It is now the second anniversary of my initial commit of my dx9/10/11 wrapper. Coding started earlier before christmas. Two weeks before the public announcement bo3b contacted me to tell me about 3DMigoto going open source. I did some heavy lifting creating an assembler something lacking in 3DMigoto but present in Helix dx11 wrapper. I remember some heavy exchanges between HeliX and Chiri. HeliX stated why he created a disassembler but I never noticed any problems with the standard MS disassembler until I later realized it rounded values which I later fixed.
The end result for my dx11 wrapper is 6000 lines of code. The question is where to go from here. My dx9 wrapper is far less sophisticated than HeliX wrapper. I migrated features from 3DMigoto to be able to run Crysis 3 but here everything kind of stopped. As the texture hashing changed I decided to stop and put things on a backburner. It is time to pretty much admit defeat in what has always been David against Goliath. 3DMigoto is a massive beast.
Having basically wasted that much time makes me sad. It felt really good in the beginning when the future for DX11 was really bleak with two abandoned wrappers and both authors being AWOL. I felt like the only one crazy enough to start writing a wrapper knowing I would learn what I needed along the way. This turned out to be very accurate, no-one else was that crazy.
Being the author of a wrapper few people used and being unable to fix shaders makes my contribution very small considering the time spent.
Going forward one question is when DX12 will appear and how VR and 3D Vision will co-exist.
I've recently bought a 3D camera and that is just as amazing as the old 3D camera I completely misplaced. 2D photos are way worse than my Nikon 5100 but 3D looks really good.
Currently I'm stuck in 2D land. I've spent 40h last two weeks playing Counter-Strike.
I clearly don't limit myself to only play 3D games.
My top played games
TF2
Counter-Strike: Global Offensive
Dawn of War 2 MP
Trials Evolution
Trials 2
Counter-Strike: Source
Natural Selection 2
Older history is not kept by steam.
I'm no longer expecting official 3D Vision Ready games but you can always hope.
There is a overall trend, my most played games don't work in 3D for the most part and none of them can be finished. The last part is probably why I don't finish games as a general rule.
As long as we have people fixing games 3D Vision will live on.
I would gladly play with other 3D Vision users if timezone and latency is manageable.
http://steamcommunity.com/id/Flugan
It is now the second anniversary of my initial commit of my dx9/10/11 wrapper. Coding started earlier before christmas. Two weeks before the public announcement bo3b contacted me to tell me about 3DMigoto going open source. I did some heavy lifting creating an assembler something lacking in 3DMigoto but present in Helix dx11 wrapper. I remember some heavy exchanges between HeliX and Chiri. HeliX stated why he created a disassembler but I never noticed any problems with the standard MS disassembler until I later realized it rounded values which I later fixed.
The end result for my dx11 wrapper is 6000 lines of code. The question is where to go from here. My dx9 wrapper is far less sophisticated than HeliX wrapper. I migrated features from 3DMigoto to be able to run Crysis 3 but here everything kind of stopped. As the texture hashing changed I decided to stop and put things on a backburner. It is time to pretty much admit defeat in what has always been David against Goliath. 3DMigoto is a massive beast.
Having basically wasted that much time makes me sad. It felt really good in the beginning when the future for DX11 was really bleak with two abandoned wrappers and both authors being AWOL. I felt like the only one crazy enough to start writing a wrapper knowing I would learn what I needed along the way. This turned out to be very accurate, no-one else was that crazy.
Being the author of a wrapper few people used and being unable to fix shaders makes my contribution very small considering the time spent.
Going forward one question is when DX12 will appear and how VR and 3D Vision will co-exist.
I've recently bought a 3D camera and that is just as amazing as the old 3D camera I completely misplaced. 2D photos are way worse than my Nikon 5100 but 3D looks really good.
Currently I'm stuck in 2D land. I've spent 40h last two weeks playing Counter-Strike.
I clearly don't limit myself to only play 3D games.
My top played games
TF2
Counter-Strike: Global Offensive
Dawn of War 2 MP
Trials Evolution
Trials 2
Counter-Strike: Source
Natural Selection 2
Older history is not kept by steam.
I'm no longer expecting official 3D Vision Ready games but you can always hope.
There is a overall trend, my most played games don't work in 3D for the most part and none of them can be finished. The last part is probably why I don't finish games as a general rule.
As long as we have people fixing games 3D Vision will live on.
I would gladly play with other 3D Vision users if timezone and latency is manageable.
http://steamcommunity.com/id/Flugan
Thanks to everybody using my assembler it warms my heart.
To have a critical piece of code that everyone can enjoy!
What more can you ask for?
