3D Vision CPU Bottelneck: Gathering Information thread.
8 / 22
A small update:
[color="orange"]Hi Ray,
Any new news on a fix for this issue? :)
The community is concerned that due to nVidia quietly relegating 3D Vision to "Legacy" status, this issue, which affects all 3D Vision users and all games, won't be fixed. The problem is that new games are becoming increasingly CPU intensive (It doesn't help that CPUs have hit performance brick wall as of the past 5 years), which means that it has become nigh on impossible to play recent games with 3D Vision at playable frame rates due to this bug.
It would be good to know that it is actively being worked on, or even better, an idea of when (or if? :( ) we can realistically expect a fix! :)
Kind regards,
-- Shahzad[/color]
[color="green"]Hi Shahzad,
Based on the most recent update on the bug it appears higher priority issues have halted investigation on this issue since engineering resource had to be pulled away. I don't see anything to suggest we would not continue to investigate this issue. In fact last comment was that they will resume as soon as they close on the higher priority issues.
Again I have little visibility into development schedule and priorities, so unless they provide update in the bug I'm pretty much in the same boat as you are. Sorry but I don't have anything more to update.
Best regards,
Ray[/color]
So, it looks like it is being worked on, but it is a low priority. Let's keep our fingers crossed.
The community is concerned that due to nVidia quietly relegating 3D Vision to "Legacy" status, this issue, which affects all 3D Vision users and all games, won't be fixed. The problem is that new games are becoming increasingly CPU intensive (It doesn't help that CPUs have hit performance brick wall as of the past 5 years), which means that it has become nigh on impossible to play recent games with 3D Vision at playable frame rates due to this bug.
It would be good to know that it is actively being worked on, or even better, an idea of when (or if? :( ) we can realistically expect a fix! :)
Kind regards,
-- Shahzad
Hi Shahzad,
Based on the most recent update on the bug it appears higher priority issues have halted investigation on this issue since engineering resource had to be pulled away. I don't see anything to suggest we would not continue to investigate this issue. In fact last comment was that they will resume as soon as they close on the higher priority issues.
Again I have little visibility into development schedule and priorities, so unless they provide update in the bug I'm pretty much in the same boat as you are. Sorry but I don't have anything more to update.
Best regards,
Ray
So, it looks like it is being worked on, but it is a low priority. Let's keep our fingers crossed.
Windows 10 64-bit, Intel 7700K @ 5.1GHz, 16GB 3600MHz CL15 DDR4 RAM, 2x GTX 1080 SLI, Asus Maximus IX Hero, Sound Blaster ZxR, PCIe Quad SSD, Oculus Rift CV1, DLP Link PGD-150 glasses, ViewSonic PJD6531w 3D DLP Projector @ 1280x800 120Hz native / 2560x1600 120Hz DSR 3D Gaming.
Read between the lines RAGEdemon.
It will never happen!
PS: In my opinion if it will be solved it will be done indirectly by addressing a related issue, perhaps something related to VR?
Ha no body is working on and if is. Its some trainee.
Nvidia gains more money when this issue is not fixed and what does
Nvidia have on n.1 priority ? MONEY
Ha no body is working on and if is. Its some trainee.
Nvidia gains more money when this issue is not fixed and what does
Nvidia have on n.1 priority ? MONEY
CoreX9 Custom watercooling (valkswagen polo radiator)
I7-8700k@stock
TitanX pascal with shitty stock cooler
Win7/10
Video: Passive 3D fullhd 3D@60hz/channel Denon x1200w /Hc5 x 2 Geobox501->eeColorBoxes->polarizers/omega filttersCustom made silverscreen
Ocupation: Enterprenior.Painting/surfacing/constructions
Interests/skills:
3D gaming,3D movies, 3D printing,Drums, Bass and guitar.
Suomi - FINLAND - perkele
The 1080Ti literally puts a huge lead on the 980Ti in this GTA V benchmark.
http://www.anandtech.com/show/11180/the-nvidia-geforce-gtx-1080-ti-review/12
Notice in the 2560x1440 resolution, that's the closest one I used to extrapolate 3d performance at 1080p 3d Vision. There is a 40 fps improvement going from the 980Ti to the 1080Ti.
Now I wonder if the 1080Ti has the same performance problem with Grand Theft Auto V and 3d Vision turned on. Or is it still cpu core bottlenecked.
Notice in the 2560x1440 resolution, that's the closest one I used to extrapolate 3d performance at 1080p 3d Vision. There is a 40 fps improvement going from the 980Ti to the 1080Ti.
Now I wonder if the 1080Ti has the same performance problem with Grand Theft Auto V and 3d Vision turned on. Or is it still cpu core bottlenecked.
