETTER than any other, also glasses costs 4 euros and can be viewed from more people at the same time.
The real solution to 3d is to DROP shutter glasses.
I Really hope someone to make a good polarized monitor [...] that is FAR BETTER than any other, also glasses costs 4 euros and can be viewed from more people at the same time.
The real solution to 3d is to DROP shutter glasses.[/quote]
Well with a couple of problems:
- as you mention, we need an awful high resolution to match up with full HD. The highest resolution available to customers are 2560x1600 @ 30" - the prices still hover close to 2000,- USD on standard monitors - hardly an option for the avarage user.
- There are solutions like the IZ3D panels that use standard TFT panel with 2 layers of polarized filters in front. They need careful trim of polarizers in glasses and display to avoid color mismatch/color ghosting, additionally they loose some brightness due to multiple layers of filters. Also even IZ3D the pioneer of this technology was not successful in putting the 26" announced a year ago to market.
- nvidia does not support this (yet).
- displays in use to manufacture standars LCD TV sets allready support 120Hz and above, all needed to make a 3D ready TV is a different circuitry to drive the panel and thus much easier and likely route for the manufacturers to choose - preannounced Sony Bravias e.g. use shutter technology.
on a side note, german computer magazine ct' had a test display setup at IFA where people were able to A/B test available technologies with surprisingly clear preference of all participants for the shutter technology (mind, with a Samsung 2233RZ !)
I Really hope someone to make a good polarized monitor [...] that is FAR BETTER than any other, also glasses costs 4 euros and can be viewed from more people at the same time.
The real solution to 3d is to DROP shutter glasses.
Well with a couple of problems:
- as you mention, we need an awful high resolution to match up with full HD. The highest resolution available to customers are 2560x1600 @ 30" - the prices still hover close to 2000,- USD on standard monitors - hardly an option for the avarage user.
- There are solutions like the IZ3D panels that use standard TFT panel with 2 layers of polarized filters in front. They need careful trim of polarizers in glasses and display to avoid color mismatch/color ghosting, additionally they loose some brightness due to multiple layers of filters. Also even IZ3D the pioneer of this technology was not successful in putting the 26" announced a year ago to market.
- nvidia does not support this (yet).
- displays in use to manufacture standars LCD TV sets allready support 120Hz and above, all needed to make a 3D ready TV is a different circuitry to drive the panel and thus much easier and likely route for the manufacturers to choose - preannounced Sony Bravias e.g. use shutter technology.
on a side note, german computer magazine ct' had a test display setup at IFA where people were able to A/B test available technologies with surprisingly clear preference of all participants for the shutter technology (mind, with a Samsung 2233RZ !)
- as you mention, we need an awful high resolution to match up with full HD. The highest resolution available to customers are 2560x1600 @ 30" - the prices still hover close to 2000,- USD on standard monitors - hardly an option for the avarage user.
- There are solutions like the IZ3D panels that use standard TFT panel with 2 layers of polarized filters in front. They need careful trim of polarizers in glasses and display to avoid color mismatch/color ghosting, additionally they loose some brightness due to multiple layers of filters. Also even IZ3D the pioneer of this technology was not successful in putting the 26" announced a year ago to market.
- nvidia does not support this (yet).
- displays in use to manufacture standars LCD TV sets allready support 120Hz and above, all needed to make a 3D ready TV is a different circuitry to drive the panel and thus much easier and likely route for the manufacturers to choose - preannounced Sony Bravias e.g. use shutter technology.
on a side note, german computer magazine ct' had a test display setup at IFA where people were able to A/B test available technologies with surprisingly clear preference of all participants for the shutter technology (mind, with a Samsung 2233RZ !)[/quote]
Shutter technology to me seems inherently inferior as it has to block significantly more light due to duty cycle timing and the fact that the temporal resolution is inherently inaccurate, which makes horizontal motion look bouncy or jittery. But perhaps home 3d approaches haven't quite caught up yet.
- as you mention, we need an awful high resolution to match up with full HD. The highest resolution available to customers are 2560x1600 @ 30" - the prices still hover close to 2000,- USD on standard monitors - hardly an option for the avarage user.
