3d Cursor Adding this could make dragon age trully amazing!
Hey guys, third post in a week (Sorry!), just been getting stuck into this new tech and enjoying it a lot.
Dragon age origins looks and plays great, but obviously has a 2d cursor. Any chance you guys are working or will work on in the future a 3d cursor we could implement into a game like this?
cheers
P.s.
The bug you have profiled for this game that character pictures only appear in one eye disappears when your main character talks to that person.
Hey guys, third post in a week (Sorry!), just been getting stuck into this new tech and enjoying it a lot.
Dragon age origins looks and plays great, but obviously has a 2d cursor. Any chance you guys are working or will work on in the future a 3d cursor we could implement into a game like this?
cheers
P.s.
The bug you have profiled for this game that character pictures only appear in one eye disappears when your main character talks to that person.
Not just Dragon Age but any game where you need to click on objects at depth. We need the developers to make the pointer a 3D object that goes to the depth of the thing it is selecting. (It will probably need to grow/shrink, too, so you don't end up with a tiny little pointer when you try to select something far off.) As far as I know, World of Warcraft is the only game to have done this so far.
But then, Dragon Age: Origins has a pretty good toolset for making mods. Maybe you could fix this bug yourself?
I've seen that character portrait bug do all sorts of wonky stuff. It sure is a strange bug but it isn't really too bothersome. The 2D pointer can be a killer, though.
Not just Dragon Age but any game where you need to click on objects at depth. We need the developers to make the pointer a 3D object that goes to the depth of the thing it is selecting. (It will probably need to grow/shrink, too, so you don't end up with a tiny little pointer when you try to select something far off.) As far as I know, World of Warcraft is the only game to have done this so far.
But then, Dragon Age: Origins has a pretty good toolset for making mods. Maybe you could fix this bug yourself?
I've seen that character portrait bug do all sorts of wonky stuff. It sure is a strange bug but it isn't really too bothersome. The 2D pointer can be a killer, though.
[quote name='Zloth' date='20 March 2011 - 06:43 PM' timestamp='1300646599' post='1210613']
Not just Dragon Age but any game where you need to click on objects at depth. We need the developers to make the pointer a 3D object that goes to the depth of the thing it is selecting. (It will probably need to grow/shrink, too, so you don't end up with a tiny little pointer when you try to select something far off.) As far as I know, World of Warcraft is the only game to have done this so far.
But then, Dragon Age: Origins has a pretty good toolset for making mods. Maybe you could fix this bug yourself?
I've seen that character portrait bug do all sorts of wonky stuff. It sure is a strange bug but it isn't really too bothersome. The 2D pointer can be a killer, though.
[/quote]
I would have no idea how to mod this, but im guessing that you wouldn't need to make the pointer grow, it would just be a 2d bitmap that changes its level of depth depending on how fair away something is that your hovering over. I would bet it could be done even if it was difficult. Ah well, here's to hoping. It would be so great if games developers opened up older games more to the communiuty so people could try and rectify thesew problems from within the game code. Would be fantastic to have all old games working perfectly with 3d!
[quote name='Zloth' date='20 March 2011 - 06:43 PM' timestamp='1300646599' post='1210613']
Not just Dragon Age but any game where you need to click on objects at depth. We need the developers to make the pointer a 3D object that goes to the depth of the thing it is selecting. (It will probably need to grow/shrink, too, so you don't end up with a tiny little pointer when you try to select something far off.) As far as I know, World of Warcraft is the only game to have done this so far.
But then, Dragon Age: Origins has a pretty good toolset for making mods. Maybe you could fix this bug yourself?
I've seen that character portrait bug do all sorts of wonky stuff. It sure is a strange bug but it isn't really too bothersome. The 2D pointer can be a killer, though.
I would have no idea how to mod this, but im guessing that you wouldn't need to make the pointer grow, it would just be a 2d bitmap that changes its level of depth depending on how fair away something is that your hovering over. I would bet it could be done even if it was difficult. Ah well, here's to hoping. It would be so great if games developers opened up older games more to the communiuty so people could try and rectify thesew problems from within the game code. Would be fantastic to have all old games working perfectly with 3d!
A user named Dragon from really.ru created a 3rd party application back in 2006 or 2007.
As you can see he made a stereo 3d cursor. From what I hear it WORKED at the expense of a high performance hit. But at the driver level implementing such a feature should be far more efficient as proven with nvidia's laser cross hair which functions VERY similar to a stereo 3d mouse cursor (statically in the middle vs dynamically move around).
[size="4"][b]My question is why a random user from the community can make a functioning 3d mouse cursor but NVIDIA cannot?[/b][/size]
I wonder if NVIDIA thinks it's a waste of time because of the in game image tied to the mouse cursor, worried it might get in the way? The counter argument is that the in game mouse image can be made transparent with a 3rd party app or the .CUR files can be found and deleted from within the games folder.
A user named Dragon from really.ru created a 3rd party application back in 2006 or 2007.
As you can see he made a stereo 3d cursor. From what I hear it WORKED at the expense of a high performance hit. But at the driver level implementing such a feature should be far more efficient as proven with nvidia's laser cross hair which functions VERY similar to a stereo 3d mouse cursor (statically in the middle vs dynamically move around).
My question is why a random user from the community can make a functioning 3d mouse cursor but NVIDIA cannot?
I wonder if NVIDIA thinks it's a waste of time because of the in game image tied to the mouse cursor, worried it might get in the way? The counter argument is that the in game mouse image can be made transparent with a 3rd party app or the .CUR files can be found and deleted from within the games folder.
I dont think the utility actually "Made" the 3D Cursor. It was something experimental already in the pre-monopoly Nvidia drivers. The Dragon utility only toggled registry entries for features already in the drivers. Some driver features were not editable through the normal Nvidia Control Panel. This helpful user made a utility to tweak those entries you would normally need to use "regedit.exe" for.
I am all for bashing Nvidia where they are trying to screw the consumers or their general incompetence. God knows they have done some BRUTAL SCREWING to us long time Nvidia 3D customers. They also seem to have left out many commonsense features that were in their older pre-monopoly drivers. Unfortunately in this case I think they stopped the development of a 3D cursor. It may still be in the works. No one knows except Nvidia themselves. Even then I am not so sure. Communication internally and with consumers seems lacking for the "3D Vision" team. Either that or they really want us to know certain things.
Having a Competent and Trustworthy representative to answer any and all questions that arise with their "3D Vision" product is ESENTIAL for the products success. This 3D stuff is very new to alot of users. There needs to be someone they can count on to answer their questions. There is also a group of old timers that have been using nvidia's 3D hardware/software for 10+ years. We need at minimum the same functionality in the drivers we had before Nvidia tried to Monopolize the PC 3D market by disabling functionality of a HUGE list of hardware that had been dependent on Nvidia for 8+ years! Nvidia would not be here with their branded "3D Vision" glasses if not for all the development work achieved while using 3rd party shutter glasses in the first place! To make matters worse, when a question is asked it is usually ignored. Even worse is when the question is answered with a guarded answer or obvious lie to save face.
All that said, I do appreciate that there is a Nvidia representative answering some questions. That's a step in the right direction. Unfortunately there is a LONG way to go in earning the respect back from us long time Nvidia 3D consumers.
THREE Steps to improve Mine and many others view of Nvidia and their 3D Vision project.
#1 APOLOGIZE to your long time supporters for Disabling/Blocking the use of our 3D hardware that is dependent on Nvidia Drivers to function!
(I personally own a $1,000 HMD that depends on Nvidia's drivers to function! It is rendered worthless because Nvidia decided to disable functionality which is still in the drivers.)
#2 DON'T LIE - I say this because of a recent claim by Nvidia that they have only had 2 years developing "3D Vision". I have been using Nvidia 3D for 10+ years! The drivers still list games from 5+ years ago! Some of which use DX7 and no longer work because of current OS and DX versions yet they still get an "Excellent" Compatibility rating within the drivers. The OLD history of "3D Vision" is still visible for all to see in the current drivers. I firmly believe Nvidia is trying to erace the publics memory to save face. They dont want to admit they BACK STABBED their long time customer base in a shameless effort to grab control of the PC 3D market.
#3 COMMUNICATE - Answer questions! Don't just respond to the easy ones! Don't avoid us to save face. That just makes you look worse! Also keep us up to date on what is going on with 3D Vision development. That helps keep spirits up and build confidence in the product!
Damn I went off on a tangent lol! Well as you can see. My wounds run very deep!
I dont think the utility actually "Made" the 3D Cursor. It was something experimental already in the pre-monopoly Nvidia drivers. The Dragon utility only toggled registry entries for features already in the drivers. Some driver features were not editable through the normal Nvidia Control Panel. This helpful user made a utility to tweak those entries you would normally need to use "regedit.exe" for.
