Was wondering if anyone knows if ghosting is better or worse on a CRT, DLP, or the bundled LCD. I'm thinging LCD and DLP are better with a lower contrast ratios but have not seen any coments on this. I have read numerous reviews about the pros and cons of this tech but never heard of any ghosting issues by the reviewers. :rolleyes:
Was wondering if anyone knows if ghosting is better or worse on a CRT, DLP, or the bundled LCD. I'm thinging LCD and DLP are better with a lower contrast ratios but have not seen any coments on this. I have read numerous reviews about the pros and cons of this tech but never heard of any ghosting issues by the reviewers. :rolleyes:
[quote name='EvilCasper' post='496469' date='Jan 25 2009, 12:41 PM']Was wondering if anyone knows if ghosting is better or worse on a CRT, DLP, or the bundled LCD. I'm thinging LCD and DLP are better with a lower contrast ratios but have not seen any coments on this. I have read numerous reviews about the pros and cons of this tech but never heard of any ghosting issues by the reviewers. :rolleyes:[/quote]
As far as we can tell, the ghosting is probably related to the glasses not going dark enough and letting in light from the video frames intended for the other eye. It likely will happen on every display because it appears to be an issue with the glasses.
Concerning it not being mentioned is reviews, it only happens in certain scenario's and is often easy to overlook the first time using the glasses. I used them for a full 4 or 5 hours before I noticed the ghosting. The 3D effect is so amazing the first time you see it, that the ghosting is easy to miss.
[quote name='EvilCasper' post='496469' date='Jan 25 2009, 12:41 PM']Was wondering if anyone knows if ghosting is better or worse on a CRT, DLP, or the bundled LCD. I'm thinging LCD and DLP are better with a lower contrast ratios but have not seen any coments on this. I have read numerous reviews about the pros and cons of this tech but never heard of any ghosting issues by the reviewers. :rolleyes:
As far as we can tell, the ghosting is probably related to the glasses not going dark enough and letting in light from the video frames intended for the other eye. It likely will happen on every display because it appears to be an issue with the glasses.
Concerning it not being mentioned is reviews, it only happens in certain scenario's and is often easy to overlook the first time using the glasses. I used them for a full 4 or 5 hours before I noticed the ghosting. The 3D effect is so amazing the first time you see it, that the ghosting is easy to miss.
[quote name='Paul Benden' post='499216' date='Jan 30 2009, 06:51 PM']As far as we can tell, the ghosting is probably related to the glasses not going dark enough and letting in light from the video frames intended for the other eye. It likely will happen on every display because it appears to be an issue with the glasses.
Concerning it not being mentioned is reviews, it only happens in certain scenario's and is often easy to overlook the first time using the glasses. I used them for a full 4 or 5 hours before I noticed the ghosting. The 3D effect is so amazing the first time you see it, that the ghosting is easy to miss.[/quote]
This makes sense why the reviewers didn't comment on ghosting, but it was just the opposite for me. I noticed the ghosting early on but now it doesn't seem to be as bad. With time and with some tweaking on my CRT monitor, upping the gamma, I hardly notice it at all. The ghosts appear at screen depth while my focus is much farther in. Ghosts can actually be useful to some degree. Calibrating image seperation and convergance can be gauged with ghosts as a reference point.
In researching the ghosting effect I found that it is actually caused by two properties, the leakage you mentioned and something else called decay or afterglow. The percentage between the two causes is about half with shutter leakage being just a little more. In my setup I am using a CRT and the decay comes from phospor, but LCDs have a similar decay effect. LCDs ghost because they have a transition lag time from opaque to clear, this is called response time. Anyone remember the early days of LCDs, the decay or lag was so severe that ghosting was present in video even without shutter glasses. Additionally, anyone using a CRT will also notice the ghosting much worse at the bottom 10% of the screen. This has to do with the way an electron beam scans the image, beginning at the top left and working down to the bottom right. The phosphor at the bottom is last to be energized and thus last to turn off. I am not sure if this happens at the bottom of LCDs, maybe someone here can confirm this. As for DLPs there is no ghosting from decay or lag for they use a MMD (micro-mirror device) which switches much faster than liquid crystals. The only ghosting left is from shutter leakage and this is half of the total ghosting CRT and LCD users see. Some DLP users claim to have near zero ghosting, though I can't confirm this, maybe someone else can.