- There are solutions like the IZ3D panels that use standard TFT panel with 2 layers of polarized filters in front. They need careful trim of polarizers in glasses and display to avoid color mismatch/color ghosting, additionally they loose some brightness due to multiple layers of filters. Also even IZ3D the pioneer of this technology was not successful in putting the 26" announced a year ago to market.
- nvidia does not support this (yet).
- displays in use to manufacture standars LCD TV sets allready support 120Hz and above, all needed to make a 3D ready TV is a different circuitry to drive the panel and thus much easier and likely route for the manufacturers to choose - preannounced Sony Bravias e.g. use shutter technology.
on a side note, german computer magazine ct' had a test display setup at IFA where people were able to A/B test available technologies with surprisingly clear preference of all participants for the shutter technology (mind, with a Samsung 2233RZ !)
Shutter technology to me seems inherently inferior as it has to block significantly more light due to duty cycle timing and the fact that the temporal resolution is inherently inaccurate, which makes horizontal motion look bouncy or jittery. But perhaps home 3d approaches haven't quite caught up yet.
With polarized monitors / glasses, the screen will appear to go very dark if you turn your heap to the side, since the polarization of the electromagnetic waves will not match the glasses, therefore no light will make it through (this is in theory, in practice, some would, but this wouldn't be a good thing...).
I like the idea of shutter glasses ALOT more than polarized ones. Keep in mind that shutter glasses allows about 50% of the light through to each eye. Polarized glasses do exactly the same thing, the monitor will show up just as bright as normal, and half the light goes to one eye, and the other half to the other.
Also remember that there are NO TIMING ISSUES with newer 3D LCD's (like on the new 3D ready notebook). The only problem is that the Samsung monitor doesn't perform well enough... I am almost certain that the new ACER LCD's that will be released in the next month or two will not have any ghosting issues like the Samsung does. I don't think we can blame NVIDIA for making this so bad, when they did nothing wrong, Samsung failed to produce a good enough quality monitor, and that is all. Soon enough with new monitors, we will have next to no ghosting, and all will be well.
I say we should just wait a little longer, and see how it goes.
Nick
P.S. My CRT has very little ghosting at all :) If you are unhappy with your 2233RZ, maybe you should replace it with a CRT for the time being :P
With polarized monitors / glasses, the screen will appear to go very dark if you turn your heap to the side, since the polarization of the electromagnetic waves will not match the glasses, therefore no light will make it through (this is in theory, in practice, some would, but this wouldn't be a good thing...).
I like the idea of shutter glasses ALOT more than polarized ones. Keep in mind that shutter glasses allows about 50% of the light through to each eye. Polarized glasses do exactly the same thing, the monitor will show up just as bright as normal, and half the light goes to one eye, and the other half to the other.
Also remember that there are NO TIMING ISSUES with newer 3D LCD's (like on the new 3D ready notebook). The only problem is that the Samsung monitor doesn't perform well enough... I am almost certain that the new ACER LCD's that will be released in the next month or two will not have any ghosting issues like the Samsung does. I don't think we can blame NVIDIA for making this so bad, when they did nothing wrong, Samsung failed to produce a good enough quality monitor, and that is all. Soon enough with new monitors, we will have next to no ghosting, and all will be well.
I say we should just wait a little longer, and see how it goes.
Nick
P.S. My CRT has very little ghosting at all :) If you are unhappy with your 2233RZ, maybe you should replace it with a CRT for the time being :P
Twitter: @Dr_Inkduff
<b>Processor:</b> Intel Core i7 920 D0 (4Ghz) <b>Motherboard:</b> ASUS P6T
<b>Memory:</b> 6GB DDR3 RAM (Kingston) <b>Graphics:</b> GTX 260 (216 cores, physX); EVGA GTX 480 SC
<b>OS:</b> Win7 Home Premium 64-bit / Vista Home Premium 64-bit
<b>Hard Disks:</b> 750GB + 500GB <b>Tower:</b> Antec 'Twelve Hundred' Gaming Tower
<b>Monitors:</b> 24" ACER GD245HQbd 120Hz 1920*1080 + 22" widescreen LCD 1680x1050
http://bit.ly/Bluesteel
shouldn't be the case with circular polarisation....
shouldn't be the case with circular polarisation....
With polarized monitors / glasses, the screen will appear to go very dark if you turn your heap to the side, since the polarization of the electromagnetic waves will not match the glasses, therefore no light will make it through (this is in theory, in practice, some would, but this wouldn't be a good thing...).
