I think that the iZ3D has potential, but they still need to work on the technology for polarizing sub-pixels as they are doing it with pixels now. Would they manage to get that working, they would single-handedly eliminate all ghosting and tinting problems, since it would allow them to control every color of every pixel individually.
Drivers would need to be updated to use this possibility, but the algorithm for that is very similar to the one already used in current iZ3D drivers, so it should not really be a problem. A few settings to trim the drivers and all ghosting and tinting problems are solved.
If they'd also replace the display to have at least 900:1 contrast (now it's only 600:1) and add the option to raise/lower the monitor (it is really low now), the 22" iZ3D would be a perfect solution for gaming, IMHO.
As the iZ3D is currently the only option for gaming if you want to play the latest games using the latest graphics cards, I will stick to the iZ3D for the time being and watch out for possible alternatives, or simply wait for them to implement that sub-pixel thingy correctly. As far as the Zalman monitor goes, I've returned mine, since the interlacing issue was killing me (not to mention missing stereo drivers for Vista and newer graphics cards, which were supposed to be released in January).
EDIT:
"BlackQ" from iZ3D said that they are working on new glasses which would eliminate ghosting (or radically reduce it). He also said that there would be no need to make monitor modifications, which makes me optimistic about the monitor I have on my desk.
I think that the iZ3D has potential, but they still need to work on the technology for polarizing sub-pixels as they are doing it with pixels now. Would they manage to get that working, they would single-handedly eliminate all ghosting and tinting problems, since it would allow them to control every color of every pixel individually.
Drivers would need to be updated to use this possibility, but the algorithm for that is very similar to the one already used in current iZ3D drivers, so it should not really be a problem. A few settings to trim the drivers and all ghosting and tinting problems are solved.
If they'd also replace the display to have at least 900:1 contrast (now it's only 600:1) and add the option to raise/lower the monitor (it is really low now), the 22" iZ3D would be a perfect solution for gaming, IMHO.
As the iZ3D is currently the only option for gaming if you want to play the latest games using the latest graphics cards, I will stick to the iZ3D for the time being and watch out for possible alternatives, or simply wait for them to implement that sub-pixel thingy correctly. As far as the Zalman monitor goes, I've returned mine, since the interlacing issue was killing me (not to mention missing stereo drivers for Vista and newer graphics cards, which were supposed to be released in January).
EDIT:
"BlackQ" from iZ3D said that they are working on new glasses which would eliminate ghosting (or radically reduce it). He also said that there would be no need to make monitor modifications, which makes me optimistic about the monitor I have on my desk.
Is there any difference between the 19" and the 22"?
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I have nothing to compare too, but i have the Zalman 22". Whilst watching the demo CD and internlaced stereo images i have not witnessed any ghosting, the images and video are very sharp and clear.
I will give an update on the Zalman 22" performing with games as soon as the nvidia driver is released for Vista.
Is there any difference between the 19" and the 22"?
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I have nothing to compare too, but i have the Zalman 22". Whilst watching the demo CD and internlaced stereo images i have not witnessed any ghosting, the images and video are very sharp and clear.
I will give an update on the Zalman 22" performing with games as soon as the nvidia driver is released for Vista.
I can't say how much better the 3D image (regarding ghosting and text in interlace mode) will be on the 22" Zalman compared to the 19" Zalman, as I've returned the 19" Zalman two weeks ago, but I've just ordered the 22" Zalman monitor (today) and will be making a direct comparison to the 22" iZ3D when the new Zalman drivers for Vista are out (hopefully on February 22nd).
From what I can see reading the specs, the 22" Zalman monitor should be a bit better than the 19" Zalman ...
Pixels: 19" = 0.294 mm, 22" = 0.282 mm
Horz Freq: 19" = 52-81 kHz, 22" = 59-75 kHz
Vert Freq: 19" = 49-76 Hz, 22" = 56-76 Hz
Brightness: 19" = 300 cd/m2, 22" = 400 cd/m2
Vert 3D viewing angle: 19" = 6 - 8 deg, 22" = 8 - 12 deg
I can't say how much better the 3D image (regarding ghosting and text in interlace mode) will be on the 22" Zalman compared to the 19" Zalman, as I've returned the 19" Zalman two weeks ago, but I've just ordered the 22" Zalman monitor (today) and will be making a direct comparison to the 22" iZ3D when the new Zalman drivers for Vista are out (hopefully on February 22nd).
[quote name='Oruq' date='Feb 14 2008, 01:56 PM']From what I can see reading the specs, the 22" Zalman monitor should be a bit better than the 19" Zalman ...
I can't say how much better the 3D image (regarding ghosting and text in interlace mode) will be on the 22" Zalman compared to the 19" Zalman, as I've returned the 19" Zalman two weeks ago, but I've just ordered the 22" Zalman monitor (today) and will be making a direct comparison to the 22" iZ3D when the new Zalman drivers for Vista are out (hopefully on February 22nd).
[quote name='Oruq' date='Feb 14 2008, 01:56 PM']From what I can see reading the specs, the 22" Zalman monitor should be a bit better than the 19" Zalman ...
Pixels: 19" = 0.294 mm, 22" = 0.282 mm
Horz Freq: 19" = 52-81 kHz, 22" = 59-75 kHz
Vert Freq: 19" = 49-76 Hz, 22" = 56-76 Hz
Brightness: 19" = 300 cd/m2, 22" = 400 cd/m2
Vert 3D viewing angle: 19" = 6 - 8 deg, 22" = 8 - 12 deg
I can't say how much better the 3D image (regarding ghosting and text in interlace mode) will be on the 22" Zalman compared to the 19" Zalman, as I've returned the 19" Zalman two weeks ago, but I've just ordered the 22" Zalman monitor (today) and will be making a direct comparison to the 22" iZ3D when the new Zalman drivers for Vista are out (hopefully on February 22nd).
Regards,
Oruq
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I hope it will be better than the iZ3D because that one is more expensive and alot harder to get a hold on, for me.
I've received my 22" Zalman monitor today and checked the included demo video in S-3D. What I can say now is that the 22" Zalman is better than a 19" Zalman in two ways.
First, it has all the options you can imagine for tilting the monitor. You can pull the monitor up/down, as well as tilt it freely left/right, up/down and clockwise/anti-clockwise. This was a very nice surprise compared to the 19" Zalman, which I could only tilt up/down and nothing more (height and everything else is fix).
Second, the monitor itself has several color presets (using MWE button on the monitor), so you can easily switch between TEXT, GAME, MOVIE, SPORTS, SMOOTH and USER color setup, without tempering with the graphics card. As far as I can remember, the 19" Zalman monitor did not have that option.
But, everything else (except for 22" being in 16:10 format while 19" is in 4:3) seems to be the same on the 19" and the 22" monitors.
Brightness, Contrast and Viewing angle on the 22" Zalman monitor in 2D are excellent, which makes it a perfect replacement for a standard monitor, but that's also the case with the 19" Zalman.
Reflection is very high, so you can use the monitor as a mirror if you set your desktops background color to black. This can be solved by darkening the room and avoiding the use of any lights behind your back, so it's not a big deal.
As far as Stereo 3D image quality goes, the demo video is watchable once you find a good position/tilt for the monitor and keep your head still. There was almost no ghosting. If I wanted to be critical, I would say that there was max 5% ghosting on high contrast images, which was mostly visible on the demo video when watching stone tunel walls (bright color), which had a slight gost image inside the tunel (total blackness). Other than that, ghosting didn't seem to be an issue.
I can't comment on gameplay now, since new Vista stereo drivers aren't out yet (I wasn't happy with the old nVidia drivers), but I can't help having a bad feeling about the interlace mode, which seems to be the same on the 22" Zalman and on the 19" Zalman.
On the other hand, you never know what Zalman might have done with their drivers, and the release date is near (February 22nd), so I will refrain from giving any more comments on that until I see the new Vista drivers in action :)
I've received my 22" Zalman monitor today and checked the included demo video in S-3D. What I can say now is that the 22" Zalman is better than a 19" Zalman in two ways.
First, it has all the options you can imagine for tilting the monitor. You can pull the monitor up/down, as well as tilt it freely left/right, up/down and clockwise/anti-clockwise. This was a very nice surprise compared to the 19" Zalman, which I could only tilt up/down and nothing more (height and everything else is fix).
Second, the monitor itself has several color presets (using MWE button on the monitor), so you can easily switch between TEXT, GAME, MOVIE, SPORTS, SMOOTH and USER color setup, without tempering with the graphics card. As far as I can remember, the 19" Zalman monitor did not have that option.
But, everything else (except for 22" being in 16:10 format while 19" is in 4:3) seems to be the same on the 19" and the 22" monitors.
Brightness, Contrast and Viewing angle on the 22" Zalman monitor in 2D are excellent, which makes it a perfect replacement for a standard monitor, but that's also the case with the 19" Zalman.
Reflection is very high, so you can use the monitor as a mirror if you set your desktops background color to black. This can be solved by darkening the room and avoiding the use of any lights behind your back, so it's not a big deal.
As far as Stereo 3D image quality goes, the demo video is watchable once you find a good position/tilt for the monitor and keep your head still. There was almost no ghosting. If I wanted to be critical, I would say that there was max 5% ghosting on high contrast images, which was mostly visible on the demo video when watching stone tunel walls (bright color), which had a slight gost image inside the tunel (total blackness). Other than that, ghosting didn't seem to be an issue.
I can't comment on gameplay now, since new Vista stereo drivers aren't out yet (I wasn't happy with the old nVidia drivers), but I can't help having a bad feeling about the interlace mode, which seems to be the same on the 22" Zalman and on the 19" Zalman.