[quote="SkySolstice"]The 1080Ti literally puts a huge lead on the 980Ti in this GTA V benchmark.
http://www.anandtech.com/show/11180/the-nvidia-geforce-gtx-1080-ti-review/12
Notice in the 2560x1440 resolution, that's the closest one I used to extrapolate 3d performance at 1080p 3d Vision. There is a 40 fps improvement going from the 980Ti to the 1080Ti.
Now I wonder if the 1080Ti has the same performance problem with Grand Theft Auto V and 3d Vision turned on. Or is it still cpu core bottlenecked.[/quote]
The Titan XP does, which is essentially the same thing.
Notice in the 2560x1440 resolution, that's the closest one I used to extrapolate 3d performance at 1080p 3d Vision. There is a 40 fps improvement going from the 980Ti to the 1080Ti.
Now I wonder if the 1080Ti has the same performance problem with Grand Theft Auto V and 3d Vision turned on. Or is it still cpu core bottlenecked.
The Titan XP does, which is essentially the same thing.
I got directed here by a helixmod's modder. I also find that my 3930k OC'd at 4.4ghz struggles with my 2x1080FE in 3D vision.. like low gpu utilizations etc but in 2D there is no bottleneck! I'm upgrading to 2x1080tis and gonna OC them in water cooling.. I haven't yet decided to upgrade my 2013 rig.. only upgrading gpus to latest and greatest.. I upgrade every 8 months.
Well I'm glad this thread exists cause a cpu problem seems to be the issue and Nvidia is losing the ball with 3D vision. I've been supporting 3D vision since 2010 and I stay with nvidia products because of 3D vision.
Best Regards,
UB
I got directed here by a helixmod's modder. I also find that my 3930k OC'd at 4.4ghz struggles with my 2x1080FE in 3D vision.. like low gpu utilizations etc but in 2D there is no bottleneck! I'm upgrading to 2x1080tis and gonna OC them in water cooling.. I haven't yet decided to upgrade my 2013 rig.. only upgrading gpus to latest and greatest.. I upgrade every 8 months.
Well I'm glad this thread exists cause a cpu problem seems to be the issue and Nvidia is losing the ball with 3D vision. I've been supporting 3D vision since 2010 and I stay with nvidia products because of 3D vision.
Best Regards,
UB
PC NAME: OVERFIEND Case: Lian Li PC-V2120X,Board: ASUS Rampage IV Extreme, CPU: Intel ® Core ™ i7-3930K OC @ 4.8ghz,RAM: Corsair 32GB 2133mhz DOMINATOR Platinum, Graphics cards: Asus GTX 2x1080Tis Founders Edition, PSU: Seasonic Platinum-1000,ASUS ROG Xonar Phoebus,Samsung SSD 850 Pro 1TB, 2xVelociRaptors 300GB Raid 1
Do we have any examples when this bug does not happen?
The load on GPU and CPU increases when 3D Vision is enabled. The load on the CPU is increased as every draw call is done twice. This obviously affects the load on the GPU as well. I'm not going to consider SLI as dual GPUs are pretty complex.
SLI in 2D is hard enough with many frames being mistimed and never shown. Nvidia was ahead of AMD in this matter producing less useless frames.
I'm not saying there is no bug but generally the framerate is half in 3D due to rendering twice, once for each eye.
Assassins Creed Unity is almost 25% instead of 50%.
I'm not sure how 3D Vision can work without VSYNC on as you want to feed completed images and if VSYNC is on you get a massive performance drop when you can't keep up with 60hz 3D. You really don't want any tearing in 3D.
Do we have any examples when this bug does not happen?
The load on GPU and CPU increases when 3D Vision is enabled. The load on the CPU is increased as every draw call is done twice. This obviously affects the load on the GPU as well. I'm not going to consider SLI as dual GPUs are pretty complex.
SLI in 2D is hard enough with many frames being mistimed and never shown. Nvidia was ahead of AMD in this matter producing less useless frames.
I'm not saying there is no bug but generally the framerate is half in 3D due to rendering twice, once for each eye.
Assassins Creed Unity is almost 25% instead of 50%.
I'm not sure how 3D Vision can work without VSYNC on as you want to feed completed images and if VSYNC is on you get a massive performance drop when you can't keep up with 60hz 3D. You really don't want any tearing in 3D.
Thanks to everybody using my assembler it warms my heart.
To have a critical piece of code that everyone can enjoy!
What more can you ask for?
If you upgrade to a 7700K and OC to 5GHz+, you will get a far better 3D Vision performance than going dual Ti from dual FE, if you are gaming under 1600p 3D. Giving an example, 1600p 3D Vision (equivalent to 4k 2D), I get solid 60FPS in the latest games unless the CPU bug becomes an issue (GPU usage goes <90%).
