Why there is no WinXP 3D Stereo driver? Is NVIDIA going to release a 3D Stereo driver for WinXP?
2 / 3
[quote]Unfortunately, these advantages are all negated by one defect. The left and right pictures are not separated fully, which leads to conspicuous and eye-straining artifacts in every game I have tried.[/quote]
first of this phenomenan is prevalent in both solutions- Nvidias shutterglasses have this as well but to a lesser extent. However with proper convergance settings and especially autoseparation this becomes a non-issue.
Unfortunately, these advantages are all negated by one defect. The left and right pictures are not separated fully, which leads to conspicuous and eye-straining artifacts in every game I have tried.
first of this phenomenan is prevalent in both solutions- Nvidias shutterglasses have this as well but to a lesser extent. However with proper convergance settings and especially autoseparation this becomes a non-issue.
[quote name='yuriythebest1' post='505806' date='Feb 14 2009, 04:26 PM']first of this phenomenan is prevalent in both solutions- Nvidias shutterglasses have this as well but to a lesser extent. However with proper convergance settings and especially autoseparation this becomes a non-issue.[/quote]
The iz3d just doesn't seem like a usable solution from what I've read. I saw in one article mention of bad viewing angles, and then I saw this:
[quote]With that established, I set out to compare the company’s 22 inch 3D display against what I had just been working with the week prior—and[b] the solution is just not there yet.[/b] On Nvidia’s GeForce 3D Vision, you adjust depth on a per-game basis, at most. Most of the time, on the titles you actually want to play in 3D, you don’t have to touch anything. [b]But on the iZ3Ds display, we had to tweak separation (depth, just like Nvidia’s 3D Vision) and convergence. [/b]And depending on what we were looking at, [b]those settings needed to be constantly tweaked.[/b] The latest technology
built into the display, called Auto Focus, attempts to correct for differences in separation and convergence. But [b]both myself and Tom’s Guide managing editor Rachel Rosmarin saw double of everything with the feature turned on. [/b][/quote]
[quote name='yuriythebest1' post='505806' date='Feb 14 2009, 04:26 PM']first of this phenomenan is prevalent in both solutions- Nvidias shutterglasses have this as well but to a lesser extent. However with proper convergance settings and especially autoseparation this becomes a non-issue.
The iz3d just doesn't seem like a usable solution from what I've read. I saw in one article mention of bad viewing angles, and then I saw this:
With that established, I set out to compare the company’s 22 inch 3D display against what I had just been working with the week prior—and the solution is just not there yet. On Nvidia’s GeForce 3D Vision, you adjust depth on a per-game basis, at most. Most of the time, on the titles you actually want to play in 3D, you don’t have to touch anything. But on the iZ3Ds display, we had to tweak separation (depth, just like Nvidia’s 3D Vision) and convergence. And depending on what we were looking at, those settings needed to be constantly tweaked. The latest technology
built into the display, called Auto Focus, attempts to correct for differences in separation and convergence. But both myself and Tom’s Guide managing editor Rachel Rosmarin saw double of everything with the feature turned on.
Sounds pretty bad in comparison. :unsure:
GTX680 SLI
Asus Rampage/intel 990X
3 X Acer GD235Hz
NVIDIA FOCUS GROUP
Not employed by NVIDIA, nor do my views represent NVIDIA's in any way.
Here is the real problem, and it has nothing to do with either the NVIDIA or the alternate product lines. It's the journalists.
First, these guys don't know what they are doing or what they are talking about. If you read the comments printed in the X-BIT Labs article that was originally referenced, I had to bring them into question because it was clear that they were mis-using the product. Crazy separation and convergence settings without understanding their relationships, testing games with equipment that is a million years out of date (and not appropriate for the target market the products are meant for), and even testing games that have long expired on the gaming shelf.
NVIDIA is far from being immune to this. Jon Peddie, one of the best analysts our industry has to offer, would have torn NVIDIA apart had I not brought up the [url="http://www.mtbs3d.com/cgi-bin/newsletter.cgi?news_id=71#Facetoface"]features of your drivers[/url] he either did not try or failed to acknowledge. Our industry is worried about the customers, but the media clearly needs to get through their learning curve as well. The problem is the media's learning curve is so public and so influential, it hurts everybody - including NVIDIA.
I read Tom's Hardware review as well, and this exemplifies the problem. NVIDIA demonstrated their solution without convergence features enabled at CES. I know, I was there. Since Tom's Hardware didn't have a clue about what they were talking about, they treated this inability to control convergence (pop-out) as a feature instead of a handicap. Had they enabled the advanced NVIDIA features, they would have been prone to the same vulnerabilities of journalist learning curve.
This is an [url="http://www.mtbs3d.com/cgi-bin/newsletter.cgi?news_id=28"]article I wrote[/url] some time ago which exemplifies this for both NVIDIA and the display alternatives, and was the motivator for MTBS to release the S-3D settings guide in the first place.
Finally, the battle isn't between NVIDIA and the other manufacturers, it's NVIDIA against the alternate spending patterns of gamers. There are seven to ten million qualified PC gamers out there (probably more!). I think the mission should be to get the buy-in from gamers into the merits of S-3D. It's much too early to treat the competition like the competition, if you get my meaning.
