No hype for Vermintide 2 yet, eh? (fix not working due to EAC)
  8 / 10    
So, got my latest response from Fatshark: [quote]Hey Ryan, We've had a response from Easy Anti-Cheat after placing a request for this to be whitelisted. Unfortunately, Easy Anti-Cheat have refused as the 3DMigoto library (in their words) [i]can[/i] be used to cheat. We can only apologise profusely for the inconvenience. Thank you, Fatshark Support[/quote] No words can express my disdain towards EAC right now, so I'm just going to not say anything for the next while to anyone. No more internetz for today.
So, got my latest response from Fatshark:

Hey Ryan,

We've had a response from Easy Anti-Cheat after placing a request for this to be whitelisted. Unfortunately, Easy Anti-Cheat have refused as the 3DMigoto library (in their words) can be used to cheat. We can only apologise profusely for the inconvenience.

Thank you,

Fatshark Support


No words can express my disdain towards EAC right now, so I'm just going to not say anything for the next while to anyone. No more internetz for today.

3D Gaming Rig: CPU: i7 7700K @ 4.9Ghz | Mobo: Asus Maximus Hero VIII | RAM: Corsair Dominator 16GB | GPU: 2 x GTX 1080 Ti SLI | 3xSSDs for OS and Apps, 2 x HDD's for 11GB storage | PSU: Seasonic X-1250 M2| Case: Corsair C70 | Cooling: Corsair H115i Hydro cooler | Displays: Asus PG278QR, BenQ XL2420TX & BenQ HT1075 | OS: Windows 10 Pro + Windows 7 dual boot

Like my fixes? Dontations can be made to: www.paypal.me/DShanz or rshannonca@gmail.com
Like electronic music? Check out: www.soundcloud.com/dj-ryan-king

Posted 04/18/2018 08:33 PM   
That really sucks. I'm curious what other 3rd party software has been whitelisted? As suggested by this guy that responded to you in the Next Day: Survival thread. It seemed that he works at SOFF Games. "Reshade is whitelisted and should be working in all EAC games. We have many similar 3rd party tools whitelisted and would be happy to look into 3DMigoto as well if you are interested in publishing a version for Next Day. " https://steamcommunity.com/app/519190/discussions/0/1458455461472960575/
That really sucks.

I'm curious what other 3rd party software has been whitelisted? As suggested by this guy that responded to you in the Next Day: Survival thread. It seemed that he works at SOFF Games.

"Reshade is whitelisted and should be working in all EAC games. We have many similar 3rd party tools whitelisted and would be happy to look into 3DMigoto as well if you are interested in publishing a version for Next Day. "