[quote="Flugan"]It is now the second anniversary of my initial commit of my dx9/10/11 wrapper. Coding started earlier before christmas. Two weeks before the public announcement bo3b contacted me to tell me about 3DMigoto going open source. I did some heavy lifting creating an assembler something lacking in 3DMigoto but present in Helix dx11 wrapper. I remember some heavy exchanges between HeliX and Chiri. HeliX stated why he created a disassembler but I never noticed any problems with the standard MS disassembler until I later realized it rounded values which I later fixed.
The end result for my dx11 wrapper is 6000 lines of code. The question is where to go from here. My dx9 wrapper is far less sophisticated than HeliX wrapper. I migrated features from 3DMigoto to be able to run Crysis 3 but here everything kind of stopped. As the texture hashing changed I decided to stop and put things on a backburner. It is time to pretty much admit defeat in what has always been David against Goliath. 3DMigoto is a massive beast.
Having basically wasted that much time makes me sad. It felt really good in the beginning when the future for DX11 was really bleak with two abandoned wrappers and both authors being AWOL. I felt like the only one crazy enough to start writing a wrapper knowing I would learn what I needed along the way. This turned out to be very accurate, no-one else was that crazy.
Being the author of a wrapper few people used and being unable to fix shaders makes my contribution very small considering the time spent.
Going forward one question is when DX12 will appear and how VR and 3D Vision will co-exist.
I've recently bought a 3D camera and that is just as amazing as the old 3D camera I completely misplaced. 2D photos are way worse than my Nikon 5100 but 3D looks really good.
Currently I'm stuck in 2D land. I've spent 40h last two weeks playing Counter-Strike.
I clearly don't limit myself to only play 3D games.
My top played games
TF2
Counter-Strike: Global Offensive
Dawn of War 2 MP
Trials Evolution
Trials 2
Counter-Strike: Source
Natural Selection 2
Older history is not kept by steam.
I'm no longer expecting official 3D Vision Ready games but you can always hope.
There is a overall trend, my most played games don't work in 3D for the most part and none of them can be finished. The last part is probably why I don't finish games as a general rule.
As long as we have people fixing games 3D Vision will live on.
I would gladly play with other 3D Vision users if timezone and latency is manageable.
http://steamcommunity.com/id/Flugan[/quote]
Thank you. We really do appreciate your work. It takes great skill to write 6000 lines of code to make a wrapper. I used yours with Project CARS because it was the only one that worked on Windows 10 at first.
I was not aware there was a 3D Vision community on Steam. I just joined. But I don't play FPS or other violent games, which seem to make up almost all the games now. That leaves me with racing games like Dirt Rally. I wish there were more modern 3D platformer games that work well with 3D Vision. Anyone know any? :)
Flugan said:It is now the second anniversary of my initial commit of my dx9/10/11 wrapper. Coding started earlier before christmas. Two weeks before the public announcement bo3b contacted me to tell me about 3DMigoto going open source. I did some heavy lifting creating an assembler something lacking in 3DMigoto but present in Helix dx11 wrapper. I remember some heavy exchanges between HeliX and Chiri. HeliX stated why he created a disassembler but I never noticed any problems with the standard MS disassembler until I later realized it rounded values which I later fixed.
The end result for my dx11 wrapper is 6000 lines of code. The question is where to go from here. My dx9 wrapper is far less sophisticated than HeliX wrapper. I migrated features from 3DMigoto to be able to run Crysis 3 but here everything kind of stopped. As the texture hashing changed I decided to stop and put things on a backburner. It is time to pretty much admit defeat in what has always been David against Goliath. 3DMigoto is a massive beast.
Having basically wasted that much time makes me sad. It felt really good in the beginning when the future for DX11 was really bleak with two abandoned wrappers and both authors being AWOL. I felt like the only one crazy enough to start writing a wrapper knowing I would learn what I needed along the way. This turned out to be very accurate, no-one else was that crazy.
Being the author of a wrapper few people used and being unable to fix shaders makes my contribution very small considering the time spent.
Going forward one question is when DX12 will appear and how VR and 3D Vision will co-exist.
I've recently bought a 3D camera and that is just as amazing as the old 3D camera I completely misplaced. 2D photos are way worse than my Nikon 5100 but 3D looks really good.
Currently I'm stuck in 2D land. I've spent 40h last two weeks playing Counter-Strike.
I clearly don't limit myself to only play 3D games.
My top played games
TF2
Counter-Strike: Global Offensive
Dawn of War 2 MP
Trials Evolution
Trials 2
Counter-Strike: Source
Natural Selection 2
Older history is not kept by steam.
I'm no longer expecting official 3D Vision Ready games but you can always hope.
There is a overall trend, my most played games don't work in 3D for the most part and none of them can be finished. The last part is probably why I don't finish games as a general rule.
