Full 1920X1080P@120Hz Projector FL35 wqxga
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[quote name='Airion' date='17 April 2012 - 07:23 PM' timestamp='1334658235' post='1397426']
Internally, 1080p 3D projectors already operate at 1080p60hz (or perhaps 1080p48hz) anyway.
[/quote]

Sorry, 1080p60hz per eye, 120hz total. If a projector has a "24fps" mode it's operating at 48hz, or some multiple of 24. This is where the difference between fps and hz comes in.
[quote name='Airion' date='17 April 2012 - 07:23 PM' timestamp='1334658235' post='1397426']

Internally, 1080p 3D projectors already operate at 1080p60hz (or perhaps 1080p48hz) anyway.





Sorry, 1080p60hz per eye, 120hz total. If a projector has a "24fps" mode it's operating at 48hz, or some multiple of 24. This is where the difference between fps and hz comes in.

#16
Posted 04/17/2012 12:33 PM   
When anyone finds a review of this projector (or any other 1080p 120Mhz) please let us know!
When anyone finds a review of this projector (or any other 1080p 120Mhz) please let us know!

Asus P8Z68-V Pro; i5 2500k@4.3Ghz; Inno3d iChill X3 gtx 1070 ; 8GB DDR3 1600Mhz; Asus Xonar DX; Vertex 3 120Gb SSD + 1TB HDD; Corsair Tx750w; CoolerMaster Storm Scout Case ; Benq W700 720p 3D Vision Projector & 88 inch Screen, Sony 5.1 Home Cinema. HTC Vive

#17
Posted 04/18/2012 11:49 AM   
Came across a link to Engadget article on a new projector being released by Red. Supposedly releasing at under $10,000 US
http://www.engadget.com/2012/04/16/redray-4k-cinema-laser-hands-on/

It says "The device supports 2D and passive 3D (up to 120fps in 3D mode), with 4K projection for each eye and has a rated laser life of over 25,000 hours."
Came across a link to Engadget article on a new projector being released by Red. Supposedly releasing at under $10,000 US

http://www.engadget.com/2012/04/16/redray-4k-cinema-laser-hands-on/



It says "The device supports 2D and passive 3D (up to 120fps in 3D mode), with 4K projection for each eye and has a rated laser life of over 25,000 hours."

#18
Posted 04/18/2012 07:51 PM   
So arguments aside - I guess non of you knows why the leap from 720p 120hz to 1080p is going to cost 9,500 pounds?
Wow - technology like this is starting to suck....
So arguments aside - I guess non of you knows why the leap from 720p 120hz to 1080p is going to cost 9,500 pounds?

Wow - technology like this is starting to suck....

#19
Posted 04/21/2012 07:30 PM   
Currently your only option is 3D surround Vision or a Dual Passive Projector set up. Both have their trade offs but are very doable for a reasonable price and some effort. I don't understand why Projectors do not support Checkerboard for 3D Gaming. Seems to me the only thing missing is the right kind of demuxer placed after the signal passes the HDMI input chip.
Currently your only option is 3D surround Vision or a Dual Passive Projector set up. Both have their trade offs but are very doable for a reasonable price and some effort. I don't understand why Projectors do not support Checkerboard for 3D Gaming. Seems to me the only thing missing is the right kind of demuxer placed after the signal passes the HDMI input chip.

#20
Posted 04/21/2012 09:07 PM   
Just throwing my 2 (1.5 actually) cents in here.

RIGHT OFF THE BAT LET ME CLEARLY STATE THAT I HAVE NO IDEA WHY THIS WORKS, I'M ONLY SAYING THAT IT WORKS FOR ME - AND THAT'S IT.

Maybe it'll work for you, maybe it won't, I dunno. But it works for me, and now that it does, I'm never touching these setting again, LOL!

Up until now, whenever I tried to play a game or movie in 3d at 1920X1080 using my projector, I would always get the "WARNING TRYING TO USE 3D WITH NON 3D SETTINGS" window. You know, that pain in the butt window with all red letters(NOT the 1 you can alt+ins away). Well, by playing around with the drivers, I stumbled onto the fact that when I use driver 285.62, if I set the pj as display 1, and my monitor as display 2 and I clone the monitor FROM the pj, if I set the pj's rez in the nvidia control panel to 1920X1080@24hz - my 3d worked PERFECTLY!!! No errors anywhere. It worked ONLY at that rez and ONLY with that driver, but hey - IT WORKED! and that's all that's important. I played my entire collection of 3d movies using the nvida 3d movie player at 1920X1080 and man, was it sweeeet!!!

in case it matters, I'm runnin:

an optoma hd66 pj out of HDMI-1
an lg 50 3dtv as the monitor out of DVI-1
a gtx 580
runnin win7ult 64
on an i7 2600k w/16g ram
on a z68 mobo
Just throwing my 2 (1.5 actually) cents in here.