https://steamcommunity.com/app/519190/discussions/0/1458455461472960575/

Posted 04/19/2018 03:38 AM   
My appeal to their reason. [quote]Hello again Julia, I appreciate you inquiring on our behalf, and providing their response. As much as I'd like to simply accept their response as the defacto answer, I simply cannot because, again, I'm absolutely locked out of playing your game now because of it. Also, in response to "...the 3DMigoto library can be used to cheat". <-- Except, ummm, it really can't. 3DMigoto allows individuals to dump, modify, and replace shaders (with modified versions of those same shaders) that are in use by the game (with the expressed purpose of correcting visuals to be rendered as stereoscopic). That's it. Any advantage that can be obtained from doing so would be completely negligible, like changing the color of something to be slightly more noticeable or disabling certain onscreen effects that might be a minor hindrance (actually, that conversation did come up in a discussion which I'll link below, where you'll see I specifically chose to err on the side of caution about certain effects like on screen blood and bile to be ethical and not provide any advantage whatsoever, no matter how small), but nothing that can enhance a players ability. There's no modification going to any of the game's code, memory allocations, processes, etc. So, again, there's literally nothing that makes 3DMigoto any different than Reshade, which they have whitelisted. The one thing that the EAC support did express concern about when I last spoke with them is 3DMigoto's ability to enable individuals to develop and run custom shaders, but again, all that a custom shader can do is add additional graphical adjustments on top of what's already existing, ie. perhaps some additional HUD info... so essentially, like what's capable by modding a game... which you were already planning on adding to this game, so what's the problem here? Again, it offers no additional gameplay functionality to the user, such as controlling their actions (ie. Aimbot) or allowing them to shoot through obstacles, or kill things in one hit, etc. The ONLY thing I could even remotely think of that might be used as a cheat would be if it were possible to disable a shader which renders a wall (or make it transparent) to be able to see through it, ie. like a wall hack, but here's the thing: if your renderer is actually doing it's job and, y'know, culling objects behind said wall to save on graphical computing processes, then nothing would actually be rendered behind it. So, again, their response about 3DMigoto possibly being used to cheat is just wrong, and IMHO just a lazy response because they don't want to do anything more than take your money with minimal effort, and it's easier to do nothing with such arbitrary draconian law. Lord forbid they give a darn about the people that want to play the games that use their technology legitimately, or they lift a finger to support them. So yeah, I entirely expected that to be their response... that's why I didn't try going to them (again) directly this time, and I came to you. I'm not the one paying them, you are so they have to answer to you, not me... but I am the one paying you! Or at least I already have (I prepurchased V2, and V1 was a day one purchase IIRC), and would like to keep doing so with your upcoming content, but I cannot do so if I cannot play your games in 3D. Maybe I'm wrong here, but based on the amount of love and effort I could tell has been put into your games, I actually had a feeling in my gut that if I reached out to you guys (and gals, Julia ;)) that you would actually care and be willing to help champion our cause. So, again, I need to ask you to support us and to return to them with the information I've provided you here and get them to reconsider! We are not cheaters, and we don't want to be! But we NEED to be able to play with our 3DVision hardware, or we can't play at all (if you had a beautiful 4k monitor, and a game developer told you couldn't use it, and had to use a 1080P monitor instead because 4K gives you more detail and is cheating, would YOU be ok with that? That's the closest analogy I could make for you). And unless developers, such as yourself, want to start employing stereoscopic best practices in your shader code, then the only way we can do so is by fixing those badly rendered shaders ourselves, and for that we need 3DMigoto. Which brings me to my very last point/request. If you cannot get EAC to reconsider, would YOU at least reconsider appending your shader code to be more stereoscopic friendly? I would be more than glad to help in this endeavor, as my only goal here is to be able to continue playing your game(s) which I enjoy more than most. And, for that matter, feel free to download my fix and evaluate it. Hopefully someone in your outfit has a 3DVision setup, and can see just how great the experience is versus simply playing in 2D. Seeing is believing! You/they will also see that it provides absolutely no competitive advantage whatsoever. I'll provide a link for that as well. I do want to thank you personally, Julia, for looking into this so far, and again, I'm sorry I can't just let this lay because it would effectively mean me giving up playing your game ever again (it's been hard enough going these past couple weeks without it), so I only hope that you guys (and again, gals) are equally as passionate about getting as many people playing your game(s) to their fullest enjoyment as possible, as I/we are at doing so. Link to discussion: https://forums.geforce.com/default/topic/1039393/3d-vision/no-hype-for-vermintide-2-yet-eh-fix-not-working-due-to-eac-/post/5303189/#5303189 Link to most recent game fix posted online: http://www.mediafire.com/file/cwmds5sp7wn0ntl/Vermintide_2_fix_v0_91.zip[/quote] and I just also added: [quote]Oh, and to add to my last message, as I previously stated, we would simply like to open a dialogue with EAC to hopefully find a compromise we can all agree with. If they could simply respond to DarkStarSword (whom I understand has already reached out to them) to discuss such possibility is really all we would like at this point. If they did so (and hopefully not just be a stonewall "NO") then I'm confident the whole 3DVision community would be able to accept as such if nothing can be agreed upon, but as it stands right now, to us they are simply being closed minded and needlessly discriminatory. Again, I hope you can help us change this. Thanks again.[/quote]
My appeal to their reason.

Hello again Julia,

I appreciate you inquiring on our behalf, and providing their response. As much as I'd like to simply accept their response as the defacto answer, I simply cannot because, again, I'm absolutely locked out of playing your game now because of it.

Also, in response to "...the 3DMigoto library can be used to cheat". <-- Except, ummm, it really can't. 3DMigoto allows individuals to dump, modify, and replace shaders (with modified versions of those same shaders) that are in use by the game (with the expressed purpose of correcting visuals to be rendered as stereoscopic). That's it. Any advantage that can be obtained from doing so would be completely negligible, like changing the color of something to be slightly more noticeable or disabling certain onscreen effects that might be a minor hindrance (actually, that conversation did come up in a discussion which I'll link below, where you'll see I specifically chose to err on the side of caution about certain effects like on screen blood and bile to be ethical and not provide any advantage whatsoever, no matter how small), but nothing that can enhance a players ability. There's no modification going to any of the game's code, memory allocations, processes, etc. So, again, there's literally nothing that makes 3DMigoto any different than Reshade, which they have whitelisted.

