Can somebody help me understand the Advanced shortcuts in 3d vision
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Thats alot of information to take in in one day. I'll read through this and see if I understand. However for now what settings would you suggest I use, with a 1080p active TV, with a 50" screen what
Thats alot of information to take in in one day. I'll read through this and see if I understand. However for now what settings would you suggest I use, with a 1080p active TV, with a 50" screen what

#16
Posted 02/13/2013 04:49 PM   
That is a blinking good PDF, nice find, for those interested, check out andysonofbobs link, its ram packed full of information.
That is a blinking good PDF, nice find, for those interested, check out andysonofbobs link, its ram packed full of information.

OS: Win 8 CPU: I7 4770k 3.5GZ GPU: GTX 780ti

#17
Posted 02/13/2013 05:45 PM   
[quote="andysonofbob"]@ Foreverseeking This might help illustrate your point. You can see a rapid 3D sensitivity drop sfter 100m using binocular disparity as a depth cue. http://www.cl.cam.ac.uk/techreports/UCAM-CL-TR-546.pdf turn to pg 31 (Page 13 in the paper)[/quote] Thanks for the link to that report. There is some great info there. One piece from there helps me understand this Parallax Budget they talk about: "The maximum degree between the nearest and furthest point in a stereo image shown on a desktop VDS, the binocular disparity threshold (BDT), should be no more than 1.5° to avoid user eyestrain [Lipton 1993]. This is directly related to Panumís Area, as discussed in Chapter 2, and varies with a number of factors, including image size, temporal frequency, eccentricity, illumination and practice [Yeh 1993]." pg. 24. That is where the min/max pixel idea comes from, where the maximum angle is expected to be 1.5 degrees, to avoid eyestrain. That matches the idea from NVidia that you can choose a range, but you can't cover the entire range at any given time. We tend to not see this as much in practice. I've been playing with stereoscopy, for maybe 25 years, and use 3D Vision every day now. I don't get eyestrain or headaches, even under fairly high settings.
andysonofbob said:@ Foreverseeking

This might help illustrate your point. You can see a rapid 3D sensitivity drop sfter 100m using binocular disparity as a depth cue.


http://www.cl.cam.ac.uk/techreports/UCAM-CL-TR-546.pdf


turn to pg 31 (Page 13 in the paper)


Thanks for the link to that report. There is some great info there.

One piece from there helps me understand this Parallax Budget they talk about:

"The maximum degree between the nearest and furthest point in a stereo image shown on a desktop
VDS, the binocular disparity threshold (BDT), should be no more than 1.5° to avoid user eyestrain
[Lipton 1993]. This is directly related to Panumís Area, as discussed in Chapter 2, and varies with a
number of factors, including image size, temporal frequency, eccentricity, illumination and practice
[Yeh 1993]." pg. 24.

That is where the min/max pixel idea comes from, where the maximum angle is expected to be 1.5 degrees, to avoid eyestrain. That matches the idea from NVidia that you can choose a range, but you can't cover the entire range at any given time.

We tend to not see this as much in practice. I've been playing with stereoscopy, for maybe 25 years, and use 3D Vision every day now. I don't get eyestrain or headaches, even under fairly high settings.

Acer H5360 (1280x720@120Hz) - ASUS VG248QE with GSync mod - 3D Vision 1&2 - Driver 372.54
GTX 970 - i5-4670K@4.2GHz - 12GB RAM - Win7x64+evilKB2670838 - 4 Disk X25 RAID
SAGER NP9870-S - GTX 980 - i7-6700K - Win10 Pro 1607
Latest 3Dmigoto Release
Bo3b's School for ShaderHackers

