Royole Moon Purchase
  2 / 3    
OK, thanks, I found the flag and fixed the driver crashing. I used bigscreen and not virtual desktop because it is free but I don't think it is why the resolution seamed so poor to me. I also tried 2D gaming in the mixed reality portal and resolution was as low as 3D in Bigscreen app. 720P on a 240cm projector screen was much much better than this. I can barely distinguish details nearby but when you look in the distance you can't make up what is there. If they would sell lenses with a FOV of 60-70 for this Headsets it would be much better as you would see less pixels and would loose less resolution.
OK, thanks, I found the flag and fixed the driver crashing.
I used bigscreen and not virtual desktop because it is free but I don't think it is why the resolution seamed so poor to me. I also tried 2D gaming in the mixed reality portal and resolution was as low as 3D in Bigscreen app. 720P on a 240cm projector screen was much much better than this.

I can barely distinguish details nearby but when you look in the distance you can't make up what is there.

If they would sell lenses with a FOV of 60-70 for this Headsets it would be much better as you would see less pixels and would loose less resolution.

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#16
Posted 04/02/2019 05:28 AM   
Shinra358, can you please post an image of the view trough the lense for Royole? Based on the specs it should still be the best option. Is yours royole X or royole moon? Thank you!
Shinra358, can you please post an image of the view trough the lense for Royole?
Based on the specs it should still be the best option.

Is yours royole X or royole moon?

Thank you!

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#17
Posted 04/02/2019 07:08 AM   
The problem about these Things is people have different experiences and different levels of quality they percieve as good or exelent. Im one of those guys who can read every letter of the eye doctors sheet and still use glasses to enhance my visuals
The problem about these Things is people have different experiences and different levels of quality they percieve as good or exelent.
Im one of those guys who can read every letter of the eye doctors sheet and still use glasses to enhance my visuals

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#18
Posted 04/02/2019 08:46 AM   
[quote="shinra358"]-only 1 3d mode and that's side by side (it has red/blue too but i dont count that because it's useless). Sony hmz let's you do sbs and top/bottom (havent updated it yet to see if that gives more)[/quote] When you say Red/Blue, does this mean that you would need to put on some paper/cardboard anaglyph glasses as well? I was wondering if you could upload the EDIDs from the Sony and Royal Moon. Use this, it's free http://www.entechtaiwan.com/util/moninfo.shtm Upload as an .inf file, to do so, you'll need to have the display connected and running, highlight the display in the id section, click the file option and the "create inf"
shinra358 said:-only 1 3d mode and that's side by side (it has red/blue too but i dont count that because it's useless). Sony hmz let's you do sbs and top/bottom (havent updated it yet to see if that gives more)


When you say Red/Blue, does this mean that you would need to put on some paper/cardboard anaglyph glasses as well?

I was wondering if you could upload the EDIDs from the Sony and Royal Moon.

Use this, it's free

http://www.entechtaiwan.com/util/moninfo.shtm


Upload as an .inf file, to do so, you'll need to have the display connected and running, highlight the display in the id section, click the file option and the "create inf"

#19
Posted 04/02/2019 11:51 AM   
[quote="D-Man11"][quote="shinra358"]-only 1 3d mode and that's side by side (it has red/blue too but i dont count that because it's useless). Sony hmz let's you do sbs and top/bottom (havent updated it yet to see if that gives more)[/quote] When you say Red/Blue, does this mean that you would need to put on some paper/cardboard anaglyph glasses as well? I was wondering if you could upload the EDIDs from the Sony and Royal Moon. Use this, it's free http://www.entechtaiwan.com/util/moninfo.shtm Upload as an .inf file, to do so, you'll need to have the display connected and running, highlight the display in the id section, click the file option and the "create inf"[/quote] If you have two discrete lenses, why would you put on any 3d glasses else than you wanna maby watch the image with other eye different colour. Im propably missing Something here as i don’t. Understand D-man11’s question nor the original quote about anaglyph glasses
D-Man11 said:
shinra358 said:-only 1 3d mode and that's side by side (it has red/blue too but i dont count that because it's useless). Sony hmz let's you do sbs and top/bottom (havent updated it yet to see if that gives more)


When you say Red/Blue, does this mean that you would need to put on some paper/cardboard anaglyph glasses as well?

I was wondering if you could upload the EDIDs from the Sony and Royal Moon.

Use this, it's free

http://www.entechtaiwan.com/util/moninfo.shtm


Upload as an .inf file, to do so, you'll need to have the display connected and running, highlight the display in the id section, click the file option and the "create inf"


If you have two discrete lenses, why would you put on any 3d glasses else than you wanna maby watch the image with other eye different colour. Im propably missing Something here as i don’t. Understand D-man11’s question nor the original quote about anaglyph glasses

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#20
Posted 04/03/2019 07:27 AM   
What if you wanted to use the native stereoscopic support built into Rocketbirds: Hardboiled Chicken? That could be a good reason.
What if you wanted to use the native stereoscopic support built into Rocketbirds: Hardboiled Chicken?

That could be a good reason.

#21
Posted 04/03/2019 12:22 PM   
[quote="D-Man11"]What if you wanted to use the native stereoscopic support built into Rocketbirds: Hardboiled Chicken? That could be a good reason. [/quote] ....you are right the cyan magenta image can´t be seperated in the output as it´s not a real 3d technique but a mess of a "2D" image that holds both left and right image in color coded format... though i wonder who would wanna torture their eye with those.... wathed on movie in anaglyph and it was one movie too much
D-Man11 said:What if you wanted to use the native stereoscopic support built into Rocketbirds: Hardboiled Chicken?

That could be a good reason.