The one thing that the EAC support did express concern about when I last spoke with them is 3DMigoto's ability to enable individuals to develop and run custom shaders, but again, all that a custom shader can do is add additional graphical adjustments on top of what's already existing, ie. perhaps some additional HUD info... so essentially, like what's capable by modding a game... which you were already planning on adding to this game, so what's the problem here? Again, it offers no additional gameplay functionality to the user, such as controlling their actions (ie. Aimbot) or allowing them to shoot through obstacles, or kill things in one hit, etc.

The ONLY thing I could even remotely think of that might be used as a cheat would be if it were possible to disable a shader which renders a wall (or make it transparent) to be able to see through it, ie. like a wall hack, but here's the thing: if your renderer is actually doing it's job and, y'know, culling objects behind said wall to save on graphical computing processes, then nothing would actually be rendered behind it. So, again, their response about 3DMigoto possibly being used to cheat is just wrong, and IMHO just a lazy response because they don't want to do anything more than take your money with minimal effort, and it's easier to do nothing with such arbitrary draconian law. Lord forbid they give a darn about the people that want to play the games that use their technology legitimately, or they lift a finger to support them.

So yeah, I entirely expected that to be their response... that's why I didn't try going to them (again) directly this time, and I came to you. I'm not the one paying them, you are so they have to answer to you, not me... but I am the one paying you! Or at least I already have (I prepurchased V2, and V1 was a day one purchase IIRC), and would like to keep doing so with your upcoming content, but I cannot do so if I cannot play your games in 3D. Maybe I'm wrong here, but based on the amount of love and effort I could tell has been put into your games, I actually had a feeling in my gut that if I reached out to you guys (and gals, Julia ;)) that you would actually care and be willing to help champion our cause.

So, again, I need to ask you to support us and to return to them with the information I've provided you here and get them to reconsider! We are not cheaters, and we don't want to be! But we NEED to be able to play with our 3DVision hardware, or we can't play at all (if you had a beautiful 4k monitor, and a game developer told you couldn't use it, and had to use a 1080P monitor instead because 4K gives you more detail and is cheating, would YOU be ok with that? That's the closest analogy I could make for you). And unless developers, such as yourself, want to start employing stereoscopic best practices in your shader code, then the only way we can do so is by fixing those badly rendered shaders ourselves, and for that we need 3DMigoto.

Which brings me to my very last point/request. If you cannot get EAC to reconsider, would YOU at least reconsider appending your shader code to be more stereoscopic friendly? I would be more than glad to help in this endeavor, as my only goal here is to be able to continue playing your game(s) which I enjoy more than most. And, for that matter, feel free to download my fix and evaluate it. Hopefully someone in your outfit has a 3DVision setup, and can see just how great the experience is versus simply playing in 2D. Seeing is believing! You/they will also see that it provides absolutely no competitive advantage whatsoever. I'll provide a link for that as well.

I do want to thank you personally, Julia, for looking into this so far, and again, I'm sorry I can't just let this lay because it would effectively mean me giving up playing your game ever again (it's been hard enough going these past couple weeks without it), so I only hope that you guys (and again, gals) are equally as passionate about getting as many people playing your game(s) to their fullest enjoyment as possible, as I/we are at doing so.


Link to discussion: https://forums.geforce.com/default/topic/1039393/3d-vision/no-hype-for-vermintide-2-yet-eh-fix-not-working-due-to-eac-/post/5303189/#5303189

Link to most recent game fix posted online: http://www.mediafire.com/file/cwmds5sp7wn0ntl/Vermintide_2_fix_v0_91.zip


and I just also added:

Oh, and to add to my last message, as I previously stated, we would simply like to open a dialogue with EAC to hopefully find a compromise we can all agree with. If they could simply respond to DarkStarSword (whom I understand has already reached out to them) to discuss such possibility is really all we would like at this point. If they did so (and hopefully not just be a stonewall "NO") then I'm confident the whole 3DVision community would be able to accept as such if nothing can be agreed upon, but as it stands right now, to us they are simply being closed minded and needlessly discriminatory.

Again, I hope you can help us change this. Thanks again.