#18
Posted 02/14/2013 07:45 AM   
[quote="cosmiclegend"]Thats alot of information to take in in one day. I'll read through this and see if I understand. However for now what settings would you suggest I use, with a 1080p active TV, with a 50" screen what [/quote] Heh! Yeah we kinda ran pretty far out into the weeds here. You don't need to know all this stuff to just use it. Try some game that is known to work extremely well in S3D, like Batman or Trine. That's to avoid getting confused by broken games with bad effects. The settings are really a matter of personal preference, there is no wrong or right. There is easier on the eyes, and harder on the eyes though, and you naturally want to lean toward easier until you are used to it. There are two primary controls. Ctrl-F4 to increase separation. Ctrl-F6 to increase convergence. (and Ctrl-F3 to decrease separation, Ctrl-F5 to decrease convergence.) To start off, just use separation and use only it for awhile to get used to it. When you want to play with convergence, that increases the pop-out effect. You have to enable that in Set Keyboard Shortcuts->Show Advanced In Game Settings. You hold Ctrl-F6 until you start to see an effect. There is no on screen feedback. It takes a long time, like 20 seconds before anything noticeable changes. Start small, and build up. If you crank the convergence too high for example, some people get headaches within 10 minutes of play. If your eyes feel like they are straining, you are going too far. You should feel any eyestrain during normal use. For your 50" screen at 6' viewing, you can probably get to 75-80% on the separation number. Depends on how well your eyes and brain adapt to the system. But to start off, I'd recommend using 25% on separation, and no convergence.
cosmiclegend said:Thats alot of information to take in in one day. I'll read through this and see if I understand. However for now what settings would you suggest I use, with a 1080p active TV, with a 50" screen what


Heh! Yeah we kinda ran pretty far out into the weeds here.

You don't need to know all this stuff to just use it.

Try some game that is known to work extremely well in S3D, like Batman or Trine. That's to avoid getting confused by broken games with bad effects.

The settings are really a matter of personal preference, there is no wrong or right.

There is easier on the eyes, and harder on the eyes though, and you naturally want to lean toward easier until you are used to it.

There are two primary controls. Ctrl-F4 to increase separation. Ctrl-F6 to increase convergence. (and Ctrl-F3 to decrease separation, Ctrl-F5 to decrease convergence.)

To start off, just use separation and use only it for awhile to get used to it.

When you want to play with convergence, that increases the pop-out effect. You have to enable that in Set Keyboard Shortcuts->Show Advanced In Game Settings.

You hold Ctrl-F6 until you start to see an effect. There is no on screen feedback. It takes a long time, like 20 seconds before anything noticeable changes.

Start small, and build up. If you crank the convergence too high for example, some people get headaches within 10 minutes of play. If your eyes feel like they are straining, you are going too far. You should feel any eyestrain during normal use.


For your 50" screen at 6' viewing, you can probably get to 75-80% on the separation number. Depends on how well your eyes and brain adapt to the system.

But to start off, I'd recommend using 25% on separation, and no convergence.

Acer H5360 (1280x720@120Hz) - ASUS VG248QE with GSync mod - 3D Vision 1&2 - Driver 372.54
GTX 970 - i5-4670K@4.2GHz - 12GB RAM - Win7x64+evilKB2670838 - 4 Disk X25 RAID
SAGER NP9870-S - GTX 980 - i7-6700K - Win10 Pro 1607
Latest 3Dmigoto Release
Bo3b's School for ShaderHackers

#19
Posted 02/14/2013 07:55 AM   
[quote="cosmiclegend"]Thats alot of information to take in in one day. I'll read through this and see if I understand. However for now what settings would you suggest I use, with a 1080p active TV, with a 50" screen what [/quote] haha, all this info is COMPLETELY irrelevant to your question cosmiclegend, its more from a development point of view, or deeper understanding of 3D. But really there is only two points. convergence: how wide are your in game eyes apart from each other. depth: at what angle are your in game eyes focussing to see the furthest away point. fiddle around until you get something awesome, and if your new to 3D gaming, keep the settings low to avoid eye strain and problems focusing. once your used to it, i find high depth and high convergence to be mucho fun, but everyones different.
cosmiclegend said:Thats alot of information to take in in one day. I'll read through this and see if I understand. However for now what settings would you suggest I use, with a 1080p active TV, with a 50" screen what


haha, all this info is COMPLETELY irrelevant to your question cosmiclegend, its more from a development point of view, or deeper understanding of 3D. But really there is only two points.

convergence: how wide are your in game eyes apart from each other.
depth: at what angle are your in game eyes focussing to see the furthest away point.

fiddle around until you get something awesome, and if your new to 3D gaming, keep the settings low to avoid eye strain and problems focusing. once your used to it, i find high depth and high convergence to be mucho fun, but everyones different.

OS: Win 8 CPU: I7 4770k 3.5GZ GPU: GTX 780ti

#20
Posted 02/14/2013 08:43 AM   
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