Building up a 3D gaming Console (Windows)
Hi, I wanted to buy a steam machine but they didn't look so good to me. I recently saw Asrock M8 mini ITX which comes with the LGA1150 Z87 motherboard at a shop close to me, selling it for about 400e. I like the case though it comes with a 450w adapter. [url]http://www.asrock.com/nettop/Intel/M8%20Series/[/url] My question is what CPU VGA and RAM should I pack in this for minimal heat and power consumption, considering my power limit, according to tom's hardware: [i]The 450 W power supply by FSP surprises us with its two 6+2-pin auxiliary power connectors. In theory, that would allow the platform to power a GeForce GTX 690, except that all of that output is carried by only three +12 V leads. ASRock recommends a graphics power limit of 200 W, probably because each of the PSU's two rails has a 216 W limit. Still, that gets you into GeForce GTX 680 territory.[/i] I want to play games preferably in HD 3D or nHD 3D with a samsung 3D TV. What I had in mind was a 960, 970 VGA with the new pentium anniversary CPU, Though I suspect the CPU can handle 3D and 970 has a big memory issue (I wanna play 3D), any ideas? Note: I can only use laptop memories on this ATX!, VGA size limit is: [i]Max. Supported VGA Dimension: 290mm x 137mm x 43.5mm; Max. Supported TDP: 200W (If you use a graphics card with over 200W TDP, please note that the system’s power supply is only 450W.)[/i]
Hi,
I wanted to buy a steam machine but they didn't look so good to me.
I recently saw Asrock M8 mini ITX which comes with the LGA1150 Z87 motherboard at a shop close to me, selling it for about 400e.
I like the case though it comes with a 450w adapter. http://www.asrock.com/nettop/Intel/M8%20Series/
My question is what CPU VGA and RAM should I pack in this for minimal heat and power consumption, considering my power limit, according to tom's hardware:

The 450 W power supply by FSP surprises us with its two 6+2-pin auxiliary power connectors. In theory, that would allow the platform to power a GeForce GTX 690, except that all of that output is carried by only three +12 V leads. ASRock recommends a graphics power limit of 200 W, probably because each of the PSU's two rails has a 216 W limit. Still, that gets you into GeForce GTX 680 territory.

I want to play games preferably in HD 3D or nHD 3D with a samsung 3D TV. What I had in mind was a 960, 970 VGA with the new pentium anniversary CPU, Though I suspect the CPU can handle 3D and 970 has a big memory issue (I wanna play 3D), any ideas?

Note: I can only use laptop memories on this ATX!, VGA size limit is:
Max. Supported VGA Dimension: 290mm x 137mm x 43.5mm; Max. Supported TDP: 200W
(If you use a graphics card with over 200W TDP, please note that the system’s power supply is only 450W.)

#1
Posted 10/08/2015 12:02 PM   
First off. That encloser will only accept a "low profile" GPU. If it limits you to a single slot GPU, your choices are very limited and in most cases the Intel integrated graphics will outperform them. That's not saying that the Intel graphics are anything amazing, they are not. It's saying that you're basicly screwed, if this is the case. If it will accept a dual slot GPU, your choices increase somewhat, but the best you can get currently is a GTX 750ti. Depending on the manufacturer and model, the Power Supply may be inadequate for a top of the line 750ti. Here again, your limiting yourself to a poor choice of power supplies because of the low profile form factor. Sure you can easily find a decent one, but there are fewer options, so this may be a problem depending on what's available to you in your area. Secondly. Stereoscopic (3D) gaming requires a lot of resources, twice that of a 2D game. If you are planning on playing any upcoming or recently released games that are rendering in DX11, you'll definitely want something beefier. Nvidia is currently the best solution stereoscopic gaming. This is due to the [color="orange"]comunity[/color] of stereoscopic enthusiasts that are constantly releasing compatibility patches for games. So for this reason alone, I'd recommend that you get a Nvidia GPU. http://helixmod.blogspot.com/2013/10/game-list-automatically-updated.html EDIT: It took me a few minutes to find it, but this is a great post that will help you grasp what I'm saying http://techreport.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=94408
First off.