3D Gaming Rig: CPU: i7 7700K @ 4.9Ghz | Mobo: Asus Maximus Hero VIII | RAM: Corsair Dominator 16GB | GPU: 2 x GTX 1080 Ti SLI | 3xSSDs for OS and Apps, 2 x HDD's for 11GB storage | PSU: Seasonic X-1250 M2| Case: Corsair C70 | Cooling: Corsair H115i Hydro cooler | Displays: Asus PG278QR, BenQ XL2420TX & BenQ HT1075 | OS: Windows 10 Pro + Windows 7 dual boot

Like my fixes? Dontations can be made to: www.paypal.me/DShanz or rshannonca@gmail.com
Like electronic music? Check out: www.soundcloud.com/dj-ryan-king

Posted 04/19/2018 05:59 AM   
Thanks for continuing to push on this one DJ-RK - I don't really have the energy to fight a battle that shouldn't even be ours to fight, but again to reiterate what I said elsewhere as one of the two primary developers on 3DMigoto I'm willing to work with EAC to make the two compatible, but I would need a line of communication to their developers to do so, and it's pretty clear that they are just looking for excuses. Also I think you have a better chance through Fatshark than I do through Ubisoft.
Thanks for continuing to push on this one DJ-RK - I don't really have the energy to fight a battle that shouldn't even be ours to fight, but again to reiterate what I said elsewhere as one of the two primary developers on 3DMigoto I'm willing to work with EAC to make the two compatible, but I would need a line of communication to their developers to do so, and it's pretty clear that they are just looking for excuses.

Also I think you have a better chance through Fatshark than I do through Ubisoft.

2x Geforce GTX 980 in SLI provided by NVIDIA, i7 6700K 4GHz CPU, Asus 27" VG278HE 144Hz 3D Monitor, BenQ W1070 3D Projector, 120" Elite Screens YardMaster 2, 32GB Corsair DDR4 3200MHz RAM, Samsung 850 EVO 500G SSD, 4x750GB HDD in RAID5, Gigabyte Z170X-Gaming 7 Motherboard, Corsair Obsidian 750D Airflow Edition Case, Corsair RM850i PSU, HTC Vive, Win 10 64bit

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Posted 04/19/2018 06:35 AM   
My pleasure to do my service! You do amazing work, and shouldn't need to expend said energy just to do said work. Allow myself (and hopefully other willing/capable people in this community) to do our part. I/we just ask that you kick ass, as you normally do, if/when we do get those channels opened... and for that, we may need to make some concessions. I recall you mentioning in the FC5 thread, I think it was, that you wouldn't be willing to strip back any features like custom shader support just to appease them, but I personally would be willing to make that sacrifice if it meant us getting whitelisted across the board. Not my call, I know, but just thought I'd state my opinion on that subject. Hopefully my argument about custom shaders only adding graphical layers, and no gameplay functionality can be held within reason, though... and that's where I would defer to your expertise, and hopefully equally capable ability for negotiation. ;) Oh, and I also recall you mentioning about considering the notion of getting 3DM digitally signed as a possible solution... I can only imagine there would be a cost involved with said certification, and I for one would have no issue with making a sizeable contribution towards said cost. I've spoken with at least a couple others and the general consensus is we'd all chip in!
My pleasure to do my service! You do amazing work, and shouldn't need to expend said energy just to do said work. Allow myself (and hopefully other willing/capable people in this community) to do our part. I/we just ask that you kick ass, as you normally do, if/when we do get those channels opened... and for that, we may need to make some concessions. I recall you mentioning in the FC5 thread, I think it was, that you wouldn't be willing to strip back any features like custom shader support just to appease them, but I personally would be willing to make that sacrifice if it meant us getting whitelisted across the board. Not my call, I know, but just thought I'd state my opinion on that subject. Hopefully my argument about custom shaders only adding graphical layers, and no gameplay functionality can be held within reason, though... and that's where I would defer to your expertise, and hopefully equally capable ability for negotiation. ;)

Oh, and I also recall you mentioning about considering the notion of getting 3DM digitally signed as a possible solution... I can only imagine there would be a cost involved with said certification, and I for one would have no issue with making a sizeable contribution towards said cost. I've spoken with at least a couple others and the general consensus is we'd all chip in!