As long as we have people fixing games 3D Vision will live on.
I would gladly play with other 3D Vision users if timezone and latency is manageable.
http://steamcommunity.com/id/Flugan
Thank you. We really do appreciate your work. It takes great skill to write 6000 lines of code to make a wrapper. I used yours with Project CARS because it was the only one that worked on Windows 10 at first.
I was not aware there was a 3D Vision community on Steam. I just joined. But I don't play FPS or other violent games, which seem to make up almost all the games now. That leaves me with racing games like Dirt Rally. I wish there were more modern 3D platformer games that work well with 3D Vision. Anyone know any? :)
[quote="Flugan"]My dx9 wrapper is far less sophisticated than HeliX wrapper. I migrated features from 3DMigoto to be able to run Crysis 3 but here everything kind of stopped.[/quote]
Honestly, I find whenever I'm working on a Dx9 game with the Helix wrapper, it's an extreme exercise in tedium. The actual fact that I have to dump the shaders at one time, exit the game, and then have to relaunch the game after copying the shaders into the override folder is such a massive headache. Then there's the issue of newer versions of the wrapper not working with certain games, so then having to try to fix without access to certain functions. Not to mention the greater ease of using HLSL than ASM in 3DMigoto... if you were able to make a Dx9 wrapper that's more inline with 3DMigoto, I for one would think that would be a very valuable addition to the community's toolset. Just a shame that Helix wrapper was not open sourced and able to build off of that. I know Dx9 is mostly yesterday's news, but there are still games being released that are only Dx9 (Dragons Dogma that I'm currently looking at), and a lot of games still have Dx9 compatibility. Just some food for thought, since I think that in the end you really want to be able to be an active contributor to the community, which is certainly admirable.
Flugan said:My dx9 wrapper is far less sophisticated than HeliX wrapper. I migrated features from 3DMigoto to be able to run Crysis 3 but here everything kind of stopped.
Honestly, I find whenever I'm working on a Dx9 game with the Helix wrapper, it's an extreme exercise in tedium. The actual fact that I have to dump the shaders at one time, exit the game, and then have to relaunch the game after copying the shaders into the override folder is such a massive headache. Then there's the issue of newer versions of the wrapper not working with certain games, so then having to try to fix without access to certain functions. Not to mention the greater ease of using HLSL than ASM in 3DMigoto... if you were able to make a Dx9 wrapper that's more inline with 3DMigoto, I for one would think that would be a very valuable addition to the community's toolset. Just a shame that Helix wrapper was not open sourced and able to build off of that. I know Dx9 is mostly yesterday's news, but there are still games being released that are only Dx9 (Dragons Dogma that I'm currently looking at), and a lot of games still have Dx9 compatibility. Just some food for thought, since I think that in the end you really want to be able to be an active contributor to the community, which is certainly admirable.
3D Gaming Rig: CPU: i7 7700K @ 4.9Ghz | Mobo: Asus Maximus Hero VIII | RAM: Corsair Dominator 16GB | GPU: 2 x GTX 1080 Ti SLI | 3xSSDs for OS and Apps, 2 x HDD's for 11GB storage | PSU: Seasonic X-1250 M2| Case: Corsair C70 | Cooling: Corsair H115i Hydro cooler | Displays: Asus PG278QR, BenQ XL2420TX & BenQ HT1075 | OS: Windows 10 Pro + Windows 7 dual boot
[color="green"]Flugan:[/color]
6000 lines of code is amazing, and I know you did it for for the best, I don't see why think of it as a contest !
Many of us try the BEST WE CAN to contribute, and it's not that easy, and you certanly have tried,
No one can take that from you !
I use your convergence fix when I play one of my favorite games - Deux Ex HR - Thanks for that :)
[color="green"]flyoffacliff[/color]
None violent platforming could be some of the old WII games, many of them is really good in 3D
PC games worth mentioning: Abyss Odyssey, Blade Kitten, Flaskback and Strider all great in 3D.
Flugan:
6000 lines of code is amazing, and I know you did it for for the best, I don't see why think of it as a contest !
Many of us try the BEST WE CAN to contribute, and it's not that easy, and you certanly have tried,
No one can take that from you !
I use your convergence fix when I play one of my favorite games - Deux Ex HR - Thanks for that :)
flyoffacliff
None violent platforming could be some of the old WII games, many of them is really good in 3D
PC games worth mentioning: Abyss Odyssey, Blade Kitten, Flaskback and Strider all great in 3D.
Win7 64bit Pro
CPU: 4790K 4.8 GHZ
GPU: Aurus 1080 TI 2.08 GHZ - 100% Watercooled !