On the other hand, you never know what Zalman might have done with their drivers, and the release date is near (February 22nd), so I will refrain from giving any more comments on that until I see the new Vista drivers in action :)
I now have more positive info on the 22" Zalman monitor in stereo ...
From testing the iZ3D monitor, I have a bunch of stereo snapshots done with the iZ3D driver in games where ghosting was really bad on the iZ3D monitor. I've used these images to try and trim the iZ3D monitor to reduce ghosting as much as possible, but was never able to get good results (ghosting was always there and at least to me, disturbing).
And now, since snapshots are done in side-by-side mode (complete L and R images), I can watch them on the Zalman monitor by changing stereo display mode to interlaced. Man, was I up for a surprise.
Yes, there is about 5% ghosting on the Zalman on some very high contrast areas, like bright yellow lights in the night sky (you would see the lights dimmed double). But, other than that minor quirk, there was virtually NO GHOSTING on the Zalman monitor, even though the exact same images have had really bad ghosting issues on the iZ3D monitor.
All snapshots I've made from games using the iZ3D driver where ghosting was really really bad on the iZ3D monitor, give a perfectly clear stereo image on the Zalman monitor, except for one thing: Text and small icons are blury because of the interlace mode and no special handling.
The biggest difference was on snapshots from EVE Online, where asteroids would now have a very dim side-image, but the image did not affect the stereo experience. On the iZ3D monitor, I would always see the roids double in some color.
I've also tested with some photos I could find in side-by-side mode on the internet. While I could not get a good stereo image on the iZ3D monitor (most photos had deep background, which resulted in really bad ghosting on iZ3D), Zalman had absolutely no problems displaying these images in a clear stereo 3D experience. That was absolutely awesome!
I've also made a test where I would place 2 completely different images for the left and the right eye. While iZ3D monitor was showing total crap by mixing the two images together and displaying some blur to both eyes, the Zalman monitor has done a PERFECT image separation, giving each eye the correct image, with no side-effects. One eye would see one image crystal clear, while the other eye would see the other image crystal clear. Now ... THAT is what I call clear stereo separation :)
After this test, I have to say that I really really *really* hope that Zalman has done something to make the text and small 2D icons display better in stereo 3D, since that is currently the only thing that doesn't work very well on the Zalman. If the new stereo drivers work on Vista with the latest nVidia cards, the 22" Zalman monitor will definitely be my choice for S-3D.
PS. I've just read that iZ3D is thinking about offering their stereo drivers for use with third-party solutions. In case iZ3D would implement interlaced mode for stereo viewing and the Zalman stereo drivers wouldn't work well, I think that iZ3D monitors will soon become a thing from the past. As far as stereo drivers go, iZ3D has done an excellent job, but the technology just doesn't work right (too much ghosting spoiling the experience).
I now have more positive info on the 22" Zalman monitor in stereo ...
From testing the iZ3D monitor, I have a bunch of stereo snapshots done with the iZ3D driver in games where ghosting was really bad on the iZ3D monitor. I've used these images to try and trim the iZ3D monitor to reduce ghosting as much as possible, but was never able to get good results (ghosting was always there and at least to me, disturbing).
And now, since snapshots are done in side-by-side mode (complete L and R images), I can watch them on the Zalman monitor by changing stereo display mode to interlaced. Man, was I up for a surprise.
Yes, there is about 5% ghosting on the Zalman on some very high contrast areas, like bright yellow lights in the night sky (you would see the lights dimmed double). But, other than that minor quirk, there was virtually NO GHOSTING on the Zalman monitor, even though the exact same images have had really bad ghosting issues on the iZ3D monitor.
All snapshots I've made from games using the iZ3D driver where ghosting was really really bad on the iZ3D monitor, give a perfectly clear stereo image on the Zalman monitor, except for one thing: Text and small icons are blury because of the interlace mode and no special handling.
The biggest difference was on snapshots from EVE Online, where asteroids would now have a very dim side-image, but the image did not affect the stereo experience. On the iZ3D monitor, I would always see the roids double in some color.
I've also tested with some photos I could find in side-by-side mode on the internet. While I could not get a good stereo image on the iZ3D monitor (most photos had deep background, which resulted in really bad ghosting on iZ3D), Zalman had absolutely no problems displaying these images in a clear stereo 3D experience. That was absolutely awesome!
I've also made a test where I would place 2 completely different images for the left and the right eye. While iZ3D monitor was showing total crap by mixing the two images together and displaying some blur to both eyes, the Zalman monitor has done a PERFECT image separation, giving each eye the correct image, with no side-effects. One eye would see one image crystal clear, while the other eye would see the other image crystal clear. Now ... THAT is what I call clear stereo separation :)
After this test, I have to say that I really really *really* hope that Zalman has done something to make the text and small 2D icons display better in stereo 3D, since that is currently the only thing that doesn't work very well on the Zalman. If the new stereo drivers work on Vista with the latest nVidia cards, the 22" Zalman monitor will definitely be my choice for S-3D.
PS. I've just read that iZ3D is thinking about offering their stereo drivers for use with third-party solutions. In case iZ3D would implement interlaced mode for stereo viewing and the Zalman stereo drivers wouldn't work well, I think that iZ3D monitors will soon become a thing from the past. As far as stereo drivers go, iZ3D has done an excellent job, but the technology just doesn't work right (too much ghosting spoiling the experience).
Just so I don't make comparisons out of memory, I've connected the iZ3D monitor again and looked at the stereo images now.
There is absolutely no doubt that the iZ3D monitor has REALLY REALLY *REALLY* HUGE problems with ghosting. While all game snapshots and photos look perfectly clear, give a nice stereo experience and were pleasant to look at on the 22" Zalman monitor, the exact same images and photos look have a lot of artifacts and suffer from major ghosting on the 22" iZ3D monitor.
Looking at text on white background, the Zalman monitor shows perfectly crystal white and black, while the same text on the iZ3D monitor looks unsharp (default settings on both monitors). And the same goes for all other colors.
Looking at the the test image in nVidia control panel, I can simply not get the iZ3D monitor to give me a full set of gray scale colors. On the other hand, the Zalman monitor displays a perfect grayscale (you can count the color blocks) at default settings.
The iZ3D monitor is also very sensitive to vertical and horizontal tilt, as well as up/down head movements in 2D, which Zalman has no problems with (clear image from a very wide viewing angle in all directions). In stereo 3D mode, iZ3D is also highly sensitive to head "rotation", where even a single degree can make a big difference. Zalman is quite indifferent to head tilting, with the image always being crystal clear. The only thing Zalman does not like very mich is when you move your head up and down a few cm, while with the iZ3D every milimeter counts.
Another thing I can not explain is that my eyes always start burning after using the iZ3D monitor for longer than 5 minutes, but I have had absolutely no problems using the Zalman monitor for hours throughout the day.
I don't have the 19" Zalman monitor anymore, but if I remember right, I had more ghosting issues there than on the 22" Zalman. Ghosting on the 19" Zalman was not as high as on the iZ3D monitor, but it was there.
After having had the 19" and 22" Zalman, as well as 22" iZ3D monitors, the only monitor I can recommend for watching movies in S-3D is the 22" Zalman. The 100 EUR price diference between the 19" and 22" Zalman monitors is (in my opinion) simply not worth saving. I can not recommend the iZ3D monitor to anyone who is looking for a clear 3D stereo image, since the iZ3D monitor has really big problems with ghosting and is overall a worse 2D monitor than both Zalman monitors, which spoils the whole experience.
Now, let's hope the stereo drivers from Zalman are at least as good as the ones from iZ3D.
Just so I don't make comparisons out of memory, I've connected the iZ3D monitor again and looked at the stereo images now.
There is absolutely no doubt that the iZ3D monitor has REALLY REALLY *REALLY* HUGE problems with ghosting. While all game snapshots and photos look perfectly clear, give a nice stereo experience and were pleasant to look at on the 22" Zalman monitor, the exact same images and photos look have a lot of artifacts and suffer from major ghosting on the 22" iZ3D monitor.
Looking at text on white background, the Zalman monitor shows perfectly crystal white and black, while the same text on the iZ3D monitor looks unsharp (default settings on both monitors). And the same goes for all other colors.
Looking at the the test image in nVidia control panel, I can simply not get the iZ3D monitor to give me a full set of gray scale colors. On the other hand, the Zalman monitor displays a perfect grayscale (you can count the color blocks) at default settings.
The iZ3D monitor is also very sensitive to vertical and horizontal tilt, as well as up/down head movements in 2D, which Zalman has no problems with (clear image from a very wide viewing angle in all directions). In stereo 3D mode, iZ3D is also highly sensitive to head "rotation", where even a single degree can make a big difference. Zalman is quite indifferent to head tilting, with the image always being crystal clear. The only thing Zalman does not like very mich is when you move your head up and down a few cm, while with the iZ3D every milimeter counts.
Another thing I can not explain is that my eyes always start burning after using the iZ3D monitor for longer than 5 minutes, but I have had absolutely no problems using the Zalman monitor for hours throughout the day.
I don't have the 19" Zalman monitor anymore, but if I remember right, I had more ghosting issues there than on the 22" Zalman. Ghosting on the 19" Zalman was not as high as on the iZ3D monitor, but it was there.
After having had the 19" and 22" Zalman, as well as 22" iZ3D monitors, the only monitor I can recommend for watching movies in S-3D is the 22" Zalman. The 100 EUR price diference between the 19" and 22" Zalman monitors is (in my opinion) simply not worth saving. I can not recommend the iZ3D monitor to anyone who is looking for a clear 3D stereo image, since the iZ3D monitor has really big problems with ghosting and is overall a worse 2D monitor than both Zalman monitors, which spoils the whole experience.
Now, let's hope the stereo drivers from Zalman are at least as good as the ones from iZ3D.