3D Gaming Rig: CPU: i7 7700K @ 4.9Ghz | Mobo: Asus Maximus Hero VIII | RAM: Corsair Dominator 16GB | GPU: 2 x GTX 1080 Ti SLI | 3xSSDs for OS and Apps, 2 x HDD's for 11GB storage | PSU: Seasonic X-1250 M2| Case: Corsair C70 | Cooling: Corsair H115i Hydro cooler | Displays: Asus PG278QR, BenQ XL2420TX & BenQ HT1075 | OS: Windows 10 Pro + Windows 7 dual boot

Like my fixes? Dontations can be made to: www.paypal.me/DShanz or rshannonca@gmail.com
Like electronic music? Check out: www.soundcloud.com/dj-ryan-king

Posted 04/19/2018 06:58 AM   
As the third 3Dmigoto I'm not one of the two major and active developers I would really like to see 3Dmigoto whitelisted. I'm not sure what I can do personally at this point. There is a lot of turbulence and we need to appeal their initial verdict to the best of our abilities. Our biggest backlash is if we get it whitelisted for the latest version and then other people would build cheats upon our powerful platform. Then we would be back at square one but much worse. We woould probably be forced to build anti cheat measures into 3Dmigoto that are good enough to make it impossible to cheat using 3Dmigoto. This is a massive challenge.
As the third 3Dmigoto I'm not one of the two major and active developers I would really like to see 3Dmigoto whitelisted. I'm not sure what I can do personally at this point. There is a lot of turbulence and we need to appeal their initial verdict to the best of our abilities.

Our biggest backlash is if we get it whitelisted for the latest version and then other people would build cheats upon our powerful platform. Then we would be back at square one but much worse.

We woould probably be forced to build anti cheat measures into 3Dmigoto that are good enough to make it impossible to cheat using 3Dmigoto. This is a massive challenge.

Thanks to everybody using my assembler it warms my heart.
To have a critical piece of code that everyone can enjoy!
What more can you ask for?

donations: ulfjalmbrant@hotmail.com

Posted 04/19/2018 08:28 AM   
But a game like tekken 7 which is actually a Esports competitive title with online tournaments credited towards actual monetary prizes and where hacking is a concern allows it. Yet a co-op game does not.... It's frankly absurd. Thank's for your efforts DJ-RK. This is really disappointing to see, and I myself, as you know have also been harassing Fatshark and EAC Fatshark have been good at least they have made a response, and the request to have it whitelisted. EAC simply have not even acknowledged they received my support request. I wonder if someone at EAC simply has one of those bigoted/ignorant viewpoints about stereoscopic gaming. I won't let this lie either and I think we as a collective whole as a community need to really get on EAC's case about this. (DSS aside as he does more than enough already) makes me wonder, what game is next... As it stands I have modified my steam review to "not recommended" with the obligatory rant, and will remain that way and remain unplayed unless something changes or Fatshark modify their shader code game to be 3dvision ready. I hate cheaters, but I will never buy a product with EAC ever again.
But a game like tekken 7 which is actually a Esports competitive title with online tournaments credited towards actual monetary prizes and where hacking is a concern allows it. Yet a co-op game does not.... It's frankly absurd.

Thank's for your efforts DJ-RK. This is really disappointing to see, and I myself, as you know have also been harassing Fatshark and EAC

Fatshark have been good at least they have made a response, and the request to have it whitelisted. EAC simply have not even acknowledged they received my support request. I wonder if someone at EAC simply has one of those bigoted/ignorant viewpoints about stereoscopic gaming.

I won't let this lie either and I think we as a collective whole as a community need to really get on EAC's case about this. (DSS aside as he does more than enough already) makes me wonder, what game is next...

As it stands I have modified my steam review to "not recommended" with the obligatory rant, and will remain that way and remain unplayed unless something changes or Fatshark modify their shader code game to be 3dvision ready.

I hate cheaters, but I will never buy a product with EAC ever again.

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Posted 04/19/2018 08:52 AM   
I'm onboard the EAC hate train. It locks me out of online play in Dragon Ball Xenoverse 2. But thankfully most of the content is single player and moving a dll is enough to disable EAC. If EAC people were willing to do some effort, they could provide access to an EAC-less beta build (exclusive for the 3D fixer). Then when the fix is done and released to the public, they could check the hash of shaders and maybe d3dx.ini (not allowing 3Dmigoto updates or new settings, sadly. Maybe with alternative hashes for SBS usage). If everything is as expected, 3Dmigoto would pass the EAC check.
I'm onboard the EAC hate train. It locks me out of online play in Dragon Ball Xenoverse 2. But thankfully most of the content is single player and moving a dll is enough to disable EAC.

If EAC people were willing to do some effort, they could provide access to an EAC-less beta build (exclusive for the 3D fixer). Then when the fix is done and released to the public, they could check the hash of shaders and maybe d3dx.ini (not allowing 3Dmigoto updates or new settings, sadly. Maybe with alternative hashes for SBS usage). If everything is as expected, 3Dmigoto would pass the EAC check.