Monitor: Asus PG278QR
And lots of ram and HD's ;)
[quote="flyoffacliff"]I wish there were more modern 3D platformer games that work well with 3D Vision. Anyone know any? :)[/quote]Grow Home, there's a fix up on the blog that 4everAwake posted... I love violent/horror games and I still found it to be absolutely amazing for it's sheer solidness despite it's quirky simplistic design, world's first indie rock climbing sim?
[url]http://helixmod.blogspot.com/2015/02/grow-home.html[/url]
And if you can get a version of Dolphin to work for you, definitely check out some Wii, and GameCube, games like Blacksmith mentioned.
edit:If you have TriDef and can get a PS1 emulator working in 3D you need to try out Jumping Jack Flash, there's a bit of 'shooting' but it's mostly a first-person platformer, great game for it's time.
flyoffacliff said:I wish there were more modern 3D platformer games that work well with 3D Vision. Anyone know any? :)
Grow Home, there's a fix up on the blog that 4everAwake posted... I love violent/horror games and I still found it to be absolutely amazing for it's sheer solidness despite it's quirky simplistic design, world's first indie rock climbing sim?
And if you can get a version of Dolphin to work for you, definitely check out some Wii, and GameCube, games like Blacksmith mentioned.
edit:If you have TriDef and can get a PS1 emulator working in 3D you need to try out Jumping Jack Flash, there's a bit of 'shooting' but it's mostly a first-person platformer, great game for it's time.
[quote="flugan"]The end result for my dx11 wrapper is 6000 lines of code. The question is where to go from here.[/quote]
Is an idea/suggestion: In a couple of threads we are talking how to add the option of SBS mode and TAB mode. Will be very nice to have that function in 3Dmigoto/Flugan/other. To my mind there are 4 names that will can do this: DSS, bo3b, helifax and you.....i don't think any is working in something like that, but will be amazing to have it.
a couple of things:
- This feature have to be compatible with 3Dmigoto and flugan wrapper
- SBS and TAB have to work in 1080p at least
- This feature have to be compatible with 3DTV Play (VR purposes for 3r party softwares like Trinus VR or future sw that come)
- In some future add some features to tweak FOV and lens distortion (VR purpose)
And don't be sad for help and make some great contributions to the community....THANKS for that!!
Cheers!!
flugan said:The end result for my dx11 wrapper is 6000 lines of code. The question is where to go from here.
Is an idea/suggestion: In a couple of threads we are talking how to add the option of SBS mode and TAB mode. Will be very nice to have that function in 3Dmigoto/Flugan/other. To my mind there are 4 names that will can do this: DSS, bo3b, helifax and you.....i don't think any is working in something like that, but will be amazing to have it.
a couple of things:
- This feature have to be compatible with 3Dmigoto and flugan wrapper
- SBS and TAB have to work in 1080p at least
- This feature have to be compatible with 3DTV Play (VR purposes for 3r party softwares like Trinus VR or future sw that come)
- In some future add some features to tweak FOV and lens distortion (VR purpose)
And don't be sad for help and make some great contributions to the community....THANKS for that!!
@Flugan - I thought that it was your code added to 3DMigoto that allows the asm fixes? That is a huge contribution, we can only fix compute shaders using asm right now and more and more games are using these. It is also a life saver when decompile issues prevent a PS fix in hlsl - I fixed Fallout4 shadows using asm, and we had to use asm in Witcher3.
@Flugan - I thought that it was your code added to 3DMigoto that allows the asm fixes? That is a huge contribution, we can only fix compute shaders using asm right now and more and more games are using these. It is also a life saver when decompile issues prevent a PS fix in hlsl - I fixed Fallout4 shadows using asm, and we had to use asm in Witcher3.
Thanks for the hard work Flugan! Anyone who can code that many lines is a genius.
Also, DHR, do you think that something like SBS at 4k would be doable? That would look amazing for anyone with a 4k TV and I believe would be equivalent for system resources stand point as gaming at 4K in 2D?
Gaming in 4K in interleave on passive 4K sets is mind blowing! but rendering 4k twice is pretty hard on my poor 980ti. LOL I've shown a few friends who have seen my projector setup, HMD, and surround setups 3D at 4K and they couldn't believe how much better it looks on the 4K display. If anyone thought 3D gaming was like looking out a window on a regular res monitor, then you will be really feeling like you could step through your TV when gaming at 4K res in 3D.
Thanks for the hard work Flugan! Anyone who can code that many lines is a genius.
Also, DHR, do you think that something like SBS at 4k would be doable? That would look amazing for anyone with a 4k TV and I believe would be equivalent for system resources stand point as gaming at 4K in 2D?