RIGHT OFF THE BAT LET ME CLEARLY STATE THAT I HAVE NO IDEA WHY THIS WORKS, I'M ONLY SAYING THAT IT WORKS FOR ME - AND THAT'S IT.



Maybe it'll work for you, maybe it won't, I dunno. But it works for me, and now that it does, I'm never touching these setting again, LOL!



Up until now, whenever I tried to play a game or movie in 3d at 1920X1080 using my projector, I would always get the "WARNING TRYING TO USE 3D WITH NON 3D SETTINGS" window. You know, that pain in the butt window with all red letters(NOT the 1 you can alt+ins away). Well, by playing around with the drivers, I stumbled onto the fact that when I use driver 285.62, if I set the pj as display 1, and my monitor as display 2 and I clone the monitor FROM the pj, if I set the pj's rez in the nvidia control panel to 1920X1080@24hz - my 3d worked PERFECTLY!!! No errors anywhere. It worked ONLY at that rez and ONLY with that driver, but hey - IT WORKED! and that's all that's important. I played my entire collection of 3d movies using the nvida 3d movie player at 1920X1080 and man, was it sweeeet!!!



in case it matters, I'm runnin:



an optoma hd66 pj out of HDMI-1

an lg 50 3dtv as the monitor out of DVI-1

a gtx 580

runnin win7ult 64

on an i7 2600k w/16g ram

on a z68 mobo

#21
Posted 04/22/2012 08:44 AM   
[quote name='fixr' date='22 April 2012 - 05:44 PM' timestamp='1335084287' post='1399343']
I played my entire collection of 3d movies using the nvida 3d movie player at 1920X1080 and man, was it sweeeet!!!
[/quote]

It's easy to get confused with this stuff.

3D movies are 1920x1080 at 24 frames per second. This is covered by HDMI 1.4 and Nvidia 3DTV Play. This is not the same as 1920x1080 120hz, or 60 frames per second per eye, which is what this thread is about. Also your projector, the HD66, is a native 720p projector. You can feed it a 1080p signal, but it must downscale to 720p. You were never seeing 1920x1080 3D, let alone at 60 frames per second.

Still, I agree that 720p 3D looks sweet! /smile2.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':))' />
[quote name='fixr' date='22 April 2012 - 05:44 PM' timestamp='1335084287' post='1399343']

I played my entire collection of 3d movies using the nvida 3d movie player at 1920X1080 and man, was it sweeeet!!!





It's easy to get confused with this stuff.



3D movies are 1920x1080 at 24 frames per second. This is covered by HDMI 1.4 and Nvidia 3DTV Play. This is not the same as 1920x1080 120hz, or 60 frames per second per eye, which is what this thread is about. Also your projector, the HD66, is a native 720p projector. You can feed it a 1080p signal, but it must downscale to 720p. You were never seeing 1920x1080 3D, let alone at 60 frames per second.



Still, I agree that 720p 3D looks sweet! /smile2.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':))' />

#22
Posted 04/22/2012 12:27 PM   
[quote name='Airion' date='22 April 2012 - 01:27 PM' timestamp='1335097679' post='1399395']
It's easy to get confused with this stuff.

3D movies are 1920x1080 at 24 frames per second. This is covered by HDMI 1.4 and Nvidia 3DTV Play. This is not the same as 1920x1080 120hz, or 60 frames per second per eye, which is what this thread is about. Also your projector, the HD66, is a native 720p projector. You can feed it a 1080p signal, but it must downscale to 720p. You were never seeing 1920x1080 3D, let alone at 60 frames per second.

Still, I agree that 720p 3D looks sweet! /smile2.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':))' />
[/quote]

You're 100% right, it's worth mentioning though that there is anecdotal evidence that 1080p downscaled to 720p sometimes looks better. I suppose it depends on the scaling algorithms that the device uses. Watching films on my old projector (720p) looked slightly better at native res as it was slightly sharper. Games often looked better though, probably because it was like using supersampling AA.
[quote name='Airion' date='22 April 2012 - 01:27 PM' timestamp='1335097679' post='1399395']

It's easy to get confused with this stuff.