Of course, it's a different story if you are going 3D @ 4K :)
Right now, the best way to deal with the bug is to brute force it using single core performance. 7700K is going to be the best low thread CPU for the foreseeable future - AMD nor Intel have any plans for more powerful than 7700K desktop chips over the next 3 years at least. Coffeelake and Cannonlake, for example, will both be low power portable/tablet chips.
If you upgrade to a 7700K and OC to 5GHz+, you will get a far better 3D Vision performance than going dual Ti from dual FE, if you are gaming under 1600p 3D. Giving an example, 1600p 3D Vision (equivalent to 4k 2D), I get solid 60FPS in the latest games unless the CPU bug becomes an issue (GPU usage goes <90%).
Of course, it's a different story if you are going 3D @ 4K :)
Right now, the best way to deal with the bug is to brute force it using single core performance. 7700K is going to be the best low thread CPU for the foreseeable future - AMD nor Intel have any plans for more powerful than 7700K desktop chips over the next 3 years at least. Coffeelake and Cannonlake, for example, will both be low power portable/tablet chips.
Windows 10 64-bit, Intel 7700K @ 5.1GHz, 16GB 3600MHz CL15 DDR4 RAM, 2x GTX 1080 SLI, Asus Maximus IX Hero, Sound Blaster ZxR, PCIe Quad SSD, Oculus Rift CV1, DLP Link PGD-150 glasses, ViewSonic PJD6531w 3D DLP Projector @ 1280x800 120Hz native / 2560x1600 120Hz DSR 3D Gaming.
[quote="RAGEdemon"]
So, it looks like it is being worked on, but it is a low priority. Let's keep our fingers crossed.
[/quote]
"Low Priority" means is not ACTIVELY worked on!
It means, that IF some developer has FREE time (ROFL) he MIGHT take a look at this bug. Which translates as "maybe in the future it will be investigated and MAYBE fixed - depending how much time & money & effort is required).
This is from a SW Engineer who understands the definition of "low priority" :)
On a side note:
Is actually funny to see this. "Somehow, I told you so" comes to my mind... Ofc, I was "bashed" at the time... Only to see exactly what I've said. This will never get fixed, as is not a BUG "per-say". Anyway, don't want to get into that discussion again. (It's a limitation of the hardware design/software and while it can be improved, it "can;t be fixed" to what some people around here believe/expect it should be).
RAGEdemon said:
So, it looks like it is being worked on, but it is a low priority. Let's keep our fingers crossed.
"Low Priority" means is not ACTIVELY worked on!
It means, that IF some developer has FREE time (ROFL) he MIGHT take a look at this bug. Which translates as "maybe in the future it will be investigated and MAYBE fixed - depending how much time & money & effort is required).
This is from a SW Engineer who understands the definition of "low priority" :)
On a side note:
Is actually funny to see this. "Somehow, I told you so" comes to my mind... Ofc, I was "bashed" at the time... Only to see exactly what I've said. This will never get fixed, as is not a BUG "per-say". Anyway, don't want to get into that discussion again. (It's a limitation of the hardware design/software and while it can be improved, it "can;t be fixed" to what some people around here believe/expect it should be).
1x Palit RTX 2080Ti Pro Gaming OC(watercooled and overclocked to hell)
3x 3D Vision Ready Asus VG278HE monitors (5760x1080).
Intel i9 9900K (overclocked to 5.3 and watercooled ofc).
Asus Maximus XI Hero Mobo.
16 GB Team Group T-Force Dark Pro DDR4 @ 3600.
Lots of Disks:
- Raid 0 - 256GB Sandisk Extreme SSD.
- Raid 0 - WD Black - 2TB.
- SanDisk SSD PLUS 480 GB.
- Intel 760p 256GB M.2 PCIe NVMe SSD.
Creative Sound Blaster Z.
Windows 10 x64 Pro.
etc
Asus Maximus X Hero Z370
MSI Gaming X 1080Ti (2100 mhz OC Watercooled)
8700k (4.7ghz OC Watercooled)
16gb DDR4 3000 Ram
500GB SAMSUNG 860 EVO SERIES SSD M.2
I have some more results, from Deus Ex Mankind Divided. I made them in Prague, in different places between tests (2D vs 3D results are from the same place each). No screenshots, so you'll have to believe me. With vsync off.
2D: 90-94
3D: 63-66
2D: 78-80
3D: 52-55
2D: 68-70
3D: 43-44
I made them at 720p with max settings except for level of detail, which I left at High. At the max setting it eats some more CPU performance. I don't remember if I maxed that setting for the last test. The GPU wasn't a bottleneck.
Edit: I think that I have already said this, but I once tested Skyrim SE and when I looked at the sky there was little difference in the 2D vs 3D fps. The CPU bottleneck must come from geometry (draw calls, as you say?), I think.
I have some more results, from Deus Ex Mankind Divided. I made them in Prague, in different places between tests (2D vs 3D results are from the same place each). No screenshots, so you'll have to believe me. With vsync off.