I am all for bashing Nvidia where they are trying to screw the consumers or their general incompetence. God knows they have done some BRUTAL SCREWING to us long time Nvidia 3D customers. They also seem to have left out many commonsense features that were in their older pre-monopoly drivers. Unfortunately in this case I think they stopped the development of a 3D cursor. It may still be in the works. No one knows except Nvidia themselves. Even then I am not so sure. Communication internally and with consumers seems lacking for the "3D Vision" team. Either that or they really want us to know certain things.
Having a Competent and Trustworthy representative to answer any and all questions that arise with their "3D Vision" product is ESENTIAL for the products success. This 3D stuff is very new to alot of users. There needs to be someone they can count on to answer their questions. There is also a group of old timers that have been using nvidia's 3D hardware/software for 10+ years. We need at minimum the same functionality in the drivers we had before Nvidia tried to Monopolize the PC 3D market by disabling functionality of a HUGE list of hardware that had been dependent on Nvidia for 8+ years! Nvidia would not be here with their branded "3D Vision" glasses if not for all the development work achieved while using 3rd party shutter glasses in the first place! To make matters worse, when a question is asked it is usually ignored. Even worse is when the question is answered with a guarded answer or obvious lie to save face.
All that said, I do appreciate that there is a Nvidia representative answering some questions. That's a step in the right direction. Unfortunately there is a LONG way to go in earning the respect back from us long time Nvidia 3D consumers.
THREE Steps to improve Mine and many others view of Nvidia and their 3D Vision project.
#1 APOLOGIZE to your long time supporters for Disabling/Blocking the use of our 3D hardware that is dependent on Nvidia Drivers to function!
(I personally own a $1,000 HMD that depends on Nvidia's drivers to function! It is rendered worthless because Nvidia decided to disable functionality which is still in the drivers.)
#2 DON'T LIE - I say this because of a recent claim by Nvidia that they have only had 2 years developing "3D Vision". I have been using Nvidia 3D for 10+ years! The drivers still list games from 5+ years ago! Some of which use DX7 and no longer work because of current OS and DX versions yet they still get an "Excellent" Compatibility rating within the drivers. The OLD history of "3D Vision" is still visible for all to see in the current drivers. I firmly believe Nvidia is trying to erace the publics memory to save face. They dont want to admit they BACK STABBED their long time customer base in a shameless effort to grab control of the PC 3D market.
#3 COMMUNICATE - Answer questions! Don't just respond to the easy ones! Don't avoid us to save face. That just makes you look worse! Also keep us up to date on what is going on with 3D Vision development. That helps keep spirits up and build confidence in the product!
Damn I went off on a tangent lol! Well as you can see. My wounds run very deep!
When I say we have been doing this for two years, I mean the new 3DV product, features etc. It takes time to get the team comfortable with giving everything out to users. So when I say we have been doing this two years, I mean supporting 3D Vision.
What questions do you want to see answered? I have answered a TON of questions on this forum. I have over 1100 posts. I respond to users about new features that are coming (Window mode, checkerboard support for 3DTV Play). I try to tell them of known issues. Please tell me what question isnt answered that you have. Please do not say I only answer the easy ones. I am in these "heated" threads right now trying to respond to users.
When I say we have been doing this for two years, I mean the new 3DV product, features etc. It takes time to get the team comfortable with giving everything out to users. So when I say we have been doing this two years, I mean supporting 3D Vision.
What questions do you want to see answered? I have answered a TON of questions on this forum. I have over 1100 posts. I respond to users about new features that are coming (Window mode, checkerboard support for 3DTV Play). I try to tell them of known issues. Please tell me what question isnt answered that you have. Please do not say I only answer the easy ones. I am in these "heated" threads right now trying to respond to users.
[quote name='andrewf@nvidia' date='21 March 2011 - 10:11 PM' timestamp='1300745471' post='1211366']
Hi
When I say we have been doing this for two years, I mean the new 3DV product, features etc. It takes time to get the team comfortable with giving everything out to users. So when I say we have been doing this two years, I mean supporting 3D Vision.
What questions do you want to see answered? I have answered a TON of questions on this forum. I have over 1100 posts. I respond to users about new features that are coming (Window mode, checkerboard support for 3DTV Play). I try to tell them of known issues. Please tell me what question isnt answered that you have. Please do not say I only answer the easy ones. I am in these "heated" threads right now trying to respond to users.
[/quote] Hmm, sounds like a play on words to me. I also noticed you edited your post and took out the 2 years thing. For all those interested here is the original.
I replied on another thread you are on about the profiles. Creating profiles is hard and takes a lot of training. We are considering how to open those up to the community but it does take a trained eye to do it.
If you remember we didnt open up SLI profiles at first, but we did over time. Give us time, we've only been doing 3D Vision now for a little over 2 years.
[/quote] http://forums.nvidia.com/index.php?showtopic=195791&st=20 In this thread that 2 years comment was enough to piss off another longtime user forcing him to sign up and point out how much it sounded like a pile of BS. I agree with him. This claim really sounds like you want people to believe Nvidia has only been working on 3D for 2 years when in fact it has been 10 years. Nvidia's actions with driver support/disabling devices and zero response to the user base when it happened also points to Nvidia wanting to cover up the past. All us hardcore users know Shutter Glasses are a very simple device. It doesn't take long to develop glasses that sync with the 120Hz refresh. Nvidia could have brought out its own glasses ages ago! We know the real hard work is in the 3D drivers. Those 3D Vision drivers and features have been in development for 10+ years. In fact you have been supporting 3DV for 10+ years. You finally gave it a name when you brought out your own glasses 2 years ago. Please don't play off that technicality.
Simply put, we long time users don't really care about this "2 years" thing. It was simply a hole in the facade that "3D Vision" is something new. Additionally, acting like you didn't backstab all your long time supports by intentionally disabling our older devices forcing us to buy your branded glasses. That's what really makes us mad.
That said, you sill avoided the #1. Apologize. Acknowledge you intentionally disabled our older Nvidia reliant devices. #2 you seem to have tried to side step that one with a technicality because you only named your 3D drivers when you brought out your glasses 2 years ago. #3 I myself don't have many questions. I usually find my answers elsewhere or just give up because I know the feature I need fixed or re-enabled will be blown off with some excuse or another. I really have very little faith that asking for a fix will make it actually happen. History just shows this. This thread itself seems to want a 3D pointer. Why not give a definitive answer to everyone if there is one in the works? If no, give a good reason why it isn't. It sounds like a feature we have needed almost from the very beginning 10 years ago. It obviously was a feature at least toyed with at some point. So whats up with the 3D pointer?
If you need the meat of my current problem in a form of a question, I guess I will bite. It's a hard one.
#1 Why did Nvidia chose to intentionally Disable 3D hardware that Nvidia 3D supporters bought to use with their Nvidia 3D capable cards? I am talking about the 3rd party Shutter Glasses, 3D Monitors, and 3D HMDs. People spent hundreds even THOUSANDS of DOLLARS to use and support Nvidias 3D movement started 10 years ago. These 3rd party devices were REQUIRED because Nvidia had no glasses of their own before the "3D Vision" branded glasses. It was clear Nvidia wanted us to use these 3rd party glasses as the standard way of viewing Nvidia 3D. That suddenly changed when your branded glasses hit the market. Through various methods the many hardcore users proved the disabling was intentional and not a compatibility issue. By simply plugging in the Nvidia branded emitter which unlocks the drivers and cloning the displays so 120Hz is locked on 2 video outputs. New branded glasses on 1 and older shutter on 2. Suddenly some of these old shutters with manual On/Off switches start functioning perfectly. All they need is the 120Hz image and they are good to go. The catch being the user must first buy a new Nvidia branded glasses kit to get his/her old glasses set functioning again. That kind of defeats the purpose. Additionally many devices had no manual On/Off switches and required a special Nvidia signal coming from the drivers to switch on. Those devices a now completely useless. My HMD most times showes to the OS as a PnP Monitor. Because of this 3D Vision refuses to output the Page Flipped image to the port the HMD is on and thats all it needs. This all begs the questions, Do you guys appreciate at all the many loyal followers you gained over the years with Nvidia 3D? Do you care at all that they spent hundreds supporting your 3D development so you could bring your own refined and branded glasses to market?
Why all the hate threads? Almost all the oldtime supporters hate you now because you intentionally disabled our 3D Equipment. We all spent hundreds on supporting your development. You want us to shelve our perfectly functional glasses/devices in favor of your Nvidia branded glasses which we basically already bought. Not a single "We are sorry", no compensation, no nothing. Basically a bend over and take it attitude from Nvidia. These new comers are hating on you because there are obvious flaws and/or missing features that would make the whole 3D Vision system work better. To be honest, I think they do complain a bit too much without all the facts or understanding of how things work. I myself understand many things can't be fixed driver side. Games need to be put together in such a way to meld well with 3D technology. On the other hand there are many fixes/tweaks that can be fixed driverside but never are because Nvidia doesn't see them as a priority. Additionally we have no control to fix them ourselves. Some problems are so damn simple its laughable yet they never get addressed. Glasses sync comes to mind.