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Posted 04/19/2018 09:15 AM   
[quote="DJ-RK"]and for that, we may need to make some concessions. I recall you mentioning in the FC5 thread, I think it was, that you wouldn't be willing to strip back any features like custom shader support just to appease them, but I personally would be willing to make that sacrifice if it meant us getting whitelisted across the board. Not my call, I know, but just thought I'd state my opinion on that subject.[/quote]The problem with stripping out custom shader support is it locks out SBS, upscaling, software mouse, auto-convergence, Tile lighting in Arkham Knight, matrix inversion for assembly shaders (including every Unity game), constant buffer stereoisation, depth buffer downscaling for SLI, the "strange blue glitch" fix in WATCH_DOGS2, the HUD flicker fix in WATCH_DOGS2, Dreamfall Chapters HUD lining up with ghosts, Volumetric light shafts in Dreamfall Chapters, the cockpit in Subnautica, the mouse lining up with certain puzzles in The Witness, debugging shaders to understand and fix complex effects... and that's just off the top of my head - maybe we can make some concessions, but that one is not really acceptable. [quote="DJ-RK"]Oh, and I also recall you mentioning about considering the notion of getting 3DM digitally signed as a possible solution... I can only imagine there would be a cost involved with said certification, and I for one would have no issue with making a sizeable contribution towards said cost. I've spoken with at least a couple others and the general consensus is we'd all chip in![/quote]It doesn't necessarily have to be signed by someone like Verisign (it could, but that would cost quite a bit) - another option is for us to generate our own signing certificate and provide them with the public key for them to verify the 3DMigoto build originated from Bo3b or myself (that's all signed executables really do after all - verify where the executable came from). Edit: If it does have to be signed by an trusted third party I'm a CACert assurer and could sign it through them without it costing anything. Whether they would trust something signed by a CACert Assurer is another matter though - CACert never managed to get their root certificate in any major web browsers or operating systems, but it may be an option. [quote="masterotaku"]If EAC people were willing to do some effort, they could provide access to an EAC-less beta build (exclusive for the 3D fixer). Then when the fix is done and released to the public, they could check the hash of shaders and maybe d3dx.ini (not allowing 3Dmigoto updates or new settings, sadly. Maybe with alternative hashes for SBS usage). If everything is as expected, 3Dmigoto would pass the EAC check.[/quote]Yeah, that's along the same lines of what I was thinking as well - some special mode for the shaderhacker to develop their fix, then a locked down environment for users. I was thinking that inside EAC 3DMigoto might be restricted to load everything from a zip file that has a detached signature that either 3DMigoto or EAC can verify, and a cut down config file that only contains settings users may need to edit (like SBS, upscaling, etc)... But we'd need to actually talk to some of the EAC engineers to determine what would work.
DJ-RK said:and for that, we may need to make some concessions. I recall you mentioning in the FC5 thread, I think it was, that you wouldn't be willing to strip back any features like custom shader support just to appease them, but I personally would be willing to make that sacrifice if it meant us getting whitelisted across the board. Not my call, I know, but just thought I'd state my opinion on that subject.
The problem with stripping out custom shader support is it locks out SBS, upscaling, software mouse, auto-convergence, Tile lighting in Arkham Knight, matrix inversion for assembly shaders (including every Unity game), constant buffer stereoisation, depth buffer downscaling for SLI, the "strange blue glitch" fix in WATCH_DOGS2, the HUD flicker fix in WATCH_DOGS2, Dreamfall Chapters HUD lining up with ghosts, Volumetric light shafts in Dreamfall Chapters, the cockpit in Subnautica, the mouse lining up with certain puzzles in The Witness, debugging shaders to understand and fix complex effects... and that's just off the top of my head - maybe we can make some concessions, but that one is not really acceptable.

DJ-RK said:Oh, and I also recall you mentioning about considering the notion of getting 3DM digitally signed as a possible solution... I can only imagine there would be a cost involved with said certification, and I for one would have no issue with making a sizeable contribution towards said cost. I've spoken with at least a couple others and the general consensus is we'd all chip in!
It doesn't necessarily have to be signed by someone like Verisign (it could, but that would cost quite a bit) - another option is for us to generate our own signing certificate and provide them with the public key for them to verify the 3DMigoto build originated from Bo3b or myself (that's all signed executables really do after all - verify where the executable came from).

