HTC Vive release date and launch price announced
  2 / 14    
Wow, expensive (though not unexpected). I'll wait until the verdict is in on them both before pulling the trigger.
Wow, expensive (though not unexpected). I'll wait until the verdict is in on them both before pulling the trigger.

#16
Posted 02/22/2016 04:35 AM   
I'm curious to what the 3D community thinks. If you had to order one right now, would it be the rift or the vive?
I'm curious to what the 3D community thinks.
If you had to order one right now, would it be the rift or the vive?

#17
Posted 02/22/2016 12:26 PM   
/\ I don't think it's any secret at this point that I've planted my flag with the Vive (unless Acer can pull a stunner out of their hat). The thing is, though, I can dig my heals in on principle. I refuse to upgrade my GPU until there's a new node process. I really wish I knew when Pascal was coming. Because if it was coming Q2, I'd book my pre-order on the 29th for Vive. It's the only thing giving me caution at this point. Should also be noted that I not only like the launch lineup for the Vive, but I have a pretty cool concept for a room scale VR game (that absolutely will not work without motion controls). I'm not really ready to start that yet, but I hope to by the first half of the year. And I'll obviously need a Vive for that (because anyone who's ever used VR knows that theories are useless with VR. It's all based on experimentations/observations while in VR.) So I probably should pre-order anyways.
/\

I don't think it's any secret at this point that I've planted my flag with the Vive (unless Acer can pull a stunner out of their hat). The thing is, though, I can dig my heals in on principle. I refuse to upgrade my GPU until there's a new node process. I really wish I knew when Pascal was coming. Because if it was coming Q2, I'd book my pre-order on the 29th for Vive. It's the only thing giving me caution at this point.

Should also be noted that I not only like the launch lineup for the Vive, but I have a pretty cool concept for a room scale VR game (that absolutely will not work without motion controls). I'm not really ready to start that yet, but I hope to by the first half of the year. And I'll obviously need a Vive for that (because anyone who's ever used VR knows that theories are useless with VR. It's all based on experimentations/observations while in VR.)

So I probably should pre-order anyways.

#18
Posted 02/22/2016 12:37 PM   
[quote="GibsonRed"]I'm curious to what the 3D community thinks. If you had to order one right now, would it be the rift or the vive?[/quote] Vive for me.
GibsonRed said:I'm curious to what the 3D community thinks.
If you had to order one right now, would it be the rift or the vive?


Vive for me.

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#19
Posted 02/22/2016 01:27 PM   
If I was going to buy one, it would be the Vive at this point. But I'm definitely holding out to see which one is more interesting post-release.
If I was going to buy one, it would be the Vive at this point. But I'm definitely holding out to see which one is more interesting post-release.

#20
Posted 02/22/2016 01:31 PM   
Check this out... http://www.kitguru.net/gaming/matthew-wilson/valves-vr-performance-demo-has-hidden-l4d3-and-hl3-files/ I'm aware files have been found in the past before but it does sound promising. Especially as the latest HTC vive video shows someone looking suspiciously like the female portal character towards the end. Think I'm going to cancel my rift preorder and get the vive instead. I just hope there's enough to play on launch day as the rift seems to have a more substantial lineup out of the gate. I can imagine having gun fights in a room with Windows in a left4dead VR experience. A bit like hoverjunkers but with zombies!
Check this out...

http://www.kitguru.net/gaming/matthew-wilson/valves-vr-performance-demo-has-hidden-l4d3-and-hl3-files/


I'm aware files have been found in the past before but it does sound promising.
Especially as the latest HTC vive video shows someone looking suspiciously like the female portal character towards the end.

Think I'm going to cancel my rift preorder and get the vive instead.
I just hope there's enough to play on launch day as the rift seems to have a more substantial lineup out of the gate.

I can imagine having gun fights in a room with Windows in a left4dead VR experience.
A bit like hoverjunkers but with zombies!