....you are right the cyan magenta image can´t be seperated in the output as it´s not a real 3d technique but a mess of a "2D" image that holds both left and right image in color coded format...
though i wonder who would wanna torture their eye with those....
wathed on movie in anaglyph and it was one movie too much

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#22
Posted 04/03/2019 06:32 PM   
I was kind of asking because of this https://www.reddit.com/r/Vive/comments/7h916h/do_i_need_to_get_vorpx_to_play_games_like/dqp68mg/ While this hack wouldn't work for VR games on the moon, it should allow a way to bypass 1080P24Hz restrictions by Nvidia on the Royal Moon.
I was kind of asking because of this
https://www.reddit.com/r/Vive/comments/7h916h/do_i_need_to_get_vorpx_to_play_games_like/dqp68mg/

While this hack wouldn't work for VR games on the moon, it should allow a way to bypass 1080P24Hz restrictions by Nvidia on the Royal Moon.

#23
Posted 04/03/2019 07:40 PM   
[quote="joker18"]OK, thanks, I found the flag and fixed the driver crashing. I used bigscreen and not virtual desktop because it is free but I don't think it is why the resolution seamed so poor to me. I also tried 2D gaming in the mixed reality portal and resolution was as low as 3D in Bigscreen app. 720P on a 240cm projector screen was much much better than this. I can barely distinguish details nearby but when you look in the distance you can't make up what is there. If they would sell lenses with a FOV of 60-70 for this Headsets it would be much better as you would see less pixels and would loose less resolution. [/quote]Experiment with using SuperSampling. Since you have a 1080ti, you can bump the SS to at least 200% in the Settings in SteamVR. This dramatically improves the image at a very high performance cost. Also double check that the game you are playing on the virtual screen is using a high resolution. I'm less clear on how much this matters, but if it's less than 1080p, it will be dramatically worse. WMR has much better resolution than Rift/Vive, you really would be disappointed with them. And Rift has god-rays that make it unusable as a theater, in my opinion. Having noted that, I also have yet to get a VR virtual screen that is as good as my 720p projector.
joker18 said:OK, thanks, I found the flag and fixed the driver crashing.
I used bigscreen and not virtual desktop because it is free but I don't think it is why the resolution seamed so poor to me. I also tried 2D gaming in the mixed reality portal and resolution was as low as 3D in Bigscreen app. 720P on a 240cm projector screen was much much better than this.

I can barely distinguish details nearby but when you look in the distance you can't make up what is there.

If they would sell lenses with a FOV of 60-70 for this Headsets it would be much better as you would see less pixels and would loose less resolution.
Experiment with using SuperSampling. Since you have a 1080ti, you can bump the SS to at least 200% in the Settings in SteamVR. This dramatically improves the image at a very high performance cost.

Also double check that the game you are playing on the virtual screen is using a high resolution. I'm less clear on how much this matters, but if it's less than 1080p, it will be dramatically worse.

WMR has much better resolution than Rift/Vive, you really would be disappointed with them. And Rift has god-rays that make it unusable as a theater, in my opinion.

Having noted that, I also have yet to get a VR virtual screen that is as good as my 720p projector.

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#24
Posted 04/03/2019 09:05 PM   
[quote="D-Man11"][quote="shinra358"]-only 1 3d mode and that's side by side (it has red/blue too but i dont count that because it's useless). Sony hmz let's you do sbs and top/bottom (havent updated it yet to see if that gives more)[/quote] When you say Red/Blue, does this mean that you would need to put on some paper/cardboard anaglyph glasses as well? I was wondering if you could upload the EDIDs from the Sony and Royal Moon. Use this, it's free http://www.entechtaiwan.com/util/moninfo.shtm Upload as an .inf file, to do so, you'll need to have the display connected and running, highlight the display in the id section, click the file option and the "create inf"[/quote] one eye would be red. the other would be blue. similar to nvidias red/blue. doesn't seem to work very well though. Just like nvidias. sorry for delay. ok, ill do that a bit later.
D-Man11 said:
shinra358 said:-only 1 3d mode and that's side by side (it has red/blue too but i dont count that because it's useless). Sony hmz let's you do sbs and top/bottom (havent updated it yet to see if that gives more)


When you say Red/Blue, does this mean that you would need to put on some paper/cardboard anaglyph glasses as well?

I was wondering if you could upload the EDIDs from the Sony and Royal Moon.

Use this, it's free

http://www.entechtaiwan.com/util/moninfo.shtm


Upload as an .inf file, to do so, you'll need to have the display connected and running, highlight the display in the id section, click the file option and the "create inf"


one eye would be red. the other would be blue. similar to nvidias red/blue. doesn't seem to work very well though. Just like nvidias. sorry for delay. ok, ill do that a bit later.

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#25
Posted 04/04/2019 01:22 AM   
[quote="joker18"]Shinra358, can you please post an image of the view trough the lense for Royole? Based on the specs it should still be the best option. Is yours royole X or royole moon? Thank you! [/quote] it is great quality. just that the circular lenses causes cut corners and you have to make the screen smaller in the headset in order to avoid it. and even still, the circular lenses still causes a strain because of those corners. And you have to make the screen so small that itll be lesser than Sony's display before you dont feel that discomfort from those corners. [s]Sony's t3w doesn't have this problem for some reason.[/s][b]Sony's doesn't have this problem because it's pretty much the same headset/lenses as the goovis (rectanglarish lenses)[/b] Moon. too difficult to get a pic inside.
joker18 said:Shinra358, can you please post an image of the view trough the lense for Royole?
Based on the specs it should still be the best option.

Is yours royole X or royole moon?

Thank you!

it is great quality. just that the circular lenses causes cut corners and you have to make the screen smaller in the headset in order to avoid it. and even still, the circular lenses still causes a strain because of those corners. And you have to make the screen so small that itll be lesser than Sony's display before you dont feel that discomfort from those corners. Sony's t3w doesn't have this problem for some reason.Sony's doesn't have this problem because it's pretty much the same headset/lenses as the goovis (rectanglarish lenses)

Moon.


too difficult to get a pic inside.