2D: 90-94
3D: 63-66
2D: 78-80
3D: 52-55
2D: 68-70
3D: 43-44
I made them at 720p with max settings except for level of detail, which I left at High. At the max setting it eats some more CPU performance. I don't remember if I maxed that setting for the last test. The GPU wasn't a bottleneck.
Edit: I think that I have already said this, but I once tested Skyrim SE and when I looked at the sky there was little difference in the 2D vs 3D fps. The CPU bottleneck must come from geometry (draw calls, as you say?), I think.
[quote="helifax"][quote="RAGEdemon"]
So, it looks like it is being worked on, but it is a low priority. Let's keep our fingers crossed.[/quote]"Low Priority" means is not ACTIVELY worked on!
It means, that IF some developer has FREE time (ROFL) he MIGHT take a look at this bug. Which translates as "maybe in the future it will be investigated and MAYBE fixed - depending how much time & money & effort is required).
This is from a SW Engineer who understands the definition of "low priority" :)
On a side note:
Is actually funny to see this. "Somehow, I told you so" comes to my mind... Ofc, I was "bashed" at the time... Only to see exactly what I've said. This will never get fixed, as is not a BUG "per-say". Anyway, don't want to get into that discussion again. (It's a limitation of the hardware design/software and while it can be improved, it "can;t be fixed" to what some people around here believe/expect it should be).[/quote]
Well, there of course is no guarantee they will fix it, they are slow as hell even when they do fix things. The server update to fix 3D TV Play activations took 9 months. 9 months.
But I disagree that this is not being looked at. "low priority" is RageDemon's embellishment, not what they said. In today's world it's important to listen to what was actually said.
[quote][color="green"]Hi Shahzad,
Based on the most recent update on the bug it appears higher priority issues have halted investigation on this issue since engineering resource had to be pulled away. I don't see anything to suggest we would not continue to investigate this issue. In fact last comment was that they will resume as soon as they close on the higher priority issues.
Again I have little visibility into development schedule and priorities, so unless they provide update in the bug I'm pretty much in the same boat as you are. Sorry but I don't have anything more to update.
Best regards,
Ray[/color][/quote]
That says specifically that it got pre-empted, not that it is low priority. It is not a surprise that this bug would take a back seat to say.... 1080ti, right?
The important part is that they have successfully reproduced the bug. As a software developer, that tells me the bug will be fixed.
RAGEdemon said:
So, it looks like it is being worked on, but it is a low priority. Let's keep our fingers crossed.
"Low Priority" means is not ACTIVELY worked on!
It means, that IF some developer has FREE time (ROFL) he MIGHT take a look at this bug. Which translates as "maybe in the future it will be investigated and MAYBE fixed - depending how much time & money & effort is required).
This is from a SW Engineer who understands the definition of "low priority" :)
On a side note:
Is actually funny to see this. "Somehow, I told you so" comes to my mind... Ofc, I was "bashed" at the time... Only to see exactly what I've said. This will never get fixed, as is not a BUG "per-say". Anyway, don't want to get into that discussion again. (It's a limitation of the hardware design/software and while it can be improved, it "can;t be fixed" to what some people around here believe/expect it should be).
Well, there of course is no guarantee they will fix it, they are slow as hell even when they do fix things. The server update to fix 3D TV Play activations took 9 months. 9 months.
But I disagree that this is not being looked at. "low priority" is RageDemon's embellishment, not what they said. In today's world it's important to listen to what was actually said.
Hi Shahzad,
Based on the most recent update on the bug it appears higher priority issues have halted investigation on this issue since engineering resource had to be pulled away. I don't see anything to suggest we would not continue to investigate this issue. In fact last comment was that they will resume as soon as they close on the higher priority issues.
Again I have little visibility into development schedule and priorities, so unless they provide update in the bug I'm pretty much in the same boat as you are. Sorry but I don't have anything more to update.
Best regards,
Ray
That says specifically that it got pre-empted, not that it is low priority. It is not a surprise that this bug would take a back seat to say.... 1080ti, right?
The important part is that they have successfully reproduced the bug. As a software developer, that tells me the bug will be fixed.
Acer H5360 (1280x720@120Hz) - ASUS VG248QE with GSync mod - 3D Vision 1&2 - Driver 372.54
GTX 970 - i5-4670K@4.2GHz - 12GB RAM - Win7x64+evilKB2670838 - 4 Disk X25 RAID
SAGER NP9870-S - GTX 980 - i7-6700K - Win10 Pro 1607 Latest 3Dmigoto Release Bo3b's School for ShaderHackers
Sorry if it seems I am "embellishing" as bo3b puts it :)
As can be seen, no-one really reads my long posts or emails back and forth with nVidia, so I usually sum up the update in a short sentence in white, so people don't have to read the entire thing but also get a gist of what is happening :)
This time specifically, they said [color="green"]"In fact last comment was that they will resume as soon as they close on the higher priority issues." [/color]
This does suggest that the bug is a 'low priority', as they specifically say they will resume when they finish with "higher priority" items. I hope people will not think I am exaggerating anything to build up hope; I would use the word "paraphrase" instead of "embellish" :)
@masterotaku, thanks for the numbers. It would be great if you could list average CPU usage (single percentage number) with 3D on and then 3D off. If CPU usage is decreasing with 3D Vision on, then the bug is pretty prevalent still.