Practically every 3D system suffers from ghosting to some degree, some worse than others. If you truly want zero ghosting as I do the only option would be a head-mounted display. There is no cross talk because each eye receives a seperate and independant image. A good HMD with a 720p resolution will cost about the price of a 60" DLP screen, about $1500. Too much money right now, but at least its finally here and a real consideration for the future. Add a head tracker for good measure, zero ghosting and total immersion, S-3D is taken to the next level. After decades of failed promises, VR is becomming a reality, at the cost of a 60" home theater rig.
This is just the beginning...
ghost out /thumbup.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':thumbup:' />
[quote name='Paul Benden' post='499216' date='Jan 30 2009, 06:51 PM']As far as we can tell, the ghosting is probably related to the glasses not going dark enough and letting in light from the video frames intended for the other eye. It likely will happen on every display because it appears to be an issue with the glasses.
Concerning it not being mentioned is reviews, it only happens in certain scenario's and is often easy to overlook the first time using the glasses. I used them for a full 4 or 5 hours before I noticed the ghosting. The 3D effect is so amazing the first time you see it, that the ghosting is easy to miss.
This makes sense why the reviewers didn't comment on ghosting, but it was just the opposite for me. I noticed the ghosting early on but now it doesn't seem to be as bad. With time and with some tweaking on my CRT monitor, upping the gamma, I hardly notice it at all. The ghosts appear at screen depth while my focus is much farther in. Ghosts can actually be useful to some degree. Calibrating image seperation and convergance can be gauged with ghosts as a reference point.
In researching the ghosting effect I found that it is actually caused by two properties, the leakage you mentioned and something else called decay or afterglow. The percentage between the two causes is about half with shutter leakage being just a little more. In my setup I am using a CRT and the decay comes from phospor, but LCDs have a similar decay effect. LCDs ghost because they have a transition lag time from opaque to clear, this is called response time. Anyone remember the early days of LCDs, the decay or lag was so severe that ghosting was present in video even without shutter glasses. Additionally, anyone using a CRT will also notice the ghosting much worse at the bottom 10% of the screen. This has to do with the way an electron beam scans the image, beginning at the top left and working down to the bottom right. The phosphor at the bottom is last to be energized and thus last to turn off. I am not sure if this happens at the bottom of LCDs, maybe someone here can confirm this. As for DLPs there is no ghosting from decay or lag for they use a MMD (micro-mirror device) which switches much faster than liquid crystals. The only ghosting left is from shutter leakage and this is half of the total ghosting CRT and LCD users see. Some DLP users claim to have near zero ghosting, though I can't confirm this, maybe someone else can.
Practically every 3D system suffers from ghosting to some degree, some worse than others. If you truly want zero ghosting as I do the only option would be a head-mounted display. There is no cross talk because each eye receives a seperate and independant image. A good HMD with a 720p resolution will cost about the price of a 60" DLP screen, about $1500. Too much money right now, but at least its finally here and a real consideration for the future. Add a head tracker for good measure, zero ghosting and total immersion, S-3D is taken to the next level. After decades of failed promises, VR is becomming a reality, at the cost of a 60" home theater rig.
This is just the beginning...
ghost out /thumbup.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':thumbup:' />
As far as we can tell, the ghosting is probably related to the glasses not going dark enough and letting in light from the video frames intended for the other eye. It likely will happen on every display because it appears to be an issue with the glasses.
Concerning it not being mentioned is reviews, it only happens in certain scenario's and is often easy to overlook the first time using the glasses. I used them for a full 4 or 5 hours before I noticed the ghosting. The 3D effect is so amazing the first time you see it, that the ghosting is easy to miss.
As far as we can tell, the ghosting is probably related to the glasses not going dark enough and letting in light from the video frames intended for the other eye. It likely will happen on every display because it appears to be an issue with the glasses.
Concerning it not being mentioned is reviews, it only happens in certain scenario's and is often easy to overlook the first time using the glasses. I used them for a full 4 or 5 hours before I noticed the ghosting. The 3D effect is so amazing the first time you see it, that the ghosting is easy to miss.