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#26
Posted 04/04/2019 01:29 AM   
sony hmz-t3w wired mode [code]; INF file generated by Monitor Asset Manager (2.91.0.1043), 4/3/2019 ; Copyright (c) 1995-2019, EnTech Taiwan. ; Internet: http://www.entechtaiwan.com [Version] Signature="$WINDOWS NT$" Class=Monitor ClassGUID={4d36e96e-e325-11ce-bfc1-08002be10318} Provider=%MFG% DriverVer=4/3/2019, 1.0.0.0 ;CatalogFile=YourSignedCatalogFile.cat [DestinationDirs] DefaultDestDir=23 [SourceDisksNames] 1=%DISC% [SourceDisksFiles] ;YourColorProfileFile.icm [Manufacturer] %VENDOR%=EDID_OVERRIDE,NTx86,NTamd64 [EDID_OVERRIDE.NTx86] %PRODUCTID%=OVERRIDDEN-EDID.Install, MONITOR\SNY3F03 [EDID_OVERRIDE.NTamd64] %PRODUCTID%=OVERRIDDEN-EDID.Install.NTamd64, MONITOR\SNY3F03 [OVERRIDDEN-EDID.Install.NTx86] DelReg=DEL_CURRENT_REG AddReg=OVERRIDDEN-EDID.AddReg, MODE1, DPMS CopyFiles=OVERRIDDEN-EDID.CopyFiles [OVERRIDDEN-EDID.Install.NTamd64] DelReg=DEL_CURRENT_REG AddReg=OVERRIDDEN-EDID.AddReg, MODE1, DPMS CopyFiles=OVERRIDDEN-EDID.CopyFiles [OVERRIDDEN-EDID.Install.NTx86.HW] AddReg=OVERRIDDEN-EDID_AddReg [OVERRIDDEN-EDID.Install.NTamd64.HW] AddReg=OVERRIDDEN-EDID_AddReg [OVERRIDDEN-EDID_AddReg] ;Base EDID HKR,EDID_OVERRIDE,"0",0x01,0x00,0xFF,0xFF,0xFF,0xFF,0xFF,0xFF,0x00,0x4D,0xD9,0x03,0x3F,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x28,0x17,0x01,0x03,0x80,0xA0,0x5A,0x78,0x0A,0x0D,0xC9,0xA0,0x57,0x47,0x98,0x27,0x12,0x48,0x4C,0x20,0x00,0x00,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x1D,0x00,0x72,0x51,0xD0,0x1E,0x20,0x6E,0x28,0x55,0x00,0x40,0x84,0x63,0x00,0x00,0x1E,0x01,0x1D,0x00,0xBC,0x52,0xD0,0x1E,0x20,0xB8,0x28,0x55,0x40,0x40,0x84,0x63,0x00,0x00,0x1E,0x00,0x00,0x00,0xFD,0x00,0x30,0x3E,0x0F,0x46,0x0F,0x00,0x0A,0x20,0x20,0x20,0x20,0x20,0x20,0x00,0x00,0x00,0xFC,0x00,0x53,0x4F,0x4E,0x59,0x20,0x48,0x4D,0x44,0x0A,0x20,0x20,0x20,0x20,0x01,0x3D ;Extension bloc #1, e.g., CEA/CTA-EXT, DID-EXT, etc. HKR,EDID_OVERRIDE,"1",0x01,0x02,0x03,0x37,0xF0,0x4D,0x10,0x1F,0x20,0x04,0x13,0x3C,0x05,0x14,0x03,0x02,0x12,0x11,0x01,0x23,0x09,0x07,0x07,0x83,0x01,0x00,0x00,0x75,0x03,0x0C,0x00,0x10,0x00,0x80,0x21,0x2F,0xC8,0x0B,0x01,0x40,0x00,0x1F,0x20,0x30,0x40,0x68,0x10,0x78,0x10,0xE3,0x05,0x1F,0x01,0xE2,0x00,0x7B,0x02,0x3A,0x80,0x18,0x71,0x38,0x2D,0x40,0x58,0x2C,0x45,0x00,0xA0,0x2A,0x53,0x00,0x00,0x1E,0x02,0x3A,0x80,0xD0,0x72,0x38,0x2D,0x40,0x10,0x2C,0x45,0x80,0xA0,0x2A,0x53,0x00,0x00,0x1E,0x8C,0x0A,0xD0,0x90,0x20,0x40,0x31,0x20,0x0C,0x40,0x55,0x00,0x40,0x84,0x63,0x00,0x00,0x18,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x05 [DEL_CURRENT_REG] HKR,MODES HKR,EDID_OVERRIDE HKR,,MaxResolution HKR,,PreferredMode HKR,,DPMS HKR,,ICMProfile [DPMS] HKR,,DPMS,,0 HKR,,PreferredMode,,"1280,720,60" [MODE1] HKR,,MaxResolution,,"1280,720,60" [OVERRIDDEN-EDID.AddReg] HKR,"MODES\1280,720,60",Mode1,,"15.0-70.0,48.0-62.0,+,+" [OVERRIDDEN-EDID.CopyFiles] ;YourColorProfileFile.icm for non-sRGB displays [Strings] MFG="EnTech Taiwan" DISC="Monitor EDID Override Installation Disk" PRODUCTID="SONY HMD (SNY3F03 EDID Override)" VENDOR="Sony" [/code] Sony hmz-t3w wireless mode [code]; INF file generated by Monitor Asset Manager (2.91.0.1043), 4/3/2019 ; Copyright (c) 1995-2019, EnTech Taiwan. ; Internet: http://www.entechtaiwan.com [Version] Signature="$WINDOWS NT$" Class=Monitor ClassGUID={4d36e96e-e325-11ce-bfc1-08002be10318} Provider=%MFG% DriverVer=4/3/2019, 1.0.0.0 ;CatalogFile=YourSignedCatalogFile.cat [DestinationDirs] DefaultDestDir=23 [SourceDisksNames] 1=%DISC% [SourceDisksFiles] ;YourColorProfileFile.icm [Manufacturer] %VENDOR%=EDID_OVERRIDE,NTx86,NTamd64 [EDID_OVERRIDE.NTx86] %PRODUCTID%=OVERRIDDEN-EDID.Install, MONITOR\SNY4003 [EDID_OVERRIDE.NTamd64] %PRODUCTID%=OVERRIDDEN-EDID.Install.NTamd64, MONITOR\SNY4003 [OVERRIDDEN-EDID.Install.NTx86] DelReg=DEL_CURRENT_REG AddReg=OVERRIDDEN-EDID.AddReg, MODE1, DPMS CopyFiles=OVERRIDDEN-EDID.CopyFiles [OVERRIDDEN-EDID.Install.NTamd64] DelReg=DEL_CURRENT_REG AddReg=OVERRIDDEN-EDID.AddReg, MODE1, DPMS CopyFiles=OVERRIDDEN-EDID.CopyFiles [OVERRIDDEN-EDID.Install.NTx86.HW] AddReg=OVERRIDDEN-EDID_AddReg [OVERRIDDEN-EDID.Install.NTamd64.HW] AddReg=OVERRIDDEN-EDID_AddReg [OVERRIDDEN-EDID_AddReg] ;Base EDID