3D movies are 1920x1080 at 24 frames per second. This is covered by HDMI 1.4 and Nvidia 3DTV Play. This is not the same as 1920x1080 120hz, or 60 frames per second per eye, which is what this thread is about. Also your projector, the HD66, is a native 720p projector. You can feed it a 1080p signal, but it must downscale to 720p. You were never seeing 1920x1080 3D, let alone at 60 frames per second.



Still, I agree that 720p 3D looks sweet! /smile2.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':))' />





You're 100% right, it's worth mentioning though that there is anecdotal evidence that 1080p downscaled to 720p sometimes looks better. I suppose it depends on the scaling algorithms that the device uses. Watching films on my old projector (720p) looked slightly better at native res as it was slightly sharper. Games often looked better though, probably because it was like using supersampling AA.

GTX 1070 SLI, I7-6700k ~ 4.4Ghz, 3x BenQ XL2420T, BenQ TK800, LG 55EG960V (3D OLED), Samsung 850 EVO SSD, Crucial M4 SSD, 3D vision kit, Xpand x104 glasses, Corsair HX1000i, Win 10 pro 64/Win 7 64https://www.3dmark.com/fs/9529310

#23
Posted 04/22/2012 01:01 PM   
[quote name='rustyk' date='22 April 2012 - 10:01 PM' timestamp='1335099706' post='1399407']there is anecdotal evidence that 1080p downscaled to 720p sometimes looks better. I suppose it depends on the scaling algorithms that the device uses.
[/quote]

Yep, depends on which scaler is better, the output device (software) or the display (hardware). For movies, probably either is just fine.

However, in terms of games, you're facing a heavy performance cost if you want to feed a 720p display a 1080p image. You might get a little extra sharpness if your display has a poor scaler, but you'd be losing any frames per second above 24, and furthermore you'd be losing half the resolution that your PC is going to all the trouble to render. Feed a 720p 3D display a 1080p24hz 3D signal, and you'll basically be seeing 720p at 24 frames per second. Not good! Your PC and graphics card will be working as hard as they can, but the HDMI chip and display will have to throw out a large amount of the resolution and fps it produces. Bottom line, stick to 720p60fps for gaming on a 720p display.

If you've got an amazing PC with multiple graphics cards, maybe it's worth it though. Kind of like ubersampling.
[quote name='rustyk' date='22 April 2012 - 10:01 PM' timestamp='1335099706' post='1399407']there is anecdotal evidence that 1080p downscaled to 720p sometimes looks better. I suppose it depends on the scaling algorithms that the device uses.





Yep, depends on which scaler is better, the output device (software) or the display (hardware). For movies, probably either is just fine.



However, in terms of games, you're facing a heavy performance cost if you want to feed a 720p display a 1080p image. You might get a little extra sharpness if your display has a poor scaler, but you'd be losing any frames per second above 24, and furthermore you'd be losing half the resolution that your PC is going to all the trouble to render. Feed a 720p 3D display a 1080p24hz 3D signal, and you'll basically be seeing 720p at 24 frames per second. Not good! Your PC and graphics card will be working as hard as they can, but the HDMI chip and display will have to throw out a large amount of the resolution and fps it produces. Bottom line, stick to 720p60fps for gaming on a 720p display.



If you've got an amazing PC with multiple graphics cards, maybe it's worth it though. Kind of like ubersampling.

#24
Posted 04/22/2012 01:49 PM   
Ahhhh fudgebumps! I knew it seemed too good to be true. LOL oh well, as they say, ignorance is bliss. I can tell you this tho, my neighbor has the exact same projector, and when he shows movies at 720, they don't look anywhere near as good. So, if what you guys are saying is true than the hd66 is using a pretty good algorithm. But, as Airion said, that's not what this thread is about. so, sorry for dragging you fine folks off topic - [i]we now return you to your regularly scheduled program ....[/i] /biggrin.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':biggrin:' />
Ahhhh fudgebumps! I knew it seemed too good to be true. LOL oh well, as they say, ignorance is bliss. I can tell you this tho, my neighbor has the exact same projector, and when he shows movies at 720, they don't look anywhere near as good. So, if what you guys are saying is true than the hd66 is using a pretty good algorithm. But, as Airion said, that's not what this thread is about. so, sorry for dragging you fine folks off topic - we now return you to your regularly scheduled program .... /biggrin.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':biggrin:' />