I like the idea of shutter glasses ALOT more than polarized ones. Keep in mind that shutter glasses allows about 50% of the light through to each eye. Polarized glasses do exactly the same thing, the monitor will show up just as bright as normal, and half the light goes to one eye, and the other half to the other.
Also remember that there are NO TIMING ISSUES with newer 3D LCD's (like on the new 3D ready notebook). The only problem is that the Samsung monitor doesn't perform well enough... I am almost certain that the new ACER LCD's that will be released in the next month or two will not have any ghosting issues like the Samsung does. I don't think we can blame NVIDIA for making this so bad, when they did nothing wrong, Samsung failed to produce a good enough quality monitor, and that is all. Soon enough with new monitors, we will have next to no ghosting, and all will be well.
I say we should just wait a little longer, and see how it goes.
Nick
P.S. My CRT has very little ghosting at all :) If you are unhappy with your 2233RZ, maybe you should replace it with a CRT for the time being :P[/quote]
Shuttler glasses only allow 50% light through per eye theoretically ... in the real world, the screen itself takes some amount of that time to transition to the other eye's view, which means the shutters cannot be open during that time or else the wrong image will leak through. And of course the light blocked by the shutters is not perfect. Again, the duty cycle on the Samsung is about 25% light per eye and that's pretty bad.
The temporal inaccuracy per eye is a fundamental limitation and probably worse on a long term basis. The polarized approach is better here because the same scene can be shown at the same time per eye. Offsetting the second eye's image ahead by 1/120th of a second causes motion to appear jittery or bouncy. The only way a shutter approach can make this better is to increase the refresh rate even further ... perhaps 240 or 480 Hz. Which brings us back to the light per eye issue... In the meantime, it is very important to have a video card that can maintain the full frame rate so that motion jitters are minimized.
With all that said, I think if the ghosting issues of the Samsung are addressed in newer projector/monitor technologies, 3d vision as a whole becomes much more palatable. I would not be that tempted to upgrade my display again once I got a decent size screen with no ghosting up and running at 720p or 1680x1050.
With polarized monitors / glasses, the screen will appear to go very dark if you turn your heap to the side, since the polarization of the electromagnetic waves will not match the glasses, therefore no light will make it through (this is in theory, in practice, some would, but this wouldn't be a good thing...).
I like the idea of shutter glasses ALOT more than polarized ones. Keep in mind that shutter glasses allows about 50% of the light through to each eye. Polarized glasses do exactly the same thing, the monitor will show up just as bright as normal, and half the light goes to one eye, and the other half to the other.
Also remember that there are NO TIMING ISSUES with newer 3D LCD's (like on the new 3D ready notebook). The only problem is that the Samsung monitor doesn't perform well enough... I am almost certain that the new ACER LCD's that will be released in the next month or two will not have any ghosting issues like the Samsung does. I don't think we can blame NVIDIA for making this so bad, when they did nothing wrong, Samsung failed to produce a good enough quality monitor, and that is all. Soon enough with new monitors, we will have next to no ghosting, and all will be well.
I say we should just wait a little longer, and see how it goes.
Nick
P.S. My CRT has very little ghosting at all :) If you are unhappy with your 2233RZ, maybe you should replace it with a CRT for the time being :P
Shuttler glasses only allow 50% light through per eye theoretically ... in the real world, the screen itself takes some amount of that time to transition to the other eye's view, which means the shutters cannot be open during that time or else the wrong image will leak through. And of course the light blocked by the shutters is not perfect. Again, the duty cycle on the Samsung is about 25% light per eye and that's pretty bad.
The temporal inaccuracy per eye is a fundamental limitation and probably worse on a long term basis. The polarized approach is better here because the same scene can be shown at the same time per eye. Offsetting the second eye's image ahead by 1/120th of a second causes motion to appear jittery or bouncy. The only way a shutter approach can make this better is to increase the refresh rate even further ... perhaps 240 or 480 Hz. Which brings us back to the light per eye issue... In the meantime, it is very important to have a video card that can maintain the full frame rate so that motion jitters are minimized.
With all that said, I think if the ghosting issues of the Samsung are addressed in newer projector/monitor technologies, 3d vision as a whole becomes much more palatable. I would not be that tempted to upgrade my display again once I got a decent size screen with no ghosting up and running at 720p or 1680x1050.
