Anybody try 120hz LCD HDTV but only 60hz input?
Hi everyone,

I checked the forum and knowledge base and I know they say the following:

[i]3D Vision-Ready LCDs – such as the Samsung SyncMaster 2233Z and ViewSonic® FuHzion™ VX2265wm accept a 120 Hz input and display at 120 Hz refresh rate . There are LCD HDTVs that are on the market display at 120 Hz refresh rate, but only accept a 60 Hz input signal over HDMI or dual-link DVI. These type of displays use framerate conversion or backlight flashing to convert 60 Hz signals into 120 Hz.

Please continue to check the 3D Vision System Requirements for a full list of 3D Vision—Ready displays. [url="http://www.nvidia.com/object/GeForce_3D_Vi...quirements.html"]http://www.nvidia.com/object/GeForce_3D_Vi...quirements.html[/url]
[/i]
HOWEVER, has anyone tried them on a 120hz HDTV with only the 60hz input from a PC? Would the "framerate conversion or backlight flashing" compensate for the lower 60hz input? I have the Samsung LN46A650 which has "Auto Motion Plus 120Hz" but only 60hz input from PC. If anyone tried this on a similar TV, please reply because I'd love to get these 3D glasses but there's no way I'm getting a new TV (and no I won't get a new monitor either). Thanks.

Peter
Hi everyone,



I checked the forum and knowledge base and I know they say the following:



3D Vision-Ready LCDs – such as the Samsung SyncMaster 2233Z and ViewSonic® FuHzion™ VX2265wm accept a 120 Hz input and display at 120 Hz refresh rate . There are LCD HDTVs that are on the market display at 120 Hz refresh rate, but only accept a 60 Hz input signal over HDMI or dual-link DVI. These type of displays use framerate conversion or backlight flashing to convert 60 Hz signals into 120 Hz.



Please continue to check the 3D Vision System Requirements for a full list of 3D Vision—Ready displays. http://www.nvidia.com/object/GeForce_3D_Vi...quirements.html



HOWEVER, has anyone tried them on a 120hz HDTV with only the 60hz input from a PC? Would the "framerate conversion or backlight flashing" compensate for the lower 60hz input? I have the Samsung LN46A650 which has "Auto Motion Plus 120Hz" but only 60hz input from PC. If anyone tried this on a similar TV, please reply because I'd love to get these 3D glasses but there's no way I'm getting a new TV (and no I won't get a new monitor either). Thanks.



Peter

#1
Posted 02/13/2009 02:24 PM   
[quote name='irinipaci' post='505215' date='Feb 13 2009, 08:24 AM']Hi everyone,

I checked the forum and knowledge base and I know they say the following:

[i]3D Vision-Ready LCDs – such as the Samsung SyncMaster 2233Z and ViewSonic® FuHzion™ VX2265wm accept a 120 Hz input and display at 120 Hz refresh rate . There are LCD HDTVs that are on the market display at 120 Hz refresh rate, but only accept a 60 Hz input signal over HDMI or dual-link DVI. These type of displays use framerate conversion or backlight flashing to convert 60 Hz signals into 120 Hz.

Please continue to check the 3D Vision System Requirements for a full list of 3D Vision—Ready displays. [url="http://www.nvidia.com/object/GeForce_3D_Vi...quirements.html"]http://www.nvidia.com/object/GeForce_3D_Vi...quirements.html[/url]
[/i]
HOWEVER, has anyone tried them on a 120hz HDTV with only the 60hz input from a PC? Would the "framerate conversion or backlight flashing" compensate for the lower 60hz input? I have the Samsung LN46A650 which has "Auto Motion Plus 120Hz" but only 60hz input from PC. If anyone tried this on a similar TV, please reply because I'd love to get these 3D glasses but there's no way I'm getting a new TV (and no I won't get a new monitor either). Thanks.