HKR,EDID_OVERRIDE,"0",0x01,0x00,0xFF,0xFF,0xFF,0xFF,0xFF,0xFF,0x00,0x4D,0xD9,0x03,0x40,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x1F,0x17,0x01,0x03,0x80,0xA0,0x5A,0x78,0x0A,0x0D,0xC9,0xA0,0x57,0x47,0x98,0x27,0x12,0x48,0x4C,0x20,0x00,0x00,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x1D,0x00,0x72,0x51,0xD0,0x1E,0x20,0x6E,0x28,0x55,0x00,0x40,0x84,0x63,0x00,0x00,0x1E,0x01,0x1D,0x00,0xBC,0x52,0xD0,0x1E,0x20,0xB8,0x28,0x55,0x40,0x40,0x84,0x63,0x00,0x00,0x1E,0x00,0x00,0x00,0xFC,0x00,0x53,0x4F,0x4E,0x59,0x20,0x48,0x4D,0x44,0x0A,0x20,0x20,0x20,0x20,0x00,0x00,0x00,0xFD,0x00,0x30,0x3D,0x0F,0x44,0x0F,0x00,0x0A,0x20,0x20,0x20,0x20,0x20,0x20,0x01,0x48 ;Extension bloc #1, e.g., CEA/CTA-EXT, DID-EXT, etc. HKR,EDID_OVERRIDE,"1",0x01,0x02,0x03,0x4E,0xF4,0x4D,0x10,0x1F,0x20,0x04,0x13,0x05,0x14,0x03,0x02,0x12,0x01,0x3C,0x11,0x35,0x0F,0x7F,0x07,0x15,0x07,0x55,0x35,0x07,0x30,0x3D,0x1F,0xC0,0x57,0x07,0x00,0x67,0x54,0x00,0x5F,0x7E,0x01,0x83,0x5F,0x00,0x00,0x7A,0x03,0x0C,0x00,0x10,0x00,0x80,0x21,0x2F,0xC8,0x10,0x01,0x00,0x00,0x7F,0x06,0x16,0x20,0x26,0x30,0x36,0x40,0x46,0x58,0x60,0x68,0x60,0xE2,0x00,0x7B,0xE3,0x05,0x1F,0x01,0x02,0x3A,0x80,0x18,0x71,0x38,0x2D,0x40,0x58,0x2C,0x45,0x00,0xA0,0x2A,0x53,0x00,0x00,0x1E,0x02,0x3A,0x80,0xD0,0x72,0x38,0x2D,0x40,0x10,0x2C,0x45,0x80,0xA0,0x2A,0x53,0x00,0x00,0x1E,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x2B [DEL_CURRENT_REG] HKR,MODES HKR,EDID_OVERRIDE HKR,,MaxResolution HKR,,PreferredMode HKR,,DPMS HKR,,ICMProfile [DPMS] HKR,,DPMS,,0 HKR,,PreferredMode,,"1280,720,60" [MODE1] HKR,,MaxResolution,,"1280,720,60" [OVERRIDDEN-EDID.AddReg] HKR,"MODES\1280,720,60",Mode1,,"15.0-68.0,48.0-61.0,+,+" [OVERRIDDEN-EDID.CopyFiles] ;YourColorProfileFile.icm for non-sRGB displays [Strings] MFG="EnTech Taiwan" DISC="Monitor EDID Override Installation Disk" PRODUCTID="SONY HMD (SNY4003 EDID Override)" VENDOR="Sony" [/code] royole moon [code]; INF file generated by Monitor Asset Manager (2.91.0.1043), 4/3/2019 ; Copyright (c) 1995-2019, EnTech Taiwan. ; Internet: http://www.entechtaiwan.com [Version] Signature="$WINDOWS NT$" Class=Monitor ClassGUID={4d36e96e-e325-11ce-bfc1-08002be10318} Provider=%MFG% DriverVer=4/3/2019, 1.0.0.0 ;CatalogFile=YourSignedCatalogFile.cat [DestinationDirs] DefaultDestDir=23 [SourceDisksNames] 1=%DISC% [SourceDisksFiles] ;YourColorProfileFile.icm [Manufacturer] %VENDOR%=EDID_OVERRIDE,NTx86,NTamd64 [EDID_OVERRIDE.NTx86] %PRODUCTID%=OVERRIDDEN-EDID.Install, MONITOR\TSB8888 [EDID_OVERRIDE.NTamd64] %PRODUCTID%=OVERRIDDEN-EDID.Install.NTamd64, MONITOR\TSB8888 [OVERRIDDEN-EDID.Install.NTx86] DelReg=DEL_CURRENT_REG AddReg=OVERRIDDEN-EDID.AddReg, MODE1, DPMS CopyFiles=OVERRIDDEN-EDID.CopyFiles [OVERRIDDEN-EDID.Install.NTamd64] DelReg=DEL_CURRENT_REG AddReg=OVERRIDDEN-EDID.AddReg, MODE1, DPMS CopyFiles=OVERRIDDEN-EDID.CopyFiles [OVERRIDDEN-EDID.Install.NTx86.HW] AddReg=OVERRIDDEN-EDID_AddReg [OVERRIDDEN-EDID.Install.NTamd64.HW] AddReg=OVERRIDDEN-EDID_AddReg [OVERRIDDEN-EDID_AddReg] ;Base EDID HKR,EDID_OVERRIDE,"0",0x01,0x00,0xFF,0xFF,0xFF,0xFF,0xFF,0xFF,0x00,0x52,0x62,0x88,0x88,0x00,0x88,0x88,0x88,0x1C,0x15,0x01,0x03,0x80,0x00,0x00,0x78,0x0A,0x0D,0xC9,0xA0,0x57,0x47,0x98,0x27,0x12,0x48,0x4C,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x02,0x3A,0x80,0x18,0x71,0x38,0x2D,0x40,0x58,0x2C,0x45,0x00,0xC4,0x8E,0x21,0x00,0x00,0x1E,0x01,0x1D,0x00,0x72,0x51,0xD0,0x1E,0x20,0x6E,0x28,0x55,0x00,0xC4,0x8E,0x21,0x00,0x00,0x1E,0x00,0x00,0x00,0xFC,0x00,0x52,0x6F,0x79,0x6F,0x6C,0x65,0x32,0x0A,0x20,0x20,0x20,0x20,0x20,0x00,0x00,0x00,0xFD,0x00,0x17,0x3D,0x0F,0x8C,0x17,0x00,0x0A,0x20,0x20,0x20,0x20,0x20,0x20,0x01,0x1B ;Extension bloc #1, e.g., CEA/CTA-EXT, DID-EXT, etc. HKR,EDID_OVERRIDE,"1",0x01,0x02,0x03,0x24,0x70,0x48,0x10,0x04,0x20,0x03,0x02,0x01,0x13,0x12,0x23,0x09,0x07,0x01,0x83,0x01,0x00,0x00,0x6E,0x03,0x0C,0x00,0x10,0x00,0x80,0x21,0x2F,0xC8,0x04,0x00,0x01,0x00,0x06,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0xD8 [DEL_CURRENT_REG] HKR,MODES HKR,EDID_OVERRIDE HKR,,MaxResolution HKR,,PreferredMode HKR,,DPMS HKR,,ICMProfile [DPMS] HKR,,DPMS,,0 HKR,,PreferredMode,,"1920,1080,60" [MODE1] HKR,,MaxResolution,,"1920,1080,60" [OVERRIDDEN-EDID.AddReg] HKR,"MODES\1920,1080,60",Mode1,,"15.0-140.0,23.0-61.0,+,+" [OVERRIDDEN-EDID.CopyFiles] ;YourColorProfileFile.icm for non-sRGB displays [Strings] MFG="EnTech Taiwan" DISC="Monitor EDID Override Installation Disk" PRODUCTID="Toshiba Royole2 (TSB8888 EDID Override)" VENDOR="Toshiba" [/code] Wow Luci Immers does look great! Cord looks disconnectable from the head piece! But there are no diopter adjustments :( Is it out yet?
sony hmz-t3w wired mode
; INF file generated by Monitor Asset Manager (2.91.0.1043), 4/3/2019
; Copyright (c) 1995-2019, EnTech Taiwan.
; Internet: http://www.entechtaiwan.com