My suggestion to Nvidia is do something to fix relations with all of us that have working yet non-functional equipment that was disabled in drivers. That will ALWAYS be a reason for us to chime in when a hater thread pops up. Just as important is the following! We the users need more control over our experience. That "Let's make a giant list of all NVIDIA 3D Vision failures" thread is basically a cry for more tweakability and control on the user end. It takes AGES for a new driver with minor fixes to come out. Giving the users some tweakability may actually solve some problems for you free of charge.
I am very PASSIONATE about 3D and very PISSED at NVidia. I have spent several thousand dollars on 3D equipment alone. I have also bought exclusively NVidia all the way back to the Riva TnT. I stuck with NVidia strictly for 3D at first. I then realized they make great quality graphics cards and didn't mind staying. Unfortunately the ONLY reason I am still on NVidia hardware is because I want 3D functionality. My loyalty was crushed with the proprietary glasses. Yes I have them. Yes they are great. Yes I hate NVidia for forcing me to buy them and shelve my perfectly good older ones. 3D is the "New Thing" ATM so I suggest Nvidia needs to play nice with its consumers before a new comparable solution comes to market. Hint, Hint, I know of one that will be ready soon and it works with all these "3D Vision Ready" monitors to.
[quote name='andrewf@nvidia' date='21 March 2011 - 10:11 PM' timestamp='1300745471' post='1211366']
Hi
When I say we have been doing this for two years, I mean the new 3DV product, features etc. It takes time to get the team comfortable with giving everything out to users. So when I say we have been doing this two years, I mean supporting 3D Vision.
What questions do you want to see answered? I have answered a TON of questions on this forum. I have over 1100 posts. I respond to users about new features that are coming (Window mode, checkerboard support for 3DTV Play). I try to tell them of known issues. Please tell me what question isnt answered that you have. Please do not say I only answer the easy ones. I am in these "heated" threads right now trying to respond to users.
Hmm, sounds like a play on words to me. I also noticed you edited your post and took out the 2 years thing. For all those interested here is the original.
[quote name='andrewf@nvidia' date='18 March 2011 - 12:22 PM' timestamp='1300745471' post='1211366']
Wazoo
I replied on another thread you are on about the profiles. Creating profiles is hard and takes a lot of training. We are considering how to open those up to the community but it does take a trained eye to do it.
If you remember we didnt open up SLI profiles at first, but we did over time. Give us time, we've only been doing 3D Vision now for a little over 2 years.
http://forums.nvidia.com/index.php?showtopic=195791&st=20 In this thread that 2 years comment was enough to piss off another longtime user forcing him to sign up and point out how much it sounded like a pile of BS. I agree with him. This claim really sounds like you want people to believe Nvidia has only been working on 3D for 2 years when in fact it has been 10 years. Nvidia's actions with driver support/disabling devices and zero response to the user base when it happened also points to Nvidia wanting to cover up the past. All us hardcore users know Shutter Glasses are a very simple device. It doesn't take long to develop glasses that sync with the 120Hz refresh. Nvidia could have brought out its own glasses ages ago! We know the real hard work is in the 3D drivers. Those 3D Vision drivers and features have been in development for 10+ years. In fact you have been supporting 3DV for 10+ years. You finally gave it a name when you brought out your own glasses 2 years ago. Please don't play off that technicality.
Simply put, we long time users don't really care about this "2 years" thing. It was simply a hole in the facade that "3D Vision" is something new. Additionally, acting like you didn't backstab all your long time supports by intentionally disabling our older devices forcing us to buy your branded glasses. That's what really makes us mad.
That said, you sill avoided the #1. Apologize. Acknowledge you intentionally disabled our older Nvidia reliant devices. #2 you seem to have tried to side step that one with a technicality because you only named your 3D drivers when you brought out your glasses 2 years ago. #3 I myself don't have many questions. I usually find my answers elsewhere or just give up because I know the feature I need fixed or re-enabled will be blown off with some excuse or another. I really have very little faith that asking for a fix will make it actually happen. History just shows this. This thread itself seems to want a 3D pointer. Why not give a definitive answer to everyone if there is one in the works? If no, give a good reason why it isn't. It sounds like a feature we have needed almost from the very beginning 10 years ago. It obviously was a feature at least toyed with at some point. So whats up with the 3D pointer?
If you need the meat of my current problem in a form of a question, I guess I will bite. It's a hard one.
#1 Why did Nvidia chose to intentionally Disable 3D hardware that Nvidia 3D supporters bought to use with their Nvidia 3D capable cards? I am talking about the 3rd party Shutter Glasses, 3D Monitors, and 3D HMDs. People spent hundreds even THOUSANDS of DOLLARS to use and support Nvidias 3D movement started 10 years ago. These 3rd party devices were REQUIRED because Nvidia had no glasses of their own before the "3D Vision" branded glasses. It was clear Nvidia wanted us to use these 3rd party glasses as the standard way of viewing Nvidia 3D. That suddenly changed when your branded glasses hit the market. Through various methods the many hardcore users proved the disabling was intentional and not a compatibility issue. By simply plugging in the Nvidia branded emitter which unlocks the drivers and cloning the displays so 120Hz is locked on 2 video outputs. New branded glasses on 1 and older shutter on 2. Suddenly some of these old shutters with manual On/Off switches start functioning perfectly. All they need is the 120Hz image and they are good to go. The catch being the user must first buy a new Nvidia branded glasses kit to get his/her old glasses set functioning again. That kind of defeats the purpose. Additionally many devices had no manual On/Off switches and required a special Nvidia signal coming from the drivers to switch on. Those devices a now completely useless. My HMD most times showes to the OS as a PnP Monitor. Because of this 3D Vision refuses to output the Page Flipped image to the port the HMD is on and thats all it needs. This all begs the questions, Do you guys appreciate at all the many loyal followers you gained over the years with Nvidia 3D? Do you care at all that they spent hundreds supporting your 3D development so you could bring your own refined and branded glasses to market?
Why all the hate threads? Almost all the oldtime supporters hate you now because you intentionally disabled our 3D Equipment. We all spent hundreds on supporting your development. You want us to shelve our perfectly functional glasses/devices in favor of your Nvidia branded glasses which we basically already bought. Not a single "We are sorry", no compensation, no nothing. Basically a bend over and take it attitude from Nvidia. These new comers are hating on you because there are obvious flaws and/or missing features that would make the whole 3D Vision system work better. To be honest, I think they do complain a bit too much without all the facts or understanding of how things work. I myself understand many things can't be fixed driver side. Games need to be put together in such a way to meld well with 3D technology. On the other hand there are many fixes/tweaks that can be fixed driverside but never are because Nvidia doesn't see them as a priority. Additionally we have no control to fix them ourselves. Some problems are so damn simple its laughable yet they never get addressed. Glasses sync comes to mind.
My suggestion to Nvidia is do something to fix relations with all of us that have working yet non-functional equipment that was disabled in drivers. That will ALWAYS be a reason for us to chime in when a hater thread pops up. Just as important is the following! We the users need more control over our experience. That "Let's make a giant list of all NVIDIA 3D Vision failures" thread is basically a cry for more tweakability and control on the user end. It takes AGES for a new driver with minor fixes to come out. Giving the users some tweakability may actually solve some problems for you free of charge.
I am very PASSIONATE about 3D and very PISSED at NVidia. I have spent several thousand dollars on 3D equipment alone. I have also bought exclusively NVidia all the way back to the Riva TnT. I stuck with NVidia strictly for 3D at first. I then realized they make great quality graphics cards and didn't mind staying. Unfortunately the ONLY reason I am still on NVidia hardware is because I want 3D functionality. My loyalty was crushed with the proprietary glasses. Yes I have them. Yes they are great. Yes I hate NVidia for forcing me to buy them and shelve my perfectly good older ones. 3D is the "New Thing" ATM so I suggest Nvidia needs to play nice with its consumers before a new comparable solution comes to market. Hint, Hint, I know of one that will be ready soon and it works with all these "3D Vision Ready" monitors to.
[quote name='andrewf@nvidia' date='21 March 2011 - 10:11 PM' timestamp='1300745471' post='1211366']
Hi
When I say we have been doing this for two years, I mean the new 3DV product, features etc. It takes time to get the team comfortable with giving everything out to users. So when I say we have been doing this two years, I mean supporting 3D Vision.
What questions do you want to see answered? I have answered a TON of questions on this forum. I have over 1100 posts. I respond to users about new features that are coming (Window mode, checkerboard support for 3DTV Play). I try to tell them of known issues. Please tell me what question isnt answered that you have. Please do not say I only answer the easy ones. I am in these "heated" threads right now trying to respond to users.
[/quote]
You do your job perfectly. You work as the perfect intermediary between the devs and the the community. Most companies don't even do that. My loyalty is with NVIDIA. I think everyone on this board feels the same way. You do your job well and that is never in question. You do answer all questions and respond almost always. The poster you were responding to is just mad that NVIDIA abandoned 3D at a certain point and is venting his frustration the same way I vent about no stereo mouse cursor and a lack of "ease of use" features. But ultimately I did my research. NVIDIA still offers the best stereo 3d solution and you guys are doing great. I'm just greedy for more features and perfect game profiles.