Gaming in 4K in interleave on passive 4K sets is mind blowing! but rendering 4k twice is pretty hard on my poor 980ti. LOL I've shown a few friends who have seen my projector setup, HMD, and surround setups 3D at 4K and they couldn't believe how much better it looks on the 4K display. If anyone thought 3D gaming was like looking out a window on a regular res monitor, then you will be really feeling like you could step through your TV when gaming at 4K res in 3D.
[quote="Flugan"]Going forward one question is when DX12 will appear and how VR and 3D Vision will co-exist.[/quote]
Thanks for your contributions Ulf and I hope you are doing well in this New Year.
dx12 will require that the user have Windows 10.
W8 and W10 have stereoscopic support that was never available in Windows 7.
Hopefully, W10/dx12 could be used to exclude Nvidia from the process, with the exception of their USB driver.
It would nice to get away from their locked resolutions and formats and join the real world where there are no such restrictions, just hardware limitations.
Flugan said:Going forward one question is when DX12 will appear and how VR and 3D Vision will co-exist.
Thanks for your contributions Ulf and I hope you are doing well in this New Year.
dx12 will require that the user have Windows 10.
W8 and W10 have stereoscopic support that was never available in Windows 7.
Hopefully, W10/dx12 could be used to exclude Nvidia from the process, with the exception of their USB driver.
It would nice to get away from their locked resolutions and formats and join the real world where there are no such restrictions, just hardware limitations.
The first time i played a 3D game was on the PS3, the first one was motorstorm 3D rift and super stardust, i was so impressed that I had to upgrade the PC and buy a nvidia card to try 3D vision. Ever since the first thing i look before i play a game is if there is a fix, otherwise i wont buy it, there are too many 3D games still in my list that i dont have time to play and a 2D game would just go to the very bottom of the list.
Anyway guys, thanks for making this a long list :D
The first time i played a 3D game was on the PS3, the first one was motorstorm 3D rift and super stardust, i was so impressed that I had to upgrade the PC and buy a nvidia card to try 3D vision. Ever since the first thing i look before i play a game is if there is a fix, otherwise i wont buy it, there are too many 3D games still in my list that i dont have time to play and a 2D game would just go to the very bottom of the list.
Anyway guys, thanks for making this a long list :D
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[quote="Conan481"]Also, DHR, do you think that something like SBS at 4k would be doable? That would look amazing for anyone with a 4k TV and I believe would be equivalent for system resources stand point as gaming at 4K in 2D?[/quote]
Yes, of course is possible.....i try Trine 3 in 4K - TAB mode (downsampled to 1080p), this game have the options already. Due the HDMI 1.4 limit, if i remember well, the game plays at 30fps...if you have a HDMI 2.0 will run at 4K 3D SBS or TAB at 60fps
Conan481 said:Also, DHR, do you think that something like SBS at 4k would be doable? That would look amazing for anyone with a 4k TV and I believe would be equivalent for system resources stand point as gaming at 4K in 2D?
Yes, of course is possible.....i try Trine 3 in 4K - TAB mode (downsampled to 1080p), this game have the options already. Due the HDMI 1.4 limit, if i remember well, the game plays at 30fps...if you have a HDMI 2.0 will run at 4K 3D SBS or TAB at 60fps
I know that some VG278H monitors supports SBS which is stated in the manual and if I remember correctly it is when using HDMI. I have had no luck with SBS on my monitor and even then we would be talking half-SBS. My monitor supports dual-link DVI 3D Vision and frame packed HDMI using 3D Vision glasses.
Last time I looked at HDMI 2.0 which is supported by my GTX 980 there was no new frame packed modes added. As far as I know frame packed 3D is the only one that automatically enables 3D on a TV using HDMI. Don't be too picky with details as my experience is limited to monitors only and I don't own a HDMI 2.0 display device.
Being used to 1080p60 per eye makes me wonder how to achieve that on a TV. I'm not talking crazy high resolution interlaced solutions as those are far more demanding than plain old 1080p. I don't think anyone is looking for 2160p60 per eye at this point as the performance is not here mostly.
[img]http://www.pcper.com/files/imagecache/article_max_width/review/2013-03-25/howgameswork.jpg[/img]
This image don't cover 3D Vision but we are hooking DirectX and interacting with the game. With 3D Vision automatic the game is not aware of each scene being rendered twice by duplicating rendering calls. As we are fully aware 3D Vision automatic breaks shaders which is where the developer can make them 3D aware or at a later point shaderhackers.
I don't know how it's done but because fraps can record 3D Vision gameplay it should be possible to capture each eye and produce SBS output. There is a massive question if it is possible. Somehow activating 120hz 3D Vision which requires a certified monitor and in the end producing 60hz SBS. It doesn't make any sense as why would I prefer using 60hz SBS on my 120hz 3D Vision monitor. Considering fraps severly impacting the already sensitive performance makes me question the approach further.