That encloser will only accept a "low profile" GPU. If it limits you to a single slot GPU, your choices are very limited and in most cases the Intel integrated graphics will outperform them. That's not saying that the Intel graphics are anything amazing, they are not. It's saying that you're basicly screwed, if this is the case.

If it will accept a dual slot GPU, your choices increase somewhat, but the best you can get currently is a GTX 750ti. Depending on the manufacturer and model, the Power Supply may be inadequate for a top of the line 750ti. Here again, your limiting yourself to a poor choice of power supplies because of the low profile form factor. Sure you can easily find a decent one, but there are fewer options, so this may be a problem depending on what's available to you in your area.

Secondly.

Stereoscopic (3D) gaming requires a lot of resources, twice that of a 2D game. If you are planning on playing any upcoming or recently released games that are rendering in DX11, you'll definitely want something beefier.

Nvidia is currently the best solution stereoscopic gaming. This is due to the comunity of stereoscopic enthusiasts that are constantly releasing compatibility patches for games. So for this reason alone, I'd recommend that you get a Nvidia GPU.


http://helixmod.blogspot.com/2013/10/game-list-automatically-updated.html

EDIT: It took me a few minutes to find it, but this is a great post that will help you grasp what I'm saying

http://techreport.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=94408

#2
Posted 10/08/2015 06:56 PM   
Pci-e riser could be used, like in this article: [url]http://www.anandtech.com/show/7604/asrock-m8/2[/url], but i wouldn't use that hardware for 3D gaming setup thou :/ A solid PSU of at least 500-600W is a good start, and top tier nVidia GPU is a must. If the OP can sacrifice some more cash and space, we can recommend a basic configuration.
Pci-e riser could be used, like in this article: http://www.anandtech.com/show/7604/asrock-m8/2, but i wouldn't use that hardware for 3D gaming setup thou :/

A solid PSU of at least 500-600W is a good start, and top tier nVidia GPU is a must.

If the OP can sacrifice some more cash and space, we can recommend a basic configuration.

Ryzen 1700X 3.9GHz | Asrock X370 Taichi | 16GB G.Skill
GTX 1080 Ti SLI | 850W EVGA P2 | Win7x64
Asus VG278HR | Panasonic TX-58EX750B 4K Active 3D

#3
Posted 10/08/2015 08:17 PM   
guys I need more specific details. it's a double slot! I can have 970 on my the system isn't it better than 750ti specially considering the power consumption? It does accept one good gpu no sli. I'm building up a console not a monster. on the case of cpu do I need more than 2 cores? how much is necessary how much is recommended?
guys I need more specific details.
it's a double slot!
I can have 970 on my the system isn't it better than 750ti specially considering the power consumption?
It does accept one good gpu no sli. I'm building up a console not a monster.
on the case of cpu do I need more than 2 cores? how much is necessary how much is recommended?

#4
Posted 10/08/2015 09:13 PM   
Oopps I thought it was a typical mini PC case requiring a low profile GPU. It's pretty interesting what they did to accommodate a larger GPU. Watch starting around 17 minutes in https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3u_IAQcZH90 So forget everything I said about needing a low profile GPU/ GTX 750ti.
Oopps

I thought it was a typical mini PC case requiring a low profile GPU. It's pretty interesting what they did to accommodate a larger GPU.

Watch starting around 17 minutes in



So forget everything I said about needing a low profile GPU/ GTX 750ti.

#5
Posted 10/08/2015 10:02 PM   
oh, cool video, I just want it more now, any ideas with the cpu and VGA, what is the minimum and recommended specs for 3d gaming notice I won't go higher than 1440, HD and nHD 3D is enough for me.
oh, cool video, I just want it more now, any ideas with the cpu and VGA,
what is the minimum and recommended specs for 3d gaming notice I won't go higher than 1440, HD and nHD 3D is enough for me.