Sometimes we all get caught up in our favorite games and when a 2D billboard pops out and makes you cross and recross your eyes it's just soo annoying. Then we think, well just hook all 2Dbillboard objects and let us make it transparent, TEXMOd does it. Then I get frustrated and make a post of out of rage. LOL
If you're still reading. Ask your devs these questions.
1. What is their favorite game on the PC?
2. Then see if the profile is Excellent or 3D ready.
If their favorite game is not 3D ready or excellent then it means they are not passionate gamers. What I mean by this is their devotion to making a perfect profile for a game is in question. Someone who loves Dragon Age or Mass Effect and has control over profiling games will not sleep until the profile is perfect.
I truly believe that your devs are not TRUE gamers or they simply don't have time to play games. I wish that your code was in the hands of a hardcore gamers / programmers. I know i'm not a 3d programmer, but I'm willing to step out of my area of expertise and into the "noob" zone to learn.
Now I"m going to start typing out of rage........
1. I WANT A STEREO MOUSE CURSOR, IF I HAD YOUR SOURCE CODE I WOULD DO IT.
2. I WANT TOTAL CONTROL OVER PROFILING GAMES SO I CAN MAKE THEM PERFECT OR DIE TRYING.
3. I WANT TO ADD A WHOLE BUNCH OF FEATURES
4. I WANT TO TURN OFF THOSE STUPID WARNING MESSAGES THAT SHOW UP
5. I HATE WHEN THE GLASSES BLINK IN THE LEFT EYE, THAT IS TOTALLY UN-NECESSARY.
lol, see as long as you let me vent my frustration we're good! :P
[quote name='andrewf@nvidia' date='21 March 2011 - 10:11 PM' timestamp='1300745471' post='1211366']
Hi
When I say we have been doing this for two years, I mean the new 3DV product, features etc. It takes time to get the team comfortable with giving everything out to users. So when I say we have been doing this two years, I mean supporting 3D Vision.
What questions do you want to see answered? I have answered a TON of questions on this forum. I have over 1100 posts. I respond to users about new features that are coming (Window mode, checkerboard support for 3DTV Play). I try to tell them of known issues. Please tell me what question isnt answered that you have. Please do not say I only answer the easy ones. I am in these "heated" threads right now trying to respond to users.
You do your job perfectly. You work as the perfect intermediary between the devs and the the community. Most companies don't even do that. My loyalty is with NVIDIA. I think everyone on this board feels the same way. You do your job well and that is never in question. You do answer all questions and respond almost always. The poster you were responding to is just mad that NVIDIA abandoned 3D at a certain point and is venting his frustration the same way I vent about no stereo mouse cursor and a lack of "ease of use" features. But ultimately I did my research. NVIDIA still offers the best stereo 3d solution and you guys are doing great. I'm just greedy for more features and perfect game profiles.
Sometimes we all get caught up in our favorite games and when a 2D billboard pops out and makes you cross and recross your eyes it's just soo annoying. Then we think, well just hook all 2Dbillboard objects and let us make it transparent, TEXMOd does it. Then I get frustrated and make a post of out of rage. LOL
If you're still reading. Ask your devs these questions.
1. What is their favorite game on the PC?
2. Then see if the profile is Excellent or 3D ready.
If their favorite game is not 3D ready or excellent then it means they are not passionate gamers. What I mean by this is their devotion to making a perfect profile for a game is in question. Someone who loves Dragon Age or Mass Effect and has control over profiling games will not sleep until the profile is perfect.
I truly believe that your devs are not TRUE gamers or they simply don't have time to play games. I wish that your code was in the hands of a hardcore gamers / programmers. I know i'm not a 3d programmer, but I'm willing to step out of my area of expertise and into the "noob" zone to learn.
Now I"m going to start typing out of rage........
1. I WANT A STEREO MOUSE CURSOR, IF I HAD YOUR SOURCE CODE I WOULD DO IT.
2. I WANT TOTAL CONTROL OVER PROFILING GAMES SO I CAN MAKE THEM PERFECT OR DIE TRYING.
3. I WANT TO ADD A WHOLE BUNCH OF FEATURES
4. I WANT TO TURN OFF THOSE STUPID WARNING MESSAGES THAT SHOW UP
5. I HATE WHEN THE GLASSES BLINK IN THE LEFT EYE, THAT IS TOTALLY UN-NECESSARY.
lol, see as long as you let me vent my frustration we're good! :P
Sigh... saw this coming a mile out. Sorry Foreverseeking, but you've heard about all the informed discussion you are going to get on this topic. You might try searching the forum for posts that are more than 4 months old or just checking Google.
Sigh... saw this coming a mile out. Sorry Foreverseeking, but you've heard about all the informed discussion you are going to get on this topic. You might try searching the forum for posts that are more than 4 months old or just checking Google.
[quote name='foreverseeking' date='21 March 2011 - 12:41 PM' timestamp='1300711271' post='1211050']
I would have no idea how to mod this, but im guessing that you wouldn't need to make the pointer grow, it would just be a 2d bitmap that changes its level of depth depending on how fair away something is that your hovering over. I would bet it could be done even if it was difficult. Ah well, here's to hoping. It would be so great if games developers opened up older games more to the communiuty so people could try and rectify thesew problems from within the game code. Would be fantastic to have all old games working perfectly with 3d!
[/quote]
I didn't mean to hijack the thread. The best solution I've found is to:
1. edit the dragon age .CUR mouse image files with a program called http://www.microangelo.us/ You can find the mouse image files in the [b]cursors[/b]folder in the dragon age directory.
2. edit the the common .CUR files and replace them with a 1 or 2 pixel red dot.
Then in game the mouse cursor won't be as intrusive. When you move the mouse around you'll see the two red dots and when you keep the mouse still it blends into the scene naturally so you don't notice it as much.
I uninstalled the game and it deleted the cur files I edited or I would of uploaded them. I should of saved em! But it's not hard to do, it's pretty easy to edit them.
[b]Toolset[/b]
I've used that toolset for about five months creating multiple mods. It doesn't give you access to any core parts of the game unfortunately. No mouse cursor control, no portrait control. I went down deep into the 2da's and pretty much covered every exposed method in script and didn't see anything. Of course this doesn't mean you shouldn't try but I didn't see anything close :(
[quote name='foreverseeking' date='21 March 2011 - 12:41 PM' timestamp='1300711271' post='1211050']
I would have no idea how to mod this, but im guessing that you wouldn't need to make the pointer grow, it would just be a 2d bitmap that changes its level of depth depending on how fair away something is that your hovering over. I would bet it could be done even if it was difficult. Ah well, here's to hoping. It would be so great if games developers opened up older games more to the communiuty so people could try and rectify thesew problems from within the game code. Would be fantastic to have all old games working perfectly with 3d!
I didn't mean to hijack the thread. The best solution I've found is to:
1. edit the dragon age .CUR mouse image files with a program called http://www.microangelo.us/ You can find the mouse image files in the cursorsfolder in the dragon age directory.
2. edit the the common .CUR files and replace them with a 1 or 2 pixel red dot.
Then in game the mouse cursor won't be as intrusive. When you move the mouse around you'll see the two red dots and when you keep the mouse still it blends into the scene naturally so you don't notice it as much.
I uninstalled the game and it deleted the cur files I edited or I would of uploaded them. I should of saved em! But it's not hard to do, it's pretty easy to edit them.
Toolset
I've used that toolset for about five months creating multiple mods. It doesn't give you access to any core parts of the game unfortunately. No mouse cursor control, no portrait control. I went down deep into the 2da's and pretty much covered every exposed method in script and didn't see anything. Of course this doesn't mean you shouldn't try but I didn't see anything close :(
No worries man, to be honest made interesting reading, feel sorry for the guys that got screwed by nvidia, really stupid business as it's the initial investors in tech that turn it into a reality. I'm sure in Europe they will be forces to make a 3d standard, or if not forced, pressured, as its very anti competition. Nvidia could have easily sold their driver to guys with 3rd party hardware, and offered it for free with their own glasses. Problem solved, and nvidia would have still made money but without crapting on their customers.
One point that was made though,
Nvidia dude, is there a 3d mouse in the works? If not, is that because it's not a priority or you've tried but it has serious issues? If you are not working on a 3d mouse, is there any chance of opening up the drivers to the community, as we all know if it's possible, someone out there will do it and for free!
No worries man, to be honest made interesting reading, feel sorry for the guys that got screwed by nvidia, really stupid business as it's the initial investors in tech that turn it into a reality. I'm sure in Europe they will be forces to make a 3d standard, or if not forced, pressured, as its very anti competition. Nvidia could have easily sold their driver to guys with 3rd party hardware, and offered it for free with their own glasses. Problem solved, and nvidia would have still made money but without crapting on their customers.