[quote name='RAGEdemon' date='Jan 31 2008, 05:34 PM']You know...
There is always an active projected solution. There is no noticeable ghosting (unless you concentrate hard) but there is heavy flicker, which at least I can get used to easily. Decent projectors run at 85Hz and a good 2500+ lumens won't cost over $1000. But these still rely on the nVidia driver.
IMHO, the projector produces the best results overall if the driver isn't taken into account... but what good is it without a driver to make it work?
No good what so ever. I have abandoned my projector for stereo gaming for the time being and use iZ3D only for stereo3D.
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Um, I have projected Polarized, it is really the way to go, a decent (100" + @16:9) silver screen is available for quite a bit less than $200.
The real breakthrough will come when Circular polarized Color wheel (AKA Dolby3D) DLP projectors are available for home use. The wheel is seperated left and right, and the image for each eye gets "flashed" 2 or 3x per frame (per eye!), all controlled by the DLP wheel in hardware.
The beauty of this is that we could have high resolution, large screen size, and cheap ($0.50-$15) glasses so everyone could join in the fun.
Is there anything really wrong with the Zalman way (besides the price)? Just because it is only 5xx vertical resolution isn't a big deal, it still has full horizontal resolution.
As far as the nVidia driver goes, yes they need to support it, but we are only getting farther away because of Microsoft and Vista/DX10, the writers of the standards for rendering/acceleration need to recognize this and make allowances. (slightly OT, but they also need to stabilize multi-screen acceleration, we can easily, for less than $1000, put a pair of mid-high-end cards and 4 displays on one PC, this needs work. To bring this back to the topic, when do we get the Zalman 3x monitor experience? Front viewport, left and right viewport, and all in [passive] 3D? Flicker is not an option as I suffer from Seasonal Migraines and Nausea, as well as a constant aversion to even 60hz refreshes.)
There is always an active projected solution. There is no noticeable ghosting (unless you concentrate hard) but there is heavy flicker, which at least I can get used to easily. Decent projectors run at 85Hz and a good 2500+ lumens won't cost over $1000. But these still rely on the nVidia driver.
IMHO, the projector produces the best results overall if the driver isn't taken into account... but what good is it without a driver to make it work?
No good what so ever. I have abandoned my projector for stereo gaming for the time being and use iZ3D only for stereo3D.
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Um, I have projected Polarized, it is really the way to go, a decent (100" + @16:9) silver screen is available for quite a bit less than $200.
The real breakthrough will come when Circular polarized Color wheel (AKA Dolby3D) DLP projectors are available for home use. The wheel is seperated left and right, and the image for each eye gets "flashed" 2 or 3x per frame (per eye!), all controlled by the DLP wheel in hardware.
The beauty of this is that we could have high resolution, large screen size, and cheap ($0.50-$15) glasses so everyone could join in the fun.
Is there anything really wrong with the Zalman way (besides the price)? Just because it is only 5xx vertical resolution isn't a big deal, it still has full horizontal resolution.
As far as the nVidia driver goes, yes they need to support it, but we are only getting farther away because of Microsoft and Vista/DX10, the writers of the standards for rendering/acceleration need to recognize this and make allowances. (slightly OT, but they also need to stabilize multi-screen acceleration, we can easily, for less than $1000, put a pair of mid-high-end cards and 4 displays on one PC, this needs work. To bring this back to the topic, when do we get the Zalman 3x monitor experience? Front viewport, left and right viewport, and all in [passive] 3D? Flicker is not an option as I suffer from Seasonal Migraines and Nausea, as well as a constant aversion to even 60hz refreshes.)
[quote name='Oruq' date='Jan 27 2008, 01:04 PM']As far as 2D image quality goes, the monitor seems to be better than my 19" Hansol (white is more "white" and the image has more contrast), but that doesn't mean it's worth $600 USD as a 2D monitor.
For playing 3D games, as much as I would like to, I can NOT recommend the 19" Zalman, mostly because of the interlace mode it uses. Interlace mode makes all the text very hard to read, because the driver doesn't care much about text, it simply draws it without any considerations taken into account for the fact that left eye sees only odd lines while the right eye sees only even lines and that lines are duplicated. It's hard to explain what the result of this is without seing it, but here is an example of the letter E:
If in 2D the letter E would look like this ...
xxxxxx
xx
xx
xxxxxx
xx
xx
xxxxxx
The same letter "E" seen through the left eye in 3D stereo on Zalman:
xxxxxx
xxxxxx
xx
xx
xx
xx
xxxxxx
xxxxxx
Letter "E" seen through the right eye in 3D stereo on Zalman:
xx
xx
xxxxxx
xxxxxx
xx
xx
xx
Maybe someone can make something out of this, but for me, text which would be normally readable if it wasn't for the interlace mode, was completely unreadable the way it's drawin in 3D stereo with nVidia drivers.
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Question:
Is the text drawn at 0 (screen) depth? Have you attempted to set convergence (possibly even without using the glasses) until the text resolves?
Is there any reason to have text that isn't at screen depth? (besides possibly floating nicks on an fps?)
(PS, to anyone looking for a graphics solution, the 7950GT/7900GT/GS and GTO cards are all around $95-125 shipped on ebay right now, and they overclock like mad (mild voltmod most hit 650mhz stable, even past 700mhz with fancy cooling). I actually was getting similar framerates in most older games compared to my 8800GT).
if noise is a concern you might want to investigate a large passive cooler, in the end you will probably spend the same amount to get a much faster solution, moving from the mid-range up to a low end top series card.
[quote name='Oruq' date='Jan 27 2008, 01:04 PM']As far as 2D image quality goes, the monitor seems to be better than my 19" Hansol (white is more "white" and the image has more contrast), but that doesn't mean it's worth $600 USD as a 2D monitor.
For playing 3D games, as much as I would like to, I can NOT recommend the 19" Zalman, mostly because of the interlace mode it uses. Interlace mode makes all the text very hard to read, because the driver doesn't care much about text, it simply draws it without any considerations taken into account for the fact that left eye sees only odd lines while the right eye sees only even lines and that lines are duplicated. It's hard to explain what the result of this is without seing it, but here is an example of the letter E:
If in 2D the letter E would look like this ...
xxxxxx
xx
xx
xxxxxx
xx
xx
xxxxxx
The same letter "E" seen through the left eye in 3D stereo on Zalman:
xxxxxx
xxxxxx
xx
xx
xx
xx
xxxxxx
xxxxxx
Letter "E" seen through the right eye in 3D stereo on Zalman:
xx
xx
xxxxxx
xxxxxx
xx
xx
xx
Maybe someone can make something out of this, but for me, text which would be normally readable if it wasn't for the interlace mode, was completely unreadable the way it's drawin in 3D stereo with nVidia drivers.
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Question:
Is the text drawn at 0 (screen) depth? Have you attempted to set convergence (possibly even without using the glasses) until the text resolves?
Is there any reason to have text that isn't at screen depth? (besides possibly floating nicks on an fps?)
(PS, to anyone looking for a graphics solution, the 7950GT/7900GT/GS and GTO cards are all around $95-125 shipped on ebay right now, and they overclock like mad (mild voltmod most hit 650mhz stable, even past 700mhz with fancy cooling). I actually was getting similar framerates in most older games compared to my 8800GT).
if noise is a concern you might want to investigate a large passive cooler, in the end you will probably spend the same amount to get a much faster solution, moving from the mid-range up to a low end top series card.
the text I was talking about is draw in plain 2D, flat on the screen, depth = 0. If you concentrate long enough, you can eventually read what it says by looking at the text with both eyes, but it's like looking at flashlights and usually results in a headache if you try to concentrate and read the text.
I don't have an idea how that problem could be solved, but I hope the guys at Zalman who were working on the new drivers were smarter than me :)
The good thing is that Feb 22nd is getting closer and I am starting to get used to the interlaced mode when watching photos in S-3D. Only 6 more days to wait and see how games work with the new Vista drivers on GeForce 8800 GTS ...
the text I was talking about is draw in plain 2D, flat on the screen, depth = 0. If you concentrate long enough, you can eventually read what it says by looking at the text with both eyes, but it's like looking at flashlights and usually results in a headache if you try to concentrate and read the text.
I don't have an idea how that problem could be solved, but I hope the guys at Zalman who were working on the new drivers were smarter than me :)
The good thing is that Feb 22nd is getting closer and I am starting to get used to the interlaced mode when watching photos in S-3D. Only 6 more days to wait and see how games work with the new Vista drivers on GeForce 8800 GTS ...
I'm so glad I found this thread. I've been eyeballing the Zalman 22" but I couldn't find a non-sponsored review anywhere. Every website seems to claim its the best 3d monitor out but no objective comparison with the iz3D. After reading multiple reviews (that have come out since) and whats been written here I think I am going with the Zalman.
First off, I used to game with shutter-glasses on a 21" CRT monitor, that worked well for a while. However the ghosting and low refresh rate (only 85Hz) were killing my eyes. Even for 2D applications, the CRT monitors are the pits. Unless you are lucky and have a 100-120Hz monitor its just too distracting. So I got a widescreen LCDs, which obviously doesn't work w/ stereo. However I also have a VR920 headset which works decent. The one thing I love is that, being an HMD, it can display a 100% ghost free crystal clear image in 3d. No complaints there. But the whole setup is a bit cumbersome for daily use and the virtual screen really isn't big enough. I'd much rather game on a 22" widescreen if it could do 3d.
Both the iz3D and Zalman seem like decent choices (both have pros and cons). However ghosting is one thing I simply cannot stand. Its the ghosting that limits the amount of depth you can go (also what causes headaches). On shutterglasses/anaglyph I can rarely go past maybe 10-15% seperation. With the VR920 I could safely hit 50% and higher separation values with ease. So if my experience means anything, the Zalman should theoretically be capable of displaying greater depths.
