3d on videoprojector
  1 / 2    
Hello I have an MSI gt780dxr laptop with a gtx570M graphic card. My screen isn't 3d afaik. So I've tried to link my laptop to a videoprojector through hdmi. A benq mx613st which is 3d ready. But I can't get anything in 3d. When I try to install the graphic drivers from the nvidian 3d vision installation cd, it tells me it can't find any driver compatible with my harware. How can I project a fil in 3d ? Is it possible ? Thank you
Hello
I have an MSI gt780dxr laptop with a gtx570M graphic card. My screen isn't 3d afaik. So I've tried to link my laptop to a videoprojector through hdmi. A benq mx613st which is 3d ready. But I can't get anything in 3d. When I try to install the graphic drivers from the nvidian 3d vision installation cd, it tells me it can't find any driver compatible with my harware. How can I project a fil in 3d ? Is it possible ?
Thank you

#1
Posted 02/12/2013 11:54 PM   
What do you want to do? Watch 3D Blurays played back via a BD ROM drive? Play files back from your hard drive? Game in 3D? If you are trying to game in 3D the mx613st is not "officialy" supported by 3D Vision or 3DTV Play although the BenQ MS612ST is supported by 3D Vision http://www.nvidia.com/object/3d-vision-displays.html
What do you want to do?

Watch 3D Blurays played back via a BD ROM drive?

Play files back from your hard drive?

Game in 3D?

If you are trying to game in 3D the mx613st is not "officialy" supported by 3D Vision or 3DTV Play although the
BenQ MS612ST is supported by 3D Vision http://www.nvidia.com/object/3d-vision-displays.html

#2
Posted 02/13/2013 09:19 PM   
Guys, how is watching 3D movies and playing games in 3D on projector compares to monitor or plasma TV? Is 3D on par with latter? Isnt picture too dark? Any kind of feedback from projector owners welcome
Guys, how is watching 3D movies and playing games in 3D on projector compares to monitor or plasma TV? Is 3D on par with latter? Isnt picture too dark? Any kind of feedback from projector owners welcome

i5 2500K/16gb/GTX 970/Asus VG278H + Sony HMZ-T1

#3
Posted 02/14/2013 07:29 PM   
i havnt seen it, but ive read tons on forums. a dlp projector apparntly has 0 crosstalk, and is the best way for 3D bar none. With the curtains drawn, lights out, brightness is never going to be an issue. If i had the space, i would be all over it like a rash on a soho hooker ;-)
i havnt seen it, but ive read tons on forums. a dlp projector apparntly has 0 crosstalk, and is the best way for 3D bar none. With the curtains drawn, lights out, brightness is never going to be an issue. If i had the space, i would be all over it like a rash on a soho hooker ;-)

OS: Win 8 CPU: I7 4770k 3.5GZ GPU: GTX 780ti

#4
Posted 02/14/2013 10:27 PM   
@mindwork Screen type gives brightness. My projector screen is brighter then my asus.
@mindwork
Screen type gives brightness. My projector screen is brighter then my asus.

Co-founder of helixmod.blog.com

If you like one of my helixmod patches and want to donate. Can send to me through paypal - eqzitara@yahoo.com