For the record, two of my systems run on Vista, and my XP unit is a non-gaming notebook computer. If stereoscopic 3D gaming requires an upgrade to Vista, it's well worth it.
Here is the real problem, and it has nothing to do with either the NVIDIA or the alternate product lines. It's the journalists.
First, these guys don't know what they are doing or what they are talking about. If you read the comments printed in the X-BIT Labs article that was originally referenced, I had to bring them into question because it was clear that they were mis-using the product. Crazy separation and convergence settings without understanding their relationships, testing games with equipment that is a million years out of date (and not appropriate for the target market the products are meant for), and even testing games that have long expired on the gaming shelf.
NVIDIA is far from being immune to this. Jon Peddie, one of the best analysts our industry has to offer, would have torn NVIDIA apart had I not brought up the features of your drivers he either did not try or failed to acknowledge. Our industry is worried about the customers, but the media clearly needs to get through their learning curve as well. The problem is the media's learning curve is so public and so influential, it hurts everybody - including NVIDIA.
I read Tom's Hardware review as well, and this exemplifies the problem. NVIDIA demonstrated their solution without convergence features enabled at CES. I know, I was there. Since Tom's Hardware didn't have a clue about what they were talking about, they treated this inability to control convergence (pop-out) as a feature instead of a handicap. Had they enabled the advanced NVIDIA features, they would have been prone to the same vulnerabilities of journalist learning curve.
This is an article I wrote some time ago which exemplifies this for both NVIDIA and the display alternatives, and was the motivator for MTBS to release the S-3D settings guide in the first place.
Finally, the battle isn't between NVIDIA and the other manufacturers, it's NVIDIA against the alternate spending patterns of gamers. There are seven to ten million qualified PC gamers out there (probably more!). I think the mission should be to get the buy-in from gamers into the merits of S-3D. It's much too early to treat the competition like the competition, if you get my meaning.
For the record, two of my systems run on Vista, and my XP unit is a non-gaming notebook computer. If stereoscopic 3D gaming requires an upgrade to Vista, it's well worth it.
[quote name='iondrive' post='503795' date='Feb 10 2009, 09:52 PM']XP is not dead until they stop making new games for it. Tombraider Underworld just came out
and it runs on XP/Vista.
Let's get back to the original issue.
e-ghost, what video card do you have?
XP has stereo drivers all the way up to 162.50 or more and many games work great under it.
I use 162.15.[/quote]
Hi! I am a bit bad luck. My card is not very strong but still later than 162.50. My Card is 9600GSO (older version).
"XP is not dead until they stop making new games for it. " <== Can't agree more!! /thumbup.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':thumbup:' />
Hardware vendors shall not need users to remind them this....
[quote name='iondrive' post='503795' date='Feb 10 2009, 09:52 PM']XP is not dead until they stop making new games for it. Tombraider Underworld just came out
and it runs on XP/Vista.
Let's get back to the original issue.
e-ghost, what video card do you have?
XP has stereo drivers all the way up to 162.50 or more and many games work great under it.
I use 162.15.
Hi! I am a bit bad luck. My card is not very strong but still later than 162.50. My Card is 9600GSO (older version).
"XP is not dead until they stop making new games for it. " <== Can't agree more!! /thumbup.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':thumbup:' />
Hardware vendors shall not need users to remind them this....
[quote name='e-ghost' post='506370' date='Feb 16 2009, 07:22 AM']Hi! I am a bit bad luck. My card is not very strong but still later than 162.50. My Card is 9600GSO (older version).
"XP is not dead until they stop making new games for it. " <== Can't agree more!! /thumbup.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':thumbup:' />
Hardware vendors shall not need users to remind them this....[/quote]
lol hilarious, why can't you just accept the fact that xp IS dying and WILL be very dead soon.
[quote name='e-ghost' post='506370' date='Feb 16 2009, 07:22 AM']Hi! I am a bit bad luck. My card is not very strong but still later than 162.50. My Card is 9600GSO (older version).
"XP is not dead until they stop making new games for it. " <== Can't agree more!! /thumbup.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':thumbup:' />
Hardware vendors shall not need users to remind them this....
lol hilarious, why can't you just accept the fact that xp IS dying and WILL be very dead soon.
[quote name='e-ghost' post='506370' date='Feb 16 2009, 02:22 AM']Hi! I am a bit bad luck. My card is not very strong but still later than 162.50. My Card is 9600GSO (older version).[/quote]
Sorry e-ghost,
I think you're out of luck. I have no experience with the 9000 series or above, but I still feel confident that
in XP, it's not going to work. I've only heard of success with the 8800GTX/GTS cards in XP. Before that,
the 7800GTX works in S3D on XP. Before that I use a geforce-4 with win-98SE.
I think I will be recommending that people who love s3d put together a dedicated system with older games.