I'm currently treating the 3D Vision driver as a black box and if it could output SBS they would already expose it. At times they clearly stated that they would not output SBS as that is a manual 3D mode requiring correct user interaction. One interesting but worthless point is that it's possible to do twitch streaming resulting in SBS video that can be sent to the TV. Not sure how massive the latency will be. framepacked 720p for gaming and 1080p for movies seems to be what HDMI has decided even in 2.0.
I'm open for ideas but feature requests regarding output modes which is pretty much under control of the 3D Vision driver is not something I consider feasable.
I've also been approached to replicate 3D Vision which would bring many options but is clearly beyond the scope of a single guy.
I know that some VG278H monitors supports SBS which is stated in the manual and if I remember correctly it is when using HDMI. I have had no luck with SBS on my monitor and even then we would be talking half-SBS. My monitor supports dual-link DVI 3D Vision and frame packed HDMI using 3D Vision glasses.
Last time I looked at HDMI 2.0 which is supported by my GTX 980 there was no new frame packed modes added. As far as I know frame packed 3D is the only one that automatically enables 3D on a TV using HDMI. Don't be too picky with details as my experience is limited to monitors only and I don't own a HDMI 2.0 display device.
Being used to 1080p60 per eye makes me wonder how to achieve that on a TV. I'm not talking crazy high resolution interlaced solutions as those are far more demanding than plain old 1080p. I don't think anyone is looking for 2160p60 per eye at this point as the performance is not here mostly.
This image don't cover 3D Vision but we are hooking DirectX and interacting with the game. With 3D Vision automatic the game is not aware of each scene being rendered twice by duplicating rendering calls. As we are fully aware 3D Vision automatic breaks shaders which is where the developer can make them 3D aware or at a later point shaderhackers.
I don't know how it's done but because fraps can record 3D Vision gameplay it should be possible to capture each eye and produce SBS output. There is a massive question if it is possible. Somehow activating 120hz 3D Vision which requires a certified monitor and in the end producing 60hz SBS. It doesn't make any sense as why would I prefer using 60hz SBS on my 120hz 3D Vision monitor. Considering fraps severly impacting the already sensitive performance makes me question the approach further.
I'm currently treating the 3D Vision driver as a black box and if it could output SBS they would already expose it. At times they clearly stated that they would not output SBS as that is a manual 3D mode requiring correct user interaction. One interesting but worthless point is that it's possible to do twitch streaming resulting in SBS video that can be sent to the TV. Not sure how massive the latency will be. framepacked 720p for gaming and 1080p for movies seems to be what HDMI has decided even in 2.0.
I'm open for ideas but feature requests regarding output modes which is pretty much under control of the 3D Vision driver is not something I consider feasable.
I've also been approached to replicate 3D Vision which would bring many options but is clearly beyond the scope of a single guy.
Thanks to everybody using my assembler it warms my heart.
To have a critical piece of code that everyone can enjoy!
What more can you ask for?
@Flugan
I'm not expert on this, but i thing is possible.....Here are some ideas (3DMigoto thread, post #692 onwards):
[url]https://forums.geforce.com/default/topic/685657/3d-vision/3dmigoto-now-open-source-/post/4775019/#4775019[/url]
[quote="DarkStarSword"]It should be fairly easy to grab the left and right views out of 3D Vision on the present call and we could then change them to output side-by-side, but we would probably also need to stop 3D Vision from trying to output stereo/anaglyph anyway and I'm not entirely sure how we could do that (I'm more concerned about anaglyph here as it might change the colours even if we make sure that it doesn't draw everything doubled).[/quote]
You can have both options: half or full SBS / TAB
"half" for HDMI 1.4 and "full" for HDMI 2.0
This is not going to happens from nvidia side, so is up to the community to do it...
DarkStarSword said:It should be fairly easy to grab the left and right views out of 3D Vision on the present call and we could then change them to output side-by-side, but we would probably also need to stop 3D Vision from trying to output stereo/anaglyph anyway and I'm not entirely sure how we could do that (I'm more concerned about anaglyph here as it might change the colours even if we make sure that it doesn't draw everything doubled).
You can have both options: half or full SBS / TAB
"half" for HDMI 1.4 and "full" for HDMI 2.0
This is not going to happens from nvidia side, so is up to the community to do it...
The end result for my dx11 wrapper is 6000 lines of code. The question is where to go from here. My dx9 wrapper is far less sophisticated than HeliX wrapper. I migrated features from 3DMigoto to be able to run Crysis 3 but here everything kind of stopped. As the texture hashing changed I decided to stop and put things on a backburner. It is time to pretty much admit defeat in what has always been David against Goliath. 3DMigoto is a massive beast.