#5
Posted 02/14/2013 11:37 PM   
I have had a 3d monitor, hdtv and projector for a while. Each is different really. The monitor does the best fast motion since it 120hz. The 3dtv is 55inch and provides great size and sharpness and contrast. I had a 720p and just got a 1080p benq and it is great. It is the most stunning to see. It has the wow factor for sure. IMO you need a pitch black room. The contrast is not as good as a good 3dtv. There is ghosting in all of these displays. The 3d monitor is the best at ghosting. The 3dtv is a samsung d8000 and its the worst. The monitor is an asus vg278h. The samsung is smooth for video because it has the frame interpolation, which I wish the benq had, because a 3d movie on the big projector is really neat. You can sit up close to the screen and it really is the best immersion. I dont know why I keep hearing people say dlp has no ghosting, of course it ghosts. There is no technology yet that avoids ghosting. NADA. It doesnt matter how you adjust it, you can only reduce the ghosting. DLP is really good, and I think most people that just arent that picky dont notice it, but its there alright. IMO DLP is good enough for ghosting. I think all new devices have reduced ghosting where its not really that big of a deal any more.
I have had a 3d monitor, hdtv and projector for a while. Each is different really. The monitor does the best fast motion since it 120hz. The 3dtv is 55inch and provides great size and sharpness and contrast. I had a 720p and just got a 1080p benq and it is great. It is the most stunning to see. It has the wow factor for sure. IMO you need a pitch black room. The contrast is not as good as a good 3dtv. There is ghosting in all of these displays. The 3d monitor is the best at ghosting. The 3dtv is a samsung d8000 and its the worst. The monitor is an asus vg278h. The samsung is smooth for video because it has the frame interpolation, which I wish the benq had, because a 3d movie on the big projector is really neat. You can sit up close to the screen and it really is the best immersion.

I dont know why I keep hearing people say dlp has no ghosting, of course it ghosts. There is no technology yet that avoids ghosting. NADA. It doesnt matter how you adjust it, you can only reduce the ghosting. DLP is really good, and I think most people that just arent that picky dont notice it, but its there alright. IMO DLP is good enough for ghosting. I think all new devices have reduced ghosting where its not really that big of a deal any more.

#6
Posted 02/14/2013 11:56 PM   
[quote="scstudios"]There is no technology yet that avoids ghosting. NADA. It doesnt matter how you adjust it, you can only reduce the ghosting[/quote] Well, my HMZ-T1 has absolutely zero ghosting in any game.
scstudios said:There is no technology yet that avoids ghosting. NADA. It doesnt matter how you adjust it, you can only reduce the ghosting


Well, my HMZ-T1 has absolutely zero ghosting in any game.

i5 2500K/16gb/GTX 970/Asus VG278H + Sony HMZ-T1

#7
Posted 02/15/2013 12:14 AM   
@scstudios: I'm not sure we are talking about the same thing when we say "ghosting", but the H5360 DLP I run has zero crosstalk, zero ghosting. For real. My older ViewSonic DLP projector also had zero ghosting. Pretty sure that DLP switches so fast that the technology can be ghost free. Unlike monitors, the micromirrors can switch on and off at 1/2000 second. That's roughly 10x faster than a 5ms monitor. There is no persistence in the mirror, nor the screen, so when it's off, it's off. Now, it's still possible to get ghosting from other parts of the system. The glasses in particular have to be perfectly synchronized, or you'll get ghosting. Using the NVidia Gen 1 glasses, I never see ghosting. Totally agree that the biggest drawback to projector is the lower contrast, but it's rarely a problem for me. Only when I use it during the day, with only drapes.
@scstudios:
I'm not sure we are talking about the same thing when we say "ghosting", but the H5360 DLP I run has zero crosstalk, zero ghosting. For real. My older ViewSonic DLP projector also had zero ghosting.

Pretty sure that DLP switches so fast that the technology can be ghost free. Unlike monitors, the micromirrors can switch on and off at 1/2000 second. That's roughly 10x faster than a 5ms monitor. There is no persistence in the mirror, nor the screen, so when it's off, it's off.

Now, it's still possible to get ghosting from other parts of the system. The glasses in particular have to be perfectly synchronized, or you'll get ghosting. Using the NVidia Gen 1 glasses, I never see ghosting.


Totally agree that the biggest drawback to projector is the lower contrast, but it's rarely a problem for me. Only when I use it during the day, with only drapes.