For example, Starwars Battlefront 1 & 2 works in s3d on the 7800 in XP, but it's not that great because the
game has a wide range of distances involved. Some people will like it in s3d though. It's a matter of personal
taste. It's just an example of older games that are still great. But if your system is older, then you can't really
trust the list of games that nvidia provides because it really depends on your hardware. They should include
that data in their list. That would help alot. I'm putting together my own list of which games work with which
drivers and cards. Search for "old school s3d games" a long time from now if you're interested.
I have to agree that nvidia development for s3d in xp is dead though.
[quote name='e-ghost' post='506370' date='Feb 16 2009, 02:22 AM']Hi! I am a bit bad luck. My card is not very strong but still later than 162.50. My Card is 9600GSO (older version).
Sorry e-ghost,
I think you're out of luck. I have no experience with the 9000 series or above, but I still feel confident that
in XP, it's not going to work. I've only heard of success with the 8800GTX/GTS cards in XP. Before that,
the 7800GTX works in S3D on XP. Before that I use a geforce-4 with win-98SE.
I think I will be recommending that people who love s3d put together a dedicated system with older games.
For example, Starwars Battlefront 1 & 2 works in s3d on the 7800 in XP, but it's not that great because the
game has a wide range of distances involved. Some people will like it in s3d though. It's a matter of personal
taste. It's just an example of older games that are still great. But if your system is older, then you can't really
trust the list of games that nvidia provides because it really depends on your hardware. They should include
that data in their list. That would help alot. I'm putting together my own list of which games work with which
drivers and cards. Search for "old school s3d games" a long time from now if you're interested.
I have to agree that nvidia development for s3d in xp is dead though.
A lot of people may still be using XP, but that's the way it is every time an OS or hardware standard goes EOL.
A lot of people still have the old OS or hardware, and then watch as driver and hardware support dies for what they have.
I was up at my dad's a few weeks ago and he said he had some trouble installing the new antivirus he bought, so I started the process on his PC that was already up and running. Got an error, looked, and exclaimed "WTH?! Windows 2000?! It's 2009! You won't find software for this anymore!".
Same applies here- when XP goes EOL, support for it will plummet. Already has in the enthusiast solutions- no 3D Vision, no 3 way or Quad SLi.
A lot of people may still be using XP, but that's the way it is every time an OS or hardware standard goes EOL.
A lot of people still have the old OS or hardware, and then watch as driver and hardware support dies for what they have.
I was up at my dad's a few weeks ago and he said he had some trouble installing the new antivirus he bought, so I started the process on his PC that was already up and running. Got an error, looked, and exclaimed "WTH?! Windows 2000?! It's 2009! You won't find software for this anymore!".
Same applies here- when XP goes EOL, support for it will plummet. Already has in the enthusiast solutions- no 3D Vision, no 3 way or Quad SLi.
GTX680 SLI
Asus Rampage/intel 990X
3 X Acer GD235Hz
NVIDIA FOCUS GROUP
Not employed by NVIDIA, nor do my views represent NVIDIA's in any way.
I knew what SP1 fixed. But it is subjective fact that WinXP is still far efficiency then Vista.[/quote]
That shot is just an anecdotal screen capture with absolutely no other information provided, purely to generate knee-jerk anti-Vista sentiment. He could be copying heavily fragmented data to a slow external hard drive through the parallel port, or he could be running scads of other processes in the background. My own personal experience has been that my file transfer speeds have actually increased since I upgraded to Vista 64. If you want to stick with your 8 year old operating system, you are going to miss out on new tech like 3D Vision. I just don't see why you can't dual boot if you really still want to use XP, and its not like the price of a Vista license should be an issue if you are already going to spend $200 for these glasses and an extra $400 for the monitor, or you already have spent thousands on a decent DLP HDTV.
[quote name='e-ghost' post='511130' date='Feb 26 2009, 10:40 PM']I will not ask if Vista is really an "OK' OS.
I knew what SP1 fixed. But it is subjective fact that WinXP is still far efficiency then Vista.
That shot is just an anecdotal screen capture with absolutely no other information provided, purely to generate knee-jerk anti-Vista sentiment. He could be copying heavily fragmented data to a slow external hard drive through the parallel port, or he could be running scads of other processes in the background. My own personal experience has been that my file transfer speeds have actually increased since I upgraded to Vista 64. If you want to stick with your 8 year old operating system, you are going to miss out on new tech like 3D Vision. I just don't see why you can't dual boot if you really still want to use XP, and its not like the price of a Vista license should be an issue if you are already going to spend $200 for these glasses and an extra $400 for the monitor, or you already have spent thousands on a decent DLP HDTV.
I knew what SP1 fixed. But it is subjective fact that WinXP is still far efficiency then Vista.[/quote]
That shot is just an anecdotal screen capture with absolutely no other information provided, purely to generate knee-jerk anti-Vista sentiment. He could be copying heavily fragmented data to a slow external hard drive through the parallel port, or he could be running scads of other processes in the background. My own personal experience has been that my file transfer speeds have actually increased since I upgraded to Vista 64. If you want to stick with your 8 year old operating system, you are going to miss out on new tech like 3D Vision. I just don't see why you can't dual boot if you really still want to use XP, and its not like the price of a Vista license should be an issue if you are already going to spend $200 for these glasses and an extra $400 for the monitor, or you already have spent thousands on a decent DLP HDTV.