One point that was made though,
Nvidia dude, is there a 3d mouse in the works? If not, is that because it's not a priority or you've tried but it has serious issues? If you are not working on a 3d mouse, is there any chance of opening up the drivers to the community, as we all know if it's possible, someone out there will do it and for free!
The issue with a 3D cursor is the steps needed to make it 3D. Yes, we have experimented with it in house in the past. The problem is the performance is really poor. In some cases you get 2-3fps for the mouse cursor if we try to force one. That is not a good experience for consumers.
The issue with a 3D cursor is the steps needed to make it 3D. Yes, we have experimented with it in house in the past. The problem is the performance is really poor. In some cases you get 2-3fps for the mouse cursor if we try to force one. That is not a good experience for consumers.
[quote name='andrewf@nvidia' date='23 March 2011 - 05:46 PM' timestamp='1300902393' post='1212151']
Hi
The issue with a 3D cursor is the steps needed to make it 3D. Yes, we have experimented with it in house in the past. The problem is the performance is really poor. In some cases you get 2-3fps for the mouse cursor if we try to force one. That is not a good experience for consumers.
[/quote]
Did you recreate a 3d mouse cursor from scratch or did you simply make the laser crosshair follow the mouse x,y dynamically?
[quote name='andrewf@nvidia' date='23 March 2011 - 05:46 PM' timestamp='1300902393' post='1212151']
Hi
The issue with a 3D cursor is the steps needed to make it 3D. Yes, we have experimented with it in house in the past. The problem is the performance is really poor. In some cases you get 2-3fps for the mouse cursor if we try to force one. That is not a good experience for consumers.
Did you recreate a 3d mouse cursor from scratch or did you simply make the laser crosshair follow the mouse x,y dynamically?
Dragon age origins looks and plays great, but obviously has a 2d cursor. Any chance you guys are working or will work on in the future a 3d cursor we could implement into a game like this?
cheers
P.s.
The bug you have profiled for this game that character pictures only appear in one eye disappears when your main character talks to that person.
Dragon age origins looks and plays great, but obviously has a 2d cursor. Any chance you guys are working or will work on in the future a 3d cursor we could implement into a game like this?
cheers
P.s.
The bug you have profiled for this game that character pictures only appear in one eye disappears when your main character talks to that person.
OS: Win 8 CPU: I7 4770k 3.5GZ GPU: GTX 780ti
But then, Dragon Age: Origins has a pretty good toolset for making mods. Maybe you could fix this bug yourself?
I've seen that character portrait bug do all sorts of wonky stuff. It sure is a strange bug but it isn't really too bothersome. The 2D pointer can be a killer, though.
But then, Dragon Age: Origins has a pretty good toolset for making mods. Maybe you could fix this bug yourself?
I've seen that character portrait bug do all sorts of wonky stuff. It sure is a strange bug but it isn't really too bothersome. The 2D pointer can be a killer, though.
Not just Dragon Age but any game where you need to click on objects at depth. We need the developers to make the pointer a 3D object that goes to the depth of the thing it is selecting. (It will probably need to grow/shrink, too, so you don't end up with a tiny little pointer when you try to select something far off.) As far as I know, World of Warcraft is the only game to have done this so far.
But then, Dragon Age: Origins has a pretty good toolset for making mods. Maybe you could fix this bug yourself?
I've seen that character portrait bug do all sorts of wonky stuff. It sure is a strange bug but it isn't really too bothersome. The 2D pointer can be a killer, though.
[/quote]
I would have no idea how to mod this, but im guessing that you wouldn't need to make the pointer grow, it would just be a 2d bitmap that changes its level of depth depending on how fair away something is that your hovering over. I would bet it could be done even if it was difficult. Ah well, here's to hoping. It would be so great if games developers opened up older games more to the communiuty so people could try and rectify thesew problems from within the game code. Would be fantastic to have all old games working perfectly with 3d!
Not just Dragon Age but any game where you need to click on objects at depth. We need the developers to make the pointer a 3D object that goes to the depth of the thing it is selecting. (It will probably need to grow/shrink, too, so you don't end up with a tiny little pointer when you try to select something far off.) As far as I know, World of Warcraft is the only game to have done this so far.
But then, Dragon Age: Origins has a pretty good toolset for making mods. Maybe you could fix this bug yourself?
I've seen that character portrait bug do all sorts of wonky stuff. It sure is a strange bug but it isn't really too bothersome. The 2D pointer can be a killer, though.
I would have no idea how to mod this, but im guessing that you wouldn't need to make the pointer grow, it would just be a 2d bitmap that changes its level of depth depending on how fair away something is that your hovering over. I would bet it could be done even if it was difficult. Ah well, here's to hoping. It would be so great if games developers opened up older games more to the communiuty so people could try and rectify thesew problems from within the game code. Would be fantastic to have all old games working perfectly with 3d!
OS: Win 8 CPU: I7 4770k 3.5GZ GPU: GTX 780ti
A user named Dragon from really.ru created a 3rd party application back in 2006 or 2007.
As you can see he made a stereo 3d cursor. From what I hear it WORKED at the expense of a high performance hit. But at the driver level implementing such a feature should be far more efficient as proven with nvidia's laser cross hair which functions VERY similar to a stereo 3d mouse cursor (statically in the middle vs dynamically move around).
[size="4"][b]My question is why a random user from the community can make a functioning 3d mouse cursor but NVIDIA cannot?[/b][/size]
I wonder if NVIDIA thinks it's a waste of time because of the in game image tied to the mouse cursor, worried it might get in the way? The counter argument is that the in game mouse image can be made transparent with a 3rd party app or the .CUR files can be found and deleted from within the games folder.
A user named Dragon from really.ru created a 3rd party application back in 2006 or 2007.
As you can see he made a stereo 3d cursor. From what I hear it WORKED at the expense of a high performance hit. But at the driver level implementing such a feature should be far more efficient as proven with nvidia's laser cross hair which functions VERY similar to a stereo 3d mouse cursor (statically in the middle vs dynamically move around).
My question is why a random user from the community can make a functioning 3d mouse cursor but NVIDIA cannot?
I wonder if NVIDIA thinks it's a waste of time because of the in game image tied to the mouse cursor, worried it might get in the way? The counter argument is that the in game mouse image can be made transparent with a 3rd party app or the .CUR files can be found and deleted from within the games folder.
I am all for bashing Nvidia where they are trying to screw the consumers or their general incompetence. God knows they have done some BRUTAL SCREWING to us long time Nvidia 3D customers. They also seem to have left out many commonsense features that were in their older pre-monopoly drivers. Unfortunately in this case I think they stopped the development of a 3D cursor. It may still be in the works. No one knows except Nvidia themselves. Even then I am not so sure. Communication internally and with consumers seems lacking for the "3D Vision" team. Either that or they really want us to know certain things.
Having a Competent and Trustworthy representative to answer any and all questions that arise with their "3D Vision" product is ESENTIAL for the products success. This 3D stuff is very new to alot of users. There needs to be someone they can count on to answer their questions. There is also a group of old timers that have been using nvidia's 3D hardware/software for 10+ years. We need at minimum the same functionality in the drivers we had before Nvidia tried to Monopolize the PC 3D market by disabling functionality of a HUGE list of hardware that had been dependent on Nvidia for 8+ years! Nvidia would not be here with their branded "3D Vision" glasses if not for all the development work achieved while using 3rd party shutter glasses in the first place! To make matters worse, when a question is asked it is usually ignored. Even worse is when the question is answered with a guarded answer or obvious lie to save face.
All that said, I do appreciate that there is a Nvidia representative answering some questions. That's a step in the right direction. Unfortunately there is a LONG way to go in earning the respect back from us long time Nvidia 3D consumers.
THREE Steps to improve Mine and many others view of Nvidia and their 3D Vision project.
#1 APOLOGIZE to your long time supporters for Disabling/Blocking the use of our 3D hardware that is dependent on Nvidia Drivers to function!
(I personally own a $1,000 HMD that depends on Nvidia's drivers to function! It is rendered worthless because Nvidia decided to disable functionality which is still in the drivers.)
#2 DON'T LIE - I say this because of a recent claim by Nvidia that they have only had 2 years developing "3D Vision". I have been using Nvidia 3D for 10+ years! The drivers still list games from 5+ years ago! Some of which use DX7 and no longer work because of current OS and DX versions yet they still get an "Excellent" Compatibility rating within the drivers. The OLD history of "3D Vision" is still visible for all to see in the current drivers. I firmly believe Nvidia is trying to erace the publics memory to save face. They dont want to admit they BACK STABBED their long time customer base in a shameless effort to grab control of the PC 3D market.
#3 COMMUNICATE - Answer questions! Don't just respond to the easy ones! Don't avoid us to save face. That just makes you look worse! Also keep us up to date on what is going on with 3D Vision development. That helps keep spirits up and build confidence in the product!
Damn I went off on a tangent lol! Well as you can see. My wounds run very deep!