I can certainly say more than 25% of light is making it through my glasses for my CRT, the image is not dark at all...
Just wait for the ACER monitors, I have a good feeling about them :P
I can certainly say more than 25% of light is making it through my glasses for my CRT, the image is not dark at all...
Just wait for the ACER monitors, I have a good feeling about them :P
Twitter: @Dr_Inkduff
<b>Processor:</b> Intel Core i7 920 D0 (4Ghz) <b>Motherboard:</b> ASUS P6T
<b>Memory:</b> 6GB DDR3 RAM (Kingston) <b>Graphics:</b> GTX 260 (216 cores, physX); EVGA GTX 480 SC
<b>OS:</b> Win7 Home Premium 64-bit / Vista Home Premium 64-bit
<b>Hard Disks:</b> 750GB + 500GB <b>Tower:</b> Antec 'Twelve Hundred' Gaming Tower
<b>Monitors:</b> 24" ACER GD245HQbd 120Hz 1920*1080 + 22" widescreen LCD 1680x1050
http://bit.ly/Bluesteel
I can certainly say more than 25% of light is making it through my glasses for my CRT, the image is not dark at all...
Just wait for the ACER monitors, I have a good feeling about them :P[/quote]
The human eye can easily see more than 120 hz ... Depends on the situation. Bright flashes, for example.
The stuttering in motion with shutter glasses is because you see the second eye of each frame ahead of the first eye. This is visually disorienting and incorrect. If you were to close one eye it wouldn't be a problem because it won't be out of sync with your other eye.
I took a high speed video of the glasses and am not wrong on the duty cycle. Please stick to speaking on topics you have actual knowledge of.
I can certainly say more than 25% of light is making it through my glasses for my CRT, the image is not dark at all...
Just wait for the ACER monitors, I have a good feeling about them :P
The human eye can easily see more than 120 hz ... Depends on the situation. Bright flashes, for example.
The stuttering in motion with shutter glasses is because you see the second eye of each frame ahead of the first eye. This is visually disorienting and incorrect. If you were to close one eye it wouldn't be a problem because it won't be out of sync with your other eye.
I took a high speed video of the glasses and am not wrong on the duty cycle. Please stick to speaking on topics you have actual knowledge of.
Nick
Nick
Twitter: @Dr_Inkduff
<b>Processor:</b> Intel Core i7 920 D0 (4Ghz) <b>Motherboard:</b> ASUS P6T
<b>Memory:</b> 6GB DDR3 RAM (Kingston) <b>Graphics:</b> GTX 260 (216 cores, physX); EVGA GTX 480 SC
<b>OS:</b> Win7 Home Premium 64-bit / Vista Home Premium 64-bit
<b>Hard Disks:</b> 750GB + 500GB <b>Tower:</b> Antec 'Twelve Hundred' Gaming Tower
<b>Monitors:</b> 24" ACER GD245HQbd 120Hz 1920*1080 + 22" widescreen LCD 1680x1050
http://bit.ly/Bluesteel
Although it should not have been released as stated above, I just got paid so £340 wasn't a huge hit, plus I ordered mine online and I don't want all that hassle of sending it back for 2/3cm[/quote]
Someone on Iracing pointed out this thread to me, so I am new and just joined .He was also stating that he had severe gocraping at the top of the monitor. I have 4 of the samsung sync monitors, one which is stand alone, and I use that one for 3d gaming. I have never once experience ANY such ghosting. None, zero, zilch. I bought the first one ( will have to look at the exact date) when they first came out, so I want to say march or may. I will check.
He reports ghosting in Iracing which is pretty much a "bright" sim. I did not set mine up, I have a guy who does it , so i will ask him about this issue, because I am unable to duplicate it on the single system
My system is an I7 920 ( no I don't over clock it) GTX 260 card . Windows Vista Ultimate 64. I run 12 g DDR 3 1600 Tripple channel ram .