The one major con to the Zalman, the interlacing, is something I think I can live with. Plus I'd imagine the interlaced image could get better performance (maybe even SLI supported in the future) since its on a single DVI plug and cutting vertical-resolution in half. I am also interested in watching 3d movies on the monitor, so thats a plus for me. The other issue which turned me off to the iz3D is the color tinting. As a graphic artist, something like that will drive me crazy. I will notice if its even one hue off, so that was almost the deal-breaker. For all those ghosting/tinting issues it seems you wouldn't be that much worse off with anaglyph. I don't know. Again, this is just my opinion. Other people, I'm sure, will hate interlace mode and tolerate the ghosting. Everyone is different. But my money's on the Zalman.
Also, I like the fact that the Zalman has more advanced tilt and rotate adjustments and it physically looks like a better product. Plus, since Zalman has some deal with Nvidia I imagine there will be better support as clearly some money has changed hands. I did try the new Vista-32 only nvidia stereo driver on my computer (just anaglyph for testing) and it worked great on both Crysis and 3DMark06. 2D HUD elements were rendered correctly, post-processing was fine (on Crysis), 3dMark06 has some glitches with the shadows, but otherwise it looked good. Not a lot of games were supported, but the big titles were at least. Plus, since the Zalman is more expensive, even if it sucks I could sell it and still have more than enough to get the iz3D. Thats the worst case. So IMO, Zalman is the way to go. I will post a review in the next month or so once I get the cash for this baby. Thanks for all your help, guys!
I'm so glad I found this thread. I've been eyeballing the Zalman 22" but I couldn't find a non-sponsored review anywhere. Every website seems to claim its the best 3d monitor out but no objective comparison with the iz3D. After reading multiple reviews (that have come out since) and whats been written here I think I am going with the Zalman.
First off, I used to game with shutter-glasses on a 21" CRT monitor, that worked well for a while. However the ghosting and low refresh rate (only 85Hz) were killing my eyes. Even for 2D applications, the CRT monitors are the pits. Unless you are lucky and have a 100-120Hz monitor its just too distracting. So I got a widescreen LCDs, which obviously doesn't work w/ stereo. However I also have a VR920 headset which works decent. The one thing I love is that, being an HMD, it can display a 100% ghost free crystal clear image in 3d. No complaints there. But the whole setup is a bit cumbersome for daily use and the virtual screen really isn't big enough. I'd much rather game on a 22" widescreen if it could do 3d.
Both the iz3D and Zalman seem like decent choices (both have pros and cons). However ghosting is one thing I simply cannot stand. Its the ghosting that limits the amount of depth you can go (also what causes headaches). On shutterglasses/anaglyph I can rarely go past maybe 10-15% seperation. With the VR920 I could safely hit 50% and higher separation values with ease. So if my experience means anything, the Zalman should theoretically be capable of displaying greater depths.
The one major con to the Zalman, the interlacing, is something I think I can live with. Plus I'd imagine the interlaced image could get better performance (maybe even SLI supported in the future) since its on a single DVI plug and cutting vertical-resolution in half. I am also interested in watching 3d movies on the monitor, so thats a plus for me. The other issue which turned me off to the iz3D is the color tinting. As a graphic artist, something like that will drive me crazy. I will notice if its even one hue off, so that was almost the deal-breaker. For all those ghosting/tinting issues it seems you wouldn't be that much worse off with anaglyph. I don't know. Again, this is just my opinion. Other people, I'm sure, will hate interlace mode and tolerate the ghosting. Everyone is different. But my money's on the Zalman.
Also, I like the fact that the Zalman has more advanced tilt and rotate adjustments and it physically looks like a better product. Plus, since Zalman has some deal with Nvidia I imagine there will be better support as clearly some money has changed hands. I did try the new Vista-32 only nvidia stereo driver on my computer (just anaglyph for testing) and it worked great on both Crysis and 3DMark06. 2D HUD elements were rendered correctly, post-processing was fine (on Crysis), 3dMark06 has some glitches with the shadows, but otherwise it looked good. Not a lot of games were supported, but the big titles were at least. Plus, since the Zalman is more expensive, even if it sucks I could sell it and still have more than enough to get the iz3D. Thats the worst case. So IMO, Zalman is the way to go. I will post a review in the next month or so once I get the cash for this baby. Thanks for all your help, guys!
Looking forward to that objective review matey ;-)
I would be especially interested in the driver-game compatibility and what effects it supports and performance in stereo.
Granted the iZ3D has ghosting, but the biggest advantage there is the driver which supports pretty much all D3D games with all effects. The old nVidia driver couldn't do that... I wonder if the new one can.
I feel that this is of special importance because modern games look horrible without modern effects - bloom, HDR, per pixel lighting and shadows, post processing, blur effects etc.
Would you please spend a few hours with a couple of modern games and give some impressions on what the new driver can actually do? This would be extremely helpful to everyone.
I sympathize with your ghosting predicament... even people who aren't too bothered by it find that it does take a while to get used to and one does never get completely used to it... no matter how much your mind filters it out, once you see a ghostless image, you can see instantly that it is superior.
If the nvidia driver is still like the old one then in the end it comes down to whether you prefer Ghosted image with all the eye candy or ghostless image with the bare essentials in-game. I prefer the first option but I know there are many people who would take the latter option without a second thought.
As I said, I am looking very much forward to a real review of this thing from an experienced stereogamer who actually knows what he is talking about ;-)
Looking forward to that objective review matey ;-)
I would be especially interested in the driver-game compatibility and what effects it supports and performance in stereo.
Granted the iZ3D has ghosting, but the biggest advantage there is the driver which supports pretty much all D3D games with all effects. The old nVidia driver couldn't do that... I wonder if the new one can.
I feel that this is of special importance because modern games look horrible without modern effects - bloom, HDR, per pixel lighting and shadows, post processing, blur effects etc.
Would you please spend a few hours with a couple of modern games and give some impressions on what the new driver can actually do? This would be extremely helpful to everyone.
I sympathize with your ghosting predicament... even people who aren't too bothered by it find that it does take a while to get used to and one does never get completely used to it... no matter how much your mind filters it out, once you see a ghostless image, you can see instantly that it is superior.
If the nvidia driver is still like the old one then in the end it comes down to whether you prefer Ghosted image with all the eye candy or ghostless image with the bare essentials in-game. I prefer the first option but I know there are many people who would take the latter option without a second thought.
As I said, I am looking very much forward to a real review of this thing from an experienced stereogamer who actually knows what he is talking about ;-)
-- Shahzad.
Windows 10 64-bit, Intel 7700K @ 5.1GHz, 16GB 3600MHz CL15 DDR4 RAM, 2x GTX 1080 SLI, Asus Maximus IX Hero, Sound Blaster ZxR, PCIe Quad SSD, Oculus Rift CV1, DLP Link PGD-150 glasses, ViewSonic PJD6531w 3D DLP Projector @ 1280x800 120Hz native / 2560x1600 120Hz DSR 3D Gaming.
It's good to see a variety of 3D hardware in the market. MTBS purposely doesn't review S-3D hardware to avoid conflict of interest problems. However, we do regular S-3D game reviews with both iZ3D and NVIDIA solutions, and we stand by them.
They won't speak to the hardware's visual quality, but they will give accurate software support expectations, we outline the visual flaws, and we forward our results to our game developer contacts with hopes for better S-3D compatibility with the reviewed or upcoming titles.
Have fun with your purchase and check back regularly to set your software expectations. :magic:
It's good to see a variety of 3D hardware in the market. MTBS purposely doesn't review S-3D hardware to avoid conflict of interest problems. However, we do regular S-3D game reviews with both iZ3D and NVIDIA solutions, and we stand by them.
They won't speak to the hardware's visual quality, but they will give accurate software support expectations, we outline the visual flaws, and we forward our results to our game developer contacts with hopes for better S-3D compatibility with the reviewed or upcoming titles.
Have fun with your purchase and check back regularly to set your software expectations. :magic:
I hadn't noticed your first nVidia driver WIC review. I have now had a good read and found it to be very informative.
You say they sent you a 8600 for nVidia testing... Is the game/driver not compatible with your 8800? It seems strange as they are the same family.
I'm just thinking how great it might have been to have an FPS comparison between the two.
Also, with the 1.07 iZ3d, did you find that the unit info ie health bars was at screen depth? I had found that to be one of the biggest "glitches"... did you have the same experience? If it was the same for you, what about the nVidia driver?
About the camera angles, I find that a lot of games nowadays try to mimic movies in their cutscenes hence large camera angle and FOV changes, and I find that the iZ3D's 3 profile view settings to be very helpful in such cases - nest of both worlds at the press of a button. Does the nVidia driver have any profiling hotkey functionality?
Posting here instead of MTBS as there seems to be only one reply to such a breakthrough review... it didn't seem to get much exposure maybe... I missed it till today atleast and then only after you pointed out you had nVidia vs iZ3D comparison... hoping the info you might provide will get more exposure in this thread :P
I hadn't noticed your first nVidia driver WIC review. I have now had a good read and found it to be very informative.
You say they sent you a 8600 for nVidia testing... Is the game/driver not compatible with your 8800? It seems strange as they are the same family.
I'm just thinking how great it might have been to have an FPS comparison between the two.
Also, with the 1.07 iZ3d, did you find that the unit info ie health bars was at screen depth? I had found that to be one of the biggest "glitches"... did you have the same experience? If it was the same for you, what about the nVidia driver?
About the camera angles, I find that a lot of games nowadays try to mimic movies in their cutscenes hence large camera angle and FOV changes, and I find that the iZ3D's 3 profile view settings to be very helpful in such cases - nest of both worlds at the press of a button. Does the nVidia driver have any profiling hotkey functionality?