[Version]
Signature="$WINDOWS NT$"
Class=Monitor
ClassGUID={4d36e96e-e325-11ce-bfc1-08002be10318}
Provider=%MFG%
DriverVer=4/3/2019, 1.0.0.0
;CatalogFile=YourSignedCatalogFile.cat

[DestinationDirs]
DefaultDestDir=23

[SourceDisksNames]
1=%DISC%

[SourceDisksFiles]
;YourColorProfileFile.icm

[Manufacturer]
%VENDOR%=EDID_OVERRIDE,NTx86,NTamd64

[EDID_OVERRIDE.NTx86]
%PRODUCTID%=OVERRIDDEN-EDID.Install, MONITOR\SNY3F03

[EDID_OVERRIDE.NTamd64]
%PRODUCTID%=OVERRIDDEN-EDID.Install.NTamd64, MONITOR\SNY3F03

[OVERRIDDEN-EDID.Install.NTx86]
DelReg=DEL_CURRENT_REG
AddReg=OVERRIDDEN-EDID.AddReg, MODE1, DPMS
CopyFiles=OVERRIDDEN-EDID.CopyFiles

[OVERRIDDEN-EDID.Install.NTamd64]
DelReg=DEL_CURRENT_REG
AddReg=OVERRIDDEN-EDID.AddReg, MODE1, DPMS
CopyFiles=OVERRIDDEN-EDID.CopyFiles