I notice many list the Samsung sync monitor, but say Acer, or some other monitor , including CRT's and still have the same monitor. Most of you obviously know more than I do, but maybe being new at this thread, I noticed some things regarding the samsung monitor as being the cause , yet, you are posting the results being the same on different monitors. Could it be said then it is not the monitor? In iRacing, he expressed that he had the 80/20 ghosting going on . or should I say 20/80, the 20 being at the top? I have used the glasses on and off, mostly off, because i do get headaches from them sometimes, and i am absouletly stunned by the quality of the grpahics with the monitor along in iRacing . Simply amazing. As i said before, I have ZERO ghosting when I do use them , but sometimes the headaches. I have heard several people say that, and that right there says alot. My wife is a DR , and she used them a couple of times, and in time, she said "it caused her eyes to blur. " I am not a DR either, and I will have her post with her thoughts on that, but she had a perfectly reasonable and medically competent reason for it. I will ask her to explain it. i will stick with what I know. I know when I saw a 3g movie the other day, I had the same problem
It makes no sense to blame the monitor. Especially since the same thing is duplicated at lower refresh, and on Various and different monitors. By itself, these samsund monitors ROCK ! I average 400 FPS in Iracing, full field, everything on. In 3d, I take a slight hit, but still average 300-325. It's not the monitor.
The guy who set up the original with the 3d, it took him a while to get it right , with the glasses. It surprised me, as i thought it would be 1-2-3 go. It took him a couple of hours, but I have NEVER had a Ghosting issue. So replying to my fellow Iracer , he doesn't have something set right. I called my builder earlier, and he said it IS a setting issue, and or a driver issue. Being tomorrow is x-mas, I will try to get him to post exactly how he set mine up. I do know that on my own I downloaded the latest drivers for Nvidia ( I have a driver update program) and he told me to roll it back. So I am not sure which I am using so I will wait until I have ore time with him. I don't want to lead anyone into 5 hours of guessing, but he said there is a particular set of drivers to use with the 3d glasses.
He did say emphatically , it is NOT the monitor. The monitor itself in my opinion has totally changed gaming for me. It was exactly what every review said it was, even down to the one issue that said was horrible. Inserting the monitor into the base. I litterally had to use KY jelly to get it in ( no pun intended) . That was the only bad reported in every review I read before i bought the first one. The base is also a little shakey for me. other than that I am so thrilled, i bought 3 more.
So, I first wanted to post, as several people asked , NO I do not have the ghosting problem. From the photo's, i am not playing some of the same games as the photo's posted, but I can say 100 % , no ghosting in iRacing. Never once.
The fellow iRacer who said he was, I don't know, it looked like he had 3 g of some older ram etc etc, but in my experience, and after reading the entire thread, it has to be the settings, or the glasses themselves. or both.
One other thing I can do now there is an iRacing thread, is ask the developers to ask Nvidia. We have found it very interesting that Nividia has opened a Boston Lab right across the hall from Iracing Being that Dave Krammer and John Henry own iRacing, it's probably no coincedence . They are doing something together. good news for us i think.
I am sorry for the long thread, but having read all this one, and knowing the time that it took my computer guy to hook mine up, and he said it sounded like it was a configuration /driver issue, I thought i would post here. I would hate to see people go through the hassel of returning an incrediable monitor ( my opinion) or go buy another one or 2 because as my CPU guy said regarding my fellow iRacer " it is how he has it set up " , meaning the glasses and configuration. As someone expressed, and my wife has said, there is also a possible "medical" reason that people have problems with 3d. May be an issue for some, but I doubt this many people have it. But it may help some.
Until the fellow iRacing started this thread, I have never heard of this issue, and never experienced it myself. Still, as many have helped me over the years, if i can have someone who would know, share how mine was set up ( since it works 100 % excellent) I will pass it along. I wish I could use the 3d all the time in iRacing, but i just cant. At lap 150 at Richmond, a blinding headache spoils the fun. Using 3 of these samsung monitors for Iracing, all I can say is WOW !!!!!!!
This is a good site, and i learned some things , so thank you . My computer guy said he would look at the thread saturday, and hopefully he can post something that will help . Like I said, mine works perfrectly.
And for the record, I don't work for samsung or Nvidia, I am just another fellow gammer who also gets fustrated at issues like this. 5%-10% or 20 % as my iracing friend is experiencing , would drive me crazy too !
Merry Christmas .
So, whoever was writing the posts regarding the ability to adjust the timing on the glasses , is probably a lot closer to the anser than those blaming the monitor.