Posting here instead of MTBS as there seems to be only one reply to such a breakthrough review... it didn't seem to get much exposure maybe... I missed it till today atleast and then only after you pointed out you had nVidia vs iZ3D comparison... hoping the info you might provide will get more exposure in this thread :P
-- Shahzad.
Windows 10 64-bit, Intel 7700K @ 5.1GHz, 16GB 3600MHz CL15 DDR4 RAM, 2x GTX 1080 SLI, Asus Maximus IX Hero, Sound Blaster ZxR, PCIe Quad SSD, Oculus Rift CV1, DLP Link PGD-150 glasses, ViewSonic PJD6531w 3D DLP Projector @ 1280x800 120Hz native / 2560x1600 120Hz DSR 3D Gaming.
Drivers would need to be updated to use this possibility, but the algorithm for that is very similar to the one already used in current iZ3D drivers, so it should not really be a problem. A few settings to trim the drivers and all ghosting and tinting problems are solved.
If they'd also replace the display to have at least 900:1 contrast (now it's only 600:1) and add the option to raise/lower the monitor (it is really low now), the 22" iZ3D would be a perfect solution for gaming, IMHO.
As the iZ3D is currently the only option for gaming if you want to play the latest games using the latest graphics cards, I will stick to the iZ3D for the time being and watch out for possible alternatives, or simply wait for them to implement that sub-pixel thingy correctly. As far as the Zalman monitor goes, I've returned mine, since the interlacing issue was killing me (not to mention missing stereo drivers for Vista and newer graphics cards, which were supposed to be released in January).
EDIT:
"BlackQ" from iZ3D said that they are working on new glasses which would eliminate ghosting (or radically reduce it). He also said that there would be no need to make monitor modifications, which makes me optimistic about the monitor I have on my desk.
Regards,
Oruq
Drivers would need to be updated to use this possibility, but the algorithm for that is very similar to the one already used in current iZ3D drivers, so it should not really be a problem. A few settings to trim the drivers and all ghosting and tinting problems are solved.
If they'd also replace the display to have at least 900:1 contrast (now it's only 600:1) and add the option to raise/lower the monitor (it is really low now), the 22" iZ3D would be a perfect solution for gaming, IMHO.
As the iZ3D is currently the only option for gaming if you want to play the latest games using the latest graphics cards, I will stick to the iZ3D for the time being and watch out for possible alternatives, or simply wait for them to implement that sub-pixel thingy correctly. As far as the Zalman monitor goes, I've returned mine, since the interlacing issue was killing me (not to mention missing stereo drivers for Vista and newer graphics cards, which were supposed to be released in January).
EDIT:
"BlackQ" from iZ3D said that they are working on new glasses which would eliminate ghosting (or radically reduce it). He also said that there would be no need to make monitor modifications, which makes me optimistic about the monitor I have on my desk.
Regards,
Oruq
Is there any difference between the 19" and the 22"?
Is there any difference between the 19" and the 22"?
Is there any difference between the 19" and the 22"?
[right][snapback]323933[/snapback][/right]
[/quote]
I have nothing to compare too, but i have the Zalman 22". Whilst watching the demo CD and internlaced stereo images i have not witnessed any ghosting, the images and video are very sharp and clear.
I will give an update on the Zalman 22" performing with games as soon as the nvidia driver is released for Vista.
Is there any difference between the 19" and the 22"?
I have nothing to compare too, but i have the Zalman 22". Whilst watching the demo CD and internlaced stereo images i have not witnessed any ghosting, the images and video are very sharp and clear.
I will give an update on the Zalman 22" performing with games as soon as the nvidia driver is released for Vista.
Pixels: 19" = 0.294 mm, 22" = 0.282 mm
Horz Freq: 19" = 52-81 kHz, 22" = 59-75 kHz
Vert Freq: 19" = 49-76 Hz, 22" = 56-76 Hz
Brightness: 19" = 300 cd/m2, 22" = 400 cd/m2
Vert 3D viewing angle: 19" = 6 - 8 deg, 22" = 8 - 12 deg
I can't say how much better the 3D image (regarding ghosting and text in interlace mode) will be on the 22" Zalman compared to the 19" Zalman, as I've returned the 19" Zalman two weeks ago, but I've just ordered the 22" Zalman monitor (today) and will be making a direct comparison to the 22" iZ3D when the new Zalman drivers for Vista are out (hopefully on February 22nd).
Regards,
Oruq
Pixels: 19" = 0.294 mm, 22" = 0.282 mm
Horz Freq: 19" = 52-81 kHz, 22" = 59-75 kHz
Vert Freq: 19" = 49-76 Hz, 22" = 56-76 Hz
Brightness: 19" = 300 cd/m2, 22" = 400 cd/m2
Vert 3D viewing angle: 19" = 6 - 8 deg, 22" = 8 - 12 deg
I can't say how much better the 3D image (regarding ghosting and text in interlace mode) will be on the 22" Zalman compared to the 19" Zalman, as I've returned the 19" Zalman two weeks ago, but I've just ordered the 22" Zalman monitor (today) and will be making a direct comparison to the 22" iZ3D when the new Zalman drivers for Vista are out (hopefully on February 22nd).
Regards,
Oruq
Pixels: 19" = 0.294 mm, 22" = 0.282 mm
Horz Freq: 19" = 52-81 kHz, 22" = 59-75 kHz
Vert Freq: 19" = 49-76 Hz, 22" = 56-76 Hz
Brightness: 19" = 300 cd/m2, 22" = 400 cd/m2
Vert 3D viewing angle: 19" = 6 - 8 deg, 22" = 8 - 12 deg
I can't say how much better the 3D image (regarding ghosting and text in interlace mode) will be on the 22" Zalman compared to the 19" Zalman, as I've returned the 19" Zalman two weeks ago, but I've just ordered the 22" Zalman monitor (today) and will be making a direct comparison to the 22" iZ3D when the new Zalman drivers for Vista are out (hopefully on February 22nd).
Regards,
Oruq
[right][snapback]326523[/snapback][/right]
[/quote]
I hope it will be better than the iZ3D because that one is more expensive and alot harder to get a hold on, for me.
Pixels: 19" = 0.294 mm, 22" = 0.282 mm
Horz Freq: 19" = 52-81 kHz, 22" = 59-75 kHz
Vert Freq: 19" = 49-76 Hz, 22" = 56-76 Hz
Brightness: 19" = 300 cd/m2, 22" = 400 cd/m2
Vert 3D viewing angle: 19" = 6 - 8 deg, 22" = 8 - 12 deg
I can't say how much better the 3D image (regarding ghosting and text in interlace mode) will be on the 22" Zalman compared to the 19" Zalman, as I've returned the 19" Zalman two weeks ago, but I've just ordered the 22" Zalman monitor (today) and will be making a direct comparison to the 22" iZ3D when the new Zalman drivers for Vista are out (hopefully on February 22nd).
Regards,
Oruq
I hope it will be better than the iZ3D because that one is more expensive and alot harder to get a hold on, for me.
First, it has all the options you can imagine for tilting the monitor. You can pull the monitor up/down, as well as tilt it freely left/right, up/down and clockwise/anti-clockwise. This was a very nice surprise compared to the 19" Zalman, which I could only tilt up/down and nothing more (height and everything else is fix).
Second, the monitor itself has several color presets (using MWE button on the monitor), so you can easily switch between TEXT, GAME, MOVIE, SPORTS, SMOOTH and USER color setup, without tempering with the graphics card. As far as I can remember, the 19" Zalman monitor did not have that option.
But, everything else (except for 22" being in 16:10 format while 19" is in 4:3) seems to be the same on the 19" and the 22" monitors.
Brightness, Contrast and Viewing angle on the 22" Zalman monitor in 2D are excellent, which makes it a perfect replacement for a standard monitor, but that's also the case with the 19" Zalman.
Reflection is very high, so you can use the monitor as a mirror if you set your desktops background color to black. This can be solved by darkening the room and avoiding the use of any lights behind your back, so it's not a big deal.
As far as Stereo 3D image quality goes, the demo video is watchable once you find a good position/tilt for the monitor and keep your head still. There was almost no ghosting. If I wanted to be critical, I would say that there was max 5% ghosting on high contrast images, which was mostly visible on the demo video when watching stone tunel walls (bright color), which had a slight gost image inside the tunel (total blackness). Other than that, ghosting didn't seem to be an issue.
I can't comment on gameplay now, since new Vista stereo drivers aren't out yet (I wasn't happy with the old nVidia drivers), but I can't help having a bad feeling about the interlace mode, which seems to be the same on the 22" Zalman and on the 19" Zalman.
On the other hand, you never know what Zalman might have done with their drivers, and the release date is near (February 22nd), so I will refrain from giving any more comments on that until I see the new Vista drivers in action :)
Regards,
Oruq
First, it has all the options you can imagine for tilting the monitor. You can pull the monitor up/down, as well as tilt it freely left/right, up/down and clockwise/anti-clockwise. This was a very nice surprise compared to the 19" Zalman, which I could only tilt up/down and nothing more (height and everything else is fix).
Second, the monitor itself has several color presets (using MWE button on the monitor), so you can easily switch between TEXT, GAME, MOVIE, SPORTS, SMOOTH and USER color setup, without tempering with the graphics card. As far as I can remember, the 19" Zalman monitor did not have that option.
But, everything else (except for 22" being in 16:10 format while 19" is in 4:3) seems to be the same on the 19" and the 22" monitors.
Brightness, Contrast and Viewing angle on the 22" Zalman monitor in 2D are excellent, which makes it a perfect replacement for a standard monitor, but that's also the case with the 19" Zalman.