Sorry if it seems I am "embellishing" as bo3b puts it :)
As can be seen, no-one really reads my long posts or emails back and forth with nVidia, so I usually sum up the update in a short sentence in white, so people don't have to read the entire thing but also get a gist of what is happening :)
This time specifically, they said "In fact last comment was that they will resume as soon as they close on the higher priority issues."
This does suggest that the bug is a 'low priority', as they specifically say they will resume when they finish with "higher priority" items. I hope people will not think I am exaggerating anything to build up hope; I would use the word "paraphrase" instead of "embellish" :)
@masterotaku, thanks for the numbers. It would be great if you could list average CPU usage (single percentage number) with 3D on and then 3D off. If CPU usage is decreasing with 3D Vision on, then the bug is pretty prevalent still.
Windows 10 64-bit, Intel 7700K @ 5.1GHz, 16GB 3600MHz CL15 DDR4 RAM, 2x GTX 1080 SLI, Asus Maximus IX Hero, Sound Blaster ZxR, PCIe Quad SSD, Oculus Rift CV1, DLP Link PGD-150 glasses, ViewSonic PJD6531w 3D DLP Projector @ 1280x800 120Hz native / 2560x1600 120Hz DSR 3D Gaming.
[quote="RAGEdemon"]
@masterotaku, thanks for the numbers. It would be great if you could list average CPU usage (single percentage number) with 3D on and then 3D off. If CPU usage is decreasing with 3D Vision on, then the bug is pretty prevalent still.
[/quote]
In 2D there is a higher CPU usage, reaching close to or 100% usage in all cores when I'm CPU limited. In 3D, it's still very high, with most cores at 90 something % (92-99). However, if I make the scene as demanding as possible (max LOD setting and a demanding view with max FOV too), there are two cores that are instead at 80 something %, and in 2D they lower too a bit, down to maybe 95% in two cores.
RAGEdemon said:
@masterotaku, thanks for the numbers. It would be great if you could list average CPU usage (single percentage number) with 3D on and then 3D off. If CPU usage is decreasing with 3D Vision on, then the bug is pretty prevalent still.
In 2D there is a higher CPU usage, reaching close to or 100% usage in all cores when I'm CPU limited. In 3D, it's still very high, with most cores at 90 something % (92-99). However, if I make the scene as demanding as possible (max LOD setting and a demanding view with max FOV too), there are two cores that are instead at 80 something %, and in 2D they lower too a bit, down to maybe 95% in two cores.
[quote="RAGEdemon"]Sorry if it seems I am "embellishing" as bo3b puts it :)
As can be seen, no-one really reads my long posts or emails back and forth with nVidia, so I usually sum up the update in a short sentence in white, so people don't have to read the entire thing but also get a gist of what is happening :)
This time specifically, they said [color="green"]"In fact last comment was that they will resume as soon as they close on the higher priority issues." [/color]
This does suggest that the bug is a 'low priority', as they specifically say they will resume when they finish with "higher priority" items. I hope people will not think I am exaggerating anything to build up hope; I would use the word "paraphrase" instead of "embellish" :)[/quote]
Based on your interpretation, I'm guessing that you are not a software developer. As an english paraphrase that is not an unreasonable way to describe it.
Unfortunately, in software, we have very exacting meanings for these words. As Helifax notes, if you say "low priority" then in software development, that means we don't give a shit and will never fix that bug. There are thousands of bugs in commercial software, and a lot are just skipped for schedule reasons.
Now, that's not what Ray said. He said it was preempted by more important work. That's not the same as being low priority. It's [i]lower [/i]priority, but not necessarily low.
It's not a surprise that 3D Vision bugs like this would take a back seat to something more important like 1080ti launch, or even crashing bugs. This is a non-crashing performance bug that affects fewer people than normal. But it's still a severe bug, unlike a lot of genuinely low priority bugs.
Probably these distinctions only matter to software geeks, but my main point is that I still think this bug will be fixed. In NVidia time. :->
RAGEdemon said:Sorry if it seems I am "embellishing" as bo3b puts it :)
As can be seen, no-one really reads my long posts or emails back and forth with nVidia, so I usually sum up the update in a short sentence in white, so people don't have to read the entire thing but also get a gist of what is happening :)
This time specifically, they said "In fact last comment was that they will resume as soon as they close on the higher priority issues."