Although it should not have been released as stated above, I just got paid so £340 wasn't a huge hit, plus I ordered mine online and I don't want all that hassle of sending it back for 2/3cm
Someone on Iracing pointed out this thread to me, so I am new and just joined .He was also stating that he had severe gocraping at the top of the monitor. I have 4 of the samsung sync monitors, one which is stand alone, and I use that one for 3d gaming. I have never once experience ANY such ghosting. None, zero, zilch. I bought the first one ( will have to look at the exact date) when they first came out, so I want to say march or may. I will check.
He reports ghosting in Iracing which is pretty much a "bright" sim. I did not set mine up, I have a guy who does it , so i will ask him about this issue, because I am unable to duplicate it on the single system
My system is an I7 920 ( no I don't over clock it) GTX 260 card . Windows Vista Ultimate 64. I run 12 g DDR 3 1600 Tripple channel ram .
I notice many list the Samsung sync monitor, but say Acer, or some other monitor , including CRT's and still have the same monitor. Most of you obviously know more than I do, but maybe being new at this thread, I noticed some things regarding the samsung monitor as being the cause , yet, you are posting the results being the same on different monitors. Could it be said then it is not the monitor? In iRacing, he expressed that he had the 80/20 ghosting going on . or should I say 20/80, the 20 being at the top? I have used the glasses on and off, mostly off, because i do get headaches from them sometimes, and i am absouletly stunned by the quality of the grpahics with the monitor along in iRacing . Simply amazing. As i said before, I have ZERO ghosting when I do use them , but sometimes the headaches. I have heard several people say that, and that right there says alot. My wife is a DR , and she used them a couple of times, and in time, she said "it caused her eyes to blur. " I am not a DR either, and I will have her post with her thoughts on that, but she had a perfectly reasonable and medically competent reason for it. I will ask her to explain it. i will stick with what I know. I know when I saw a 3g movie the other day, I had the same problem
It makes no sense to blame the monitor. Especially since the same thing is duplicated at lower refresh, and on Various and different monitors. By itself, these samsund monitors ROCK ! I average 400 FPS in Iracing, full field, everything on. In 3d, I take a slight hit, but still average 300-325. It's not the monitor.
The guy who set up the original with the 3d, it took him a while to get it right , with the glasses. It surprised me, as i thought it would be 1-2-3 go. It took him a couple of hours, but I have NEVER had a Ghosting issue. So replying to my fellow Iracer , he doesn't have something set right. I called my builder earlier, and he said it IS a setting issue, and or a driver issue. Being tomorrow is x-mas, I will try to get him to post exactly how he set mine up. I do know that on my own I downloaded the latest drivers for Nvidia ( I have a driver update program) and he told me to roll it back. So I am not sure which I am using so I will wait until I have ore time with him. I don't want to lead anyone into 5 hours of guessing, but he said there is a particular set of drivers to use with the 3d glasses.
He did say emphatically , it is NOT the monitor. The monitor itself in my opinion has totally changed gaming for me. It was exactly what every review said it was, even down to the one issue that said was horrible. Inserting the monitor into the base. I litterally had to use KY jelly to get it in ( no pun intended) . That was the only bad reported in every review I read before i bought the first one. The base is also a little shakey for me. other than that I am so thrilled, i bought 3 more.
So, I first wanted to post, as several people asked , NO I do not have the ghosting problem. From the photo's, i am not playing some of the same games as the photo's posted, but I can say 100 % , no ghosting in iRacing. Never once.
The fellow iRacer who said he was, I don't know, it looked like he had 3 g of some older ram etc etc, but in my experience, and after reading the entire thread, it has to be the settings, or the glasses themselves. or both.
One other thing I can do now there is an iRacing thread, is ask the developers to ask Nvidia. We have found it very interesting that Nividia has opened a Boston Lab right across the hall from Iracing Being that Dave Krammer and John Henry own iRacing, it's probably no coincedence . They are doing something together. good news for us i think.
I am sorry for the long thread, but having read all this one, and knowing the time that it took my computer guy to hook mine up, and he said it sounded like it was a configuration /driver issue, I thought i would post here. I would hate to see people go through the hassel of returning an incrediable monitor ( my opinion) or go buy another one or 2 because as my CPU guy said regarding my fellow iRacer " it is how he has it set up " , meaning the glasses and configuration. As someone expressed, and my wife has said, there is also a possible "medical" reason that people have problems with 3d. May be an issue for some, but I doubt this many people have it. But it may help some.