[OVERRIDDEN-EDID.Install.NTx86.HW]
AddReg=OVERRIDDEN-EDID_AddReg

[OVERRIDDEN-EDID.Install.NTamd64.HW]
AddReg=OVERRIDDEN-EDID_AddReg

[OVERRIDDEN-EDID_AddReg]
;Base EDID
HKR,EDID_OVERRIDE,"0",0x01,0x00,0xFF,0xFF,0xFF,0xFF,0xFF,0xFF,0x00,0x4D,0xD9,0x03,0x3F,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x28,0x17,0x01,0x03,0x80,0xA0,0x5A,0x78,0x0A,0x0D,0xC9,0xA0,0x57,0x47,0x98,0x27,0x12,0x48,0x4C,0x20,0x00,0x00,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x1D,0x00,0x72,0x51,0xD0,0x1E,0x20,0x6E,0x28,0x55,0x00,0x40,0x84,0x63,0x00,0x00,0x1E,0x01,0x1D,0x00,0xBC,0x52,0xD0,0x1E,0x20,0xB8,0x28,0x55,0x40,0x40,0x84,0x63,0x00,0x00,0x1E,0x00,0x00,0x00,0xFD,0x00,0x30,0x3E,0x0F,0x46,0x0F,0x00,0x0A,0x20,0x20,0x20,0x20,0x20,0x20,0x00,0x00,0x00,0xFC,0x00,0x53,0x4F,0x4E,0x59,0x20,0x48,0x4D,0x44,0x0A,0x20,0x20,0x20,0x20,0x01,0x3D
;Extension bloc #1, e.g., CEA/CTA-EXT, DID-EXT, etc.
HKR,EDID_OVERRIDE,"1",0x01,0x02,0x03,0x37,0xF0,0x4D,0x10,0x1F,0x20,0x04,0x13,0x3C,0x05,0x14,0x03,0x02,0x12,0x11,0x01,0x23,0x09,0x07,0x07,0x83,0x01,0x00,0x00,0x75,0x03,0x0C,0x00,0x10,0x00,0x80,0x21,0x2F,0xC8,0x0B,0x01,0x40,0x00,0x1F,0x20,0x30,0x40,0x68,0x10,0x78,0x10,0xE3,0x05,0x1F,0x01,0xE2,0x00,0x7B,0x02,0x3A,0x80,0x18,0x71,0x38,0x2D,0x40,0x58,0x2C,0x45,0x00,0xA0,0x2A,0x53,0x00,0x00,0x1E,0x02,0x3A,0x80,0xD0,0x72,0x38,0x2D,0x40,0x10,0x2C,0x45,0x80,0xA0,0x2A,0x53,0x00,0x00,0x1E,0x8C,0x0A,0xD0,0x90,0x20,0x40,0x31,0x20,0x0C,0x40,0x55,0x00,0x40,0x84,0x63,0x00,0x00,0x18,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x05

[DEL_CURRENT_REG]
HKR,MODES
HKR,EDID_OVERRIDE
HKR,,MaxResolution
HKR,,PreferredMode
HKR,,DPMS
HKR,,ICMProfile

[DPMS]
HKR,,DPMS,,0

HKR,,PreferredMode,,"1280,720,60"
[MODE1]
HKR,,MaxResolution,,"1280,720,60"

[OVERRIDDEN-EDID.AddReg]
HKR,"MODES\1280,720,60",Mode1,,"15.0-70.0,48.0-62.0,+,+"

[OVERRIDDEN-EDID.CopyFiles]
;YourColorProfileFile.icm for non-sRGB displays

[Strings]
MFG="EnTech Taiwan"
DISC="Monitor EDID Override Installation Disk"
PRODUCTID="SONY HMD (SNY3F03 EDID Override)"
VENDOR="Sony"




Sony hmz-t3w wireless mode

; INF file generated by Monitor Asset Manager (2.91.0.1043), 4/3/2019
; Copyright (c) 1995-2019, EnTech Taiwan.
; Internet: http://www.entechtaiwan.com

[Version]
Signature="$WINDOWS NT$"
Class=Monitor
ClassGUID={4d36e96e-e325-11ce-bfc1-08002be10318}
Provider=%MFG%
DriverVer=4/3/2019, 1.0.0.0
;CatalogFile=YourSignedCatalogFile.cat

[DestinationDirs]
DefaultDestDir=23

[SourceDisksNames]
1=%DISC%

[SourceDisksFiles]
;YourColorProfileFile.icm

[Manufacturer]
%VENDOR%=EDID_OVERRIDE,NTx86,NTamd64

[EDID_OVERRIDE.NTx86]
%PRODUCTID%=OVERRIDDEN-EDID.Install, MONITOR\SNY4003

[EDID_OVERRIDE.NTamd64]
%PRODUCTID%=OVERRIDDEN-EDID.Install.NTamd64, MONITOR\SNY4003

[OVERRIDDEN-EDID.Install.NTx86]
DelReg=DEL_CURRENT_REG
AddReg=OVERRIDDEN-EDID.AddReg, MODE1, DPMS
CopyFiles=OVERRIDDEN-EDID.CopyFiles

[OVERRIDDEN-EDID.Install.NTamd64]
DelReg=DEL_CURRENT_REG
AddReg=OVERRIDDEN-EDID.AddReg, MODE1, DPMS
CopyFiles=OVERRIDDEN-EDID.CopyFiles

[OVERRIDDEN-EDID.Install.NTx86.HW]
AddReg=OVERRIDDEN-EDID_AddReg

[OVERRIDDEN-EDID.Install.NTamd64.HW]
AddReg=OVERRIDDEN-EDID_AddReg

[OVERRIDDEN-EDID_AddReg]
;Base EDID
HKR,EDID_OVERRIDE,"0",0x01,0x00,0xFF,0xFF,0xFF,0xFF,0xFF,0xFF,0x00,0x4D,0xD9,0x03,0x40,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x1F,0x17,0x01,0x03,0x80,0xA0,0x5A,0x78,0x0A,0x0D,0xC9,0xA0,0x57,0x47,0x98,0x27,0x12,0x48,0x4C,0x20,0x00,0x00,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x1D,0x00,0x72,0x51,0xD0,0x1E,0x20,0x6E,0x28,0x55,0x00,0x40,0x84,0x63,0x00,0x00,0x1E,0x01,0x1D,0x00,0xBC,0x52,0xD0,0x1E,0x20,0xB8,0x28,0x55,0x40,0x40,0x84,0x63,0x00,0x00,0x1E,0x00,0x00,0x00,0xFC,0x00,0x53,0x4F,0x4E,0x59,0x20,0x48,0x4D,0x44,0x0A,0x20,0x20,0x20,0x20,0x00,0x00,0x00,0xFD,0x00,0x30,0x3D,0x0F,0x44,0x0F,0x00,0x0A,0x20,0x20,0x20,0x20,0x20,0x20,0x01,0x48
;Extension bloc #1, e.g., CEA/CTA-EXT, DID-EXT, etc.
HKR,EDID_OVERRIDE,"1",0x01,0x02,0x03,0x4E,0xF4,0x4D,0x10,0x1F,0x20,0x04,0x13,0x05,0x14,0x03,0x02,0x12,0x01,0x3C,0x11,0x35,0x0F,0x7F,0x07,0x15,0x07,0x55,0x35,0x07,0x30,0x3D,0x1F,0xC0,0x57,0x07,0x00,0x67,0x54,0x00,0x5F,0x7E,0x01,0x83,0x5F,0x00,0x00,0x7A,0x03,0x0C,0x00,0x10,0x00,0x80,0x21,0x2F,0xC8,0x10,0x01,0x00,0x00,0x7F,0x06,0x16,0x20,0x26,0x30,0x36,0x40,0x46,0x58,0x60,0x68,0x60,0xE2,0x00,0x7B,0xE3,0x05,0x1F,0x01,0x02,0x3A,0x80,0x18,0x71,0x38,0x2D,0x40,0x58,0x2C,0x45,0x00,0xA0,0x2A,0x53,0x00,0x00,0x1E,0x02,0x3A,0x80,0xD0,0x72,0x38,0x2D,0x40,0x10,0x2C,0x45,0x80,0xA0,0x2A,0x53,0x00,0x00,0x1E,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x2B