This does suggest that the bug is a 'low priority', as they specifically say they will resume when they finish with "higher priority" items. I hope people will not think I am exaggerating anything to build up hope; I would use the word "paraphrase" instead of "embellish" :)
Based on your interpretation, I'm guessing that you are not a software developer. As an english paraphrase that is not an unreasonable way to describe it.
Unfortunately, in software, we have very exacting meanings for these words. As Helifax notes, if you say "low priority" then in software development, that means we don't give a shit and will never fix that bug. There are thousands of bugs in commercial software, and a lot are just skipped for schedule reasons.
Now, that's not what Ray said. He said it was preempted by more important work. That's not the same as being low priority. It's lower priority, but not necessarily low.
It's not a surprise that 3D Vision bugs like this would take a back seat to something more important like 1080ti launch, or even crashing bugs. This is a non-crashing performance bug that affects fewer people than normal. But it's still a severe bug, unlike a lot of genuinely low priority bugs.
Probably these distinctions only matter to software geeks, but my main point is that I still think this bug will be fixed. In NVidia time. :->
Acer H5360 (1280x720@120Hz) - ASUS VG248QE with GSync mod - 3D Vision 1&2 - Driver 372.54
GTX 970 - i5-4670K@4.2GHz - 12GB RAM - Win7x64+evilKB2670838 - 4 Disk X25 RAID
SAGER NP9870-S - GTX 980 - i7-6700K - Win10 Pro 1607 Latest 3Dmigoto Release Bo3b's School for ShaderHackers
Hi Ray,
Any new news on a fix for this issue? :)
The community is concerned that due to nVidia quietly relegating 3D Vision to "Legacy" status, this issue, which affects all 3D Vision users and all games, won't be fixed. The problem is that new games are becoming increasingly CPU intensive (It doesn't help that CPUs have hit performance brick wall as of the past 5 years), which means that it has become nigh on impossible to play recent games with 3D Vision at playable frame rates due to this bug.
It would be good to know that it is actively being worked on, or even better, an idea of when (or if? :( ) we can realistically expect a fix! :)
Kind regards,
-- Shahzad
Hi Shahzad,
Based on the most recent update on the bug it appears higher priority issues have halted investigation on this issue since engineering resource had to be pulled away. I don't see anything to suggest we would not continue to investigate this issue. In fact last comment was that they will resume as soon as they close on the higher priority issues.
Again I have little visibility into development schedule and priorities, so unless they provide update in the bug I'm pretty much in the same boat as you are. Sorry but I don't have anything more to update.
Best regards,
Ray
So, it looks like it is being worked on, but it is a low priority. Let's keep our fingers crossed.
Windows 10 64-bit, Intel 7700K @ 5.1GHz, 16GB 3600MHz CL15 DDR4 RAM, 2x GTX 1080 SLI, Asus Maximus IX Hero, Sound Blaster ZxR, PCIe Quad SSD, Oculus Rift CV1, DLP Link PGD-150 glasses, ViewSonic PJD6531w 3D DLP Projector @ 1280x800 120Hz native / 2560x1600 120Hz DSR 3D Gaming.
It will never happen!
PS: In my opinion if it will be solved it will be done indirectly by addressing a related issue, perhaps something related to VR?
Intel i7 8086K
Gigabyte GTX 1080Ti Aorus Extreme
DDR4 2x8gb 3200mhz Cl14
TV LG OLED65E6V
Windows 10 64bits
Nvidia gains more money when this issue is not fixed and what does
Nvidia have on n.1 priority ? MONEY
CoreX9 Custom watercooling (valkswagen polo radiator)
I7-8700k@stock
TitanX pascal with shitty stock cooler
Win7/10
Video: Passive 3D fullhd 3D@60hz/channel Denon x1200w /Hc5 x 2 Geobox501->eeColorBoxes->polarizers/omega filttersCustom made silverscreen
Ocupation: Enterprenior.Painting/surfacing/constructions
Interests/skills:
3D gaming,3D movies, 3D printing,Drums, Bass and guitar.
Suomi - FINLAND - perkele
http://www.anandtech.com/show/11180/the-nvidia-geforce-gtx-1080-ti-review/12
Notice in the 2560x1440 resolution, that's the closest one I used to extrapolate 3d performance at 1080p 3d Vision. There is a 40 fps improvement going from the 980Ti to the 1080Ti.
Now I wonder if the 1080Ti has the same performance problem with Grand Theft Auto V and 3d Vision turned on. Or is it still cpu core bottlenecked.
3D Vision/TRIDEF User
SHIELD portable/tablet/tv
The Titan XP does, which is essentially the same thing.
I'm ishiki, forum screwed up my name.