Reflection is very high, so you can use the monitor as a mirror if you set your desktops background color to black. This can be solved by darkening the room and avoiding the use of any lights behind your back, so it's not a big deal.
As far as Stereo 3D image quality goes, the demo video is watchable once you find a good position/tilt for the monitor and keep your head still. There was almost no ghosting. If I wanted to be critical, I would say that there was max 5% ghosting on high contrast images, which was mostly visible on the demo video when watching stone tunel walls (bright color), which had a slight gost image inside the tunel (total blackness). Other than that, ghosting didn't seem to be an issue.
I can't comment on gameplay now, since new Vista stereo drivers aren't out yet (I wasn't happy with the old nVidia drivers), but I can't help having a bad feeling about the interlace mode, which seems to be the same on the 22" Zalman and on the 19" Zalman.
On the other hand, you never know what Zalman might have done with their drivers, and the release date is near (February 22nd), so I will refrain from giving any more comments on that until I see the new Vista drivers in action :)
Regards,
Oruq
From testing the iZ3D monitor, I have a bunch of stereo snapshots done with the iZ3D driver in games where ghosting was really bad on the iZ3D monitor. I've used these images to try and trim the iZ3D monitor to reduce ghosting as much as possible, but was never able to get good results (ghosting was always there and at least to me, disturbing).
And now, since snapshots are done in side-by-side mode (complete L and R images), I can watch them on the Zalman monitor by changing stereo display mode to interlaced. Man, was I up for a surprise.
Yes, there is about 5% ghosting on the Zalman on some very high contrast areas, like bright yellow lights in the night sky (you would see the lights dimmed double). But, other than that minor quirk, there was virtually NO GHOSTING on the Zalman monitor, even though the exact same images have had really bad ghosting issues on the iZ3D monitor.
All snapshots I've made from games using the iZ3D driver where ghosting was really really bad on the iZ3D monitor, give a perfectly clear stereo image on the Zalman monitor, except for one thing: Text and small icons are blury because of the interlace mode and no special handling.
The biggest difference was on snapshots from EVE Online, where asteroids would now have a very dim side-image, but the image did not affect the stereo experience. On the iZ3D monitor, I would always see the roids double in some color.
I've also tested with some photos I could find in side-by-side mode on the internet. While I could not get a good stereo image on the iZ3D monitor (most photos had deep background, which resulted in really bad ghosting on iZ3D), Zalman had absolutely no problems displaying these images in a clear stereo 3D experience. That was absolutely awesome!
I've also made a test where I would place 2 completely different images for the left and the right eye. While iZ3D monitor was showing total crap by mixing the two images together and displaying some blur to both eyes, the Zalman monitor has done a PERFECT image separation, giving each eye the correct image, with no side-effects. One eye would see one image crystal clear, while the other eye would see the other image crystal clear. Now ... THAT is what I call clear stereo separation :)
After this test, I have to say that I really really *really* hope that Zalman has done something to make the text and small 2D icons display better in stereo 3D, since that is currently the only thing that doesn't work very well on the Zalman. If the new stereo drivers work on Vista with the latest nVidia cards, the 22" Zalman monitor will definitely be my choice for S-3D.
PS. I've just read that iZ3D is thinking about offering their stereo drivers for use with third-party solutions. In case iZ3D would implement interlaced mode for stereo viewing and the Zalman stereo drivers wouldn't work well, I think that iZ3D monitors will soon become a thing from the past. As far as stereo drivers go, iZ3D has done an excellent job, but the technology just doesn't work right (too much ghosting spoiling the experience).
Regards,
Oruq
From testing the iZ3D monitor, I have a bunch of stereo snapshots done with the iZ3D driver in games where ghosting was really bad on the iZ3D monitor. I've used these images to try and trim the iZ3D monitor to reduce ghosting as much as possible, but was never able to get good results (ghosting was always there and at least to me, disturbing).
And now, since snapshots are done in side-by-side mode (complete L and R images), I can watch them on the Zalman monitor by changing stereo display mode to interlaced. Man, was I up for a surprise.
Yes, there is about 5% ghosting on the Zalman on some very high contrast areas, like bright yellow lights in the night sky (you would see the lights dimmed double). But, other than that minor quirk, there was virtually NO GHOSTING on the Zalman monitor, even though the exact same images have had really bad ghosting issues on the iZ3D monitor.
All snapshots I've made from games using the iZ3D driver where ghosting was really really bad on the iZ3D monitor, give a perfectly clear stereo image on the Zalman monitor, except for one thing: Text and small icons are blury because of the interlace mode and no special handling.
The biggest difference was on snapshots from EVE Online, where asteroids would now have a very dim side-image, but the image did not affect the stereo experience. On the iZ3D monitor, I would always see the roids double in some color.
I've also tested with some photos I could find in side-by-side mode on the internet. While I could not get a good stereo image on the iZ3D monitor (most photos had deep background, which resulted in really bad ghosting on iZ3D), Zalman had absolutely no problems displaying these images in a clear stereo 3D experience. That was absolutely awesome!
I've also made a test where I would place 2 completely different images for the left and the right eye. While iZ3D monitor was showing total crap by mixing the two images together and displaying some blur to both eyes, the Zalman monitor has done a PERFECT image separation, giving each eye the correct image, with no side-effects. One eye would see one image crystal clear, while the other eye would see the other image crystal clear. Now ... THAT is what I call clear stereo separation :)
After this test, I have to say that I really really *really* hope that Zalman has done something to make the text and small 2D icons display better in stereo 3D, since that is currently the only thing that doesn't work very well on the Zalman. If the new stereo drivers work on Vista with the latest nVidia cards, the 22" Zalman monitor will definitely be my choice for S-3D.
PS. I've just read that iZ3D is thinking about offering their stereo drivers for use with third-party solutions. In case iZ3D would implement interlaced mode for stereo viewing and the Zalman stereo drivers wouldn't work well, I think that iZ3D monitors will soon become a thing from the past. As far as stereo drivers go, iZ3D has done an excellent job, but the technology just doesn't work right (too much ghosting spoiling the experience).
Regards,
Oruq
There is absolutely no doubt that the iZ3D monitor has REALLY REALLY *REALLY* HUGE problems with ghosting. While all game snapshots and photos look perfectly clear, give a nice stereo experience and were pleasant to look at on the 22" Zalman monitor, the exact same images and photos look have a lot of artifacts and suffer from major ghosting on the 22" iZ3D monitor.
Looking at text on white background, the Zalman monitor shows perfectly crystal white and black, while the same text on the iZ3D monitor looks unsharp (default settings on both monitors). And the same goes for all other colors.
Looking at the the test image in nVidia control panel, I can simply not get the iZ3D monitor to give me a full set of gray scale colors. On the other hand, the Zalman monitor displays a perfect grayscale (you can count the color blocks) at default settings.
The iZ3D monitor is also very sensitive to vertical and horizontal tilt, as well as up/down head movements in 2D, which Zalman has no problems with (clear image from a very wide viewing angle in all directions). In stereo 3D mode, iZ3D is also highly sensitive to head "rotation", where even a single degree can make a big difference. Zalman is quite indifferent to head tilting, with the image always being crystal clear. The only thing Zalman does not like very mich is when you move your head up and down a few cm, while with the iZ3D every milimeter counts.
Another thing I can not explain is that my eyes always start burning after using the iZ3D monitor for longer than 5 minutes, but I have had absolutely no problems using the Zalman monitor for hours throughout the day.
I don't have the 19" Zalman monitor anymore, but if I remember right, I had more ghosting issues there than on the 22" Zalman. Ghosting on the 19" Zalman was not as high as on the iZ3D monitor, but it was there.
After having had the 19" and 22" Zalman, as well as 22" iZ3D monitors, the only monitor I can recommend for watching movies in S-3D is the 22" Zalman. The 100 EUR price diference between the 19" and 22" Zalman monitors is (in my opinion) simply not worth saving. I can not recommend the iZ3D monitor to anyone who is looking for a clear 3D stereo image, since the iZ3D monitor has really big problems with ghosting and is overall a worse 2D monitor than both Zalman monitors, which spoils the whole experience.
Now, let's hope the stereo drivers from Zalman are at least as good as the ones from iZ3D.
Regards,
Oruq
There is absolutely no doubt that the iZ3D monitor has REALLY REALLY *REALLY* HUGE problems with ghosting. While all game snapshots and photos look perfectly clear, give a nice stereo experience and were pleasant to look at on the 22" Zalman monitor, the exact same images and photos look have a lot of artifacts and suffer from major ghosting on the 22" iZ3D monitor.
Looking at text on white background, the Zalman monitor shows perfectly crystal white and black, while the same text on the iZ3D monitor looks unsharp (default settings on both monitors). And the same goes for all other colors.
Looking at the the test image in nVidia control panel, I can simply not get the iZ3D monitor to give me a full set of gray scale colors. On the other hand, the Zalman monitor displays a perfect grayscale (you can count the color blocks) at default settings.
The iZ3D monitor is also very sensitive to vertical and horizontal tilt, as well as up/down head movements in 2D, which Zalman has no problems with (clear image from a very wide viewing angle in all directions). In stereo 3D mode, iZ3D is also highly sensitive to head "rotation", where even a single degree can make a big difference. Zalman is quite indifferent to head tilting, with the image always being crystal clear. The only thing Zalman does not like very mich is when you move your head up and down a few cm, while with the iZ3D every milimeter counts.
Another thing I can not explain is that my eyes always start burning after using the iZ3D monitor for longer than 5 minutes, but I have had absolutely no problems using the Zalman monitor for hours throughout the day.
I don't have the 19" Zalman monitor anymore, but if I remember right, I had more ghosting issues there than on the 22" Zalman. Ghosting on the 19" Zalman was not as high as on the iZ3D monitor, but it was there.