I am all for bashing Nvidia where they are trying to screw the consumers or their general incompetence. God knows they have done some BRUTAL SCREWING to us long time Nvidia 3D customers. They also seem to have left out many commonsense features that were in their older pre-monopoly drivers. Unfortunately in this case I think they stopped the development of a 3D cursor. It may still be in the works. No one knows except Nvidia themselves. Even then I am not so sure. Communication internally and with consumers seems lacking for the "3D Vision" team. Either that or they really want us to know certain things.
Having a Competent and Trustworthy representative to answer any and all questions that arise with their "3D Vision" product is ESENTIAL for the products success. This 3D stuff is very new to alot of users. There needs to be someone they can count on to answer their questions. There is also a group of old timers that have been using nvidia's 3D hardware/software for 10+ years. We need at minimum the same functionality in the drivers we had before Nvidia tried to Monopolize the PC 3D market by disabling functionality of a HUGE list of hardware that had been dependent on Nvidia for 8+ years! Nvidia would not be here with their branded "3D Vision" glasses if not for all the development work achieved while using 3rd party shutter glasses in the first place! To make matters worse, when a question is asked it is usually ignored. Even worse is when the question is answered with a guarded answer or obvious lie to save face.
All that said, I do appreciate that there is a Nvidia representative answering some questions. That's a step in the right direction. Unfortunately there is a LONG way to go in earning the respect back from us long time Nvidia 3D consumers.
THREE Steps to improve Mine and many others view of Nvidia and their 3D Vision project.
#1 APOLOGIZE to your long time supporters for Disabling/Blocking the use of our 3D hardware that is dependent on Nvidia Drivers to function!
(I personally own a $1,000 HMD that depends on Nvidia's drivers to function! It is rendered worthless because Nvidia decided to disable functionality which is still in the drivers.)
#2 DON'T LIE - I say this because of a recent claim by Nvidia that they have only had 2 years developing "3D Vision". I have been using Nvidia 3D for 10+ years! The drivers still list games from 5+ years ago! Some of which use DX7 and no longer work because of current OS and DX versions yet they still get an "Excellent" Compatibility rating within the drivers. The OLD history of "3D Vision" is still visible for all to see in the current drivers. I firmly believe Nvidia is trying to erace the publics memory to save face. They dont want to admit they BACK STABBED their long time customer base in a shameless effort to grab control of the PC 3D market.
#3 COMMUNICATE - Answer questions! Don't just respond to the easy ones! Don't avoid us to save face. That just makes you look worse! Also keep us up to date on what is going on with 3D Vision development. That helps keep spirits up and build confidence in the product!
Damn I went off on a tangent lol! Well as you can see. My wounds run very deep!
When I say we have been doing this for two years, I mean the new 3DV product, features etc. It takes time to get the team comfortable with giving everything out to users. So when I say we have been doing this two years, I mean supporting 3D Vision.
What questions do you want to see answered? I have answered a TON of questions on this forum. I have over 1100 posts. I respond to users about new features that are coming (Window mode, checkerboard support for 3DTV Play). I try to tell them of known issues. Please tell me what question isnt answered that you have. Please do not say I only answer the easy ones. I am in these "heated" threads right now trying to respond to users.
When I say we have been doing this for two years, I mean the new 3DV product, features etc. It takes time to get the team comfortable with giving everything out to users. So when I say we have been doing this two years, I mean supporting 3D Vision.
What questions do you want to see answered? I have answered a TON of questions on this forum. I have over 1100 posts. I respond to users about new features that are coming (Window mode, checkerboard support for 3DTV Play). I try to tell them of known issues. Please tell me what question isnt answered that you have. Please do not say I only answer the easy ones. I am in these "heated" threads right now trying to respond to users.
Hi
When I say we have been doing this for two years, I mean the new 3DV product, features etc. It takes time to get the team comfortable with giving everything out to users. So when I say we have been doing this two years, I mean supporting 3D Vision.
What questions do you want to see answered? I have answered a TON of questions on this forum. I have over 1100 posts. I respond to users about new features that are coming (Window mode, checkerboard support for 3DTV Play). I try to tell them of known issues. Please tell me what question isnt answered that you have. Please do not say I only answer the easy ones. I am in these "heated" threads right now trying to respond to users.
[/quote] Hmm, sounds like a play on words to me. I also noticed you edited your post and took out the 2 years thing. For all those interested here is the original.
[quote name='andrewf@nvidia' date='18 March 2011 - 12:22 PM' timestamp='1300745471' post='1211366']
Wazoo
I replied on another thread you are on about the profiles. Creating profiles is hard and takes a lot of training. We are considering how to open those up to the community but it does take a trained eye to do it.
If you remember we didnt open up SLI profiles at first, but we did over time. Give us time, we've only been doing 3D Vision now for a little over 2 years.
[/quote] http://forums.nvidia.com/index.php?showtopic=195791&st=20 In this thread that 2 years comment was enough to piss off another longtime user forcing him to sign up and point out how much it sounded like a pile of BS. I agree with him. This claim really sounds like you want people to believe Nvidia has only been working on 3D for 2 years when in fact it has been 10 years. Nvidia's actions with driver support/disabling devices and zero response to the user base when it happened also points to Nvidia wanting to cover up the past. All us hardcore users know Shutter Glasses are a very simple device. It doesn't take long to develop glasses that sync with the 120Hz refresh. Nvidia could have brought out its own glasses ages ago! We know the real hard work is in the 3D drivers. Those 3D Vision drivers and features have been in development for 10+ years. In fact you have been supporting 3DV for 10+ years. You finally gave it a name when you brought out your own glasses 2 years ago. Please don't play off that technicality.
Simply put, we long time users don't really care about this "2 years" thing. It was simply a hole in the facade that "3D Vision" is something new. Additionally, acting like you didn't backstab all your long time supports by intentionally disabling our older devices forcing us to buy your branded glasses. That's what really makes us mad.
That said, you sill avoided the #1. Apologize. Acknowledge you intentionally disabled our older Nvidia reliant devices. #2 you seem to have tried to side step that one with a technicality because you only named your 3D drivers when you brought out your glasses 2 years ago. #3 I myself don't have many questions. I usually find my answers elsewhere or just give up because I know the feature I need fixed or re-enabled will be blown off with some excuse or another. I really have very little faith that asking for a fix will make it actually happen. History just shows this. This thread itself seems to want a 3D pointer. Why not give a definitive answer to everyone if there is one in the works? If no, give a good reason why it isn't. It sounds like a feature we have needed almost from the very beginning 10 years ago. It obviously was a feature at least toyed with at some point. So whats up with the 3D pointer?
If you need the meat of my current problem in a form of a question, I guess I will bite. It's a hard one.
#1 Why did Nvidia chose to intentionally Disable 3D hardware that Nvidia 3D supporters bought to use with their Nvidia 3D capable cards? I am talking about the 3rd party Shutter Glasses, 3D Monitors, and 3D HMDs. People spent hundreds even THOUSANDS of DOLLARS to use and support Nvidias 3D movement started 10 years ago. These 3rd party devices were REQUIRED because Nvidia had no glasses of their own before the "3D Vision" branded glasses. It was clear Nvidia wanted us to use these 3rd party glasses as the standard way of viewing Nvidia 3D. That suddenly changed when your branded glasses hit the market. Through various methods the many hardcore users proved the disabling was intentional and not a compatibility issue. By simply plugging in the Nvidia branded emitter which unlocks the drivers and cloning the displays so 120Hz is locked on 2 video outputs. New branded glasses on 1 and older shutter on 2. Suddenly some of these old shutters with manual On/Off switches start functioning perfectly. All they need is the 120Hz image and they are good to go. The catch being the user must first buy a new Nvidia branded glasses kit to get his/her old glasses set functioning again. That kind of defeats the purpose. Additionally many devices had no manual On/Off switches and required a special Nvidia signal coming from the drivers to switch on. Those devices a now completely useless. My HMD most times showes to the OS as a PnP Monitor. Because of this 3D Vision refuses to output the Page Flipped image to the port the HMD is on and thats all it needs. This all begs the questions, Do you guys appreciate at all the many loyal followers you gained over the years with Nvidia 3D? Do you care at all that they spent hundreds supporting your 3D development so you could bring your own refined and branded glasses to market?
Why all the hate threads? Almost all the oldtime supporters hate you now because you intentionally disabled our 3D Equipment. We all spent hundreds on supporting your development. You want us to shelve our perfectly functional glasses/devices in favor of your Nvidia branded glasses which we basically already bought. Not a single "We are sorry", no compensation, no nothing. Basically a bend over and take it attitude from Nvidia. These new comers are hating on you because there are obvious flaws and/or missing features that would make the whole 3D Vision system work better. To be honest, I think they do complain a bit too much without all the facts or understanding of how things work. I myself understand many things can't be fixed driver side. Games need to be put together in such a way to meld well with 3D technology. On the other hand there are many fixes/tweaks that can be fixed driverside but never are because Nvidia doesn't see them as a priority. Additionally we have no control to fix them ourselves. Some problems are so damn simple its laughable yet they never get addressed. Glasses sync comes to mind.