#21
Posted 02/23/2016 08:46 PM   
[quote="GibsonRed"]Check this out... http://www.kitguru.net/gaming/matthew-wilson/valves-vr-performance-demo-has-hidden-l4d3-and-hl3-files/ I'm aware files have been found in the past before but it does sound promising. Especially as the latest HTC vive video shows someone looking suspiciously like the female portal character towards the end. Think I'm going to cancel my rift preorder and get the vive instead. I just hope there's enough to play on launch day as the rift seems to have a more substantial lineup out of the gate. I can imagine having gun fights in a room with Windows in a left4dead VR experience. A bit like hoverjunkers but with zombies! [/quote] I'm still pondering ordering a Vive Feb 29th but if I had to choose one it's going to be the Rift ALL THE WAY. Sure the Vive has great potential but without great software, what's the point. The Vive honestly has a pitiful launch linup with maybe 5-6 games launching at many of those aren't even really games. Hover Junkers looks like it would be fun for a couple of days but the core gameplay is so basic and there is so little depth to to game. Same with Arizona Sunshine, which looks like a wii game but in VR. Seriously these games "might" be really fun games to show friends or play for a few hours but they are not fully fledged AAA type games. Too many of these games and VR will be dead very fast. Fantastic COntraption is more of a building sandbox and it's based on an old 2008 game with very poor graphics, and I'm not a huge fan of creation type games. Job simulator actually looks pretty fun but it's basically a "jokes" game and again not really a full game I could see myself playing. I'm really surprised that Valve has nothing to show!? I've been a huge Valve supporter but their lack of software is getting to the point of being ridiculous. Also, developers have had very little time with the Vive DK, while Oculus has had games being developed for over 2 years! There were free Oculus share games that looked better then the Vive linup. I'd rather have Eve Valkyrie then the entire Vive lineup, and if you enjoy 3rd person games, Luckys tale looks great as well. Anyway, this isn't about money or fanboyism for me as I own every console available and I don't have any brand loyalty. For me it's always about the software, and sadly the Vive may have an amazing room scale solution, but without software.....whats the point. The only interesting looking game, Budget Cuts, is not even a launch title. I might still preorder just in case Vale decides to announce something.....All I need is one freaking solid game and I'd get the Vive or the smart thing to do would be to wait for Vive CV2 which I'm guessing is when Vale will hopefully have Orange Box 2 ready!!!??? LOL I'm sick of buying stuff in the hopes that the good stuff is on the way. I bought the Xbox one and I'm still waiting. LOL.
GibsonRed said:Check this out...

http://www.kitguru.net/gaming/matthew-wilson/valves-vr-performance-demo-has-hidden-l4d3-and-hl3-files/


I'm aware files have been found in the past before but it does sound promising.
Especially as the latest HTC vive video shows someone looking suspiciously like the female portal character towards the end.

Think I'm going to cancel my rift preorder and get the vive instead.
I just hope there's enough to play on launch day as the rift seems to have a more substantial lineup out of the gate.

I can imagine having gun fights in a room with Windows in a left4dead VR experience.
A bit like hoverjunkers but with zombies!



I'm still pondering ordering a Vive Feb 29th but if I had to choose one it's going to be the Rift ALL THE WAY.

Sure the Vive has great potential but without great software, what's the point. The Vive honestly has a pitiful launch linup with maybe 5-6 games launching at many of those aren't even really games. Hover Junkers looks like it would be fun for a couple of days but the core gameplay is so basic and there is so little depth to to game. Same with Arizona Sunshine, which looks like a wii game but in VR. Seriously these games "might" be really fun games to show friends or play for a few hours but they are not fully fledged AAA type games. Too many of these games and VR will be dead very fast. Fantastic COntraption is more of a building sandbox and it's based on an old 2008 game with very poor graphics, and I'm not a huge fan of creation type games. Job simulator actually looks pretty fun but it's basically a "jokes" game and again not really a full game I could see myself playing.