Acer H5360 (1280x720@120Hz) - ASUS VG248QE with GSync mod - 3D Vision 1&2 - Driver 372.54
GTX 970 - i5-4670K@4.2GHz - 12GB RAM - Win7x64+evilKB2670838 - 4 Disk X25 RAID
SAGER NP9870-S - GTX 980 - i7-6700K - Win10 Pro 1607
Latest 3Dmigoto Release
Bo3b's School for ShaderHackers

#8
Posted 02/16/2013 01:17 PM   
I've been wanting to post some real photos anyway, so this is a good chance to show what I mean by Zero Ghosting. The worst times for ghosting is very bright lights, right next to a dark area, right? Here is a PHOTO, not a screenshot, taken with a Lumix camera of my projected image on the wall, of Portal 2: [img]http://www.bo3b.net/P1070157.JPG[/img] Double image like you'd expect, right? Here is the left eye, taken through the lens of the NVidia glasses. I focused the camera on the wall with a half-press on the shutter, to get proper focus: [img]http://www.bo3b.net/P1070158.JPG[/img] Right eye: [img]http://www.bo3b.net/P1070159.JPG[/img] Download these photos and take a careful look. There is no ghosting that I see, even under magnification. The noisy image is because the camera is also setting the light meter based on the half press, and thus gets less when it's taken. Might be some camera shake too, as these are 1/2 second shots. Let me know if you have any questions.
I've been wanting to post some real photos anyway, so this is a good chance to show what I mean by Zero Ghosting.

The worst times for ghosting is very bright lights, right next to a dark area, right?

Here is a PHOTO, not a screenshot, taken with a Lumix camera of my projected image on the wall, of Portal 2:

Image

Double image like you'd expect, right?


Here is the left eye, taken through the lens of the NVidia glasses. I focused the camera on the wall with a half-press on the shutter, to get proper focus:

Image


Right eye:

Image


Download these photos and take a careful look. There is no ghosting that I see, even under magnification.

The noisy image is because the camera is also setting the light meter based on the half press, and thus gets less when it's taken. Might be some camera shake too, as these are 1/2 second shots.

Let me know if you have any questions.

Acer H5360 (1280x720@120Hz) - ASUS VG248QE with GSync mod - 3D Vision 1&2 - Driver 372.54
GTX 970 - i5-4670K@4.2GHz - 12GB RAM - Win7x64+evilKB2670838 - 4 Disk X25 RAID
SAGER NP9870-S - GTX 980 - i7-6700K - Win10 Pro 1607
Latest 3Dmigoto Release
Bo3b's School for ShaderHackers

#9
Posted 02/17/2013 02:02 PM   
Right, HMD will not ghost, obviously. Polarizer and active glasses dont block 100%. They just dont. The easiest way to prove this is to just make a jpg and draw pure white only on one side all over a pure black backround, just scribble 1 side. Then view your 3d image with the system. You are going to see traces of it in the other eye. With active displays, you can see a big difference on where the issue is and how that relates to how much ghosting you get. 3dvision blog did a big breakdown with some test images to see where the image ghosted more. Its easy to see how much you get when you just do your own test that isnt a game or movie, just scribble in photoshop and look at it. I think some games are reducing the ghosting by not allowing 100% white in one eye and 100% black in the other. The displays are way better, but even if the display was perfect and the sync was perfect, the glasses arent. You need all 3 to literally be perfect for it to work. I think DLP is the closest to being able to given the nature of how they project the light off the mirrors, if the mirror is down, its not going to be making light at all. But the glasses cant block it 100%, so you have that issue left over, that is if your sync is perfect. What is the best active display for minimal ghosting?
Right, HMD will not ghost, obviously. Polarizer and active glasses dont block 100%. They just dont. The easiest way to prove this is to just make a jpg and draw pure white only on one side all over a pure black backround, just scribble 1 side. Then view your 3d image with the system. You are going to see traces of it in the other eye. With active displays, you can see a big difference on where the issue is and how that relates to how much ghosting you get. 3dvision blog did a big breakdown with some test images to see where the image ghosted more. Its easy to see how much you get when you just do your own test that isnt a game or movie, just scribble in photoshop and look at it.

I think some games are reducing the ghosting by not allowing 100% white in one eye and 100% black in the other. The displays are way better, but even if the display was perfect and the sync was perfect, the glasses arent. You need all 3 to literally be perfect for it to work. I think DLP is the closest to being able to given the nature of how they project the light off the mirrors, if the mirror is down, its not going to be making light at all. But the glasses cant block it 100%, so you have that issue left over, that is if your sync is perfect.