7700k @4.7 GHZ, 16GBDDR4@3466MHZ, 2080 Ti
Well I'm glad this thread exists cause a cpu problem seems to be the issue and Nvidia is losing the ball with 3D vision. I've been supporting 3D vision since 2010 and I stay with nvidia products because of 3D vision.
Best Regards,
UB
PC NAME: OVERFIEND Case: Lian Li PC-V2120X,Board: ASUS Rampage IV Extreme, CPU: Intel ® Core ™ i7-3930K OC @ 4.8ghz,RAM: Corsair 32GB 2133mhz DOMINATOR Platinum, Graphics cards: Asus GTX 2x1080Tis Founders Edition, PSU: Seasonic Platinum-1000,ASUS ROG Xonar Phoebus,Samsung SSD 850 Pro 1TB, 2xVelociRaptors 300GB Raid 1
The load on GPU and CPU increases when 3D Vision is enabled. The load on the CPU is increased as every draw call is done twice. This obviously affects the load on the GPU as well. I'm not going to consider SLI as dual GPUs are pretty complex.
SLI in 2D is hard enough with many frames being mistimed and never shown. Nvidia was ahead of AMD in this matter producing less useless frames.
I'm not saying there is no bug but generally the framerate is half in 3D due to rendering twice, once for each eye.
Assassins Creed Unity is almost 25% instead of 50%.
I'm not sure how 3D Vision can work without VSYNC on as you want to feed completed images and if VSYNC is on you get a massive performance drop when you can't keep up with 60hz 3D. You really don't want any tearing in 3D.
Thanks to everybody using my assembler it warms my heart.
To have a critical piece of code that everyone can enjoy!
What more can you ask for?
donations: ulfjalmbrant@hotmail.com
Of course, it's a different story if you are going 3D @ 4K :)
Right now, the best way to deal with the bug is to brute force it using single core performance. 7700K is going to be the best low thread CPU for the foreseeable future - AMD nor Intel have any plans for more powerful than 7700K desktop chips over the next 3 years at least. Coffeelake and Cannonlake, for example, will both be low power portable/tablet chips.
Windows 10 64-bit, Intel 7700K @ 5.1GHz, 16GB 3600MHz CL15 DDR4 RAM, 2x GTX 1080 SLI, Asus Maximus IX Hero, Sound Blaster ZxR, PCIe Quad SSD, Oculus Rift CV1, DLP Link PGD-150 glasses, ViewSonic PJD6531w 3D DLP Projector @ 1280x800 120Hz native / 2560x1600 120Hz DSR 3D Gaming.
"Low Priority" means is not ACTIVELY worked on!
It means, that IF some developer has FREE time (ROFL) he MIGHT take a look at this bug. Which translates as "maybe in the future it will be investigated and MAYBE fixed - depending how much time & money & effort is required).
This is from a SW Engineer who understands the definition of "low priority" :)
On a side note:
Is actually funny to see this. "Somehow, I told you so" comes to my mind... Ofc, I was "bashed" at the time... Only to see exactly what I've said. This will never get fixed, as is not a BUG "per-say". Anyway, don't want to get into that discussion again. (It's a limitation of the hardware design/software and while it can be improved, it "can;t be fixed" to what some people around here believe/expect it should be).
1x Palit RTX 2080Ti Pro Gaming OC(watercooled and overclocked to hell)
3x 3D Vision Ready Asus VG278HE monitors (5760x1080).
Intel i9 9900K (overclocked to 5.3 and watercooled ofc).
Asus Maximus XI Hero Mobo.
16 GB Team Group T-Force Dark Pro DDR4 @ 3600.
Lots of Disks:
- Raid 0 - 256GB Sandisk Extreme SSD.
- Raid 0 - WD Black - 2TB.
- SanDisk SSD PLUS 480 GB.
- Intel 760p 256GB M.2 PCIe NVMe SSD.
Creative Sound Blaster Z.
Windows 10 x64 Pro.
etc
My website with my fixes and OpenGL to 3D Vision wrapper:
http://3dsurroundgaming.com
(If you like some of the stuff that I've done and want to donate something, you can do it with PayPal at tavyhome@gmail.com)
Gaming Rig 1
i7 5820K 3.3ghz (Stock Clock)
GTX 1080 Founders Edition (Stock Clock)
16GB DDR4 2400 RAM
512 SAMSUNG 840 PRO
Gaming Rig 2
My new build
Asus Maximus X Hero Z370
MSI Gaming X 1080Ti (2100 mhz OC Watercooled)
8700k (4.7ghz OC Watercooled)
16gb DDR4 3000 Ram
500GB SAMSUNG 860 EVO SERIES SSD M.2
2D: 90-94
3D: 63-66
2D: 78-80
3D: 52-55
2D: 68-70
3D: 43-44
I made them at 720p with max settings except for level of detail, which I left at High. At the max setting it eats some more CPU performance. I don't remember if I maxed that setting for the last test. The GPU wasn't a bottleneck.