I'm really surprised that Valve has nothing to show!? I've been a huge Valve supporter but their lack of software is getting to the point of being ridiculous. Also, developers have had very little time with the Vive DK, while Oculus has had games being developed for over 2 years! There were free Oculus share games that looked better then the Vive linup.

I'd rather have Eve Valkyrie then the entire Vive lineup, and if you enjoy 3rd person games, Luckys tale looks great as well.

Anyway, this isn't about money or fanboyism for me as I own every console available and I don't have any brand loyalty. For me it's always about the software, and sadly the Vive may have an amazing room scale solution, but without software.....whats the point. The only interesting looking game, Budget Cuts, is not even a launch title.

I might still preorder just in case Vale decides to announce something.....All I need is one freaking solid game and I'd get the Vive or the smart thing to do would be to wait for Vive CV2 which I'm guessing is when Vale will hopefully have Orange Box 2 ready!!!??? LOL

I'm sick of buying stuff in the hopes that the good stuff is on the way. I bought the Xbox one and I'm still waiting. LOL.

#22
Posted 02/24/2016 01:30 AM   
Can the Vive's obstacle detection pick up a big ass dog that tends to follow me everywhere?
Can the Vive's obstacle detection pick up a big ass dog that tends to follow me everywhere?

#23
Posted 02/24/2016 01:46 AM   
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4Gs5k2Fti1U&feature=youtu.be&t=1560 Also, Valve confirmed that SteamVR will support Oculus with Chaperon and room scale. Palmer, also confirmed that the Rift can do Room Scale. It won't be as easy a setup as you will need a USB extension cable (you'd be surprised how big a deal people make about buying a 10.00 USB extention cable). I'm not here to tell people what to buy, but I can't understand for the life of me why someone would buy a Vive over a Rift. ALL the Vive games will come to the Rift when touch releases later this year. If you want to play all the great VR games, you will need the Rift, which will play everything and yes that's because of Oculus exclusive games, and I'm sure many people hate that and will not buy a Rift because they are pushing excllusives and Oculus Home. But, on the flipside, if they are completely funding a game, then I don't see a problem with it being exclusive. I'd be pissed if they forced 3rd party devs to only support the Rift. I'm sure if HTC decided to fully fund a game, I'm certain that they would find a way to make it only work on the Vive software. Also, I'm a sucker for visual fidelity. I'd gladly pay double or triple for something that's visibly better and yet again from almost every report, the Rift is said to have better optics, less SDE, and better overall visual fidelity. If you don't believe me, just read the CES hands on reports. The only thing people seem to like about the Vive is the higher FOV, vs. the wider FOV of the Rift, but that's more preference. If the Vive had gone for 4K screens (which probably don't exist yet :() or had done something to make the Vive stand out as the premium product, then I'd be all over that shit and any multi platform games would be used on the Vive. Again, no so as the Rift also has better ergonomics, it's lighter and has a better more polished design, while the Vive still feels like a prototype. It seems to me like the Vive needed at least 6 more months or refinement.... Anyway, This is a great time to be into VR!!
;feature=youtu.be&t=1560

Also, Valve confirmed that SteamVR will support Oculus with Chaperon and room scale. Palmer, also confirmed that the Rift can do Room Scale. It won't be as easy a setup as you will need a USB extension cable (you'd be surprised how big a deal people make about buying a 10.00 USB extention cable).

I'm not here to tell people what to buy, but I can't understand for the life of me why someone would buy a Vive over a Rift. ALL the Vive games will come to the Rift when touch releases later this year. If you want to play all the great VR games, you will need the Rift, which will play everything and yes that's because of Oculus exclusive games, and I'm sure many people hate that and will not buy a Rift because they are pushing excllusives and Oculus Home. But, on the flipside, if they are completely funding a game, then I don't see a problem with it being exclusive. I'd be pissed if they forced 3rd party devs to only support the Rift.

I'm sure if HTC decided to fully fund a game, I'm certain that they would find a way to make it only work on the Vive software.