Having basically wasted that much time makes me sad. It felt really good in the beginning when the future for DX11 was really bleak with two abandoned wrappers and both authors being AWOL. I felt like the only one crazy enough to start writing a wrapper knowing I would learn what I needed along the way. This turned out to be very accurate, no-one else was that crazy.
Being the author of a wrapper few people used and being unable to fix shaders makes my contribution very small considering the time spent.
Going forward one question is when DX12 will appear and how VR and 3D Vision will co-exist.
I've recently bought a 3D camera and that is just as amazing as the old 3D camera I completely misplaced. 2D photos are way worse than my Nikon 5100 but 3D looks really good.
Currently I'm stuck in 2D land. I've spent 40h last two weeks playing Counter-Strike.
I clearly don't limit myself to only play 3D games.
My top played games
TF2
Counter-Strike: Global Offensive
Dawn of War 2 MP
Trials Evolution
Trials 2
Counter-Strike: Source
Natural Selection 2
Older history is not kept by steam.
I'm no longer expecting official 3D Vision Ready games but you can always hope.
There is a overall trend, my most played games don't work in 3D for the most part and none of them can be finished. The last part is probably why I don't finish games as a general rule.
As long as we have people fixing games 3D Vision will live on.
I would gladly play with other 3D Vision users if timezone and latency is manageable.
http://steamcommunity.com/id/Flugan
Thanks to everybody using my assembler it warms my heart.
To have a critical piece of code that everyone can enjoy!
What more can you ask for?
donations: ulfjalmbrant@hotmail.com
Thank you. We really do appreciate your work. It takes great skill to write 6000 lines of code to make a wrapper. I used yours with Project CARS because it was the only one that worked on Windows 10 at first.
I was not aware there was a 3D Vision community on Steam. I just joined. But I don't play FPS or other violent games, which seem to make up almost all the games now. That leaves me with racing games like Dirt Rally. I wish there were more modern 3D platformer games that work well with 3D Vision. Anyone know any? :)
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Honestly, I find whenever I'm working on a Dx9 game with the Helix wrapper, it's an extreme exercise in tedium. The actual fact that I have to dump the shaders at one time, exit the game, and then have to relaunch the game after copying the shaders into the override folder is such a massive headache. Then there's the issue of newer versions of the wrapper not working with certain games, so then having to try to fix without access to certain functions. Not to mention the greater ease of using HLSL than ASM in 3DMigoto... if you were able to make a Dx9 wrapper that's more inline with 3DMigoto, I for one would think that would be a very valuable addition to the community's toolset. Just a shame that Helix wrapper was not open sourced and able to build off of that. I know Dx9 is mostly yesterday's news, but there are still games being released that are only Dx9 (Dragons Dogma that I'm currently looking at), and a lot of games still have Dx9 compatibility. Just some food for thought, since I think that in the end you really want to be able to be an active contributor to the community, which is certainly admirable.
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6000 lines of code is amazing, and I know you did it for for the best, I don't see why think of it as a contest !
Many of us try the BEST WE CAN to contribute, and it's not that easy, and you certanly have tried,
No one can take that from you !
I use your convergence fix when I play one of my favorite games - Deux Ex HR - Thanks for that :)
flyoffacliff
None violent platforming could be some of the old WII games, many of them is really good in 3D
PC games worth mentioning: Abyss Odyssey, Blade Kitten, Flaskback and Strider all great in 3D.
Win7 64bit Pro
CPU: 4790K 4.8 GHZ
GPU: Aurus 1080 TI 2.08 GHZ - 100% Watercooled !
Monitor: Asus PG278QR
And lots of ram and HD's ;)
http://helixmod.blogspot.com/2015/02/grow-home.html
And if you can get a version of Dolphin to work for you, definitely check out some Wii, and GameCube, games like Blacksmith mentioned.
edit:If you have TriDef and can get a PS1 emulator working in 3D you need to try out Jumping Jack Flash, there's a bit of 'shooting' but it's mostly a first-person platformer, great game for it's time.
[MonitorSizeOverride][Global/Base Profile Tweaks][Depth=IPD]
Is an idea/suggestion: In a couple of threads we are talking how to add the option of SBS mode and TAB mode. Will be very nice to have that function in 3Dmigoto/Flugan/other. To my mind there are 4 names that will can do this: DSS, bo3b, helifax and you.....i don't think any is working in something like that, but will be amazing to have it.
a couple of things:
- This feature have to be compatible with 3Dmigoto and flugan wrapper
- SBS and TAB have to work in 1080p at least
- This feature have to be compatible with 3DTV Play (VR purposes for 3r party softwares like Trinus VR or future sw that come)
- In some future add some features to tweak FOV and lens distortion (VR purpose)
And don't be sad for help and make some great contributions to the community....THANKS for that!!