Edit: I think that I have already said this, but I once tested Skyrim SE and when I looked at the sky there was little difference in the 2D vs 3D fps. The CPU bottleneck must come from geometry (draw calls, as you say?), I think.
CPU: Intel Core i7 7700K @ 4.9GHz
Motherboard: Gigabyte Aorus GA-Z270X-Gaming 5
RAM: GSKILL Ripjaws Z 16GB 3866MHz CL18
GPU: Gainward Phoenix 1080 GLH
Monitor: Asus PG278QR
Speakers: Logitech Z506
Donations account: masterotakusuko@gmail.com
Well, there of course is no guarantee they will fix it, they are slow as hell even when they do fix things. The server update to fix 3D TV Play activations took 9 months. 9 months.
But I disagree that this is not being looked at. "low priority" is RageDemon's embellishment, not what they said. In today's world it's important to listen to what was actually said.
That says specifically that it got pre-empted, not that it is low priority. It is not a surprise that this bug would take a back seat to say.... 1080ti, right?
The important part is that they have successfully reproduced the bug. As a software developer, that tells me the bug will be fixed.
Acer H5360 (1280x720@120Hz) - ASUS VG248QE with GSync mod - 3D Vision 1&2 - Driver 372.54
GTX 970 - i5-4670K@4.2GHz - 12GB RAM - Win7x64+evilKB2670838 - 4 Disk X25 RAID
SAGER NP9870-S - GTX 980 - i7-6700K - Win10 Pro 1607
Latest 3Dmigoto Release
Bo3b's School for ShaderHackers
As can be seen, no-one really reads my long posts or emails back and forth with nVidia, so I usually sum up the update in a short sentence in white, so people don't have to read the entire thing but also get a gist of what is happening :)
This time specifically, they said "In fact last comment was that they will resume as soon as they close on the higher priority issues."
This does suggest that the bug is a 'low priority', as they specifically say they will resume when they finish with "higher priority" items. I hope people will not think I am exaggerating anything to build up hope; I would use the word "paraphrase" instead of "embellish" :)
@masterotaku, thanks for the numbers. It would be great if you could list average CPU usage (single percentage number) with 3D on and then 3D off. If CPU usage is decreasing with 3D Vision on, then the bug is pretty prevalent still.
Windows 10 64-bit, Intel 7700K @ 5.1GHz, 16GB 3600MHz CL15 DDR4 RAM, 2x GTX 1080 SLI, Asus Maximus IX Hero, Sound Blaster ZxR, PCIe Quad SSD, Oculus Rift CV1, DLP Link PGD-150 glasses, ViewSonic PJD6531w 3D DLP Projector @ 1280x800 120Hz native / 2560x1600 120Hz DSR 3D Gaming.
In 2D there is a higher CPU usage, reaching close to or 100% usage in all cores when I'm CPU limited. In 3D, it's still very high, with most cores at 90 something % (92-99). However, if I make the scene as demanding as possible (max LOD setting and a demanding view with max FOV too), there are two cores that are instead at 80 something %, and in 2D they lower too a bit, down to maybe 95% in two cores.
CPU: Intel Core i7 7700K @ 4.9GHz
Motherboard: Gigabyte Aorus GA-Z270X-Gaming 5
RAM: GSKILL Ripjaws Z 16GB 3866MHz CL18
GPU: Gainward Phoenix 1080 GLH
Monitor: Asus PG278QR
Speakers: Logitech Z506
Donations account: masterotakusuko@gmail.com
Based on your interpretation, I'm guessing that you are not a software developer. As an english paraphrase that is not an unreasonable way to describe it.
Unfortunately, in software, we have very exacting meanings for these words. As Helifax notes, if you say "low priority" then in software development, that means we don't give a shit and will never fix that bug. There are thousands of bugs in commercial software, and a lot are just skipped for schedule reasons.
Now, that's not what Ray said. He said it was preempted by more important work. That's not the same as being low priority. It's lower priority, but not necessarily low.
It's not a surprise that 3D Vision bugs like this would take a back seat to something more important like 1080ti launch, or even crashing bugs. This is a non-crashing performance bug that affects fewer people than normal. But it's still a severe bug, unlike a lot of genuinely low priority bugs.
Probably these distinctions only matter to software geeks, but my main point is that I still think this bug will be fixed. In NVidia time. :->
Acer H5360 (1280x720@120Hz) - ASUS VG248QE with GSync mod - 3D Vision 1&2 - Driver 372.54
GTX 970 - i5-4670K@4.2GHz - 12GB RAM - Win7x64+evilKB2670838 - 4 Disk X25 RAID
SAGER NP9870-S - GTX 980 - i7-6700K - Win10 Pro 1607
Latest 3Dmigoto Release
Bo3b's School for ShaderHackers