My suggestion to Nvidia is do something to fix relations with all of us that have working yet non-functional equipment that was disabled in drivers. That will ALWAYS be a reason for us to chime in when a hater thread pops up. Just as important is the following! We the users need more control over our experience. That "Let's make a giant list of all NVIDIA 3D Vision failures" thread is basically a cry for more tweakability and control on the user end. It takes AGES for a new driver with minor fixes to come out. Giving the users some tweakability may actually solve some problems for you free of charge.
I am very PASSIONATE about 3D and very PISSED at NVidia. I have spent several thousand dollars on 3D equipment alone. I have also bought exclusively NVidia all the way back to the Riva TnT. I stuck with NVidia strictly for 3D at first. I then realized they make great quality graphics cards and didn't mind staying. Unfortunately the ONLY reason I am still on NVidia hardware is because I want 3D functionality. My loyalty was crushed with the proprietary glasses. Yes I have them. Yes they are great. Yes I hate NVidia for forcing me to buy them and shelve my perfectly good older ones. 3D is the "New Thing" ATM so I suggest Nvidia needs to play nice with its consumers before a new comparable solution comes to market. Hint, Hint, I know of one that will be ready soon and it works with all these "3D Vision Ready" monitors to.
Hi
When I say we have been doing this for two years, I mean the new 3DV product, features etc. It takes time to get the team comfortable with giving everything out to users. So when I say we have been doing this two years, I mean supporting 3D Vision.
What questions do you want to see answered? I have answered a TON of questions on this forum. I have over 1100 posts. I respond to users about new features that are coming (Window mode, checkerboard support for 3DTV Play). I try to tell them of known issues. Please tell me what question isnt answered that you have. Please do not say I only answer the easy ones. I am in these "heated" threads right now trying to respond to users.
Hmm, sounds like a play on words to me. I also noticed you edited your post and took out the 2 years thing. For all those interested here is the original.
[quote name='andrewf@nvidia' date='18 March 2011 - 12:22 PM' timestamp='1300745471' post='1211366']
Wazoo
I replied on another thread you are on about the profiles. Creating profiles is hard and takes a lot of training. We are considering how to open those up to the community but it does take a trained eye to do it.
If you remember we didnt open up SLI profiles at first, but we did over time. Give us time, we've only been doing 3D Vision now for a little over 2 years.
http://forums.nvidia.com/index.php?showtopic=195791&st=20 In this thread that 2 years comment was enough to piss off another longtime user forcing him to sign up and point out how much it sounded like a pile of BS. I agree with him. This claim really sounds like you want people to believe Nvidia has only been working on 3D for 2 years when in fact it has been 10 years. Nvidia's actions with driver support/disabling devices and zero response to the user base when it happened also points to Nvidia wanting to cover up the past. All us hardcore users know Shutter Glasses are a very simple device. It doesn't take long to develop glasses that sync with the 120Hz refresh. Nvidia could have brought out its own glasses ages ago! We know the real hard work is in the 3D drivers. Those 3D Vision drivers and features have been in development for 10+ years. In fact you have been supporting 3DV for 10+ years. You finally gave it a name when you brought out your own glasses 2 years ago. Please don't play off that technicality.
Simply put, we long time users don't really care about this "2 years" thing. It was simply a hole in the facade that "3D Vision" is something new. Additionally, acting like you didn't backstab all your long time supports by intentionally disabling our older devices forcing us to buy your branded glasses. That's what really makes us mad.
That said, you sill avoided the #1. Apologize. Acknowledge you intentionally disabled our older Nvidia reliant devices. #2 you seem to have tried to side step that one with a technicality because you only named your 3D drivers when you brought out your glasses 2 years ago. #3 I myself don't have many questions. I usually find my answers elsewhere or just give up because I know the feature I need fixed or re-enabled will be blown off with some excuse or another. I really have very little faith that asking for a fix will make it actually happen. History just shows this. This thread itself seems to want a 3D pointer. Why not give a definitive answer to everyone if there is one in the works? If no, give a good reason why it isn't. It sounds like a feature we have needed almost from the very beginning 10 years ago. It obviously was a feature at least toyed with at some point. So whats up with the 3D pointer?
If you need the meat of my current problem in a form of a question, I guess I will bite. It's a hard one.
#1 Why did Nvidia chose to intentionally Disable 3D hardware that Nvidia 3D supporters bought to use with their Nvidia 3D capable cards? I am talking about the 3rd party Shutter Glasses, 3D Monitors, and 3D HMDs. People spent hundreds even THOUSANDS of DOLLARS to use and support Nvidias 3D movement started 10 years ago. These 3rd party devices were REQUIRED because Nvidia had no glasses of their own before the "3D Vision" branded glasses. It was clear Nvidia wanted us to use these 3rd party glasses as the standard way of viewing Nvidia 3D. That suddenly changed when your branded glasses hit the market. Through various methods the many hardcore users proved the disabling was intentional and not a compatibility issue. By simply plugging in the Nvidia branded emitter which unlocks the drivers and cloning the displays so 120Hz is locked on 2 video outputs. New branded glasses on 1 and older shutter on 2. Suddenly some of these old shutters with manual On/Off switches start functioning perfectly. All they need is the 120Hz image and they are good to go. The catch being the user must first buy a new Nvidia branded glasses kit to get his/her old glasses set functioning again. That kind of defeats the purpose. Additionally many devices had no manual On/Off switches and required a special Nvidia signal coming from the drivers to switch on. Those devices a now completely useless. My HMD most times showes to the OS as a PnP Monitor. Because of this 3D Vision refuses to output the Page Flipped image to the port the HMD is on and thats all it needs. This all begs the questions, Do you guys appreciate at all the many loyal followers you gained over the years with Nvidia 3D? Do you care at all that they spent hundreds supporting your 3D development so you could bring your own refined and branded glasses to market?
Why all the hate threads? Almost all the oldtime supporters hate you now because you intentionally disabled our 3D Equipment. We all spent hundreds on supporting your development. You want us to shelve our perfectly functional glasses/devices in favor of your Nvidia branded glasses which we basically already bought. Not a single "We are sorry", no compensation, no nothing. Basically a bend over and take it attitude from Nvidia. These new comers are hating on you because there are obvious flaws and/or missing features that would make the whole 3D Vision system work better. To be honest, I think they do complain a bit too much without all the facts or understanding of how things work. I myself understand many things can't be fixed driver side. Games need to be put together in such a way to meld well with 3D technology. On the other hand there are many fixes/tweaks that can be fixed driverside but never are because Nvidia doesn't see them as a priority. Additionally we have no control to fix them ourselves. Some problems are so damn simple its laughable yet they never get addressed. Glasses sync comes to mind.
My suggestion to Nvidia is do something to fix relations with all of us that have working yet non-functional equipment that was disabled in drivers. That will ALWAYS be a reason for us to chime in when a hater thread pops up. Just as important is the following! We the users need more control over our experience. That "Let's make a giant list of all NVIDIA 3D Vision failures" thread is basically a cry for more tweakability and control on the user end. It takes AGES for a new driver with minor fixes to come out. Giving the users some tweakability may actually solve some problems for you free of charge.
I am very PASSIONATE about 3D and very PISSED at NVidia. I have spent several thousand dollars on 3D equipment alone. I have also bought exclusively NVidia all the way back to the Riva TnT. I stuck with NVidia strictly for 3D at first. I then realized they make great quality graphics cards and didn't mind staying. Unfortunately the ONLY reason I am still on NVidia hardware is because I want 3D functionality. My loyalty was crushed with the proprietary glasses. Yes I have them. Yes they are great. Yes I hate NVidia for forcing me to buy them and shelve my perfectly good older ones. 3D is the "New Thing" ATM so I suggest Nvidia needs to play nice with its consumers before a new comparable solution comes to market. Hint, Hint, I know of one that will be ready soon and it works with all these "3D Vision Ready" monitors to.
Hi
When I say we have been doing this for two years, I mean the new 3DV product, features etc. It takes time to get the team comfortable with giving everything out to users. So when I say we have been doing this two years, I mean supporting 3D Vision.
What questions do you want to see answered? I have answered a TON of questions on this forum. I have over 1100 posts. I respond to users about new features that are coming (Window mode, checkerboard support for 3DTV Play). I try to tell them of known issues. Please tell me what question isnt answered that you have. Please do not say I only answer the easy ones. I am in these "heated" threads right now trying to respond to users.
[/quote]
You do your job perfectly. You work as the perfect intermediary between the devs and the the community. Most companies don't even do that. My loyalty is with NVIDIA. I think everyone on this board feels the same way. You do your job well and that is never in question. You do answer all questions and respond almost always. The poster you were responding to is just mad that NVIDIA abandoned 3D at a certain point and is venting his frustration the same way I vent about no stereo mouse cursor and a lack of "ease of use" features. But ultimately I did my research. NVIDIA still offers the best stereo 3d solution and you guys are doing great. I'm just greedy for more features and perfect game profiles.