Also, I'm a sucker for visual fidelity. I'd gladly pay double or triple for something that's visibly better and yet again from almost every report, the Rift is said to have better optics, less SDE, and better overall visual fidelity. If you don't believe me, just read the CES hands on reports. The only thing people seem to like about the Vive is the higher FOV, vs. the wider FOV of the Rift, but that's more preference.

If the Vive had gone for 4K screens (which probably don't exist yet :() or had done something to make the Vive stand out as the premium product, then I'd be all over that shit and any multi platform games would be used on the Vive. Again, no so as the Rift also has better ergonomics, it's lighter and has a better more polished design, while the Vive still feels like a prototype. It seems to me like the Vive needed at least 6 more months or refinement....

Anyway, This is a great time to be into VR!!

#24
Posted 02/24/2016 01:53 AM   
As mentioned elsewhere I contacted Gabe Newell personally regarding licensing the source engine. Their straight forward response was: 1. Source Engine does not support VR 2. They no longer license the source engine. They suggested using either Unity or Unreal Engine 4 for proper VR support. 1. Unity is out of the question they don't evey offer full source code access to the engine 2. Unreal Engine 4 looks like a great engine with full source code available. My goal is to create innovative games. My secondary goal is to make all 3DVision games work together with vive in the best way possible.
As mentioned elsewhere I contacted Gabe Newell personally regarding licensing the source engine.

Their straight forward response was:
1. Source Engine does not support VR
2. They no longer license the source engine.

They suggested using either Unity or Unreal Engine 4 for proper VR support.
1. Unity is out of the question they don't evey offer full source code access to the engine
2. Unreal Engine 4 looks like a great engine with full source code available.

My goal is to create innovative games.
My secondary goal is to make all 3DVision games work together with vive in the best way possible.

Thanks to everybody using my assembler it warms my heart.
To have a critical piece of code that everyone can enjoy!
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#25
Posted 02/24/2016 01:56 AM   
Thank you for sharing Conan481, This is a really difficult choice and the easiest solution is just to buy both and get the best of two worlds.
Thank you for sharing Conan481,

This is a really difficult choice and the easiest solution is just to buy both and get the best of two worlds.

Thanks to everybody using my assembler it warms my heart.
To have a critical piece of code that everyone can enjoy!
What more can you ask for?

donations: ulfjalmbrant@hotmail.com

#26
Posted 02/24/2016 02:00 AM   
Yes, I was looking for any reason to buy the Vive, but after trying to hype myself up watching videos and reading up the Vive linup, I just didn't feel any of the games are worth 1300 CAD! Portal 3, L4D 3 or praise God, HL3, would be enough for me..... And, I've got an unfinished basement which cold give me the max 15' x 15' Vive experience. Damn you valve time, damn you! also forgot to mention that Oculus is also creating really cool stuff through OCulus studios, and they are supposed to announce a bunch of new stuff March 15, including new multiplayer Touch games. BTW, the Touch Playroom was the reason that Will from Tested.com left to start a social VR company. The experience he had with the Touch playroom and interacting with others in VR was literally life changing and he's seen everything that there is to see in VR. Facebook is the social network after all... and gaming is only one application of VR, and Oculus is going in full speed ahead. Also, Oculus has got billions of dollars of support and if you think about it, doesn't really need the support initially.... They can afford to not sell large quantites and don't expect the Rift to add any meaningful capital for the first few years away. Zukerberg has said that Oculus was a LONG TERM INVESTMENT> HTC, on the other hand is very close to not being a company at all. They have put most of their bets on the Vive and if it doesn't succeed, there will most likely not ever be another Vive ever again. Maybe we should being buying the Vive to keep them afloat, or I'm sure Acer, or one of the other larger companies will be coming into the VR game soon anyway.
Yes, I was looking for any reason to buy the Vive, but after trying to hype myself up watching videos and reading up the Vive linup, I just didn't feel any of the games are worth 1300 CAD! Portal 3, L4D 3 or praise God, HL3, would be enough for me.....