Edit: If it does have to be signed by an trusted third party I'm a CACert assurer and could sign it through them without it costing anything. Whether they would trust something signed by a CACert Assurer is another matter though - CACert never managed to get their root certificate in any major web browsers or operating systems, but it may be an option.

masterotaku said:If EAC people were willing to do some effort, they could provide access to an EAC-less beta build (exclusive for the 3D fixer). Then when the fix is done and released to the public, they could check the hash of shaders and maybe d3dx.ini (not allowing 3Dmigoto updates or new settings, sadly. Maybe with alternative hashes for SBS usage). If everything is as expected, 3Dmigoto would pass the EAC check.
Yeah, that's along the same lines of what I was thinking as well - some special mode for the shaderhacker to develop their fix, then a locked down environment for users. I was thinking that inside EAC 3DMigoto might be restricted to load everything from a zip file that has a detached signature that either 3DMigoto or EAC can verify, and a cut down config file that only contains settings users may need to edit (like SBS, upscaling, etc)... But we'd need to actually talk to some of the EAC engineers to determine what would work.

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Posted 04/19/2018 09:56 AM   
! Ignore please 3Dmigoto has never been used to cheat and we are not cheaters.
! Ignore please

3Dmigoto has never been used to cheat and we are not cheaters.

Thanks to everybody using my assembler it warms my heart.
To have a critical piece of code that everyone can enjoy!
What more can you ask for?

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Posted 04/19/2018 12:07 PM   
Can we just stop all talk of cheating, Flugan . We are not cheaters, 3dmigoto is not used to cheat and it's not a helpful context to discuss this I think. I have this horrid feeling they are just lazy and can't be bothered. How exactly can 3dmigoto considered to be cheating when they have whitelisted Reshade? In this case the game isn't even competitive.. I would really like to know what actual reasoning EAC has, if any to block it and what they consider cheating. I feel if this isn't clarified what exactly they consider a violation, it doesn't matter what is done on the 3dmigoto side anyway.
Can we just stop all talk of cheating, Flugan . We are not cheaters, 3dmigoto is not used to cheat and it's not a helpful context to discuss this I think.

I have this horrid feeling they are just lazy and can't be bothered. How exactly can 3dmigoto considered to be cheating when they have whitelisted Reshade? In this case the game isn't even competitive..

I would really like to know what actual reasoning EAC has, if any to block it and what they consider cheating. I feel if this isn't clarified what exactly they consider a violation, it doesn't matter what is done on the 3dmigoto side anyway.

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Posted 04/19/2018 12:41 PM   
[quote="DarkStarSword"][quote="DJ-RK"]and for that, we may need to make some concessions. I recall you mentioning in the FC5 thread, I think it was, that you wouldn't be willing to strip back any features like custom shader support just to appease them, but I personally would be willing to make that sacrifice if it meant us getting whitelisted across the board. Not my call, I know, but just thought I'd state my opinion on that subject.[/quote]The problem with stripping out custom shader support is it locks out SBS, upscaling, software mouse, auto-convergence, Tile lighting in Arkham Knight, matrix inversion for assembly shaders (including every Unity game), constant buffer stereoisation, depth buffer downscaling for SLI, the "strange blue glitch" fix in WATCH_DOGS2, the HUD flicker fix in WATCH_DOGS2, Dreamfall Chapters HUD lining up with ghosts, Volumetric light shafts in Dreamfall Chapters, the cockpit in Subnautica, the mouse lining up with certain puzzles in The Witness, debugging shaders to understand and fix complex effects... and that's just off the top of my head - maybe we can make some concessions, but that one is not really acceptable.[/quote] Oh, I certainly wouldn't dream of having custom shader support stripped out of the non-EAC approved branch, and especially not out of existing fixes, I was more thinking along the lines of creating a fork that would be enough for them to consider allowing it, while still giving us enough of what we need to be able to fix games. I know for someone with knowledge such as yourself that custom shader support provides nearly endless possibilities and is essential to your workflow, but I'd wager for most of us that it mostly falls into "nice to have territory" (mainly because we're not full fledged programmers, and limited to utilizing the cool stuff you've already come up with). Anyways, I can see that me holding that opinion is not all that different from the stereo bigots (as Necropants called them), where they probably see us as just wanting something that would be "nice to have" in our attempts to keep 3DVision alive and playable here, in their ignorance, so I'll somewhat retract that opinion and statement. I also had thought of the beta build access for shaderhackers, which would be a pretty ideal scenario. I'm just concerned that's a lot more effort involved for EAC/developers and they wouldn't be willing to take on that responsibility. With an approved version/branch of 3DM, it would be a simple "one and done" approach with the whitelist... but yeah, if we could get that and then have the ability to sign and lock down the fix would be awesome!
DarkStarSword said:
DJ-RK said:and for that, we may need to make some concessions. I recall you mentioning in the FC5 thread, I think it was, that you wouldn't be willing to strip back any features like custom shader support just to appease them, but I personally would be willing to make that sacrifice if it meant us getting whitelisted across the board. Not my call, I know, but just thought I'd state my opinion on that subject.
The problem with stripping out custom shader support is it locks out SBS, upscaling, software mouse, auto-convergence, Tile lighting in Arkham Knight, matrix inversion for assembly shaders (including every Unity game), constant buffer stereoisation, depth buffer downscaling for SLI, the "strange blue glitch" fix in WATCH_DOGS2, the HUD flicker fix in WATCH_DOGS2, Dreamfall Chapters HUD lining up with ghosts, Volumetric light shafts in Dreamfall Chapters, the cockpit in Subnautica, the mouse lining up with certain puzzles in The Witness, debugging shaders to understand and fix complex effects... and that's just off the top of my head - maybe we can make some concessions, but that one is not really acceptable.