Peter[/quote]

Hi,

It won't work, and there will be option to enable it. There is no way to create frames that doesnt exist.
[quote name='irinipaci' post='505215' date='Feb 13 2009, 08:24 AM']Hi everyone,



I checked the forum and knowledge base and I know they say the following:



3D Vision-Ready LCDs – such as the Samsung SyncMaster 2233Z and ViewSonic® FuHzion™ VX2265wm accept a 120 Hz input and display at 120 Hz refresh rate . There are LCD HDTVs that are on the market display at 120 Hz refresh rate, but only accept a 60 Hz input signal over HDMI or dual-link DVI. These type of displays use framerate conversion or backlight flashing to convert 60 Hz signals into 120 Hz.



Please continue to check the 3D Vision System Requirements for a full list of 3D Vision—Ready displays. http://www.nvidia.com/object/GeForce_3D_Vi...quirements.html



HOWEVER, has anyone tried them on a 120hz HDTV with only the 60hz input from a PC? Would the "framerate conversion or backlight flashing" compensate for the lower 60hz input? I have the Samsung LN46A650 which has "Auto Motion Plus 120Hz" but only 60hz input from PC. If anyone tried this on a similar TV, please reply because I'd love to get these 3D glasses but there's no way I'm getting a new TV (and no I won't get a new monitor either). Thanks.



Peter



Hi,



It won't work, and there will be option to enable it. There is no way to create frames that doesnt exist.

#2
Posted 02/13/2009 05:38 PM   
[quote name='andrewf@nvidia' post='505275' date='Feb 13 2009, 01:38 PM']Hi,

It won't work, and there will be option to enable it. There is no way to create frames that doesnt exist.[/quote]

Hi, I have the same TV (Samsung LN46A650) and would love to get these glasses.

What do you mean by "there will be option to enable it"? Can you elaborate further please? Do you mean in the future we will be able to use this somehow?
[quote name='andrewf@nvidia' post='505275' date='Feb 13 2009, 01:38 PM']Hi,



It won't work, and there will be option to enable it. There is no way to create frames that doesnt exist.



Hi, I have the same TV (Samsung LN46A650) and would love to get these glasses.



What do you mean by "there will be option to enable it"? Can you elaborate further please? Do you mean in the future we will be able to use this somehow?

#3
Posted 05/28/2009 09:51 PM   
[quote name='M0N5TER' post='546281' date='May 28 2009, 05:51 PM']Hi, I have the same TV (Samsung LN46A650) and would love to get these glasses.

What do you mean by "there will be option to enable it"? Can you elaborate further please? Do you mean in the future we will be able to use this somehow?[/quote]

You won't get a response from Andrew, nvidia stopped replying on these forums months ago. :">

3d Vision won't work with any LCDs except the Samsung 2233RZ and Viewsonic VX2265WM. In order to be compatible, the LCD has to be able to produce a 120Hz display AS WELL AS accept a 120Hz signal, currently the Samsung & Viewsonic are the only 2 LCDs on the market that do so. Any other LCD that purports to be "120Hz" but does not expressly say "3d-ready" is actually only receiving a 60Hz signal, then interpolating frames to output an emulated 120Hz in an effort to produce a smoother output image. Those LCDs do not actually accept 120Hz input, though, which is essential for 3d Vision to work.
[quote name='M0N5TER' post='546281' date='May 28 2009, 05:51 PM']Hi, I have the same TV (Samsung LN46A650) and would love to get these glasses.



What do you mean by "there will be option to enable it"? Can you elaborate further please? Do you mean in the future we will be able to use this somehow?



You won't get a response from Andrew, nvidia stopped replying on these forums months ago. :">



3d Vision won't work with any LCDs except the Samsung 2233RZ and Viewsonic VX2265WM. In order to be compatible, the LCD has to be able to produce a 120Hz display AS WELL AS accept a 120Hz signal, currently the Samsung & Viewsonic are the only 2 LCDs on the market that do so. Any other LCD that purports to be "120Hz" but does not expressly say "3d-ready" is actually only receiving a 60Hz signal, then interpolating frames to output an emulated 120Hz in an effort to produce a smoother output image. Those LCDs do not actually accept 120Hz input, though, which is essential for 3d Vision to work.