#25
Posted 04/23/2012 12:35 AM   
[quote name='rustyk' date='22 April 2012 - 01:01 PM' timestamp='1335099706' post='1399407']
You're 100% right, it's worth mentioning though that there is anecdotal evidence that 1080p downscaled to 720p sometimes looks better. I suppose it depends on the scaling algorithms that the device uses. Watching films on my old projector (720p) looked slightly better at native res as it was slightly sharper. Games often looked better though, probably because it was like using supersampling AA.
[/quote]

This is true, my 1080p mkv movies look much better than the 720p ones. But maybe this is because they were ripped and, therefore, compressed (like divx or mp3). Would like to see a comparison of uncompressed 720p and 1080p movies, but I have none at the moment.

[quote name='Airion' date='22 April 2012 - 01:49 PM' timestamp='1335102547' post='1399417']
Yep, depends on which scaler is better, the output device (software) or the display (hardware). For movies, probably either is just fine.

However, in terms of games, you're facing a heavy performance cost if you want to feed a 720p display a 1080p image. You might get a little extra sharpness if your display has a poor scaler, but you'd be losing any frames per second above 24, and furthermore you'd be losing half the resolution that your PC is going to all the trouble to render. Feed a 720p 3D display a 1080p24hz 3D signal, and you'll basically be seeing 720p at 24 frames per second. Not good! Your PC and graphics card will be working as hard as they can, but the HDMI chip and display will have to throw out a large amount of the resolution and fps it produces. Bottom line, stick to 720p60fps for gaming on a 720p display.

If you've got an amazing PC with multiple graphics cards, maybe it's worth it though. Kind of like ubersampling.
[/quote]

Does this means he was playing at 24fps?! Woulnd he noticed it?
[quote name='rustyk' date='22 April 2012 - 01:01 PM' timestamp='1335099706' post='1399407']

You're 100% right, it's worth mentioning though that there is anecdotal evidence that 1080p downscaled to 720p sometimes looks better. I suppose it depends on the scaling algorithms that the device uses. Watching films on my old projector (720p) looked slightly better at native res as it was slightly sharper. Games often looked better though, probably because it was like using supersampling AA.





This is true, my 1080p mkv movies look much better than the 720p ones. But maybe this is because they were ripped and, therefore, compressed (like divx or mp3). Would like to see a comparison of uncompressed 720p and 1080p movies, but I have none at the moment.

[quote name='Airion' date='22 April 2012 - 01:49 PM' timestamp='1335102547' post='1399417']

Yep, depends on which scaler is better, the output device (software) or the display (hardware). For movies, probably either is just fine.



However, in terms of games, you're facing a heavy performance cost if you want to feed a 720p display a 1080p image. You might get a little extra sharpness if your display has a poor scaler, but you'd be losing any frames per second above 24, and furthermore you'd be losing half the resolution that your PC is going to all the trouble to render. Feed a 720p 3D display a 1080p24hz 3D signal, and you'll basically be seeing 720p at 24 frames per second. Not good! Your PC and graphics card will be working as hard as they can, but the HDMI chip and display will have to throw out a large amount of the resolution and fps it produces. Bottom line, stick to 720p60fps for gaming on a 720p display.



If you've got an amazing PC with multiple graphics cards, maybe it's worth it though. Kind of like ubersampling.





Does this means he was playing at 24fps?! Woulnd he noticed it?

Asus P8Z68-V Pro; i5 2500k@4.3Ghz; Inno3d iChill X3 gtx 1070 ; 8GB DDR3 1600Mhz; Asus Xonar DX; Vertex 3 120Gb SSD + 1TB HDD; Corsair Tx750w; CoolerMaster Storm Scout Case ; Benq W700 720p 3D Vision Projector & 88 inch Screen, Sony 5.1 Home Cinema. HTC Vive

#26
Posted 04/23/2012 04:10 AM   
[quote name='fixr' date='23 April 2012 - 09:35 AM' timestamp='1335141339' post='1399611']my neighbor has the exact same projector, and when he shows movies at 720, they don't look anywhere near as good. So, if what you guys are saying is true than the hd66 is using a pretty good algorithm.[/quote]

Good to know. I've noticed with my 1080p HC3800 projector that 720p videos off my computer look best when I set my desktop resolution to 720p instead of 1080p. I think my WMP or VLC just aren't setup to do any serious upscaling, so it's best to feed 720p video as 720p video and let my projector upscale it. The PS3, on the other hand, seems to handle it very well. I imagine the same can happen when downscaling.
[quote name='fixr' date='23 April 2012 - 09:35 AM' timestamp='1335141339' post='1399611']my neighbor has the exact same projector, and when he shows movies at 720, they don't look anywhere near as good. So, if what you guys are saying is true than the hd66 is using a pretty good algorithm.