After having had the 19" and 22" Zalman, as well as 22" iZ3D monitors, the only monitor I can recommend for watching movies in S-3D is the 22" Zalman. The 100 EUR price diference between the 19" and 22" Zalman monitors is (in my opinion) simply not worth saving. I can not recommend the iZ3D monitor to anyone who is looking for a clear 3D stereo image, since the iZ3D monitor has really big problems with ghosting and is overall a worse 2D monitor than both Zalman monitors, which spoils the whole experience.
Now, let's hope the stereo drivers from Zalman are at least as good as the ones from iZ3D.
Regards,
Oruq
There is always an active projected solution. There is no noticeable ghosting (unless you concentrate hard) but there is heavy flicker, which at least I can get used to easily. Decent projectors run at 85Hz and a good 2500+ lumens won't cost over $1000. But these still rely on the nVidia driver.
IMHO, the projector produces the best results overall if the driver isn't taken into account... but what good is it without a driver to make it work?
No good what so ever. I have abandoned my projector for stereo gaming for the time being and use iZ3D only for stereo3D.
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[/quote]
Um, I have projected Polarized, it is really the way to go, a decent (100" + @16:9) silver screen is available for quite a bit less than $200.
The real breakthrough will come when Circular polarized Color wheel (AKA Dolby3D) DLP projectors are available for home use. The wheel is seperated left and right, and the image for each eye gets "flashed" 2 or 3x per frame (per eye!), all controlled by the DLP wheel in hardware.
The beauty of this is that we could have high resolution, large screen size, and cheap ($0.50-$15) glasses so everyone could join in the fun.
Is there anything really wrong with the Zalman way (besides the price)? Just because it is only 5xx vertical resolution isn't a big deal, it still has full horizontal resolution.
As far as the nVidia driver goes, yes they need to support it, but we are only getting farther away because of Microsoft and Vista/DX10, the writers of the standards for rendering/acceleration need to recognize this and make allowances. (slightly OT, but they also need to stabilize multi-screen acceleration, we can easily, for less than $1000, put a pair of mid-high-end cards and 4 displays on one PC, this needs work. To bring this back to the topic, when do we get the Zalman 3x monitor experience? Front viewport, left and right viewport, and all in [passive] 3D? Flicker is not an option as I suffer from Seasonal Migraines and Nausea, as well as a constant aversion to even 60hz refreshes.)
There is always an active projected solution. There is no noticeable ghosting (unless you concentrate hard) but there is heavy flicker, which at least I can get used to easily. Decent projectors run at 85Hz and a good 2500+ lumens won't cost over $1000. But these still rely on the nVidia driver.
IMHO, the projector produces the best results overall if the driver isn't taken into account... but what good is it without a driver to make it work?
No good what so ever. I have abandoned my projector for stereo gaming for the time being and use iZ3D only for stereo3D.
Um, I have projected Polarized, it is really the way to go, a decent (100" + @16:9) silver screen is available for quite a bit less than $200.
The real breakthrough will come when Circular polarized Color wheel (AKA Dolby3D) DLP projectors are available for home use. The wheel is seperated left and right, and the image for each eye gets "flashed" 2 or 3x per frame (per eye!), all controlled by the DLP wheel in hardware.
The beauty of this is that we could have high resolution, large screen size, and cheap ($0.50-$15) glasses so everyone could join in the fun.
Is there anything really wrong with the Zalman way (besides the price)? Just because it is only 5xx vertical resolution isn't a big deal, it still has full horizontal resolution.
As far as the nVidia driver goes, yes they need to support it, but we are only getting farther away because of Microsoft and Vista/DX10, the writers of the standards for rendering/acceleration need to recognize this and make allowances. (slightly OT, but they also need to stabilize multi-screen acceleration, we can easily, for less than $1000, put a pair of mid-high-end cards and 4 displays on one PC, this needs work. To bring this back to the topic, when do we get the Zalman 3x monitor experience? Front viewport, left and right viewport, and all in [passive] 3D? Flicker is not an option as I suffer from Seasonal Migraines and Nausea, as well as a constant aversion to even 60hz refreshes.)
For playing 3D games, as much as I would like to, I can NOT recommend the 19" Zalman, mostly because of the interlace mode it uses. Interlace mode makes all the text very hard to read, because the driver doesn't care much about text, it simply draws it without any considerations taken into account for the fact that left eye sees only odd lines while the right eye sees only even lines and that lines are duplicated. It's hard to explain what the result of this is without seing it, but here is an example of the letter E:
If in 2D the letter E would look like this ...
xxxxxx
xx
xx
xxxxxx
xx
xx
xxxxxx
The same letter "E" seen through the left eye in 3D stereo on Zalman:
xxxxxx
xxxxxx
xx
xx
xx
xx
xxxxxx
xxxxxx
Letter "E" seen through the right eye in 3D stereo on Zalman:
xx
xx
xxxxxx
xxxxxx
xx
xx
xx
Maybe someone can make something out of this, but for me, text which would be normally readable if it wasn't for the interlace mode, was completely unreadable the way it's drawin in 3D stereo with nVidia drivers.
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[/quote]
Question:
Is the text drawn at 0 (screen) depth? Have you attempted to set convergence (possibly even without using the glasses) until the text resolves?
Is there any reason to have text that isn't at screen depth? (besides possibly floating nicks on an fps?)
(PS, to anyone looking for a graphics solution, the 7950GT/7900GT/GS and GTO cards are all around $95-125 shipped on ebay right now, and they overclock like mad (mild voltmod most hit 650mhz stable, even past 700mhz with fancy cooling). I actually was getting similar framerates in most older games compared to my 8800GT).
if noise is a concern you might want to investigate a large passive cooler, in the end you will probably spend the same amount to get a much faster solution, moving from the mid-range up to a low end top series card.
For playing 3D games, as much as I would like to, I can NOT recommend the 19" Zalman, mostly because of the interlace mode it uses. Interlace mode makes all the text very hard to read, because the driver doesn't care much about text, it simply draws it without any considerations taken into account for the fact that left eye sees only odd lines while the right eye sees only even lines and that lines are duplicated. It's hard to explain what the result of this is without seing it, but here is an example of the letter E:
If in 2D the letter E would look like this ...
xxxxxx
xx
xx
xxxxxx
xx
xx
xxxxxx
The same letter "E" seen through the left eye in 3D stereo on Zalman:
xxxxxx
xxxxxx
xx
xx
xx
xx
xxxxxx
xxxxxx
Letter "E" seen through the right eye in 3D stereo on Zalman:
xx
xx
xxxxxx
xxxxxx
xx
xx
xx
Maybe someone can make something out of this, but for me, text which would be normally readable if it wasn't for the interlace mode, was completely unreadable the way it's drawin in 3D stereo with nVidia drivers.
Question:
Is the text drawn at 0 (screen) depth? Have you attempted to set convergence (possibly even without using the glasses) until the text resolves?
Is there any reason to have text that isn't at screen depth? (besides possibly floating nicks on an fps?)
(PS, to anyone looking for a graphics solution, the 7950GT/7900GT/GS and GTO cards are all around $95-125 shipped on ebay right now, and they overclock like mad (mild voltmod most hit 650mhz stable, even past 700mhz with fancy cooling). I actually was getting similar framerates in most older games compared to my 8800GT).
if noise is a concern you might want to investigate a large passive cooler, in the end you will probably spend the same amount to get a much faster solution, moving from the mid-range up to a low end top series card.
the text I was talking about is draw in plain 2D, flat on the screen, depth = 0. If you concentrate long enough, you can eventually read what it says by looking at the text with both eyes, but it's like looking at flashlights and usually results in a headache if you try to concentrate and read the text.
I don't have an idea how that problem could be solved, but I hope the guys at Zalman who were working on the new drivers were smarter than me :)
The good thing is that Feb 22nd is getting closer and I am starting to get used to the interlaced mode when watching photos in S-3D. Only 6 more days to wait and see how games work with the new Vista drivers on GeForce 8800 GTS ...
Regards,
Oruq
the text I was talking about is draw in plain 2D, flat on the screen, depth = 0. If you concentrate long enough, you can eventually read what it says by looking at the text with both eyes, but it's like looking at flashlights and usually results in a headache if you try to concentrate and read the text.
I don't have an idea how that problem could be solved, but I hope the guys at Zalman who were working on the new drivers were smarter than me :)
The good thing is that Feb 22nd is getting closer and I am starting to get used to the interlaced mode when watching photos in S-3D. Only 6 more days to wait and see how games work with the new Vista drivers on GeForce 8800 GTS ...
Regards,
Oruq
First off, I used to game with shutter-glasses on a 21" CRT monitor, that worked well for a while. However the ghosting and low refresh rate (only 85Hz) were killing my eyes. Even for 2D applications, the CRT monitors are the pits. Unless you are lucky and have a 100-120Hz monitor its just too distracting. So I got a widescreen LCDs, which obviously doesn't work w/ stereo. However I also have a VR920 headset which works decent. The one thing I love is that, being an HMD, it can display a 100% ghost free crystal clear image in 3d. No complaints there. But the whole setup is a bit cumbersome for daily use and the virtual screen really isn't big enough. I'd much rather game on a 22" widescreen if it could do 3d.
Both the iz3D and Zalman seem like decent choices (both have pros and cons). However ghosting is one thing I simply cannot stand. Its the ghosting that limits the amount of depth you can go (also what causes headaches). On shutterglasses/anaglyph I can rarely go past maybe 10-15% seperation. With the VR920 I could safely hit 50% and higher separation values with ease. So if my experience means anything, the Zalman should theoretically be capable of displaying greater depths.