Oh, I certainly wouldn't dream of having custom shader support stripped out of the non-EAC approved branch, and especially not out of existing fixes, I was more thinking along the lines of creating a fork that would be enough for them to consider allowing it, while still giving us enough of what we need to be able to fix games. I know for someone with knowledge such as yourself that custom shader support provides nearly endless possibilities and is essential to your workflow, but I'd wager for most of us that it mostly falls into "nice to have territory" (mainly because we're not full fledged programmers, and limited to utilizing the cool stuff you've already come up with). Anyways, I can see that me holding that opinion is not all that different from the stereo bigots (as Necropants called them), where they probably see us as just wanting something that would be "nice to have" in our attempts to keep 3DVision alive and playable here, in their ignorance, so I'll somewhat retract that opinion and statement.

I also had thought of the beta build access for shaderhackers, which would be a pretty ideal scenario. I'm just concerned that's a lot more effort involved for EAC/developers and they wouldn't be willing to take on that responsibility. With an approved version/branch of 3DM, it would be a simple "one and done" approach with the whitelist... but yeah, if we could get that and then have the ability to sign and lock down the fix would be awesome!

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Posted 04/19/2018 03:31 PM   
This is sad and unfair. I feel so helpless.. I wish I could help somehow, mb we shoud contact the "nvidia" guy to point out the problem since we use its technology to play games. btw due to some circumstances i had to reinstall my OS some days ago, and now i'm not "lucky" anymore (so i think it was some missing/installed updates). The most disturbing thing is EAC may spead to many titles in the nearest future
This is sad and unfair. I feel so helpless.. I wish I could help somehow, mb we shoud contact the "nvidia" guy to point out the problem since we use its technology to play games. btw due to some circumstances i had to reinstall my OS some days ago, and now i'm not "lucky" anymore (so i think it was some missing/installed updates). The most disturbing thing is EAC may spead to many titles in the nearest future

Posted 04/20/2018 09:59 AM   
I'm going to attempt to get the current WIP fix to work in-game. But after looking at it briefly I really need to beef up my hook dll in many places. A lot of features are new. At this point it's just empty words as I have not started working yet. Just informing my intention.
I'm going to attempt to get the current WIP fix to work in-game. But after looking at it briefly I really need to beef up my hook dll in many places. A lot of features are new. At this point it's just empty words as I have not started working yet. Just informing my intention.

Thanks to everybody using my assembler it warms my heart.
To have a critical piece of code that everyone can enjoy!
What more can you ask for?

donations: ulfjalmbrant@hotmail.com

Posted 04/20/2018 05:51 PM   
Ouch, this is sad news. I don't have much time to play and on the few days I'd like to play a cool game like this it's still broken :-( If any Fatshark, EAC or NVIDIA people read here: please fix 3D Vision! Otherwise people like me need to stick to old games and can't buy new games (and don't need new Graphic-Cards). Without 3D-Vision games look worse than ~10 Years ago :-(
Ouch, this is sad news.
I don't have much time to play and on the few days I'd like to play a cool game like this it's still broken :-(

If any Fatshark, EAC or NVIDIA people read here: please fix 3D Vision!
Otherwise people like me need to stick to old games and can't buy new games (and don't need new Graphic-Cards).

Without 3D-Vision games look worse than ~10 Years ago :-(

Posted 05/13/2018 05:17 PM   
  8 / 10    
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