And, I've got an unfinished basement which cold give me the max 15' x 15' Vive experience. Damn you valve time, damn you!

also forgot to mention that Oculus is also creating really cool stuff through OCulus studios, and they are supposed to announce a bunch of new stuff March 15, including new multiplayer Touch games.

BTW, the Touch Playroom was the reason that Will from Tested.com left to start a social VR company. The experience he had with the Touch playroom and interacting with others in VR was literally life changing and he's seen everything that there is to see in VR.

Facebook is the social network after all... and gaming is only one application of VR, and Oculus is going in full speed ahead.

Also, Oculus has got billions of dollars of support and if you think about it, doesn't really need the support initially.... They can afford to not sell large quantites and don't expect the Rift to add any meaningful capital for the first few years away. Zukerberg has said that Oculus was a LONG TERM INVESTMENT>

HTC, on the other hand is very close to not being a company at all. They have put most of their bets on the Vive and if it doesn't succeed, there will most likely not ever be another Vive ever again. Maybe we should being buying the Vive to keep them afloat, or I'm sure Acer, or one of the other larger companies will be coming into the VR game soon anyway.

#27
Posted 02/24/2016 02:34 AM   
I don't think Will or Norm know much about VR for good old gaming. I mean they know a lot, but like scientists evaluating how kids enjoy games. The life span of a lot of the experiences they do overviews of seem very very short (imo of course).
I don't think Will or Norm know much about VR for good old gaming. I mean they know a lot, but like scientists evaluating how kids enjoy games. The life span of a lot of the experiences they do overviews of seem very very short (imo of course).

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#28
Posted 02/24/2016 02:46 AM   
Buying the oculus will be like buying a new monitor. I think the room scaling / tracking and motion controllers are what's going to make it. I like how the vive has games working with the motion controllers from the start. The rift games that have been in development for years are all using the Xbox pad. That seems a little uncommitted to me and possibly half baked. Adding in controller support later is not the right way for things to be done! The vive/HTC/Steam had a conference at the end of last month to show off lots of games. The vive also has native unity support added in. I like the tilt brush, mini golf, hover Junkers, elite.m which are all out at launch. For driving games it won't really matter which VR headset you get as you'll be seated anyway. The vive is also supposed to have a higher field of view too which is something that I like. Then there's the vive only needing 1 X USB port instead of the rifts x4 USB ports required, That's quite a buggy for me as I have a miniitx motherboard and lots of external drives and devices! I like how steam is the program to use with the vive. No extra game library programs to install and less fragmentation of my game library. I think the sound will be better on the rift. The intergrated headphones look a lot better than the vibes earbuds and will probably sound a lot better too with a higher quality DAC. Saying that though I have various high quality headphones and earbuds for music production that will work well. (AKG cans and Ultimate Ears Tri Fi tens with custom ear molds.) so it's not a major concern for me. The rift has talked about 3D positional audio like a fake pseudo Dolby atmos but there's no mention of what the vive will be offering. This is a concern for me. If we get how blogs stereo it'll be a bit of an anticlimax. Sound will play an even bigger part in immersion than it ever has done before. I hope the vive doesn't overlook this. Conan, just out of interest what games are you looking forward to with the rift? I know it has a better lineup at launch than the vive but I wouldn't say it was like night and day. I guess it boils down to what you want from VR, for me it's about the motion in the ocean rather than head tracking view from a pew! It's all personal preference at the end of the day. You pays your money and you takes your choice. I definitely going to pre order the vive I'm just working out if I should cancel my oculus preorder. I bet it would fetch quite a bit on eBay if I decided to sell it after trying them both out!
Buying the oculus will be like buying a new monitor.
I think the room scaling / tracking and motion controllers are what's going to make it.
I like how the vive has games working with the motion controllers from the start.

The rift games that have been in development for years are all using the Xbox pad.
That seems a little uncommitted to me and possibly half baked.
Adding in controller support later is not the right way for things to be done!