[quote name='e-ghost' post='511130' date='Feb 26 2009, 10:40 PM']I will not ask if Vista is really an "OK' OS.
I knew what SP1 fixed. But it is subjective fact that WinXP is still far efficiency then Vista.
That shot is just an anecdotal screen capture with absolutely no other information provided, purely to generate knee-jerk anti-Vista sentiment. He could be copying heavily fragmented data to a slow external hard drive through the parallel port, or he could be running scads of other processes in the background. My own personal experience has been that my file transfer speeds have actually increased since I upgraded to Vista 64. If you want to stick with your 8 year old operating system, you are going to miss out on new tech like 3D Vision. I just don't see why you can't dual boot if you really still want to use XP, and its not like the price of a Vista license should be an issue if you are already going to spend $200 for these glasses and an extra $400 for the monitor, or you already have spent thousands on a decent DLP HDTV.
Yeah when Microsoft is leaving XP for dead its time to jump ship. Windows 7 is just around the corner.
The DRIVERS for IZ3d are great. If you take 3Dvision and IZ3D's monitor side by side you pick Nvidia everytime. You cant put "journalists" in bucket and say there all the same. What it sounded like. Please the Iz3d monitor, takes alot of tweaking to get each game right. And then you still have ghosting front or in the back and the 2d is not crisp and sharp. And some reviews do a great job. And to say he/she would have said or what was really said.. your better than that. Both are not perfect. The price for NV is just awful. Most would rather SAVE $200-300 and just get IZ3d. Its not the best yet its getting better with new glassed a new monitor 26" soon and support is easy and fast and those guys are or seem to be working night and day lol.
Yeah when Microsoft is leaving XP for dead its time to jump ship. Windows 7 is just around the corner.
The DRIVERS for IZ3d are great. If you take 3Dvision and IZ3D's monitor side by side you pick Nvidia everytime. You cant put "journalists" in bucket and say there all the same. What it sounded like. Please the Iz3d monitor, takes alot of tweaking to get each game right. And then you still have ghosting front or in the back and the 2d is not crisp and sharp. And some reviews do a great job. And to say he/she would have said or what was really said.. your better than that. Both are not perfect. The price for NV is just awful. Most would rather SAVE $200-300 and just get IZ3d. Its not the best yet its getting better with new glassed a new monitor 26" soon and support is easy and fast and those guys are or seem to be working night and day lol.
I just tried the iZ3D driver on my 8800GTS 640 MB card and it works good for some games.
So e-ghost, if you want to play s3d games in winXP, I think you only have 2 options:
1) downgrade to an older card
if you're happy with older games, I suggest a 7800GTX 256MB.
you can play the 3 spiderman movie games, tombraider up to Anniversary,
X-men Legends-2, Iron-Man, Marvel Ultimate Alliance, others.
Keep in mind some of these have a bad depth for their on-screen-data so that
it's only good if you've played the game before and don't need the OSD. Otherwise
toggle s3d on/off as needed to read on-screen text. (health level and OS-maps can
also be a problem)
An 8800 card can be tricky to get working good. You need to use nHancer.
2) try the iZ3D driver from [url="http://iz3d.com/t-dcdriver.aspx"]http://iz3d.com/t-dcdriver.aspx[/url]
unfortunately it's only a free trial for something like 60 or 90 days, then it's $50 to buy
a license. You can have both nvidia and iZ3D drivers installed at the same time. Just don't
activate both of them simultaneously. The iZ3D stereo driver control is similar to nvidia's
using hotkeys that you can define. Prince of Persia - Sands of Time and 2 Thrones work
well on my 8800. The newest Prince almost works for me but might work for you on your
9600 card.
Using this driver, you need to turn on the glasses separately with E-D-Activator from
www.edimensional.com/support_updates.php but you might have an eye-swapping problem.
Better yet, use a hardware switch built-in on some $10 cheapies from www.xforce3d.com.
They have a hardware switch to turn on the glasses and a button to swap eye-sync. It's nice
not depending on software for those functions. You have to use a display with an old-style
15-pin connector though.
They also have hardware line-blanking mode and sync-doubling mode as well as page-flipping.
Besides all that, what viewing hardware do you want to use?
I'm guessing that you have shutter glasses that you want to use on a CRT?
Also what games do you have or want to try?
unfortunately it's only a free trial for something like 60 or 90 days, then it's $50 to buy
a license. You can have both nvidia and iZ3D drivers installed at the same time. Just don't
activate both of them simultaneously. The iZ3D stereo driver control is similar to nvidia's
using hotkeys that you can define. Prince of Persia - Sands of Time and 2 Thrones work
well on my 8800. The newest Prince almost works for me but might work for you on your
9600 card.
Using this driver, you need to turn on the glasses separately with E-D-Activator from
www.edimensional.com/support_updates.php but you might have an eye-swapping problem.
Better yet, use a hardware switch built-in on some $10 cheapies from www.xforce3d.com.