What is the best active display for minimal ghosting?

#10
Posted 02/17/2013 09:47 PM   
Here is a simple sample image: https://sites.google.com/site/jkaweghuieqwehg/_/rsrc/1361138406574/home/ghost.jpg

#11
Posted 02/17/2013 10:05 PM   
[quote="scstudios"]Here is a simple sample image: https://sites.google.com/site/jkaweghuieqwehg/_/rsrc/1361138406574/home/ghost.jpg[/quote] Cool, thanks for the test image. I'll take photos of it, and post them too. Just to be clear, I'm definitely not suggesting that there is no measurable crosstalk. You are of course right that an LCD polarizer will never block 100% of light when active. But, for practical gaming uses, the NVidia glasses are so much better than the old glasses that it's hard to believe. I'm also looking for the optimal experience, and am on the Kickstarter for Rift. It has a lot of promise, and of course will also have zero crosstalk because of the non-shared screen. For today though, for practical purposes, I have yet to find anything better than DLP projector+3D Vision.
scstudios said:Here is a simple sample image:


https://sites.google.com/site/jkaweghuieqwehg/_/rsrc/1361138406574/home/ghost.jpg



Cool, thanks for the test image. I'll take photos of it, and post them too.


Just to be clear, I'm definitely not suggesting that there is no measurable crosstalk. You are of course right that an LCD polarizer will never block 100% of light when active.

But, for practical gaming uses, the NVidia glasses are so much better than the old glasses that it's hard to believe.

I'm also looking for the optimal experience, and am on the Kickstarter for Rift. It has a lot of promise, and of course will also have zero crosstalk because of the non-shared screen.

For today though, for practical purposes, I have yet to find anything better than DLP projector+3D Vision.

Acer H5360 (1280x720@120Hz) - ASUS VG248QE with GSync mod - 3D Vision 1&2 - Driver 372.54
GTX 970 - i5-4670K@4.2GHz - 12GB RAM - Win7x64+evilKB2670838 - 4 Disk X25 RAID
SAGER NP9870-S - GTX 980 - i7-6700K - Win10 Pro 1607
Latest 3Dmigoto Release
Bo3b's School for ShaderHackers

#12
Posted 02/18/2013 02:20 AM   
OK, I took some time and experimented with that test image. Trying to get good photos is challenging, but the exercise was worth doing. I set the camera to maximum ISO of 400, which makes things grainy, but figured we cared more about shutter speed. Shutter speed was slow at 0.7 seconds, and I used a tripod and the 2s countdown timer to avoid shake. Here is the usual double image when changing that to JPS, and showing it in 3D Vision Photo Viewer: [img]http://bo3b.net/ghost/double.JPG[/img] Here are the glasses, turned on, and the overall view: [img]http://bo3b.net/ghost/glasses.JPG[/img] Here is the left eye through the glasses. You can see just a little bit of ghosting on the left. [img]http://bo3b.net/ghost/left.JPG[/img] Here is the right eye through the glasses. Here you can see a fair amount of ghosting on the right. [img]http://bo3b.net/ghost/right.JPG[/img] Taking a picture on the left, trying to match where my eye looks through the lens was easy. I could not do it on the right, because of the earpiece and the location of the camera lens. It's clear that location matters. There is a dark stripe through the glasses, right at the interocular distance, that probably helps optimize the picture. If your eyes don't happen to align with that spot, I bet you get worse results than I do.
OK, I took some time and experimented with that test image. Trying to get good photos is challenging, but the exercise was worth doing. I set the camera to maximum ISO of 400, which makes things grainy, but figured we cared more about shutter speed. Shutter speed was slow at 0.7 seconds, and I used a tripod and the 2s countdown timer to avoid shake.


Here is the usual double image when changing that to JPS, and showing it in 3D Vision Photo Viewer:

Image


Here are the glasses, turned on, and the overall view:

Image


Here is the left eye through the glasses. You can see just a little bit of ghosting on the left.