Concerning it not being mentioned is reviews, it only happens in certain scenario's and is often easy to overlook the first time using the glasses. I used them for a full 4 or 5 hours before I noticed the ghosting. The 3D effect is so amazing the first time you see it, that the ghosting is easy to miss.[/quote]
This makes sense why the reviewers didn't comment on ghosting, but it was just the opposite for me. I noticed the ghosting early on but now it doesn't seem to be as bad. With time and with some tweaking on my CRT monitor, upping the gamma, I hardly notice it at all. The ghosts appear at screen depth while my focus is much farther in. Ghosts can actually be useful to some degree. Calibrating image seperation and convergance can be gauged with ghosts as a reference point.
In researching the ghosting effect I found that it is actually caused by two properties, the leakage you mentioned and something else called decay or afterglow. The percentage between the two causes is about half with shutter leakage being just a little more. In my setup I am using a CRT and the decay comes from phospor, but LCDs have a similar decay effect. LCDs ghost because they have a transition lag time from opaque to clear, this is called response time. Anyone remember the early days of LCDs, the decay or lag was so severe that ghosting was present in video even without shutter glasses. Additionally, anyone using a CRT will also notice the ghosting much worse at the bottom 10% of the screen. This has to do with the way an electron beam scans the image, beginning at the top left and working down to the bottom right. The phosphor at the bottom is last to be energized and thus last to turn off. I am not sure if this happens at the bottom of LCDs, maybe someone here can confirm this. As for DLPs there is no ghosting from decay or lag for they use a MMD (micro-mirror device) which switches much faster than liquid crystals. The only ghosting left is from shutter leakage and this is half of the total ghosting CRT and LCD users see. Some DLP users claim to have near zero ghosting, though I can't confirm this, maybe someone else can.
Practically every 3D system suffers from ghosting to some degree, some worse than others. If you truly want zero ghosting as I do the only option would be a head-mounted display. There is no cross talk because each eye receives a seperate and independant image. A good HMD with a 720p resolution will cost about the price of a 60" DLP screen, about $1500. Too much money right now, but at least its finally here and a real consideration for the future. Add a head tracker for good measure, zero ghosting and total immersion, S-3D is taken to the next level. After decades of failed promises, VR is becomming a reality, at the cost of a 60" home theater rig.
This is just the beginning...
ghost out
Concerning it not being mentioned is reviews, it only happens in certain scenario's and is often easy to overlook the first time using the glasses. I used them for a full 4 or 5 hours before I noticed the ghosting. The 3D effect is so amazing the first time you see it, that the ghosting is easy to miss.
This makes sense why the reviewers didn't comment on ghosting, but it was just the opposite for me. I noticed the ghosting early on but now it doesn't seem to be as bad. With time and with some tweaking on my CRT monitor, upping the gamma, I hardly notice it at all. The ghosts appear at screen depth while my focus is much farther in. Ghosts can actually be useful to some degree. Calibrating image seperation and convergance can be gauged with ghosts as a reference point.
In researching the ghosting effect I found that it is actually caused by two properties, the leakage you mentioned and something else called decay or afterglow. The percentage between the two causes is about half with shutter leakage being just a little more. In my setup I am using a CRT and the decay comes from phospor, but LCDs have a similar decay effect. LCDs ghost because they have a transition lag time from opaque to clear, this is called response time. Anyone remember the early days of LCDs, the decay or lag was so severe that ghosting was present in video even without shutter glasses. Additionally, anyone using a CRT will also notice the ghosting much worse at the bottom 10% of the screen. This has to do with the way an electron beam scans the image, beginning at the top left and working down to the bottom right. The phosphor at the bottom is last to be energized and thus last to turn off. I am not sure if this happens at the bottom of LCDs, maybe someone here can confirm this. As for DLPs there is no ghosting from decay or lag for they use a MMD (micro-mirror device) which switches much faster than liquid crystals. The only ghosting left is from shutter leakage and this is half of the total ghosting CRT and LCD users see. Some DLP users claim to have near zero ghosting, though I can't confirm this, maybe someone else can.
Practically every 3D system suffers from ghosting to some degree, some worse than others. If you truly want zero ghosting as I do the only option would be a head-mounted display. There is no cross talk because each eye receives a seperate and independant image. A good HMD with a 720p resolution will cost about the price of a 60" DLP screen, about $1500. Too much money right now, but at least its finally here and a real consideration for the future. Add a head tracker for good measure, zero ghosting and total immersion, S-3D is taken to the next level. After decades of failed promises, VR is becomming a reality, at the cost of a 60" home theater rig.
This is just the beginning...
ghost out