They have a hardware switch to turn on the glasses and a button to swap eye-sync. It's nice
not depending on software for those functions. You have to use a display with an old-style
15-pin connector though.
They also have hardware line-blanking mode and sync-doubling mode as well as page-flipping.
Besides all that, what viewing hardware do you want to use?
I'm guessing that you have shutter glasses that you want to use on a CRT?
first of this phenomenan is prevalent in both solutions- Nvidias shutterglasses have this as well but to a lesser extent. However with proper convergance settings and especially autoseparation this becomes a non-issue.
first of this phenomenan is prevalent in both solutions- Nvidias shutterglasses have this as well but to a lesser extent. However with proper convergance settings and especially autoseparation this becomes a non-issue.
[url="http://www.extremetech.com/article2/0,2845,2338999,00.asp"]http://www.extremetech.com/article2/0,2845,2338999,00.asp[/url][/quote]
From your link:
[quote]Truly, there are a lot of popular games that work pretty well with the tech.[/quote]
Big difference between that and [quote]conspicuous and eye-straining artifacts in every game I have tried.[/quote] for iz3d, wouldn't you say?
Another problem with the dual pane solutions like iz3d is their far more limited depth.
http://www.extremetech.com/article2/0,2845,2338999,00.asp
From your link:
Big difference between that and for iz3d, wouldn't you say?
Another problem with the dual pane solutions like iz3d is their far more limited depth.
GTX680 SLI
Asus Rampage/intel 990X
3 X Acer GD235Hz
NVIDIA FOCUS GROUP
Not employed by NVIDIA, nor do my views represent NVIDIA's in any way.
The iz3d just doesn't seem like a usable solution from what I've read. I saw in one article mention of bad viewing angles, and then I saw this:
[url="http://www.tomshardware.com/news/iz3d-3d-vision,6783.html"]http://www.tomshardware.com/news/iz3d-3d-vision,6783.html[/url]
[quote]With that established, I set out to compare the company’s 22 inch 3D display against what I had just been working with the week prior—and[b] the solution is just not there yet.[/b] On Nvidia’s GeForce 3D Vision, you adjust depth on a per-game basis, at most. Most of the time, on the titles you actually want to play in 3D, you don’t have to touch anything. [b]But on the iZ3Ds display, we had to tweak separation (depth, just like Nvidia’s 3D Vision) and convergence. [/b]And depending on what we were looking at, [b]those settings needed to be constantly tweaked.[/b] The latest technology
built into the display, called Auto Focus, attempts to correct for differences in separation and convergence. But [b]both myself and Tom’s Guide managing editor Rachel Rosmarin saw double of everything with the feature turned on. [/b][/quote]
Sounds pretty bad in comparison. :unsure:
The iz3d just doesn't seem like a usable solution from what I've read. I saw in one article mention of bad viewing angles, and then I saw this:
http://www.tomshardware.com/news/iz3d-3d-vision,6783.html
Sounds pretty bad in comparison. :unsure:
GTX680 SLI
Asus Rampage/intel 990X
3 X Acer GD235Hz
NVIDIA FOCUS GROUP
Not employed by NVIDIA, nor do my views represent NVIDIA's in any way.
Here is the real problem, and it has nothing to do with either the NVIDIA or the alternate product lines. It's the journalists.
First, these guys don't know what they are doing or what they are talking about. If you read the comments printed in the X-BIT Labs article that was originally referenced, I had to bring them into question because it was clear that they were mis-using the product. Crazy separation and convergence settings without understanding their relationships, testing games with equipment that is a million years out of date (and not appropriate for the target market the products are meant for), and even testing games that have long expired on the gaming shelf.
NVIDIA is far from being immune to this. Jon Peddie, one of the best analysts our industry has to offer, would have torn NVIDIA apart had I not brought up the [url="http://www.mtbs3d.com/cgi-bin/newsletter.cgi?news_id=71#Facetoface"]features of your drivers[/url] he either did not try or failed to acknowledge. Our industry is worried about the customers, but the media clearly needs to get through their learning curve as well. The problem is the media's learning curve is so public and so influential, it hurts everybody - including NVIDIA.
I read Tom's Hardware review as well, and this exemplifies the problem. NVIDIA demonstrated their solution without convergence features enabled at CES. I know, I was there. Since Tom's Hardware didn't have a clue about what they were talking about, they treated this inability to control convergence (pop-out) as a feature instead of a handicap. Had they enabled the advanced NVIDIA features, they would have been prone to the same vulnerabilities of journalist learning curve.
This is an [url="http://www.mtbs3d.com/cgi-bin/newsletter.cgi?news_id=28"]article I wrote[/url] some time ago which exemplifies this for both NVIDIA and the display alternatives, and was the motivator for MTBS to release the S-3D settings guide in the first place.
Finally, the battle isn't between NVIDIA and the other manufacturers, it's NVIDIA against the alternate spending patterns of gamers. There are seven to ten million qualified PC gamers out there (probably more!). I think the mission should be to get the buy-in from gamers into the merits of S-3D. It's much too early to treat the competition like the competition, if you get my meaning.