#6
Posted 10/08/2015 10:11 PM   
There is some CPU dependant games, so i'd go for quad core: [.]i5-4460 3.20GHz (Turbo Mode 3.40GHz)[/.] [.]i5-4570 3.20GHz (Turbo Mode 3.60GHz)[/.] [.]i5-4590 3.30GHz (Turbo Mode 3.70GHz)[/.] If you can fit GTX970, it is a great choice. And do not forget some moar RAM (preferably 2x8Gb), speed is not so important (-:
There is some CPU dependant games, so i'd go for quad core:
  • i5-4460 3.20GHz (Turbo Mode 3.40GHz)
  • i5-4570 3.20GHz (Turbo Mode 3.60GHz)
  • i5-4590 3.30GHz (Turbo Mode 3.70GHz)

  • If you can fit GTX970, it is a great choice.
    And do not forget some moar RAM (preferably 2x8Gb), speed is not so important (-:

    Ryzen 1700X 3.9GHz | Asrock X370 Taichi | 16GB G.Skill
    GTX 1080 Ti SLI | 850W EVGA P2 | Win7x64
    Asus VG278HR | Panasonic TX-58EX750B 4K Active 3D

    #7
    Posted 10/08/2015 11:14 PM   
    I believe 3DTV play still maxes out at 720p. So, not sure of the specifics but I think a PC that comfortably runs games at 1080p should be able to run 3DTV play just fine. I use a 560ti and games run pretty well for me, though I think all I've played are last-gen games.
    I believe 3DTV play still maxes out at 720p. So, not sure of the specifics but I think a PC that comfortably runs games at 1080p should be able to run 3DTV play just fine.

    I use a 560ti and games run pretty well for me, though I think all I've played are last-gen games.

    #8
    Posted 10/08/2015 11:14 PM   
    then is 960 enough? Cause 970 with memory issue probably doesn't worth 100e more! what about a cori3 with hyper threading?
    then is 960 enough?
    Cause 970 with memory issue probably doesn't worth 100e more!
    what about a cori3 with hyper threading?

    #9
    Posted 10/09/2015 09:47 AM   
    A lot depends upon your expectations versus what you'd like to spend. A single 960 would work at 1080p, but you'd have to turn down in-game settings to get playable frame rates in 3D. If you don't mind playing with eye-candy turned down, it would be an OK choice. Things we need to know- 1) What monitor are you planning to play on? I recommend a projector for best experience, and 720p makes it possible to get away with weaker hardware. 2) What games are you interested in? I know you are interested in Alien:Isolation, but what else? 3) What settings are you targeting? All at max, or no AA, lower textures OK? With regard to RAM, I have to disagree with mihabolil, there is no need for 16G today. Nothing will use even 8G, today. Unless you are going to be doing video editing or something like that. Get an SSD. Makes a MUCH bigger difference than more RAM. An i3 would probably be OK, but is below minimum spec for a number of games. So, depends upon what you want to play, and at what level. As noted, 3D Vision is pretty demanding. You need to be able to draw 2x the frames, one for each eye. PSU I would not worry about, as long as you go with a 9xx series card. People always *wildly* overspec their PSUs. 450W is easily enough for a single card+cpu, as long as you don't plan to overclock. It needs to be a quality brand though- no off brand chinese junk. As a rough idea, you can look at other websites benchmarks, and look for high enough performance to meet your needs. So, 120 fps examples would translate to 60 fps in 3D. If you can find i3+970 benchmarks you can get an idea of how well it will work. 970 card is a fine card, even with that idiotic memory design. Assume it's a 3.5G card, the last 500 is useless. That's still a fine card, and the benchmarks prove it's a pretty good value.
    A lot depends upon your expectations versus what you'd like to spend. A single 960 would work at 1080p, but you'd have to turn down in-game settings to get playable frame rates in 3D. If you don't mind playing with eye-candy turned down, it would be an OK choice.

    Things we need to know-
    1) What monitor are you planning to play on? I recommend a projector for best experience, and 720p makes it possible to get away with weaker hardware.
    2) What games are you interested in? I know you are interested in Alien:Isolation, but what else?
    3) What settings are you targeting? All at max, or no AA, lower textures OK?


    With regard to RAM, I have to disagree with mihabolil, there is no need for 16G today. Nothing will use even 8G, today. Unless you are going to be doing video editing or something like that.