Cheers!!
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Also, DHR, do you think that something like SBS at 4k would be doable? That would look amazing for anyone with a 4k TV and I believe would be equivalent for system resources stand point as gaming at 4K in 2D?
Gaming in 4K in interleave on passive 4K sets is mind blowing! but rendering 4k twice is pretty hard on my poor 980ti. LOL I've shown a few friends who have seen my projector setup, HMD, and surround setups 3D at 4K and they couldn't believe how much better it looks on the 4K display. If anyone thought 3D gaming was like looking out a window on a regular res monitor, then you will be really feeling like you could step through your TV when gaming at 4K res in 3D.
Thanks for your contributions Ulf and I hope you are doing well in this New Year.
dx12 will require that the user have Windows 10.
W8 and W10 have stereoscopic support that was never available in Windows 7.
Hopefully, W10/dx12 could be used to exclude Nvidia from the process, with the exception of their USB driver.
It would nice to get away from their locked resolutions and formats and join the real world where there are no such restrictions, just hardware limitations.
Anyway guys, thanks for making this a long list :D
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Yes, of course is possible.....i try Trine 3 in 4K - TAB mode (downsampled to 1080p), this game have the options already. Due the HDMI 1.4 limit, if i remember well, the game plays at 30fps...if you have a HDMI 2.0 will run at 4K 3D SBS or TAB at 60fps
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Last time I looked at HDMI 2.0 which is supported by my GTX 980 there was no new frame packed modes added. As far as I know frame packed 3D is the only one that automatically enables 3D on a TV using HDMI. Don't be too picky with details as my experience is limited to monitors only and I don't own a HDMI 2.0 display device.
Being used to 1080p60 per eye makes me wonder how to achieve that on a TV. I'm not talking crazy high resolution interlaced solutions as those are far more demanding than plain old 1080p. I don't think anyone is looking for 2160p60 per eye at this point as the performance is not here mostly.
This image don't cover 3D Vision but we are hooking DirectX and interacting with the game. With 3D Vision automatic the game is not aware of each scene being rendered twice by duplicating rendering calls. As we are fully aware 3D Vision automatic breaks shaders which is where the developer can make them 3D aware or at a later point shaderhackers.
I don't know how it's done but because fraps can record 3D Vision gameplay it should be possible to capture each eye and produce SBS output. There is a massive question if it is possible. Somehow activating 120hz 3D Vision which requires a certified monitor and in the end producing 60hz SBS. It doesn't make any sense as why would I prefer using 60hz SBS on my 120hz 3D Vision monitor. Considering fraps severly impacting the already sensitive performance makes me question the approach further.
I'm currently treating the 3D Vision driver as a black box and if it could output SBS they would already expose it. At times they clearly stated that they would not output SBS as that is a manual 3D mode requiring correct user interaction. One interesting but worthless point is that it's possible to do twitch streaming resulting in SBS video that can be sent to the TV. Not sure how massive the latency will be. framepacked 720p for gaming and 1080p for movies seems to be what HDMI has decided even in 2.0.
I'm open for ideas but feature requests regarding output modes which is pretty much under control of the 3D Vision driver is not something I consider feasable.
I've also been approached to replicate 3D Vision which would bring many options but is clearly beyond the scope of a single guy.
Thanks to everybody using my assembler it warms my heart.
To have a critical piece of code that everyone can enjoy!
What more can you ask for?
donations: ulfjalmbrant@hotmail.com
Thank you Flugan, we all appreciate your hard work very much!
Windows 10 64-bit, Intel 7700K @ 5.1GHz, 16GB 3600MHz CL15 DDR4 RAM, 2x GTX 1080 SLI, Asus Maximus IX Hero, Sound Blaster ZxR, PCIe Quad SSD, Oculus Rift CV1, DLP Link PGD-150 glasses, ViewSonic PJD6531w 3D DLP Projector @ 1280x800 120Hz native / 2560x1600 120Hz DSR 3D Gaming.
I'm not expert on this, but i thing is possible.....Here are some ideas (3DMigoto thread, post #692 onwards):
https://forums.geforce.com/default/topic/685657/3d-vision/3dmigoto-now-open-source-/post/4775019/#4775019
You can have both options: half or full SBS / TAB
"half" for HDMI 1.4 and "full" for HDMI 2.0
This is not going to happens from nvidia side, so is up to the community to do it...
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My 3D Screenshot Gallery
Like my fixes? you can donate to Paypal: dhr.donation@gmail.com