For the record, two of my systems run on Vista, and my XP unit is a non-gaming notebook computer. If stereoscopic 3D gaming requires an upgrade to Vista, it's well worth it.
Regards,
Chopper
Here is the real problem, and it has nothing to do with either the NVIDIA or the alternate product lines. It's the journalists.
First, these guys don't know what they are doing or what they are talking about. If you read the comments printed in the X-BIT Labs article that was originally referenced, I had to bring them into question because it was clear that they were mis-using the product. Crazy separation and convergence settings without understanding their relationships, testing games with equipment that is a million years out of date (and not appropriate for the target market the products are meant for), and even testing games that have long expired on the gaming shelf.
NVIDIA is far from being immune to this. Jon Peddie, one of the best analysts our industry has to offer, would have torn NVIDIA apart had I not brought up the features of your drivers he either did not try or failed to acknowledge. Our industry is worried about the customers, but the media clearly needs to get through their learning curve as well. The problem is the media's learning curve is so public and so influential, it hurts everybody - including NVIDIA.
I read Tom's Hardware review as well, and this exemplifies the problem. NVIDIA demonstrated their solution without convergence features enabled at CES. I know, I was there. Since Tom's Hardware didn't have a clue about what they were talking about, they treated this inability to control convergence (pop-out) as a feature instead of a handicap. Had they enabled the advanced NVIDIA features, they would have been prone to the same vulnerabilities of journalist learning curve.
This is an article I wrote some time ago which exemplifies this for both NVIDIA and the display alternatives, and was the motivator for MTBS to release the S-3D settings guide in the first place.
Finally, the battle isn't between NVIDIA and the other manufacturers, it's NVIDIA against the alternate spending patterns of gamers. There are seven to ten million qualified PC gamers out there (probably more!). I think the mission should be to get the buy-in from gamers into the merits of S-3D. It's much too early to treat the competition like the competition, if you get my meaning.
For the record, two of my systems run on Vista, and my XP unit is a non-gaming notebook computer. If stereoscopic 3D gaming requires an upgrade to Vista, it's well worth it.
Regards,
Chopper
and it runs on XP/Vista.
Let's get back to the original issue.
e-ghost, what video card do you have?
XP has stereo drivers all the way up to 162.50 or more and many games work great under it.
I use 162.15.[/quote]
Hi! I am a bit bad luck. My card is not very strong but still later than 162.50. My Card is 9600GSO (older version).
"XP is not dead until they stop making new games for it. " <== Can't agree more!!
Hardware vendors shall not need users to remind them this....
and it runs on XP/Vista.
Let's get back to the original issue.
e-ghost, what video card do you have?
XP has stereo drivers all the way up to 162.50 or more and many games work great under it.
I use 162.15.
Hi! I am a bit bad luck. My card is not very strong but still later than 162.50. My Card is 9600GSO (older version).
"XP is not dead until they stop making new games for it. " <== Can't agree more!!
Hardware vendors shall not need users to remind them this....
"XP is not dead until they stop making new games for it. " <== Can't agree more!!
Hardware vendors shall not need users to remind them this....[/quote]
lol hilarious, why can't you just accept the fact that xp IS dying and WILL be very dead soon.
lol there's nothing you can do about it.
oh.. wait.. use vista.
"XP is not dead until they stop making new games for it. " <== Can't agree more!!
Hardware vendors shall not need users to remind them this....
lol hilarious, why can't you just accept the fact that xp IS dying and WILL be very dead soon.
lol there's nothing you can do about it.
oh.. wait.. use vista.
Sorry e-ghost,
I think you're out of luck. I have no experience with the 9000 series or above, but I still feel confident that
in XP, it's not going to work. I've only heard of success with the 8800GTX/GTS cards in XP. Before that,
the 7800GTX works in S3D on XP. Before that I use a geforce-4 with win-98SE.
I think I will be recommending that people who love s3d put together a dedicated system with older games.
For example, Starwars Battlefront 1 & 2 works in s3d on the 7800 in XP, but it's not that great because the
game has a wide range of distances involved. Some people will like it in s3d though. It's a matter of personal
taste. It's just an example of older games that are still great. But if your system is older, then you can't really
trust the list of games that nvidia provides because it really depends on your hardware. They should include
that data in their list. That would help alot. I'm putting together my own list of which games work with which
drivers and cards. Search for "old school s3d games" a long time from now if you're interested.
I have to agree that nvidia development for s3d in xp is dead though.
Once again,
sorry.
Sorry e-ghost,
I think you're out of luck. I have no experience with the 9000 series or above, but I still feel confident that
in XP, it's not going to work. I've only heard of success with the 8800GTX/GTS cards in XP. Before that,
the 7800GTX works in S3D on XP. Before that I use a geforce-4 with win-98SE.
I think I will be recommending that people who love s3d put together a dedicated system with older games.
For example, Starwars Battlefront 1 & 2 works in s3d on the 7800 in XP, but it's not that great because the
game has a wide range of distances involved. Some people will like it in s3d though. It's a matter of personal
taste. It's just an example of older games that are still great. But if your system is older, then you can't really
trust the list of games that nvidia provides because it really depends on your hardware. They should include
that data in their list. That would help alot. I'm putting together my own list of which games work with which
drivers and cards. Search for "old school s3d games" a long time from now if you're interested.