Image


Here is the right eye through the glasses. Here you can see a fair amount of ghosting on the right.

Image


Taking a picture on the left, trying to match where my eye looks through the lens was easy. I could not do it on the right, because of the earpiece and the location of the camera lens.

It's clear that location matters. There is a dark stripe through the glasses, right at the interocular distance, that probably helps optimize the picture. If your eyes don't happen to align with that spot, I bet you get worse results than I do.

Acer H5360 (1280x720@120Hz) - ASUS VG248QE with GSync mod - 3D Vision 1&2 - Driver 372.54
GTX 970 - i5-4670K@4.2GHz - 12GB RAM - Win7x64+evilKB2670838 - 4 Disk X25 RAID
SAGER NP9870-S - GTX 980 - i7-6700K - Win10 Pro 1607
Latest 3Dmigoto Release
Bo3b's School for ShaderHackers

#13
Posted 02/19/2013 08:14 AM   
Here is my best example of the sweet spot in the lens. I inverted the glasses so the earpieces pointed at the screen, so that I could aim for the sweet spot. You can see that there is a section in the middle that is nearly perfect, and that ghosting comes in on both edges as you get out of the sweet spot. That sweet spot is where my eyes land when wearing them normally, which helps explain why my results are so good. [img]http://bo3b.net/ghost/invert.JPG[/img]
Here is my best example of the sweet spot in the lens. I inverted the glasses so the earpieces pointed at the screen, so that I could aim for the sweet spot.

You can see that there is a section in the middle that is nearly perfect, and that ghosting comes in on both edges as you get out of the sweet spot. That sweet spot is where my eyes land when wearing them normally, which helps explain why my results are so good.

Image

Acer H5360 (1280x720@120Hz) - ASUS VG248QE with GSync mod - 3D Vision 1&2 - Driver 372.54
GTX 970 - i5-4670K@4.2GHz - 12GB RAM - Win7x64+evilKB2670838 - 4 Disk X25 RAID
SAGER NP9870-S - GTX 980 - i7-6700K - Win10 Pro 1607
Latest 3Dmigoto Release
Bo3b's School for ShaderHackers

#14
Posted 02/19/2013 08:25 AM   
Found the 3D Vision Blog test images, and thought I'd add those. This allows you to compare to some of Bloody's test images for comparison. [url]http://3dvision-blog.com/4056-stereo-3d-display-crosstalk-test-photos-with-some-results/comment-page-1/[/url] Laura Croft boat picture, left eye: [img]http://www.bo3b.net/ghost/laura-left.JPG[/img] The black on right, plants on left test*: [img]http://www.bo3b.net/ghost/black.JPG[/img] The white on right, plants on left test: [img]http://www.bo3b.net/ghost/white.JPG[/img] *Please note that my black test is flawed because of a reflective bookcase on the left. There is a shimmer from that, that is visible, but is not the fault of the glasses.
Found the 3D Vision Blog test images, and thought I'd add those. This allows you to compare to some of Bloody's test images for comparison.

http://3dvision-blog.com/4056-stereo-3d-display-crosstalk-test-photos-with-some-results/comment-page-1/


Laura Croft boat picture, left eye:

Image


The black on right, plants on left test*:

Image

The white on right, plants on left test:

Image


*Please note that my black test is flawed because of a reflective bookcase on the left. There is a shimmer from that, that is visible, but is not the fault of the glasses.

Acer H5360 (1280x720@120Hz) - ASUS VG248QE with GSync mod - 3D Vision 1&2 - Driver 372.54
GTX 970 - i5-4670K@4.2GHz - 12GB RAM - Win7x64+evilKB2670838 - 4 Disk X25 RAID
SAGER NP9870-S - GTX 980 - i7-6700K - Win10 Pro 1607
Latest 3Dmigoto Release
Bo3b's School for ShaderHackers

#15
Posted 02/19/2013 09:38 AM   
  1 / 2    
Scroll To Top