Sometimes we all get caught up in our favorite games and when a 2D billboard pops out and makes you cross and recross your eyes it's just soo annoying. Then we think, well just hook all 2Dbillboard objects and let us make it transparent, TEXMOd does it. Then I get frustrated and make a post of out of rage. LOL
If you're still reading. Ask your devs these questions.
1. What is their favorite game on the PC?
2. Then see if the profile is Excellent or 3D ready.
If their favorite game is not 3D ready or excellent then it means they are not passionate gamers. What I mean by this is their devotion to making a perfect profile for a game is in question. Someone who loves Dragon Age or Mass Effect and has control over profiling games will not sleep until the profile is perfect.
I truly believe that your devs are not TRUE gamers or they simply don't have time to play games. I wish that your code was in the hands of a hardcore gamers / programmers. I know i'm not a 3d programmer, but I'm willing to step out of my area of expertise and into the "noob" zone to learn.
Now I"m going to start typing out of rage........
1. I WANT A STEREO MOUSE CURSOR, IF I HAD YOUR SOURCE CODE I WOULD DO IT.
2. I WANT TOTAL CONTROL OVER PROFILING GAMES SO I CAN MAKE THEM PERFECT OR DIE TRYING.
3. I WANT TO ADD A WHOLE BUNCH OF FEATURES
4. I WANT TO TURN OFF THOSE STUPID WARNING MESSAGES THAT SHOW UP
5. I HATE WHEN THE GLASSES BLINK IN THE LEFT EYE, THAT IS TOTALLY UN-NECESSARY.
lol, see as long as you let me vent my frustration we're good! :P
Hi
When I say we have been doing this for two years, I mean the new 3DV product, features etc. It takes time to get the team comfortable with giving everything out to users. So when I say we have been doing this two years, I mean supporting 3D Vision.
What questions do you want to see answered? I have answered a TON of questions on this forum. I have over 1100 posts. I respond to users about new features that are coming (Window mode, checkerboard support for 3DTV Play). I try to tell them of known issues. Please tell me what question isnt answered that you have. Please do not say I only answer the easy ones. I am in these "heated" threads right now trying to respond to users.
You do your job perfectly. You work as the perfect intermediary between the devs and the the community. Most companies don't even do that. My loyalty is with NVIDIA. I think everyone on this board feels the same way. You do your job well and that is never in question. You do answer all questions and respond almost always. The poster you were responding to is just mad that NVIDIA abandoned 3D at a certain point and is venting his frustration the same way I vent about no stereo mouse cursor and a lack of "ease of use" features. But ultimately I did my research. NVIDIA still offers the best stereo 3d solution and you guys are doing great. I'm just greedy for more features and perfect game profiles.
Sometimes we all get caught up in our favorite games and when a 2D billboard pops out and makes you cross and recross your eyes it's just soo annoying. Then we think, well just hook all 2Dbillboard objects and let us make it transparent, TEXMOd does it. Then I get frustrated and make a post of out of rage. LOL
If you're still reading. Ask your devs these questions.
1. What is their favorite game on the PC?
2. Then see if the profile is Excellent or 3D ready.
If their favorite game is not 3D ready or excellent then it means they are not passionate gamers. What I mean by this is their devotion to making a perfect profile for a game is in question. Someone who loves Dragon Age or Mass Effect and has control over profiling games will not sleep until the profile is perfect.
I truly believe that your devs are not TRUE gamers or they simply don't have time to play games. I wish that your code was in the hands of a hardcore gamers / programmers. I know i'm not a 3d programmer, but I'm willing to step out of my area of expertise and into the "noob" zone to learn.
Now I"m going to start typing out of rage........
1. I WANT A STEREO MOUSE CURSOR, IF I HAD YOUR SOURCE CODE I WOULD DO IT.
2. I WANT TOTAL CONTROL OVER PROFILING GAMES SO I CAN MAKE THEM PERFECT OR DIE TRYING.
3. I WANT TO ADD A WHOLE BUNCH OF FEATURES
4. I WANT TO TURN OFF THOSE STUPID WARNING MESSAGES THAT SHOW UP
5. I HATE WHEN THE GLASSES BLINK IN THE LEFT EYE, THAT IS TOTALLY UN-NECESSARY.
lol, see as long as you let me vent my frustration we're good! :P
I would have no idea how to mod this, but im guessing that you wouldn't need to make the pointer grow, it would just be a 2d bitmap that changes its level of depth depending on how fair away something is that your hovering over. I would bet it could be done even if it was difficult. Ah well, here's to hoping. It would be so great if games developers opened up older games more to the communiuty so people could try and rectify thesew problems from within the game code. Would be fantastic to have all old games working perfectly with 3d!
[/quote]
I didn't mean to hijack the thread. The best solution I've found is to:
1. edit the dragon age .CUR mouse image files with a program called http://www.microangelo.us/ You can find the mouse image files in the [b]cursors[/b]folder in the dragon age directory.
2. edit the the common .CUR files and replace them with a 1 or 2 pixel red dot.
Then in game the mouse cursor won't be as intrusive. When you move the mouse around you'll see the two red dots and when you keep the mouse still it blends into the scene naturally so you don't notice it as much.
I uninstalled the game and it deleted the cur files I edited or I would of uploaded them. I should of saved em! But it's not hard to do, it's pretty easy to edit them.
[b]Toolset[/b]
I've used that toolset for about five months creating multiple mods. It doesn't give you access to any core parts of the game unfortunately. No mouse cursor control, no portrait control. I went down deep into the 2da's and pretty much covered every exposed method in script and didn't see anything. Of course this doesn't mean you shouldn't try but I didn't see anything close :(
I would have no idea how to mod this, but im guessing that you wouldn't need to make the pointer grow, it would just be a 2d bitmap that changes its level of depth depending on how fair away something is that your hovering over. I would bet it could be done even if it was difficult. Ah well, here's to hoping. It would be so great if games developers opened up older games more to the communiuty so people could try and rectify thesew problems from within the game code. Would be fantastic to have all old games working perfectly with 3d!
I didn't mean to hijack the thread. The best solution I've found is to:
1. edit the dragon age .CUR mouse image files with a program called http://www.microangelo.us/ You can find the mouse image files in the cursorsfolder in the dragon age directory.
2. edit the the common .CUR files and replace them with a 1 or 2 pixel red dot.
Then in game the mouse cursor won't be as intrusive. When you move the mouse around you'll see the two red dots and when you keep the mouse still it blends into the scene naturally so you don't notice it as much.
I uninstalled the game and it deleted the cur files I edited or I would of uploaded them. I should of saved em! But it's not hard to do, it's pretty easy to edit them.
Toolset
I've used that toolset for about five months creating multiple mods. It doesn't give you access to any core parts of the game unfortunately. No mouse cursor control, no portrait control. I went down deep into the 2da's and pretty much covered every exposed method in script and didn't see anything. Of course this doesn't mean you shouldn't try but I didn't see anything close :(
One point that was made though,
Nvidia dude, is there a 3d mouse in the works? If not, is that because it's not a priority or you've tried but it has serious issues? If you are not working on a 3d mouse, is there any chance of opening up the drivers to the community, as we all know if it's possible, someone out there will do it and for free!
Cheers all.
One point that was made though,
Nvidia dude, is there a 3d mouse in the works? If not, is that because it's not a priority or you've tried but it has serious issues? If you are not working on a 3d mouse, is there any chance of opening up the drivers to the community, as we all know if it's possible, someone out there will do it and for free!
Cheers all.
OS: Win 8 CPU: I7 4770k 3.5GZ GPU: GTX 780ti
The issue with a 3D cursor is the steps needed to make it 3D. Yes, we have experimented with it in house in the past. The problem is the performance is really poor. In some cases you get 2-3fps for the mouse cursor if we try to force one. That is not a good experience for consumers.
The issue with a 3D cursor is the steps needed to make it 3D. Yes, we have experimented with it in house in the past. The problem is the performance is really poor. In some cases you get 2-3fps for the mouse cursor if we try to force one. That is not a good experience for consumers.
Hi
The issue with a 3D cursor is the steps needed to make it 3D. Yes, we have experimented with it in house in the past. The problem is the performance is really poor. In some cases you get 2-3fps for the mouse cursor if we try to force one. That is not a good experience for consumers.
[/quote]
Did you recreate a 3d mouse cursor from scratch or did you simply make the laser crosshair follow the mouse x,y dynamically?
Hi
The issue with a 3D cursor is the steps needed to make it 3D. Yes, we have experimented with it in house in the past. The problem is the performance is really poor. In some cases you get 2-3fps for the mouse cursor if we try to force one. That is not a good experience for consumers.
Did you recreate a 3d mouse cursor from scratch or did you simply make the laser crosshair follow the mouse x,y dynamically?