    Get an SSD. Makes a MUCH bigger difference than more RAM.

    An i3 would probably be OK, but is below minimum spec for a number of games. So, depends upon what you want to play, and at what level. As noted, 3D Vision is pretty demanding. You need to be able to draw 2x the frames, one for each eye.

    PSU I would not worry about, as long as you go with a 9xx series card. People always *wildly* overspec their PSUs. 450W is easily enough for a single card+cpu, as long as you don't plan to overclock. It needs to be a quality brand though- no off brand chinese junk.


    As a rough idea, you can look at other websites benchmarks, and look for high enough performance to meet your needs. So, 120 fps examples would translate to 60 fps in 3D. If you can find i3+970 benchmarks you can get an idea of how well it will work.

    970 card is a fine card, even with that idiotic memory design. Assume it's a 3.5G card, the last 500 is useless. That's still a fine card, and the benchmarks prove it's a pretty good value.

    Acer H5360 (1280x720@120Hz) - ASUS VG248QE with GSync mod - 3D Vision 1&2 - Driver 372.54
    GTX 970 - i5-4670K@4.2GHz - 12GB RAM - Win7x64+evilKB2670838 - 4 Disk X25 RAID
    SAGER NP9870-S - GTX 980 - i7-6700K - Win10 Pro 1607
    Latest 3Dmigoto Release
    Bo3b's School for ShaderHackers

    #10
    Posted 10/09/2015 10:31 AM   
    Well, i tend to go into extremes sometimes, but that is because we can never have enough performance imo. Bellow is a video comparing i3 vs i5 and one of the cards is GTX780 witch is not too far from 970. [url]https://www.youtube.com/watch?t=67&v=aXPK9doyMLg[/url] More RAM i recommend, because couple years ago when i had just 6GB, i was getting very annoying "Low Memory" warnings while in game. But this might be just me :/
    Well, i tend to go into extremes sometimes, but that is because we can never have enough performance imo.

    Bellow is a video comparing i3 vs i5 and one of the cards is GTX780 witch is not too far from 970.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?t=67&v=aXPK9doyMLg


    More RAM i recommend, because couple years ago when i had just 6GB, i was getting very annoying "Low Memory" warnings while in game. But this might be just me :/

    Ryzen 1700X 3.9GHz | Asrock X370 Taichi | 16GB G.Skill
    GTX 1080 Ti SLI | 850W EVGA P2 | Win7x64
    Asus VG278HR | Panasonic TX-58EX750B 4K Active 3D

    #11
    Posted 10/09/2015 12:25 PM   
    Great Tips I would go with a Cori3-4170, it's faster than the one on the video . I think GTX-970 should be safe to play everything in 3D on High setting FHD-3D, at least the games which are optimized for the PC. I have to use SODIMM memory. What I'm planning to buy now is: MSI V317-001R (MSI GTX 970 (4!)GD5 OC) INTEL Core i3-4170 3 7GHz 3MB Cache Boxed CPU Samsung MZ-75E250B/EU EVO 850 interne SSD 250GB HyperX Impact HX316LS9IB/8 ram 8GB 1600MHz DDR3L CL9 SODIMM 1,35V With the asrsock it sums up to a tad higher than a 1000e what do you think is this combination good?
    Great Tips I would go with a Cori3-4170, it's faster than the one on the video .
    I think GTX-970 should be safe to play everything in 3D on High setting FHD-3D, at least the games which are optimized for the PC.
    I have to use SODIMM memory.

    What I'm planning to buy now is:
    MSI V317-001R (MSI GTX 970 (4!)GD5 OC)
    INTEL Core i3-4170 3 7GHz 3MB Cache Boxed CPU
    Samsung MZ-75E250B/EU EVO 850 interne SSD 250GB
    HyperX Impact HX316LS9IB/8 ram 8GB 1600MHz DDR3L CL9 SODIMM 1,35V

    With the asrsock it sums up to a tad higher than a 1000e
    what do you think
    is this combination good?

    #12
    Posted 10/09/2015 03:04 PM   
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