[DEL_CURRENT_REG]
HKR,MODES
HKR,EDID_OVERRIDE
HKR,,MaxResolution
HKR,,PreferredMode
HKR,,DPMS
HKR,,ICMProfile

[DPMS]
HKR,,DPMS,,0

HKR,,PreferredMode,,"1280,720,60"
[MODE1]
HKR,,MaxResolution,,"1280,720,60"

[OVERRIDDEN-EDID.AddReg]
HKR,"MODES\1280,720,60",Mode1,,"15.0-68.0,48.0-61.0,+,+"

[OVERRIDDEN-EDID.CopyFiles]
;YourColorProfileFile.icm for non-sRGB displays

[Strings]
MFG="EnTech Taiwan"
DISC="Monitor EDID Override Installation Disk"
PRODUCTID="SONY HMD (SNY4003 EDID Override)"
VENDOR="Sony"




royole moon

; INF file generated by Monitor Asset Manager (2.91.0.1043), 4/3/2019
; Copyright (c) 1995-2019, EnTech Taiwan.
; Internet: http://www.entechtaiwan.com

[Version]
Signature="$WINDOWS NT$"
Class=Monitor
ClassGUID={4d36e96e-e325-11ce-bfc1-08002be10318}
Provider=%MFG%
DriverVer=4/3/2019, 1.0.0.0
;CatalogFile=YourSignedCatalogFile.cat

[DestinationDirs]
DefaultDestDir=23

[SourceDisksNames]
1=%DISC%

[SourceDisksFiles]
;YourColorProfileFile.icm

[Manufacturer]
%VENDOR%=EDID_OVERRIDE,NTx86,NTamd64

[EDID_OVERRIDE.NTx86]
%PRODUCTID%=OVERRIDDEN-EDID.Install, MONITOR\TSB8888

[EDID_OVERRIDE.NTamd64]
%PRODUCTID%=OVERRIDDEN-EDID.Install.NTamd64, MONITOR\TSB8888

[OVERRIDDEN-EDID.Install.NTx86]
DelReg=DEL_CURRENT_REG
AddReg=OVERRIDDEN-EDID.AddReg, MODE1, DPMS
CopyFiles=OVERRIDDEN-EDID.CopyFiles

[OVERRIDDEN-EDID.Install.NTamd64]
DelReg=DEL_CURRENT_REG
AddReg=OVERRIDDEN-EDID.AddReg, MODE1, DPMS
CopyFiles=OVERRIDDEN-EDID.CopyFiles

[OVERRIDDEN-EDID.Install.NTx86.HW]
AddReg=OVERRIDDEN-EDID_AddReg

[OVERRIDDEN-EDID.Install.NTamd64.HW]
AddReg=OVERRIDDEN-EDID_AddReg

[OVERRIDDEN-EDID_AddReg]
;Base EDID
HKR,EDID_OVERRIDE,"0",0x01,0x00,0xFF,0xFF,0xFF,0xFF,0xFF,0xFF,0x00,0x52,0x62,0x88,0x88,0x00,0x88,0x88,0x88,0x1C,0x15,0x01,0x03,0x80,0x00,0x00,0x78,0x0A,0x0D,0xC9,0xA0,0x57,0x47,0x98,0x27,0x12,0x48,0x4C,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x01,0x02,0x3A,0x80,0x18,0x71,0x38,0x2D,0x40,0x58,0x2C,0x45,0x00,0xC4,0x8E,0x21,0x00,0x00,0x1E,0x01,0x1D,0x00,0x72,0x51,0xD0,0x1E,0x20,0x6E,0x28,0x55,0x00,0xC4,0x8E,0x21,0x00,0x00,0x1E,0x00,0x00,0x00,0xFC,0x00,0x52,0x6F,0x79,0x6F,0x6C,0x65,0x32,0x0A,0x20,0x20,0x20,0x20,0x20,0x00,0x00,0x00,0xFD,0x00,0x17,0x3D,0x0F,0x8C,0x17,0x00,0x0A,0x20,0x20,0x20,0x20,0x20,0x20,0x01,0x1B
;Extension bloc #1, e.g., CEA/CTA-EXT, DID-EXT, etc.
HKR,EDID_OVERRIDE,"1",0x01,0x02,0x03,0x24,0x70,0x48,0x10,0x04,0x20,0x03,0x02,0x01,0x13,0x12,0x23,0x09,0x07,0x01,0x83,0x01,0x00,0x00,0x6E,0x03,0x0C,0x00,0x10,0x00,0x80,0x21,0x2F,0xC8,0x04,0x00,0x01,0x00,0x06,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0x00,0xD8