The one major con to the Zalman, the interlacing, is something I think I can live with. Plus I'd imagine the interlaced image could get better performance (maybe even SLI supported in the future) since its on a single DVI plug and cutting vertical-resolution in half. I am also interested in watching 3d movies on the monitor, so thats a plus for me. The other issue which turned me off to the iz3D is the color tinting. As a graphic artist, something like that will drive me crazy. I will notice if its even one hue off, so that was almost the deal-breaker. For all those ghosting/tinting issues it seems you wouldn't be that much worse off with anaglyph. I don't know. Again, this is just my opinion. Other people, I'm sure, will hate interlace mode and tolerate the ghosting. Everyone is different. But my money's on the Zalman.
Also, I like the fact that the Zalman has more advanced tilt and rotate adjustments and it physically looks like a better product. Plus, since Zalman has some deal with Nvidia I imagine there will be better support as clearly some money has changed hands. I did try the new Vista-32 only nvidia stereo driver on my computer (just anaglyph for testing) and it worked great on both Crysis and 3DMark06. 2D HUD elements were rendered correctly, post-processing was fine (on Crysis), 3dMark06 has some glitches with the shadows, but otherwise it looked good. Not a lot of games were supported, but the big titles were at least. Plus, since the Zalman is more expensive, even if it sucks I could sell it and still have more than enough to get the iz3D. Thats the worst case. So IMO, Zalman is the way to go. I will post a review in the next month or so once I get the cash for this baby. Thanks for all your help, guys!
First off, I used to game with shutter-glasses on a 21" CRT monitor, that worked well for a while. However the ghosting and low refresh rate (only 85Hz) were killing my eyes. Even for 2D applications, the CRT monitors are the pits. Unless you are lucky and have a 100-120Hz monitor its just too distracting. So I got a widescreen LCDs, which obviously doesn't work w/ stereo. However I also have a VR920 headset which works decent. The one thing I love is that, being an HMD, it can display a 100% ghost free crystal clear image in 3d. No complaints there. But the whole setup is a bit cumbersome for daily use and the virtual screen really isn't big enough. I'd much rather game on a 22" widescreen if it could do 3d.
Both the iz3D and Zalman seem like decent choices (both have pros and cons). However ghosting is one thing I simply cannot stand. Its the ghosting that limits the amount of depth you can go (also what causes headaches). On shutterglasses/anaglyph I can rarely go past maybe 10-15% seperation. With the VR920 I could safely hit 50% and higher separation values with ease. So if my experience means anything, the Zalman should theoretically be capable of displaying greater depths.
The one major con to the Zalman, the interlacing, is something I think I can live with. Plus I'd imagine the interlaced image could get better performance (maybe even SLI supported in the future) since its on a single DVI plug and cutting vertical-resolution in half. I am also interested in watching 3d movies on the monitor, so thats a plus for me. The other issue which turned me off to the iz3D is the color tinting. As a graphic artist, something like that will drive me crazy. I will notice if its even one hue off, so that was almost the deal-breaker. For all those ghosting/tinting issues it seems you wouldn't be that much worse off with anaglyph. I don't know. Again, this is just my opinion. Other people, I'm sure, will hate interlace mode and tolerate the ghosting. Everyone is different. But my money's on the Zalman.
Also, I like the fact that the Zalman has more advanced tilt and rotate adjustments and it physically looks like a better product. Plus, since Zalman has some deal with Nvidia I imagine there will be better support as clearly some money has changed hands. I did try the new Vista-32 only nvidia stereo driver on my computer (just anaglyph for testing) and it worked great on both Crysis and 3DMark06. 2D HUD elements were rendered correctly, post-processing was fine (on Crysis), 3dMark06 has some glitches with the shadows, but otherwise it looked good. Not a lot of games were supported, but the big titles were at least. Plus, since the Zalman is more expensive, even if it sucks I could sell it and still have more than enough to get the iz3D. Thats the worst case. So IMO, Zalman is the way to go. I will post a review in the next month or so once I get the cash for this baby. Thanks for all your help, guys!
check my blog - cybereality.com
I would be especially interested in the driver-game compatibility and what effects it supports and performance in stereo.
Granted the iZ3D has ghosting, but the biggest advantage there is the driver which supports pretty much all D3D games with all effects. The old nVidia driver couldn't do that... I wonder if the new one can.
I feel that this is of special importance because modern games look horrible without modern effects - bloom, HDR, per pixel lighting and shadows, post processing, blur effects etc.
Would you please spend a few hours with a couple of modern games and give some impressions on what the new driver can actually do? This would be extremely helpful to everyone.
I sympathize with your ghosting predicament... even people who aren't too bothered by it find that it does take a while to get used to and one does never get completely used to it... no matter how much your mind filters it out, once you see a ghostless image, you can see instantly that it is superior.
If the nvidia driver is still like the old one then in the end it comes down to whether you prefer Ghosted image with all the eye candy or ghostless image with the bare essentials in-game. I prefer the first option but I know there are many people who would take the latter option without a second thought.
As I said, I am looking very much forward to a real review of this thing from an experienced stereogamer who actually knows what he is talking about ;-)
-- Shahzad.
I would be especially interested in the driver-game compatibility and what effects it supports and performance in stereo.
Granted the iZ3D has ghosting, but the biggest advantage there is the driver which supports pretty much all D3D games with all effects. The old nVidia driver couldn't do that... I wonder if the new one can.
I feel that this is of special importance because modern games look horrible without modern effects - bloom, HDR, per pixel lighting and shadows, post processing, blur effects etc.
Would you please spend a few hours with a couple of modern games and give some impressions on what the new driver can actually do? This would be extremely helpful to everyone.
I sympathize with your ghosting predicament... even people who aren't too bothered by it find that it does take a while to get used to and one does never get completely used to it... no matter how much your mind filters it out, once you see a ghostless image, you can see instantly that it is superior.
If the nvidia driver is still like the old one then in the end it comes down to whether you prefer Ghosted image with all the eye candy or ghostless image with the bare essentials in-game. I prefer the first option but I know there are many people who would take the latter option without a second thought.
As I said, I am looking very much forward to a real review of this thing from an experienced stereogamer who actually knows what he is talking about ;-)
-- Shahzad.
Windows 10 64-bit, Intel 7700K @ 5.1GHz, 16GB 3600MHz CL15 DDR4 RAM, 2x GTX 1080 SLI, Asus Maximus IX Hero, Sound Blaster ZxR, PCIe Quad SSD, Oculus Rift CV1, DLP Link PGD-150 glasses, ViewSonic PJD6531w 3D DLP Projector @ 1280x800 120Hz native / 2560x1600 120Hz DSR 3D Gaming.
They won't speak to the hardware's visual quality, but they will give accurate software support expectations, we outline the visual flaws, and we forward our results to our game developer contacts with hopes for better S-3D compatibility with the reviewed or upcoming titles.
Have fun with your purchase and check back regularly to set your software expectations. :magic:
Regards,
Chopper
They won't speak to the hardware's visual quality, but they will give accurate software support expectations, we outline the visual flaws, and we forward our results to our game developer contacts with hopes for better S-3D compatibility with the reviewed or upcoming titles.
Have fun with your purchase and check back regularly to set your software expectations. :magic:
Regards,
Chopper
I hadn't noticed your first nVidia driver WIC review. I have now had a good read and found it to be very informative.
You say they sent you a 8600 for nVidia testing... Is the game/driver not compatible with your 8800? It seems strange as they are the same family.
I'm just thinking how great it might have been to have an FPS comparison between the two.
Also, with the 1.07 iZ3d, did you find that the unit info ie health bars was at screen depth? I had found that to be one of the biggest "glitches"... did you have the same experience? If it was the same for you, what about the nVidia driver?
About the camera angles, I find that a lot of games nowadays try to mimic movies in their cutscenes hence large camera angle and FOV changes, and I find that the iZ3D's 3 profile view settings to be very helpful in such cases - nest of both worlds at the press of a button. Does the nVidia driver have any profiling hotkey functionality?
Posting here instead of MTBS as there seems to be only one reply to such a breakthrough review... it didn't seem to get much exposure maybe... I missed it till today atleast and then only after you pointed out you had nVidia vs iZ3D comparison... hoping the info you might provide will get more exposure in this thread :P
-- Shahzad.
I hadn't noticed your first nVidia driver WIC review. I have now had a good read and found it to be very informative.
You say they sent you a 8600 for nVidia testing... Is the game/driver not compatible with your 8800? It seems strange as they are the same family.
I'm just thinking how great it might have been to have an FPS comparison between the two.
Also, with the 1.07 iZ3d, did you find that the unit info ie health bars was at screen depth? I had found that to be one of the biggest "glitches"... did you have the same experience? If it was the same for you, what about the nVidia driver?
About the camera angles, I find that a lot of games nowadays try to mimic movies in their cutscenes hence large camera angle and FOV changes, and I find that the iZ3D's 3 profile view settings to be very helpful in such cases - nest of both worlds at the press of a button. Does the nVidia driver have any profiling hotkey functionality?
Posting here instead of MTBS as there seems to be only one reply to such a breakthrough review... it didn't seem to get much exposure maybe... I missed it till today atleast and then only after you pointed out you had nVidia vs iZ3D comparison... hoping the info you might provide will get more exposure in this thread :P
-- Shahzad.
Windows 10 64-bit, Intel 7700K @ 5.1GHz, 16GB 3600MHz CL15 DDR4 RAM, 2x GTX 1080 SLI, Asus Maximus IX Hero, Sound Blaster ZxR, PCIe Quad SSD, Oculus Rift CV1, DLP Link PGD-150 glasses, ViewSonic PJD6531w 3D DLP Projector @ 1280x800 120Hz native / 2560x1600 120Hz DSR 3D Gaming.