Good to know. I've noticed with my 1080p HC3800 projector that 720p videos off my computer look best when I set my desktop resolution to 720p instead of 1080p. I think my WMP or VLC just aren't setup to do any serious upscaling, so it's best to feed 720p video as 720p video and let my projector upscale it. The PS3, on the other hand, seems to handle it very well. I imagine the same can happen when downscaling.

#27
Posted 04/23/2012 04:12 AM   
[quote name='Badelhas' date='23 April 2012 - 01:10 PM' timestamp='1335154252' post='1399669']
Does this means he was playing at 24fps?! Woulnd he noticed it?
[/quote]

If you feed a display or projector a 1080p24fps 3D signal, then it would have to be, whether noticed or not.

EDIT: I realized I wasn't clear enough in my earlier post that I was talking about 3D only. If we're talking 2D, then you can feed a 720p projector a 1080p image and get 60 fps downscaled to 720p if you can spare the performance.
[quote name='Badelhas' date='23 April 2012 - 01:10 PM' timestamp='1335154252' post='1399669']

Does this means he was playing at 24fps?! Woulnd he noticed it?





If you feed a display or projector a 1080p24fps 3D signal, then it would have to be, whether noticed or not.



EDIT: I realized I wasn't clear enough in my earlier post that I was talking about 3D only. If we're talking 2D, then you can feed a 720p projector a 1080p image and get 60 fps downscaled to 720p if you can spare the performance.

#28
Posted 04/23/2012 04:26 AM   
Guys, you might find this interesting:

How to upsample frame rate to 120fps.

[url="http://forums.nvidia.com/index.php?showtopic=227993"]My post is here[/url]

-- Shahzad.
Guys, you might find this interesting:



How to upsample frame rate to 120fps.



My post is here



-- Shahzad.

Windows 10 64-bit, Intel 7700K @ 5.1GHz, 16GB 3600MHz CL15 DDR4 RAM, 2x GTX 1080 SLI, Asus Maximus IX Hero, Sound Blaster ZxR, PCIe Quad SSD, Oculus Rift CV1, DLP Link PGD-150 glasses, ViewSonic PJD6531w 3D DLP Projector @ 1280x800 120Hz native / 2560x1600 120Hz DSR 3D Gaming.

#29
Posted 04/23/2012 11:32 AM   
[quote name='RAGEdemon' date='23 April 2012 - 08:32 PM' timestamp='1335180720' post='1399779']
Guys, you might find this interesting:

How to upsample frame rate to 120fps.

[url="http://forums.nvidia.com/index.php?showtopic=227993"]My post is here[/url]

-- Shahzad.
[/quote]

No CPU magic can overcome HDMI hardware limitations. You can interpolate 120 frames per second in the PC, you but can only send 60fps per eye at 720p or 24fps per eye at 1080p over HDMI. Some projectors have FI capabilities, but as you acknowledge in that thread, none of them have the equivalent of an i7 processor. It's an interesting subject, but the 120fps you're offering isn't the 120fps we're looking for here. /smile.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':smile:' />
[quote name='RAGEdemon' date='23 April 2012 - 08:32 PM' timestamp='1335180720' post='1399779']

Guys, you might find this interesting:



How to upsample frame rate to 120fps.



My post is here



-- Shahzad.





No CPU magic can overcome HDMI hardware limitations. You can interpolate 120 frames per second in the PC, you but can only send 60fps per eye at 720p or 24fps per eye at 1080p over HDMI. Some projectors have FI capabilities, but as you acknowledge in that thread, none of them have the equivalent of an i7 processor. It's an interesting subject, but the 120fps you're offering isn't the 120fps we're looking for here. /smile.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':smile:' />

#30
Posted 04/23/2012 01:32 PM   
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