Until the fellow iRacing started this thread, I have never heard of this issue, and never experienced it myself. Still, as many have helped me over the years, if i can have someone who would know, share how mine was set up ( since it works 100 % excellent) I will pass it along. I wish I could use the 3d all the time in iRacing, but i just cant. At lap 150 at Richmond, a blinding headache spoils the fun. Using 3 of these samsung monitors for Iracing, all I can say is WOW !!!!!!!
This is a good site, and i learned some things , so thank you . My computer guy said he would look at the thread saturday, and hopefully he can post something that will help . Like I said, mine works perfrectly.
And for the record, I don't work for samsung or Nvidia, I am just another fellow gammer who also gets fustrated at issues like this. 5%-10% or 20 % as my iracing friend is experiencing , would drive me crazy too !
Merry Christmas .
So, whoever was writing the posts regarding the ability to adjust the timing on the glasses , is probably a lot closer to the anser than those blaming the monitor.
i dl'd the newest nvidia gpu drivers
i dl'd the newest nvidia 3d vision drivers
i uninstalled my old gpu driver with driver sweeper
rebooted
installed newest gpu drivers
rebooted
installed newest 3d vision drivers
rebooted
went into my monitor settings and set it to 120hz
had 3d work in every game no problem on the compatibility list. not one problem everything went smooth as butter. i get no headaches, i get a great 3d effect, batman and assassins creed completely blow me away it looks so incredible.
i am taking a nice hit in performance when 3d is enabled. i only get a max of 60fps in iRacing and every other game i've tested. I have set the 3d to 120hz in the 3d control panel.
i'm thinking, you're getting headaches and getting very high fps, do me a favor and right click the desktop and go to the nvidia control panel/ stereoscopic 3d/ set up stereoscopic 3d/ test stereoscopic 3d and check the refresh rate. What is it set at?
also right click the desktop again click personalize/ display settings/ advanced settings/ monitor/ screen refresh rate- what is that set to?
i'd appreciate that.
i dl'd the newest nvidia gpu drivers
i dl'd the newest nvidia 3d vision drivers
i uninstalled my old gpu driver with driver sweeper
rebooted
installed newest gpu drivers
rebooted
installed newest 3d vision drivers
rebooted
went into my monitor settings and set it to 120hz
had 3d work in every game no problem on the compatibility list. not one problem everything went smooth as butter. i get no headaches, i get a great 3d effect, batman and assassins creed completely blow me away it looks so incredible.
i am taking a nice hit in performance when 3d is enabled. i only get a max of 60fps in iRacing and every other game i've tested. I have set the 3d to 120hz in the 3d control panel.
i'm thinking, you're getting headaches and getting very high fps, do me a favor and right click the desktop and go to the nvidia control panel/ stereoscopic 3d/ set up stereoscopic 3d/ test stereoscopic 3d and check the refresh rate. What is it set at?
also right click the desktop again click personalize/ display settings/ advanced settings/ monitor/ screen refresh rate- what is that set to?
i'd appreciate that.
Well you're either A. simply wrong, or B. a very lucky individual. The cause of the ghosting has already been shown to be the time the monitor takes to scan from top to bottom combined with the glasses shutter timing. I posted high speed videos a while ago that demonstrated this. For that to not be your monitor it would need to mean that Samsung made some sort of invisible revision to this monitor and that you happened to get one.
The majority of new posters have no idea how to check these things or even what they are looking at, so you'll have to excuse the skepticism, but the burden of proof is you to show otherwise. Take a photo through your shutter glasses on a known high contrast/ghosting 3d screenshot and we'll believe you.
Well you're either A. simply wrong, or B. a very lucky individual. The cause of the ghosting has already been shown to be the time the monitor takes to scan from top to bottom combined with the glasses shutter timing. I posted high speed videos a while ago that demonstrated this. For that to not be your monitor it would need to mean that Samsung made some sort of invisible revision to this monitor and that you happened to get one.
The majority of new posters have no idea how to check these things or even what they are looking at, so you'll have to excuse the skepticism, but the burden of proof is you to show otherwise. Take a photo through your shutter glasses on a known high contrast/ghosting 3d screenshot and we'll believe you.