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#4
Posted 05/29/2009 01:34 AM   
[quote name='Chris-NYC' post='546332' date='May 29 2009, 03:34 AM']You won't get a response from Andrew, nvidia stopped replying on these forums months ago.[/quote]

Well, maybe he would... but just adding a Nvidia logo and a nvidia website to one's profile doesn't make it an official nvidia statement ;-)

otherwise, secon'd... It does NOT work on any other than the listed monitors: either native 120Hz TFTs or DLPs that accept checkerboard input and put out Vesa signal... If you don't have one of these and do not want to uprade, save your money and time.
[quote name='Chris-NYC' post='546332' date='May 29 2009, 03:34 AM']You won't get a response from Andrew, nvidia stopped replying on these forums months ago.



Well, maybe he would... but just adding a Nvidia logo and a nvidia website to one's profile doesn't make it an official nvidia statement ;-)



otherwise, secon'd... It does NOT work on any other than the listed monitors: either native 120Hz TFTs or DLPs that accept checkerboard input and put out Vesa signal... If you don't have one of these and do not want to uprade, save your money and time.

#5
Posted 05/29/2009 11:52 AM   
Thanks for the replies fellas.

Bummer, just got this TV not long ago, and I don't think I'll get a new one anytime soon.

Do you guys think that it might be possible in the future to get an adapter or firmware upgrade that will allow 120Hz input to these TVs? I mean, they're capable of displaying 120Hz, but some idiot decided to limit the input. WTF? Or is this a hardware issue that can't be resolved, i.e. we're missing certain pins on the VGA connector or something like that.
Thanks for the replies fellas.



Bummer, just got this TV not long ago, and I don't think I'll get a new one anytime soon.



Do you guys think that it might be possible in the future to get an adapter or firmware upgrade that will allow 120Hz input to these TVs? I mean, they're capable of displaying 120Hz, but some idiot decided to limit the input. WTF? Or is this a hardware issue that can't be resolved, i.e. we're missing certain pins on the VGA connector or something like that.

#6
Posted 05/29/2009 03:23 PM   
[quote name='M0N5TER' post='546551' date='May 29 2009, 05:23 PM']Do you guys think that it might be possible in the future to get an adapter or firmware upgrade that will allow 120Hz input to these TVs? Or is this a hardware issue that can't be resolved, i.e. we're missing certain pins on the VGA connector or something like that.[/quote]
It's not the mechanical interface, as stated in another thread HDMI has 340MHz bandwith which is basically sufficiant for Full HD @ 120 Hz. However, the electronics that drive the display is more than likely not capable for this. You must understand the idea behind higher refresh rates on these LCD screens primarily designed for watching TV and movies: It is supposed to reduce stutter or judder. To achieve this the signal passes a quite complicated algorithm that calculates artificially interpolated frames between the actual present frames. All this electronics would have to be hard-bypassed completely to allow the input signal to reach the panel without alteration. It is very unlikely the hardware allows for that signal flow and even if it would be this would mean a lot of firmware rewriting for the manufacturer without additional profit. From a marketing perspective they would rather release a new model.
[quote name='M0N5TER' post='546551' date='May 29 2009, 05:23 PM']Do you guys think that it might be possible in the future to get an adapter or firmware upgrade that will allow 120Hz input to these TVs? Or is this a hardware issue that can't be resolved, i.e. we're missing certain pins on the VGA connector or something like that.

It's not the mechanical interface, as stated in another thread HDMI has 340MHz bandwith which is basically sufficiant for Full HD @ 120 Hz. However, the electronics that drive the display is more than likely not capable for this. You must understand the idea behind higher refresh rates on these LCD screens primarily designed for watching TV and movies: It is supposed to reduce stutter or judder. To achieve this the signal passes a quite complicated algorithm that calculates artificially interpolated frames between the actual present frames. All this electronics would have to be hard-bypassed completely to allow the input signal to reach the panel without alteration. It is very unlikely the hardware allows for that signal flow and even if it would be this would mean a lot of firmware rewriting for the manufacturer without additional profit. From a marketing perspective they would rather release a new model.

#7
Posted 05/29/2009 11:03 PM   
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