I have to agree that nvidia development for s3d in xp is dead though.
Once again,
sorry.
A lot of people still have the old OS or hardware, and then watch as driver and hardware support dies for what they have.
I was up at my dad's a few weeks ago and he said he had some trouble installing the new antivirus he bought, so I started the process on his PC that was already up and running. Got an error, looked, and exclaimed "WTH?! Windows 2000?! It's 2009! You won't find software for this anymore!".
Same applies here- when XP goes EOL, support for it will plummet. Already has in the enthusiast solutions- no 3D Vision, no 3 way or Quad SLi.
A lot of people still have the old OS or hardware, and then watch as driver and hardware support dies for what they have.
I was up at my dad's a few weeks ago and he said he had some trouble installing the new antivirus he bought, so I started the process on his PC that was already up and running. Got an error, looked, and exclaimed "WTH?! Windows 2000?! It's 2009! You won't find software for this anymore!".
Same applies here- when XP goes EOL, support for it will plummet. Already has in the enthusiast solutions- no 3D Vision, no 3 way or Quad SLi.
GTX680 SLI
Asus Rampage/intel 990X
3 X Acer GD235Hz
NVIDIA FOCUS GROUP
Not employed by NVIDIA, nor do my views represent NVIDIA's in any way.
[img]http://news.mydrivers.com/img/20090226/11542715.jpg[/img]
I knew what SP1 had fixed. But it is a subjective fact that WinXP is still far more efficient than Vista.
I knew what SP1 had fixed. But it is a subjective fact that WinXP is still far more efficient than Vista.
[img]http://news.mydrivers.com/img/20090226/11542715.jpg[/img]
I knew what SP1 had fixed. But it is a subjective fact that WinXP is still far more efficient than Vista.
I knew what SP1 had fixed. But it is a subjective fact that WinXP is still far more efficient than Vista.
[img]http://news.mydrivers.com/img/20090226/11542715.jpg[/img]
I knew what SP1 fixed. But it is subjective fact that WinXP is still far efficiency then Vista.[/quote]
That shot is just an anecdotal screen capture with absolutely no other information provided, purely to generate knee-jerk anti-Vista sentiment. He could be copying heavily fragmented data to a slow external hard drive through the parallel port, or he could be running scads of other processes in the background. My own personal experience has been that my file transfer speeds have actually increased since I upgraded to Vista 64. If you want to stick with your 8 year old operating system, you are going to miss out on new tech like 3D Vision. I just don't see why you can't dual boot if you really still want to use XP, and its not like the price of a Vista license should be an issue if you are already going to spend $200 for these glasses and an extra $400 for the monitor, or you already have spent thousands on a decent DLP HDTV.
I knew what SP1 fixed. But it is subjective fact that WinXP is still far efficiency then Vista.
That shot is just an anecdotal screen capture with absolutely no other information provided, purely to generate knee-jerk anti-Vista sentiment. He could be copying heavily fragmented data to a slow external hard drive through the parallel port, or he could be running scads of other processes in the background. My own personal experience has been that my file transfer speeds have actually increased since I upgraded to Vista 64. If you want to stick with your 8 year old operating system, you are going to miss out on new tech like 3D Vision. I just don't see why you can't dual boot if you really still want to use XP, and its not like the price of a Vista license should be an issue if you are already going to spend $200 for these glasses and an extra $400 for the monitor, or you already have spent thousands on a decent DLP HDTV.
[img]http://news.mydrivers.com/img/20090226/11542715.jpg[/img]
I knew what SP1 fixed. But it is subjective fact that WinXP is still far efficiency then Vista.[/quote]
That shot is just an anecdotal screen capture with absolutely no other information provided, purely to generate knee-jerk anti-Vista sentiment. He could be copying heavily fragmented data to a slow external hard drive through the parallel port, or he could be running scads of other processes in the background. My own personal experience has been that my file transfer speeds have actually increased since I upgraded to Vista 64. If you want to stick with your 8 year old operating system, you are going to miss out on new tech like 3D Vision. I just don't see why you can't dual boot if you really still want to use XP, and its not like the price of a Vista license should be an issue if you are already going to spend $200 for these glasses and an extra $400 for the monitor, or you already have spent thousands on a decent DLP HDTV.
I knew what SP1 fixed. But it is subjective fact that WinXP is still far efficiency then Vista.
That shot is just an anecdotal screen capture with absolutely no other information provided, purely to generate knee-jerk anti-Vista sentiment. He could be copying heavily fragmented data to a slow external hard drive through the parallel port, or he could be running scads of other processes in the background. My own personal experience has been that my file transfer speeds have actually increased since I upgraded to Vista 64. If you want to stick with your 8 year old operating system, you are going to miss out on new tech like 3D Vision. I just don't see why you can't dual boot if you really still want to use XP, and its not like the price of a Vista license should be an issue if you are already going to spend $200 for these glasses and an extra $400 for the monitor, or you already have spent thousands on a decent DLP HDTV.