The vive/HTC/Steam had a conference at the end of last month to show off lots of games.
The vive also has native unity support added in.
I like the tilt brush, mini golf, hover Junkers, elite.m which are all out at launch.
For driving games it won't really matter which VR headset you get as you'll be seated anyway.

The vive is also supposed to have a higher field of view too which is something that I like.
Then there's the vive only needing 1 X USB port instead of the rifts x4 USB ports required,
That's quite a buggy for me as I have a miniitx motherboard and lots of external drives and devices!
I like how steam is the program to use with the vive. No extra game library programs to install and less fragmentation of my game library.

I think the sound will be better on the rift. The intergrated headphones look a lot better than the vibes earbuds and will probably sound a lot better too with a higher quality DAC. Saying that though I have various high quality headphones and earbuds for music production that will work well.
(AKG cans and Ultimate Ears Tri Fi tens with custom ear molds.) so it's not a major concern for me.
The rift has talked about 3D positional audio like a fake pseudo Dolby atmos but there's no mention of what the vive will be offering.
This is a concern for me. If we get how blogs stereo it'll be a bit of an anticlimax. Sound will play an even bigger part in immersion than it ever has done before.
I hope the vive doesn't overlook this.

Conan, just out of interest what games are you looking forward to with the rift? I know it has a better lineup at launch than the vive but I wouldn't say it was like night and day.

I guess it boils down to what you want from VR, for me it's about the motion in the ocean rather than head tracking view from a pew!
It's all personal preference at the end of the day. You pays your money and you takes your choice.

I definitely going to pre order the vive I'm just working out if I should cancel my oculus preorder. I bet it would fetch quite a bit on eBay if I decided to sell it after trying them both out!

#29
Posted 02/24/2016 12:18 PM   
[quote="Conan481"] I[b]'m not here to tell people what to buy, but I can't understand for the life of me why someone would buy a Vive over a Rift. [/b][/quote] Sounds like you are. Palmer is PR spinning. Rift will never be room scale without fundamental changes. Forgetting the logistical mess of trying to run all those wires to your PC (from the camera), or the very real possibility the FOV of the camera is too small to prevent occlusion (and they'd have to be a massive improvement over DK2 camera for this to be reality... because DK2's camera's FOV SUCKED!), there's the practical matter: You need a chaperon type system. Even just standing to play something simple like Windlands, I smashed my headset into my monitor a couple of times. I could have very easily hit at a different angle and smashed my mouth against the monitor. It's a PR lie that Rift in its current form will ever be practical for room scale. There's a reason they preached seated over and over (until HTC unveiled Vive). P.S. I love the Facebook guys who post a video talking about how superior Rift is technically (from CES), when there are just as many (if not more) who claim Vive is better in those tech areas. I suspect they're virtually indistinguishable and I wouldn't built a fort defending either position.
Conan481 said:

I'm not here to tell people what to buy, but I can't understand for the life of me why someone would buy a Vive over a Rift.


Sounds like you are. Palmer is PR spinning. Rift will never be room scale without fundamental changes. Forgetting the logistical mess of trying to run all those wires to your PC (from the camera), or the very real possibility the FOV of the camera is too small to prevent occlusion (and they'd have to be a massive improvement over DK2 camera for this to be reality... because DK2's camera's FOV SUCKED!), there's the practical matter: You need a chaperon type system. Even just standing to play something simple like Windlands, I smashed my headset into my monitor a couple of times. I could have very easily hit at a different angle and smashed my mouth against the monitor. It's a PR lie that Rift in its current form will ever be practical for room scale. There's a reason they preached seated over and over (until HTC unveiled Vive).

P.S. I love the Facebook guys who post a video talking about how superior Rift is technically (from CES), when there are just as many (if not more) who claim Vive is better in those tech areas. I suspect they're virtually indistinguishable and I wouldn't built a fort defending either position.

#30
Posted 02/24/2016 12:31 PM   
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