[DEL_CURRENT_REG]
HKR,MODES
HKR,EDID_OVERRIDE
HKR,,MaxResolution
HKR,,PreferredMode
HKR,,DPMS
HKR,,ICMProfile

[DPMS]
HKR,,DPMS,,0

HKR,,PreferredMode,,"1920,1080,60"
[MODE1]
HKR,,MaxResolution,,"1920,1080,60"

[OVERRIDDEN-EDID.AddReg]
HKR,"MODES\1920,1080,60",Mode1,,"15.0-140.0,23.0-61.0,+,+"

[OVERRIDDEN-EDID.CopyFiles]
;YourColorProfileFile.icm for non-sRGB displays

[Strings]
MFG="EnTech Taiwan"
DISC="Monitor EDID Override Installation Disk"
PRODUCTID="Toshiba Royole2 (TSB8888 EDID Override)"
VENDOR="Toshiba"



Wow Luci Immers does look great! Cord looks disconnectable from the head piece! But there are no diopter adjustments :(
Is it out yet?

Model: Clevo P570WM Laptop
GPU: GeForce GTX 980M ~8GB GDDR5
CPU: Intel Core i7-4960X CPU +4.2GHz (12 CPUs)
Memory: 32GB Corsair Vengeance DDR3L 1600MHz, 4x8gb
OS: Microsoft Windows 7 Ultimate

#27
Posted 04/04/2019 01:52 AM   
[quote="shinra358"][quote="joker18"]Shinra358, can you please post an image of the view trough the lense for Royole? Based on the specs it should still be the best option. Is yours royole X or royole moon? Thank you! [/quote] it is great quality. just that the circular lenses causes cut corners and you have to make the screen smaller in the headset in order to avoid it. and even still, the circular lenses still causes a strain because of those corners. And you have to make the screen so small that itll be lesser than Sony's display before you dont feel that discomfort from those corners. [s]Sony's t3w doesn't have this problem for some reason.[/s][b]Sony's doesn't have this problem because it's pretty much the same headset/lenses as the goovis (rectanglarish lenses)[/b] Moon. too difficult to get a pic inside.[/quote] You know the padding is removable ? Luci is propably a scam. I don't know they push it too much. Email keep on raining to act fast. I already paid 10 dollar advance to get it cheaper, but so does anyone else seems to get it as cheap. No answer to emails so i have not plegdged the Final product. Gonn leave my 10 dollars in. Plus those assholes vow the Hell out of it being a native 3D Viewer and sbs support is all it has, Not even framepacked 24p support let alone frame Sequential
shinra358 said:
joker18 said:Shinra358, can you please post an image of the view trough the lense for Royole?
Based on the specs it should still be the best option.

Is yours royole X or royole moon?

Thank you!

it is great quality. just that the circular lenses causes cut corners and you have to make the screen smaller in the headset in order to avoid it. and even still, the circular lenses still causes a strain because of those corners. And you have to make the screen so small that itll be lesser than Sony's display before you dont feel that discomfort from those corners. Sony's t3w doesn't have this problem for some reason.Sony's doesn't have this problem because it's pretty much the same headset/lenses as the goovis (rectanglarish lenses)

Moon.


too difficult to get a pic inside.


You know the padding is removable ?
Luci is propably a scam. I don't know they push it too much. Email keep on raining to act fast.
I already paid 10 dollar advance to get it cheaper, but so does anyone else seems to get it as cheap.
No answer to emails so i have not plegdged the Final product. Gonn leave my 10 dollars in.
Plus those assholes vow the Hell out of it being a native 3D Viewer and sbs support is all it has,
Not even framepacked 24p support let alone frame Sequential

CoreX9 Custom watercooling (valkswagen polo radiator)
I7-8700k@4.7
TitanX pascal with shitty stock cooler
Win7/10
Video: Passive 3D fullhd 3D@60hz/channel Denon x1200w /Hc5 x 2 Geobox501->eeColorBoxes->polarizers/omega filttersCustom made silverscreen
Ocupation: Enterprenior.Painting/surfacing/constructions
Interests/skills:
3D gaming,3D movies, 3D printing,Drums, Bass and guitar.
Suomi - FINLAND - perkele

#28
Posted 04/04/2019 04:20 AM   
[quote="Metal-O-Holic"]Luci is propably a scam. [/quote] From the web..... Luci, is a Santa Clara, California-based company, which is a division of Beijing-based AT Holding The virtual screen has a pixel density of 3,147 pixels per inch (PPI), native 3D effects, a response time of less than one millisecond, and a contrast ratio of 100,000:1. It uses three degrees of freedom (3DoF) controls and an infrared sensor. https://www.luci.one/ Holy crap, do not go to the media page, it automatically opened Steam and started VR without a prompt. Since nothing was hooked up, it kicked in 3D Vision and blacked out my screen. So I had to ctrl+alt+del out of the page. lol, should I change my password :P For the Kickstarter campaign, the first 100 units will be sold for $500, a steep discount from the expected retail price of around $1,000. The units are expected to ship in early fall 2019 and are currently in production.
Metal-O-Holic said:Luci is propably a scam.


From the web.....

Luci, is a Santa Clara, California-based company, which is a division of Beijing-based AT Holding

The virtual screen has a pixel density of 3,147 pixels per inch (PPI), native 3D effects, a response time of less than one millisecond, and a contrast ratio of 100,000:1. It uses three degrees of freedom (3DoF) controls and an infrared sensor.


https://www.luci.one/
Holy crap, do not go to the media page, it automatically opened Steam and started VR without a prompt. Since nothing was hooked up, it kicked in 3D Vision and blacked out my screen. So I had to ctrl+alt+del out of the page. lol, should I change my password :P

For the Kickstarter campaign, the first 100 units will be sold for $500, a steep discount from the expected retail price of around $1,000. The units are expected to ship in early fall 2019 and are currently in production.

#29
Posted 04/04/2019 12:44 PM   
@shinra358 Thanks for posting those
@shinra358

Thanks for posting those

#30
Posted 04/04/2019 12:44 PM   
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