The DRIVERS for IZ3d are great. If you take 3Dvision and IZ3D's monitor side by side you pick Nvidia everytime. You cant put "journalists" in bucket and say there all the same. What it sounded like. Please the Iz3d monitor, takes alot of tweaking to get each game right. And then you still have ghosting front or in the back and the 2d is not crisp and sharp. And some reviews do a great job. And to say he/she would have said or what was really said.. your better than that. Both are not perfect. The price for NV is just awful. Most would rather SAVE $200-300 and just get IZ3d. Its not the best yet its getting better with new glassed a new monitor 26" soon and support is easy and fast and those guys are or seem to be working night and day lol.
The DRIVERS for IZ3d are great. If you take 3Dvision and IZ3D's monitor side by side you pick Nvidia everytime. You cant put "journalists" in bucket and say there all the same. What it sounded like. Please the Iz3d monitor, takes alot of tweaking to get each game right. And then you still have ghosting front or in the back and the 2d is not crisp and sharp. And some reviews do a great job. And to say he/she would have said or what was really said.. your better than that. Both are not perfect. The price for NV is just awful. Most would rather SAVE $200-300 and just get IZ3d. Its not the best yet its getting better with new glassed a new monitor 26" soon and support is easy and fast and those guys are or seem to be working night and day lol.
I just tried the iZ3D driver on my 8800GTS 640 MB card and it works good for some games.
So e-ghost, if you want to play s3d games in winXP, I think you only have 2 options:
1) downgrade to an older card
if you're happy with older games, I suggest a 7800GTX 256MB.
you can play the 3 spiderman movie games, tombraider up to Anniversary,
X-men Legends-2, Iron-Man, Marvel Ultimate Alliance, others.
Keep in mind some of these have a bad depth for their on-screen-data so that
it's only good if you've played the game before and don't need the OSD. Otherwise
toggle s3d on/off as needed to read on-screen text. (health level and OS-maps can
also be a problem)
An 8800 card can be tricky to get working good. You need to use nHancer.
2) try the iZ3D driver from [url="http://iz3d.com/t-dcdriver.aspx"]http://iz3d.com/t-dcdriver.aspx[/url]
unfortunately it's only a free trial for something like 60 or 90 days, then it's $50 to buy
a license. You can have both nvidia and iZ3D drivers installed at the same time. Just don't
activate both of them simultaneously. The iZ3D stereo driver control is similar to nvidia's
using hotkeys that you can define. Prince of Persia - Sands of Time and 2 Thrones work
well on my 8800. The newest Prince almost works for me but might work for you on your
9600 card.
Using this driver, you need to turn on the glasses separately with E-D-Activator from
www.edimensional.com/support_updates.php but you might have an eye-swapping problem.
Better yet, use a hardware switch built-in on some $10 cheapies from www.xforce3d.com.
They have a hardware switch to turn on the glasses and a button to swap eye-sync. It's nice
not depending on software for those functions. You have to use a display with an old-style
15-pin connector though.
They also have hardware line-blanking mode and sync-doubling mode as well as page-flipping.
Besides all that, what viewing hardware do you want to use?
I'm guessing that you have shutter glasses that you want to use on a CRT?
Also what games do you have or want to try?
later,
--- iondrive ---
I just tried the iZ3D driver on my 8800GTS 640 MB card and it works good for some games.
So e-ghost, if you want to play s3d games in winXP, I think you only have 2 options:
1) downgrade to an older card
if you're happy with older games, I suggest a 7800GTX 256MB.
you can play the 3 spiderman movie games, tombraider up to Anniversary,
X-men Legends-2, Iron-Man, Marvel Ultimate Alliance, others.
Keep in mind some of these have a bad depth for their on-screen-data so that
it's only good if you've played the game before and don't need the OSD. Otherwise
toggle s3d on/off as needed to read on-screen text. (health level and OS-maps can
also be a problem)
An 8800 card can be tricky to get working good. You need to use nHancer.
2) try the iZ3D driver from http://iz3d.com/t-dcdriver.aspx
unfortunately it's only a free trial for something like 60 or 90 days, then it's $50 to buy
a license. You can have both nvidia and iZ3D drivers installed at the same time. Just don't
activate both of them simultaneously. The iZ3D stereo driver control is similar to nvidia's
using hotkeys that you can define. Prince of Persia - Sands of Time and 2 Thrones work
well on my 8800. The newest Prince almost works for me but might work for you on your
9600 card.
Using this driver, you need to turn on the glasses separately with E-D-Activator from
www.edimensional.com/support_updates.php but you might have an eye-swapping problem.
Better yet, use a hardware switch built-in on some $10 cheapies from www.xforce3d.com.
They have a hardware switch to turn on the glasses and a button to swap eye-sync. It's nice
not depending on software for those functions. You have to use a display with an old-style
15-pin connector though.
They also have hardware line-blanking mode and sync-doubling mode as well as page-flipping.
Besides all that, what viewing hardware do you want to use?
I'm guessing that you have shutter glasses that you want to use on a CRT?
Also what games do you have or want to try?
later,
--- iondrive ---